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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
RAGE QU1T
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2012.09.06 20:09:00 -
[31] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:RAGE QU1T wrote:ok, lets say for sake of argument i relocate to low sec. what incentives would be good enough for that kind of move? for instance places like Tama, Amamake, Sagain, and the infamous pirate haven Rancer. That's a stupid argument and you know it. There are plenty of quiet low-sec systems to do your business in.
Not rly stupid when you consider those "Quiet" systems wont be so quiet and you would possible see corps/alliances blockade those systems to protect the use of those manufacuring lines in those stations. |
Karl Hobb
Stellar Ore Refinery and Crematorium
539
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Posted - 2012.09.06 20:14:00 -
[32] - Quote
RAGE QU1T wrote:Not rly stupid when you consider those "Quiet" systems wont be so quiet and you would possible see corps/alliances blockade those systems to protect the use of those manufacuring lines in those stations. OMG YOU MIGHT HAEV TO PVP IN A PVP GAEM!!!!! Nothing Found |
RAGE QU1T
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2012.09.06 20:16:00 -
[33] - Quote
Karl Hobb wrote:RAGE QU1T wrote:Not rly stupid when you consider those "Quiet" systems wont be so quiet and you would possible see corps/alliances blockade those systems to protect the use of those manufacuring lines in those stations. OMG YOU MIGHT HAEV TO PVP IN A PVP GAEM!!!!!
I'm not interisted in going to war with other industrilsts, there's no sport in it for me and a waste of my time |
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ISD Suvetar
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
4
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Posted - 2012.09.06 20:36:00 -
[34] - Quote
James 315 wrote:Don't be so modest, not only did you fix the OP link, you fixed it in every post where it was quoted! Now that's going above and beyond the call of duty.
Thank you very much! ISD Suvetar Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
571
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Posted - 2012.09.06 20:49:00 -
[35] - Quote
James 315 wrote:First, don't link to EN24. And if you must link a Jester Trek blog post, why not link directly to the blog? Finally, no. Things are not too expensive, and people do need to see highsec nerfed before they'll leave.
GL with that.
By that I mean, those that want to already do, those that don't want to won't.
But you know that...
RAGE QU1T wrote:ok, lets say for sake of argument i relocate to low sec. what incentives would be good enough for that kind of move? for instance places like Tama, Amamake, Sagain, and the infamous pirate haven Rancer. What in the name of god would make you move there? SERIOUSLY? If you're going to troll, at least make an attempt at trolling REASONABLY!
Kids these days...
Interdict Hi-Sec - it's the only way to be sure... |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings
323
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Posted - 2012.09.06 22:01:00 -
[36] - Quote
RAGE QU1T wrote:So CCP wants to nerf High sec manufacturing , ok do it, if you think mods and ships are expensive now wait to see how much of an increase you will see with this nerf, and to confirm low sec is bleep and will forever be bleep and no amount of incentive will be enough for indy corps and alliances to move their assets to low sec to conduct their manufacurting under the illusion of IDK WTF??? after all this is a litter box and if i dont want i live in a certain part of space i dont have too, that's why i pay subs. i emplor every industirist to bat phone their CSM representative in hopes to find out WTF is CCP thinking about???? Discuss http://www.evenews24.com/2012/09/06/jesters-trek-cogs/
OP, I take it you didn't actually read the blog, given that it basically disproves the "sky is falling" highsec whiners such as yourself. |
Pipa Porto
875
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Posted - 2012.09.06 22:09:00 -
[37] - Quote
RAGE QU1T wrote:ok, lets say for sake of argument i relocate to low sec. what incentives would be good enough for that kind of move? for instance places like Tama, Amamake, Sagain, and the infamous pirate haven Rancer.
Yes, the best plan, if LS becomes *GASP* worth doing industry in (besides Cap production, ofc) is to go right to the busiest and most dangerous areas. I can already tell you're gonna be successful at EVE. Especially since you assume that prices will remain static in the face of changing manufacturing costs.
RAGE QU1T wrote:if it costs me more to build things and not make a profit....Yea i waste my time, after all i don't build things out of the goodness of my heart.
Also,
RAGE QU1T wrote:I'm not interisted in going to war with other industrilsts, there's no sport in it for me and a waste of my time
So, do you not sell your goods, or is there some NPC buy orders for manufactured goods that allow you to [sparkles]magically[/sparkles] avoid competing with other industrialists? EvE: Everyone vs Everyone
-RubyPorto |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
571
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Posted - 2012.09.06 22:12:00 -
[38] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Yes, the best plan, if LS becomes *GASP* worth doing industry in (besides Cap production, ofc) is to go right to the busiest and most dangerous areas. I can already tell you're gonna be successful at EVE. Especially since you assume that prices will remain static in the face of changing manufacturing costs. Is Ruby "unable to log into the forums"? Just wondering.
And yeah, OP is like a chicken on fire in a gasoline rainstorm...
Interdict Hi-Sec - it's the only way to be sure... |
Russell Casey
Deep Void Industrial Group Damned Nation
190
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Posted - 2012.09.06 22:23:00 -
[39] - Quote
Virgil Travis wrote: Oh you are talking about some comment made by a CCP dev about ideas that they're discussing, not actual changes that are being made.
Isn't that how it always goes? A Dev makes some random comment about nerfing a cushy source of EZ-income and the forums scream that it's the end of EVE. |
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
87
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Posted - 2012.09.06 22:52:00 -
[40] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Here's an idea, if CCP nerf hisec manufacturing... move.
Good idea, like another MMO for instance.
Ideas to nerf high-sec we shouldn't expect anything else with nobody really representing high-sec on the CSM which is where some of these ideas probably originate. |
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Montevius Williams
Eclipse Industrial Inc
319
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Posted - 2012.09.06 22:58:00 -
[41] - Quote
Saede Riordan wrote:Your income should be less then it is now. That's the heart of it. As an highsec industrialist, you will never be able to reach the heights you could reach in low or nullsec, and if you can, currently, then its a system failure. If you want to stay in highsec for your safe, assured, highsec money, then do it. But don't expect to make as much as the people willing to actually take risks. And no, "I'm a paying subscriber" is not justification for you to get preferential treatment. If I buy a boardgame, that doesn't mean I get to win because its 'my game' and if I do claim something like that, I'm probably 5.
In short: HTFU, this is eve.
This makes no sense whatsoever. System failure? Wtf?
This is EVE, yes people need to HTFU but people need to also play smarter, not harder.
If someone can make billions in hi sec and be smart doing it, more power to them. If someone decides to go to Low/Null to make billions and they loose billions, we'll, sucks to be them.
Being an industrialist/marketeer is one of the riskiest things to do in EVE. You can loose billions EASY, if you are stupid and not paying attention and even if you are paying attention, Market PvP can still kick your ass. And all in Hi sec.
Risk doesnt just equate to blowing **** up. or being in Low/Null Sec. There is plenty of risk in hi sec as well. "The American Government indoctrination system known as public education has been relentlessly churning out socialists for over 20 years". - TravisWB |
Paul Oliver
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
916
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:02:00 -
[42] - Quote
Russell Casey wrote:Virgil Travis wrote: Oh you are talking about some comment made by a CCP dev about ideas that they're discussing, not actual changes that are being made.
Isn't that how it always goes? A Dev makes some random comment about nerfing a cushy source of EZ-income and the forums scream that it's the end of EVE. Well sure, didn't ya know... EVE is real "Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must undergo the fatigues of supporting it." - Thomas Paine |
Selinate
984
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:13:00 -
[43] - Quote
High sec is being nerfed?
Well this is the first I've heard about it. I have to do something about this!!!....
*sits in Jita and waits for the tears* |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
770
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:21:00 -
[44] - Quote
Do not think of it as Hi-sec being nerfed just think of it as Lo-sec and Null being made a bit better
My biggest concerns are actually about those with no Manufacturing and refining capabilities, while living in an area harder than Null sec they rely on Hi-sec to process and manufacture.
This is of course Wormhole dwellers. Well hopefully the new POS system will help a lot for everyone with refining and manufacturing.
And as this looks like it deservers to be in Jita Park.
Insert regular speech "If you consider these changes radical or damaging to your way of play, Then either find a Candidate to support that has your interests or Run for the CSM yourself.
The CSM Your Voice when things get Nerfed" Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge.
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Alaekessa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Zombie Ninja Space Bears
57
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:22:00 -
[45] - Quote
RAGE QU1T wrote:So CCP wants to nerf High sec manufacturing , ok do it, if you think mods and ships are expensive now wait to see how much of an increase you will see with this nerf, and to confirm low sec is bleep and will forever be bleep and no amount of incentive will be enough for indy corps and alliances to move their assets to low sec to conduct their manufacurting under the illusion of IDK WTF??? after all this is a litter box and if i dont want i live in a certain part of space i dont have too, that's why i pay subs. i emplor every industirist to bat phone their CSM representative in hopes to find out WTF is CCP thinking about???? Discuss http://www.evenews24.com/2012/09/06/jesters-trek-cogs/
Speak for yourself Forum Alt I agree with the following assessment of the Mining Barge Buff and as a reformed "Greed-fit", High-sec AFK miner, I think that is saying something. -áMining Barge buff: CCP has acknowledged that miners in general are too stupid to make the correct fitting choices to make ganking them unprofitable. |
Knight Cabbage
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
10
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:23:00 -
[46] - Quote
For smart high sec industrialists this will get again very entertaining and profitable. The low-sec and null-bear lobby is champaining again for hasseling high sec dwellers. And they will achieve is higher prices and higher profits for the industrialists. Just keep on lobbying....
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Marlona Sky
D00M. Northern Coalition.
1278
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:31:00 -
[47] - Quote
I love the idea that if a faction is losing it causes higher taxes for that faction. Don't like your favorite mission hub being taxed to death? Maybe move or better yet, join in FW and do something about it.
Also high sec manufacturing needs to be balanced. This is the first step. Keep in mind not all changes are going to be direct nerfs to high sec manufacturing.
Remove local, structure mails and revamp the directional scanner! |
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
87
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:31:00 -
[48] - Quote
Knight Cabbage wrote:For smart high sec industrialists this will get very entertaining and profitable. The low-sec and null-bear lobby is champaining again for hasseling high sec dwellers. And they will achieve higher prices and higher profits for the industrialists. Just keep on lobbying....
That's all well and good, but if your profits are coming from people leaving the game, then EVE (CCP) doesn't win.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, you won't drive people from high-sec into low-sec or null you'll just drive them from the game. Which is what will happen if you try to make low-sec and null more appealing at the expense of high-sec. |
Brooks Puuntai
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
719
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:40:00 -
[49] - Quote
They need to remove the penalty on adv arrays and make them only anchorable in low/WH/0.0. Also reduce the material multiplier on stations and other POS mods that are in non highsec areas. No need to nerf high, just buff the others.
You really run into the risk of a mass exodus if you cut too deep. For some there really is no way you will get them to move, they will quit. Depending on the amount that quit, not only do you not boost pvp targets, but you will also lose many industrial pilots who keep the prices low. Worst case scenario but still possible. |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
770
|
Posted - 2012.09.06 23:51:00 -
[50] - Quote
Sabrina Solette wrote: I've said it before and I'll say it again, you won't drive people from high-sec into low-sec or null you'll just drive them from the game. Which is what will happen if you try to make low-sec and null more appealing at the expense of high-sec.
These changes are not about moving people from Hi-sec to low and Null. This is about balancing risk vs reward in the game.
Rather than just giving lo and Null super buffs, this is about balancing it from both sides. So a little from Column A and a Little to Column B,C and D Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge.
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Anya Ohaya
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
165
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:53:00 -
[51] - Quote
RAGE QU1T wrote:ok, lets say for sake of argument i relocate to low sec. what incentives would be good enough for that kind of move? for instance places like Tama, Amamake, Sagain, and the infamous pirate haven Rancer.
Drugs? Really good drugs?
Seriously, there are plenty of empty low sec systems, you'd be insane to pick a pirate haven. |
Anya Ohaya
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
165
|
Posted - 2012.09.06 23:55:00 -
[52] - Quote
Knight Cabbage wrote:For smart high sec industrialists this will get very entertaining and profitable. The low-sec and null-bear lobby is champaining again for hasseling high sec dwellers. And they will achieve higher prices and higher profits for the industrialists. Just keep on lobbying....
Raising the barrier to entry will help established industrialists. Newbies will get it in the shorts, as usual. |
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
487
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:57:00 -
[53] - Quote
Encouraging Nullsec & Lowsec production is a good thing... Increase the install cost to 200k, and increase the cost per hour by 100 fold.. (33300.isk per hr). Then it would costs 800k isk per day to operate a MF slot. Manufacturers will just move the cost to the consumer... So most goods will increase in cost by 10-30%.
A dual 180mm autocannon II would increase from 1.1m to 1.2m to produce.... A 150mm autocannon II would increase from 500k to 560k to produce....
T2 ammo would increase quite a bit... because it has a long production time Scorch M would increase by 140k isk per crystal Null L would increase by 225 isk per round... (from 1200 isk to 1400 isk)....
This would actually be a VERY good isk sink for the game (150-300m isk per month per full-time hisec character). This would very much encourage people to use POS's (if you're spending 200m isk / month already, why not do it in your own pos) To use the POS's, players are encouraged to war-deccable PLAYER corps, and there are more targets in space....
Then quarter this rates in lowsec & NPC nullsec, and leave it Corp definable in Sov nullsec...
The consumers are the people that will see a general price increase... but so what.... it's an isk sink, and it encourages people to take risks for profits... Highsec producers will mostly stay in highsec... |
Pipa Porto
878
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Posted - 2012.09.07 00:08:00 -
[54] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:They need to remove the penalty on adv arrays and make them only anchorable in low/WH/0.0. Also reduce the material multiplier on stations and other POS mods that are in non highsec areas. No need to nerf high, just buff the others.
You really run into the risk of a mass exodus if you cut too deep. For some there really is no way you will get them to move, they will quit. Depending on the amount that quit, not only do you not boost pvp targets, but you will also lose many industrial pilots who keep the prices low. Worst case scenario but still possible.
You could make LS and Nullsec slots unlimited and free, and most industry (besides some research) would stay in HS. The ease of logistics is too large an advantage for HS manufacturing to be overcome without dramatically increasing the cost of doing business in HS.
A Freighter load of material can be moved anywhere in HS for about 15m ISK using RFF/Push. Moving the same amount of material out of LS costs around 120m. (Doing it yourself costs the same, unless you've decided your time/fuel is free).
Assuming a 10k ISK installation cost and 10k ISK/hr (massively over real manufacturing installation costs in HS), renting a manufacturing slot for a month costs less than 7m ISK. There are no shortage of open HS manufacturing slots. If LS manufacturing were free, you'd break even only if it took 15 months to make 1 freighterload of your items (and you could afford to sit on your goods for over a year). EvE: Everyone vs Everyone
-RubyPorto |
stoicfaux
1548
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Posted - 2012.09.07 00:10:00 -
[55] - Quote
Saede Riordan wrote:Your income should be less then it is now. That's the heart of it. As an highsec industrialist, you will never be able to reach the heights you could reach in low or nullsec, and if you can, currently, then its a system failure. If you want to stay in highsec for your safe, assured, highsec money, then do it. But don't expect to make as much as the people willing to actually take risks. And no, "I'm a paying subscriber" is not justification for you to get preferential treatment. If I buy a boardgame, that doesn't mean I get to win because its 'my game' and if I do claim something like that, I'm probably 5.
In short: HTFU, this is eve. Uhm... do you make more profit running a business in high-sec (say the US or Europe) than in null/lo-sec, such as Somalia?
Security, stability (e.g. reliable supply chain) and access to markets drive long term profits. Large scale industry and markets in low-sec aren't going to happen until low-sec isn't low security anymore.
You can tell me what is and isn't Truth when you pry the tinfoil from my cold, lifeless head.
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Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
87
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Posted - 2012.09.07 00:12:00 -
[56] - Quote
Frying Doom wrote:Sabrina Solette wrote: I've said it before and I'll say it again, you won't drive people from high-sec into low-sec or null you'll just drive them from the game. Which is what will happen if you try to make low-sec and null more appealing at the expense of high-sec.
These changes are not about moving people from Hi-sec to low and Null. This is about balancing risk vs reward in the game. Rather than just giving lo and Null super buffs, this is about balancing it from both sides. So a little from Column A and a Little to Column B,C and D
I don't know about these days but in 2009 I made far more in 0.0 than I ever did in high-sec.
It's like you won't drive people from NPC corps in high-sec into player corps, for various reasons.
New people struggle to make isk in high-sec at the start and you want to make it harder for them. As higher prices effects everyone not just those with more isk than they know what to do with.
Higher prices means more work to get the isk to PvP, more work equals less fun. When a game gets to a point were it's all work and no play it ceases to be a game and becomes little more than a time sink.
I just don't see anything good happening for this game if the PvPers keep hitting on high-sec with this risk Vs reward crap. |
Rengerel en Distel
Amarr Science and Industry
358
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Posted - 2012.09.07 02:51:00 -
[57] - Quote
I too would like to get upset about changes that might happen after ships are rebalanced, and crimewatch is done, and the POS changes are in, and ... but I can't really get upset about the 2017 changes yet.
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Gun Gal
Dark Club
91
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Posted - 2012.09.07 05:03:00 -
[58] - Quote
so lets see....... in highsec, manufacturing is king, why? probobly the same frikin reason that in real life the DEVELOPED COUNTRIES are the best at it too.
you want to have third world countries be the best at manufatcuring and the like?
jesus christ, you loosers are bigger idiots than i thought, and if CCP goes for this good luck on holding subs.
ill look on from the sidelines as the game with the greatest potential ever is nerfed into oblivion by the minority of loudmouthed whiners.
ive seen alot over the past 9 years of EVE, but this last year is really gettin rediculous, stupid ideas, stupid buisness practices, and catering to the vocal minority.
CCP, seriously take a good look what your doing, and to you vocal minority pushing for ******** changes, if i could reach though my computer screen and slap you with a dead fish, i probobly would.
prob get a ban on this post, but so what, ill just post on another account
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1302
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Posted - 2012.09.07 05:15:00 -
[59] - Quote
Gun Gal wrote:jesus christ, you loosers are bigger idiots than i thought, and if CCP goes for this good luck on holding subs.
ill look on from the sidelines as the game with the greatest potential ever is nerfed into oblivion by the minority of loudmouthed whiners. Yeah I mean sheesh, moving towards being low-risk good-enough-reward is totally the wrong thing to do just because some people scream when they're ganked.
Ah well, I guess we'll just have to let them take the gun buffing and then maybe we'll see about more CONCORD buffs. Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
780
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Posted - 2012.09.07 05:20:00 -
[60] - Quote
Sabrina Solette wrote:Frying Doom wrote:Sabrina Solette wrote: I've said it before and I'll say it again, you won't drive people from high-sec into low-sec or null you'll just drive them from the game. Which is what will happen if you try to make low-sec and null more appealing at the expense of high-sec.
These changes are not about moving people from Hi-sec to low and Null. This is about balancing risk vs reward in the game. Rather than just giving lo and Null super buffs, this is about balancing it from both sides. So a little from Column A and a Little to Column B,C and D I don't know about these days but in 2009 I made far more in 0.0 than I ever did in high-sec. It's like you won't drive people from NPC corps in high-sec into player corps, for various reasons. New people struggle to make isk in high-sec at the start and you want to make it harder for them. As higher prices effects everyone not just those with more isk than they know what to do with. Higher prices means more work to get the isk to PvP, more work equals less fun. When a game gets to a point were it's all work and no play it ceases to be a game and becomes little more than a time sink. I just don't see anything good happening for this game if the PvPers keep hitting on high-sec with this risk Vs reward crap. Interesting Point, Shame I am an industrialist not a PvPer. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge.
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