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HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.05.03 00:28:00 -
[31]
Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 03/05/2011 00:28:43
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: HeIIfire11
Originally by: Akita T when you come back, ALMOST all your work up to that point could be basically completed by a newbie just starting up in a matter of months, if not weeks ?
This is pretty much eve to be honest thanks to plex and the char bazzar.
Except that here it's not "free" (or at least not trivial). How many people are willing to shell out the cost of a great gaming rig just to "catch up" with other "top" players in a MMO ?
No you're right about that.I was looking at it from the game play point of view. It seems almost like cheating to me and takes away the desire to work for things that others just buy. Sure I can buy it myself but then..why bother playing. But thats just me.
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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.05.03 00:54:00 -
[32]
Wallet voting is the problem.
CCP have decided posting a trailer and getting some new subscribers is easier then delivering.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.05.03 01:21:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Akita T on 03/05/2011 01:26:44
Originally by: Elmer Dunley Horsekoch
Originally by: Akita T Except that here it's not "free" (or at least not trivial). How many people are willing to shell out the cost of a great gaming rig just to "catch up" with other "top" players in a MMO ?
At least a few dozen newer members of my alliance fall into that catergory and i'm sure a hell of a lot more than that in general.
It's all a matter of percentages. How many would toil hard to get there if they knew it would only take a few weeks/months without paying anything extra -vs- how many would choose to pay a lot since they know they'd need to work hard for years. I'm quite certain that the former group (as it applies to WoW) is much, much larger as a percentage compared to the second group (as it applies to EVE).
Originally by: HeIIfire11 No you're right about that.I was looking at it from the game play point of view. It seems almost like cheating to me and takes away the desire to work for things that others just buy. Sure I can buy it myself but then..why bother playing. But thats just me.
Doesn't really matter how it "feels". I personally would not bother spending any non-trivial amount of money (i.e. higher than a single, or at most, twin sub cost) to advance faster in any game, and I'm sure a lot of others feel more or less the same. However, I don't mind if others speed up their progress through the use of out-of-game money. Afterall, what would you feel is more satisfying when crushing the hopes and dreams of somebody who is flying a 80+ bil ISK ship - knowing the victim made it speculating on the in-game market for minimal effort, or knowing the guy just paid 2000+ USD for it ?
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Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Elmer Dunley Horsekoch
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Posted - 2011.05.03 02:04:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Akita T It's all a matter of percentages. How many would toil hard to get there if they knew it would only take a few weeks/months without paying anything extra -vs- how many would choose to pay a lot since they know they'd need to work hard for years. I'm quite certain that the former group (as it applies to WoW) is much, much larger as a percentage compared to the second group (as it applies to EVE).
Of course it is and i've obviously got no clue what the actual percentage is, but I am personally aware of quite a number of new players taking advantage of the bazaar. Not all of them spending purely PLEX'd isk though. Some of the more enterprising types are ones who spent a year or so on their first character earning isk to buy a higher skilled combat character before they applied. Nothing wrong with it in either case, to my mind at least.
The problem with asking a newbie not to purchase a character in EVE is two fold: For one, as you said, it's a matter of years going by rather than weeks or a few months of work (ala WoW). They may be very interested in joining our fleet, but we have fairly strict fitting requirements to take part. You can't simply x-up and expect fleet when you've got a t1 fit battleship that's using the inappropriate weapon system and/or tank. You're simply wasting space. Second, the majority of newer players don't understand the scope of the game. They don't understand the concept of corps staying together for years on end or alliances they'll be in for just as long. They see things from the viewpoint of Joe WoW-Player who assumes "guilds" come and go after a few years tops, and more likely a few months (however long their content patch cycles are these days). To them, it's a matter of some urgency to "see endgame," because they only understand MMO's in linear terms.
So again, do I think they have a flawed viewpoint? Sure, i've even reccomended some of them join our holding corp and pvp in lowsec with our fleets who take anyone. I've suggested a lot of things to them in the hopes they grasp how open-ended EVE is. That said, they are not completely in the wrong. I don't see any reason that they should not be allowed to purchase a character someone else doesn't want to use anymore so they can join in fleet combat in a more timely manner. If they don't have the moxie to stick around long-term like a real "EVE player," would, then they are the only loosers. Someone who sold the character still has the isk. They have an account that will go inactive with an otherwise useless character. Everybody (who still plays) wins.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.05.03 02:47:00 -
[35]
Why do I have the feeling we're arguing on the same side of things with just ever so slightly different viewpoints ? _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Elmer Dunley Horsekoch
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Posted - 2011.05.03 02:48:00 -
[36]
I would assume that is the case. I didn't bother to read much of the thread.
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Kurama Bingyi
Amarr Red Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.03 04:34:00 -
[37]
Not sure I'm understanding what's going on, here.
What's CCP done, so far, to tarnish their image and reputation? -----
Quote: "Nay," responded Kurama Bingyi, "to crush your enemies, to see them fall at your feet - to take their horses and goods and hear the lamentation of their women. That is best."
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Skydell
Caldari Morrigna Order
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Posted - 2011.05.03 06:45:00 -
[38]
I've seen other companies run thier MMO in to the ground. Milk it to the last drop. CCP never seemed to have that attitude but watching them ignore things over the year in the name of sandbox, I wonder at times if they just aren't riding the old horse untill it drops, so they can shoot it in the head and go find another one. |
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Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire
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Posted - 2011.05.03 07:45:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Liang Nuren Edited by: Liang Nuren on 02/05/2011 21:35:34 It seems like the latest plummet in forum quality (and quantity!) started right after the forum snafu. Chribba, what's the graph look like for activity before/after that? If you send me an excel spreadsheet of posts by week or something I'll put together a nice graph. :)
Anyway, I've almost totally switched over to Failheap now.... and even there I mostly lurk.
-Liang
2011-01-013895 2011-01-024396 2011-01-034890 2011-01-044947 2011-01-054819 2011-01-065132 2011-01-075378 2011-01-084932 2011-01-095080 2011-01-105185 2011-01-115383 2011-01-125623 2011-01-135379 2011-01-145591 2011-01-154429 2011-01-164854 2011-01-175551 2011-01-1810540 2011-01-1913817 2011-01-2010491 2011-01-219787 2011-01-226785 2011-01-236655 2011-01-247147 2011-01-257156 2011-01-267284 2011-01-277455 2011-01-287117 2011-01-297230 2011-01-305875 2011-01-316212 2011-02-015306 2011-02-026227 2011-02-035691 2011-02-045967 2011-02-054870 2011-02-065198 2011-02-075700 2011-02-085538 2011-02-094516 2011-02-105680 2011-02-115704 2011-02-124765 2011-02-134743 2011-02-145374 2011-02-155432 2011-02-166084 2011-02-175653 2011-02-185444 2011-02-195198 2011-02-204876 2011-02-215240 2011-02-225245 2011-02-235654 2011-02-245330 2011-02-254757 2011-02-264249 2011-02-274478 2011-02-284961 2011-03-015153 2011-03-024834 2011-03-034652 2011-03-044913 2011-03-054059 2011-03-064149 2011-03-074504 2011-03-085140 2011-03-095455 2011-03-105466 2011-03-114941 2011-03-123996 2011-03-134025 2011-03-144787 2011-03-154963 2011-03-164585 2011-03-174243 2011-03-184605 2011-03-194106 2011-03-204255 2011-03-215304 2011-03-225003 2011-03-234586 2011-03-244577 2011-03-254985 2011-03-265126 2011-03-274851 2011-03-285437 2011-03-295307 2011-03-305698 2011-03-315665 2011-04-015450 2011-04-024451 2011-04-034504 2011-04-044927 2011-04-055148 2011-04-069015 2011-04-076540 2011-04-083516 2011-04-09508 2011-04-105585 2011-04-115603 2011-04-126499 2011-04-135372 2011-04-145392 2011-04-154712 2011-04-164424 2011-04-174243 2011-04-184850 2011-04-194647 2011-04-204745 2011-04-214455 2011-04-224487 2011-04-234125 2011-04-244697 2011-04-254540 2011-04-264622 2011-04-274887 2011-04-284618 2011-04-294195 2011-04-304011 2011-05-013899 2011-05-024549
/c
Secure 3rd party service | my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar' |
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.05.03 11:30:00 -
[40]
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.05.03 11:42:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Tres Farmer on 03/05/2011 11:43:05
Originally by: Akita T
what's the fit for an equation/method?
PS: looks to me like the active player numbers I see on eve-ger's server graphs.. so nothing odd imho.
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
Nominh Ehre
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Posted - 2011.05.03 11:44:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Gavjack Bunk CCP do more to damage their own image than their customers could ever hope to achieve.
Literally, can you think of anybody who protects their code worse? Literally, can you think of anybody who protects their brand worse? quote]
Sony?
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.05.03 13:04:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Akita T on 03/05/2011 13:06:56
Originally by: Tres Farmer
Originally by: Akita T http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/9536/postsx.jpg
what's the fit for an equation/method?
Excel 2010's polynomial trend line, don't recall exactly what order I selected (4, I think, but not sure). P.S. Whichever looked like it fit the graph best, anyway. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2011.05.03 17:42:00 -
[44]
So its the quality that has gone down to make this place seem like a ghost town.
Someone should make 50 more threads about removing local.
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Pesky LaRue
Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel
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Posted - 2011.05.03 17:45:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Sig Sour So its the quality that has gone down to make this place seem like a ghost town.
that's certainly how it seems. GD in particular seems to have become Troll-Central and the majority of the threads are either nonsense, crying or deliberate flamebait/trolling. .
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Liang Nuren
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Posted - 2011.05.03 17:46:00 -
[46]
I see that Akita got there before me. Seems like there's a downward trend but it's not as bad as I was thinking. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2011.05.03 20:03:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Pesky LaRue
Originally by: Sig Sour So its the quality that has gone down to make this place seem like a ghost town.
that's certainly how it seems. GD in particular seems to have become Troll-Central and the majority of the threads are either nonsense, crying or deliberate flamebait/trolling.
Well good trolls are funny and make things entertaining (I ♥ getting Akita fired up). Bad trolls are just boring.
I suppose taking some action and putting up some legit topics wouldn't be so bad either. Shall we see if we can turn things around?
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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.05.03 23:36:00 -
[48]
You need proof that eve is being run into the ground by CCP?
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.05.04 00:01:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Constantinus Maximus You need proof that eve is being run into the ground by CCP?
I would agree that the latest trends look serious enough to be worrying, but I still wouldn't call it "running EVE into the ground". Severely reduce the appeal, noticeably decrease population, sure, in the long run, quite possible... but "death" ? Not likely. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.05.04 02:12:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Akita T but I still wouldn't call it "running EVE into the ground".
Well we're 10 months into 18 months of no resources being dedicated to Eve.
Can't see anything being done after those 18 months are "finished".
10/18 and it's already looking pretty grim around here.
Didn't believe for a second that it could be pushed to 18 months without Eve suffering. Don't know why CCP believe that they can neglect their flagship for so long.
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2011.05.04 03:13:00 -
[51]
The signal:noise ratio in GD has been consistently dropping for many years. I suspect that the perception that there has been a sudden change is only due to the number of troll posts reaching that point where the first page of GD is scrolled/filled with troll posts before you read it again.
It's worth going to page 2, you may end up finding more useful stuff.
-- [Aussie players: join ANZAC channel] |
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