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Lilith Order
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:02:00 -
[151]
-Agent report: The Quafe Zero is having some uninteded side effects... |
Sofa Raddis
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:09:00 -
[152]
Originally by: Zeus Fatale Sociopath's get bored, griefing feeds\fuels the disease drive for entertainment at the expense of someone else. They can't get away with it in real life (as easily) so certainly having Eve as a conduit is a perfect outlet for sociopath behavior.
They generally didn't set out to grief in Eve at the start, but early on they found that being anonymous is a gift that their personality disorder can't resist.
The one common skill they all will share is the ability\gift at lieing and deceit. Pulling off a grief using a scam or lie is the number one desired payoff. Being anonymous simply means they will never have to answer or own up IRL, a perfect environment.
Once in awhile the Eve Sociopath (griefer)will disappear for long periods of time or unexpectedly vanish from a corps. No reason would be given or at least a reason that made little sense but once in awhile they become emotionally guilty for their behavior and withdraw and hide.
When they come back its as if nothing happened "Do over" and any question about their mysterious absence is ignored or shrugged off, its simply (game on) at this point griefing as usual.
Seeing this thread and posting negative about the article is simple self defense and expected behavior from a sociopath or business as usual.
Be happy that a virtual world is where they enact the behavior and hope its the only necessary outlet.
One more example to look for a griefer\sociopath. -If ever questioned about their behavior by a corps mate all hell will break loose and someone is going to get destroyed even if it means turning on a corps and starting a revolution. Enjoy your game.
Now you're just being plain rude.
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Xervish Krin
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:11:00 -
[153]
Edited by: Xervish Krin on 08/05/2011 18:11:51 The hell is this? Griefing is part of EVE, deeply ingrained into the core of the game, etc etc. When people play, they're entering an environment of their own choice where people can kill their pixels for fun. Complaining about it is like complaining about someone taking your knight in chess. You might not want to lose it, but those are the rules you agreed to when you sat down to play.
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Igualmentedos
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:23:00 -
[154]
Yes! I thought I was the only one that noticed the stupidity of griefers. Unfortunately, it's the internet so they're not going anywhere.
"At the end of this Soapbox, all I can do is feel immensely sorry for these folks. Attempting to fill various voids in your life with the tears of another sentient is indicative of an unimaginably empty existence"
He pretty much hit the nail on the head.
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Zelda Wei
Caldari New Horizon Trade Exchange
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:29:00 -
[155]
Judging from all the butt-hurt in this thread :-
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Roosterton
The 57th Overlanders
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:33:00 -
[156]
Originally by: Zeus Fatale Sociopath's get bored, griefing feeds\fuels the disease drive for entertainment at the expense of someone else. They can't get away with it in real life (as easily) so certainly having Eve as a conduit is a perfect outlet for sociopath behavior.
They generally didn't set out to grief in Eve at the start, but early on they found that being anonymous is a gift that their personality disorder can't resist.
The one common skill they all will share is the ability\gift at lieing and deceit. Pulling off a grief using a scam or lie is the number one desired payoff. Being anonymous simply means they will never have to answer or own up IRL, a perfect environment.
Once in awhile the Eve Sociopath (griefer)will disappear for long periods of time or unexpectedly vanish from a corps. No reason would be given or at least a reason that made little sense but once in awhile they become emotionally guilty for their behavior and withdraw and hide.
When they come back its as if nothing happened "Do over" and any question about their mysterious absence is ignored or shrugged off, its simply (game on) at this point griefing as usual.
Seeing this thread and posting negative about the article is simple self defense and expected behavior from a sociopath or business as usual.
Be happy that a virtual world is where they enact the behavior and hope its the only necessary outlet.
One more example to look for a griefer\sociopath. -If ever questioned about their behavior by a corps mate all hell will break loose and someone is going to get destroyed even if it means turning on a corps and starting a revolution. Enjoy your game.
Griefers are not necessarily sociopaths; sociopaths are not necessarily griefers. A griefer is somebody who is playing EVE to win, and are willing to use tactics that some consider "underhanded" to do so. Sociopaths are often lyers, people who feel entitled to things, feel superior to everyone else, and can be pushed over the edge by small events. As a matter of fact, most griefers I know are open and honest when it comes to talking with me, and only act like *******s to people who deserve it; many carebears fit the sociopath profile a lot better, raging and providing "tears" over insignificant ship losses and quitting EVE over minute things.
Saying that they have a personality disorder is immature, idiotic, and ignorant.
More likely, the reason they grief is not because they have no consequences; they simply do it to attain their feeling of "winning" in EVE. Maybe they pull off scams in order to have isk so that they can PVP; maybe they kill carebears to gain killmails in order to have a l33t reputation; whatever the case, I'm sure they do not want to go around killing people in real life, the same way that pro tennis players aren't *******s for making serves that their opponents can't hit back.
More likely, their disappearances are just because they're going on vacation or taking breaks from the game, and they vanish from corps because most corps suck. (Probably including yours, or you wouldn't be saying this.)
When they come back, the reason they shrug it off is probably more because they don't care to tell you that they spent the last two weeks visiting their Alaskan Grandma.
You're an idiot for believing the writer of that article; he's the same guy who thinks people who win Monopoly games are greedy bankers, and pro tennis players are *******s for being good at tennis.
Your last example really does give it all away; you (or your main) was in some terrible corp which had a psychotic CEO who got mad at a griefer for being a griefer, so the griefer left and decced you, resulting in epic tears and causing you to be mad. I'm right, aren't I? It's your corp's fault for being so terrible.
Stop posting. -------- Enemy corps raided into disbandment: Three.
Originally by: Tarminic
OH MY GOD WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?! |
EnderCapitalG
Caldari GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:43:00 -
[157]
Broad generalization.
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Haquer
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:44:00 -
[158]
Originally by: EnderCapitalG Broad generalization.
Nonsensical statement involving how big of a meanie head you are.
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Naynomi
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:44:00 -
[159]
Originally by: Haquer
Originally by: EnderCapitalG Broad generalization.
Nonsensical statement involving how big of a meanie head you are.
Implying that you are a sociopath because you are the actual meanie :(
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Viktor Resnov
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:45:00 -
[160]
Originally by: Naynomi
Originally by: Haquer
Originally by: EnderCapitalG Broad generalization.
Nonsensical statement involving how big of a meanie head you are.
Implying that you are a sociopath because you are the actual meanie :(
Statement that this is only a game and you all take it too seriously.
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Gabriel Kaile
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:45:00 -
[161]
Originally by: Viktor Resnov
Originally by: Naynomi
Originally by: Haquer
Originally by: EnderCapitalG Broad generalization.
Nonsensical statement involving how big of a meanie head you are.
Implying that you are a sociopath because you are the actual meanie :(
Statement that this is only a game and you all take it too seriously.
Implying that a game is literally real life and you beat children.
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Sofa Raddis
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:48:00 -
[162]
Great laughs, folks, great laughs indeed.
FFS, that article might even inspire someone to START griefing.
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J Kunjeh
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:54:00 -
[163]
Edited by: J Kunjeh on 08/05/2011 18:56:18 Edited by: J Kunjeh on 08/05/2011 18:55:42 I think what this discussion could use right now is a refresher on the meaning of "griefer" or "to grief".
For me, it is basically this: doing something allowed by the mechanics of the game to an extent that it no longer serves actual game purpose, it only serves to irritate, belittle, and annoy other players.
I think one of the major problems with the "pro-griefer" side of this debate is that they often conflate underhanded, slimy, evil, double-dealing, conniving, twisted behaviors committed in order to advance game purposes (totally acceptable in Eve) with doing those same things with the sole purpose of harvesting tears rather than serving advancement of their game.
What the "anti-griefers" are attempting to communicate is that perfectly acceptable and desirable game behavior can easily cross the line into the realm of asshattery for the sake of asshattery. I don't think any of them are claiming that behavior in-game and IRL should be (or even could be) equated. But they are saying that griefing, asshat behavior (or at the least, intentions) in-game and IRL can and often is equated.
~Gnosis~ |
EnderCapitalG
Caldari GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.05.08 18:57:00 -
[164]
Originally by: J Kunjeh I think what this discussion could use right now is a refresher on the meaning of "griefer" or "to grief".
For me, it is basically this: doing something allowed by the mechanics of the game to an extent that it no longer serves actual game purpose, it only serves to irriate, belittle, and annoy other players.
I think one of the major problems with the "pro-griefer" side of this debate is that they often conflate underhanded, slimy, evil, double-dealing, conniving, twisted behaviors committed in order to advance game purposes (totally acceptable in Eve) with doing those same things with the sole purpose of harvesting tears rather than serving advancement of their game.
What the "anti-griefers" are attempting to communicate is that perfectly acceptable and desirable game behavior can easily cross the line into the realm of asshattery for the sake of asshattery.
What do you think that CCP should do to curb griefing, then?
Many have pointed it out that it's "against the EULA/TOS", so why not petition them?
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J Kunjeh
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.08 19:00:00 -
[165]
Edited by: J Kunjeh on 08/05/2011 19:00:10
Originally by: EnderCapitalG
Originally by: J Kunjeh I think what this discussion could use right now is a refresher on the meaning of "griefer" or "to grief".
For me, it is basically this: doing something allowed by the mechanics of the game to an extent that it no longer serves actual game purpose, it only serves to irriate, belittle, and annoy other players.
I think one of the major problems with the "pro-griefer" side of this debate is that they often conflate underhanded, slimy, evil, double-dealing, conniving, twisted behaviors committed in order to advance game purposes (totally acceptable in Eve) with doing those same things with the sole purpose of harvesting tears rather than serving advancement of their game.
What the "anti-griefers" are attempting to communicate is that perfectly acceptable and desirable game behavior can easily cross the line into the realm of asshattery for the sake of asshattery.
What do you think that CCP should do to curb griefing, then?
Many have pointed it out that it's "against the EULA/TOS", so why not petition them?
I think people should be petitioning them. Just like people report asshattery on the forums, they should do likewise with asshat behaviors in-game that are petitionable according to the EULA.
~Gnosis~ |
Sofa Raddis
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Posted - 2011.05.08 19:05:00 -
[166]
Originally by: J Kunjeh
What the "anti-griefers" are attempting to communicate is that perfectly acceptable and desirable game behavior can easily cross the line into the realm of asshattery for the sake of asshattery. .
That's all fine and dandy, but one could do so without the blatant labeling of strangers.
Where do one find the audacity to call someone a sociopath over games in a lengty article?
And in such an amateurish psychobabble manner? They're not "mad", they feel "sorry" for the griefers.... priceless.
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Marcella Moreau
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.08 19:12:00 -
[167]
Originally by: EnderCapitalG
What do you think that CCP should do to curb griefing, then?
Many have pointed it out that it's "against the EULA/TOS", so why not petition them?
Never thought I'd catch myself agreeing with a Goonie-bird--but I guess there's a first time for everything.
If someone has crossed the line and is griefing/harassing then petitioning is the best route to go. Thing to remember is that the burden of proof is on the petitioner--remember it's the petitioner who is making the accusation. You can't just say though that this guy is being a poopiehead and picking on me. It's the petitioner's responsibility to document the who...what...where...when...and how's of the situation/s. The better and more solid your case, the more likely CCP will be to take action against the griefer. If griefing is a serious problem and if enough people make solid petitions then the message will sink in. But again, before you make that accusation and begin the petitioning process, be sure that it really is a matter of griefing and not just sharp gameplay on the part of whoever popped/podded you. "Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies." Groucho Marx |
J Kunjeh
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.08 19:12:00 -
[168]
Edited by: J Kunjeh on 08/05/2011 19:12:00
Originally by: Sofa Raddis Edited by: Sofa Raddis on 08/05/2011 19:07:49
Originally by: J Kunjeh
What the "anti-griefers" are attempting to communicate is that perfectly acceptable and desirable game behavior can easily cross the line into the realm of asshattery for the sake of asshattery. .
That's all fine and dandy, but one could do so without the blatant labeling of strangers.
Where does one find the audacity to call someone a sociopath over games?
Oh, we're in complete agreement there. I don't think griefing means that someone is a sociopath, that's just rediculous (though they very well be could be one)...it just makes them a griefer.
~Gnosis~ |
Thomas Phillippe
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Posted - 2011.05.08 19:26:00 -
[169]
Edited by: Thomas Phillippe on 08/05/2011 19:27:48
Originally by: Sofa Raddis
That's all fine and dandy, but one could do so without the blatant labeling of strangers.
Where does one find the audacity to call someone a sociopath over games?
And in such an amateurish psychobabble manner? They're not "mad", they feel "sorry" for the griefers.... priceless.
Very childish and I have no sympathy.
I know what you mean. It's immature and childish when pvpers accuse carebears of being pussies, greedy, and sociopaths over a game.
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FeralShadow
NME1
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Posted - 2011.05.08 19:28:00 -
[170]
Originally by: Viktor Resnov
Originally by: Naynomi
Originally by: Haquer
Originally by: EnderCapitalG If you kill people in Eve Online you literally kill people IRL. I can make sweeping generalizations, too.
_______________________________________________ "If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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Sofa Raddis
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Posted - 2011.05.08 19:43:00 -
[171]
Edited by: Sofa Raddis on 08/05/2011 19:46:43 Edited by: Sofa Raddis on 08/05/2011 19:45:06 Edited by: Sofa Raddis on 08/05/2011 19:44:06
Originally by: Thomas Phillippe
I know what you mean. It's immature and childish when pvpers accuse carebears of being pussies, greedy, and sociopaths over a game.
Of course this is valid as well.
But forgive me, I seem to detect a slight sarcasm. Anything I said? Please elaborate.
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Hesperius
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Posted - 2011.05.08 22:59:00 -
[172]
Do you guys dig this deep into the meaning of a loss of a pawn when playing chess?
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Roosterton
The 57th Overlanders
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Posted - 2011.05.09 00:04:00 -
[173]
Originally by: Hesperius Do you guys dig this deep into the meaning of a loss of a pawn when playing chess?
Hey, some people do ragequit resign over it. -------- Enemy corps raided into disbandment: Three.
Originally by: Tarminic
OH MY GOD WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?! |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.05.09 01:01:00 -
[174]
Edited by: Tippia on 09/05/2011 01:03:59
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2 If it is giving him real life pleasure to make real life people miserable it is NOT acting. It doesn't get more obvious than that.
àand then he's no longer an jerk-RP:er. If he That's the point you keep missing. Again: if the jerk-RP:er is actually jerk-RP:ing, he's acting, and thus we have a situation where acting like a jerk in-game is decoupled from being a jerk IRL.
Quote: And I'd wager that there aren't people out there intentionally harassing people and not enjoying it.
Again, you're missing the point: the enjoyment for the jerk-RP:er comes from the depiction of the role, not the act.
I'd counter-wager that thse people get a bit upset when they come across people who can't disassociate in-game with real-life and get for-real upset just because their stuff got blown up. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Mortania
Minmatar No Compromise Gentlemen's Agreement
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Posted - 2011.05.09 01:26:00 -
[175]
The level of mental acuity in this thread is very high.
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Tosser Galore
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Posted - 2011.05.09 03:21:00 -
[176]
As for the chess analogy; in eve you're actually risking the loss of hours/months/years of work at the mercy of your own stupidity and others people's evil/random deeds. Chess is easy to transcend compared to eve and other mmorpgs that are designed to bring about a meta world. Of course people are going to react as per their usual social interface, yadi yadi etc etc even in this fake world, game entity. "You shot my spaceship!", you killed my pod.
There is a certain (albeit very small) subset of the griefing population that surely would classify as pathological irl (e.g you found great pleasure in torturing small animals as a kid and have similar tendencies hovering about your person), and then we have the closet freaks and then we have the week end *******s, and the average human who like to rp a douche bag and rampage throughout a world very much like our own, but with no moral rules or boundaries.
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Ludi Burek
Universal Engineering
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Posted - 2011.05.09 06:10:00 -
[177]
Being griefed is your state of mind and not the "griefers" problem.
Also, every time I kill someone in pretend spaceships online, it's because my RL victim escaped me and I'm therefore compensating.
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Shawna Gray
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.09 07:29:00 -
[178]
Originally by: Tosser Galore As for the chess analogy; in eve you're actually risking the loss of hours/months/years of work at the mercy of your own stupidity and others people's evil/random deeds.
You dont lose anything. You get exactly what you paid for, a game where you can make isk and possibly get blown up.
If you dont see the similarity to chess how about professional football. If you get relegated to a lower league your club loses millions in income. Or if you dont manage to get that champions league spot your club loses millions. And that is actual real world money not imaginary spaceship money. Are the opposing teams players sociopaths for beating your team?
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JitaBUGz TheGreat
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Posted - 2011.05.09 07:31:00 -
[179]
Think ppl in this thread are confusing griefing with ganking.
I like to, every now and then. Get in my destroyer and go and gank me some retrievers. That is ganking. When the person opens his mouth about it in local, then he is griefing himself. To be a griefer, u must first fly a mining barge, and or hauler.
20 mil in destroyers=about 150mill in loot(retriever killing). A nice passive income, on a slow nite.
There is no such thing as a active griefer, just the softies the buy into that kind of thinking, then grief themselves. Only you can make yourself mad in a game. In Eve it is almost impossible to loose a ship, even against a ganker. I hate pre-aligned retrievers. I dont like to loose my ship alone.
Ramble Ramble, Bla,Bla. That linkage is the best wall of QQ, the world is so mad. I have ever read. Tell that guy to write up a wall of text about, how Eve players all fart and make him smell it also.
In short, griefing is self inflicted. Not projected. And if there is a argument about vocal/text griefing-block-block-block. And if u dont. Like I said, self inflicted.
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Tosser Galore
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Posted - 2011.05.09 07:48:00 -
[180]
Originally by: Shawna Gray
Originally by: Tosser Galore As for the chess analogy; in eve you're actually risking the loss of hours/months/years of work at the mercy of your own stupidity and others people's evil/random deeds.
You dont lose anything. You get exactly what you paid for, a game where you can make isk and possibly get blown up. ?
You loose time, a prime resource in eve.
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