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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 19 post(s) |
Kumq uat
Gallente Guiding Hand Social Club Dystopia Alliance
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:04:00 -
[2071]
Have played this game for six years and NEVER pulled my I am cancelling my sub card. I did it today though. I have cancelled my sub and until CCP gives me a good reason to give them money again I won't.
Now if you will excuse me I feel sick to my stomach. Six ****ing years. Thought the only way I was leaving Eve was if CCP shut it down. I am gonna go be emo over in the corner here. --------------------------------------- www.eve-pirate.com original author |
RougeOperator
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:05:00 -
[2072]
Originally by: RC Denton
Originally by: Rheum Rhabarbarium
Originally by: RougeOperator Edited by: RougeOperator on 24/06/2011 06:53:13 Its funny that because CCP overreached in pure greed on this nex stuff. What could have been a nice cash flow for them at a $1 0r $2 an item may never materialize now. They may have ruined their chances to ever have micro-transactions work.
They are now considered Gordon Gecko forever. The internet does not forget.
This is exactly what I thought. Slamming the playerbase with a $80 monocle on launch was a very bad idea - instead they should've had a large quantity of cheap and accessible items from the start up, and build towards exclusive content... Now, because most of the players thought NeX was just too expensive, and now the leaked memo... well, you've just managed to pull off a one-two punch that probably turned off most of the community from buying anything micro-transaction related, EVER. Or at least until they have to...
It looks like the hyper expensive items were done on purpose based on what's in the memo about people deriving emotional content from buying expensive stuff. I just think they waaayyy over estimated the value that people would assign to these items.
Thats just their plain stupidity on many levels. Or pure insanity. Or Both.
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Kitsunebi Sol'Rayven
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:05:00 -
[2073]
Edited by: Kitsunebi Sol''Rayven on 24/06/2011 07:09:05 It is multiple issues that have me worried a lot. I have got the feeling that the same thing that happened to SWG is happening here, a major disconnect between the players and developers.
1. The performance of captains quarters. I donÆt have one of the top of the line computers but its not a peace of crap i can play Masseffect 2 and dragon age origins on max graphics no problem. My graphics card has overheated twice first time I cut all graphics down to medium that helped but then it overheated a second time so I have had to disable CQ altogether. I have not tired to use both my accounts at once in fear my computer would implode. I understand you want captain quarters to look amazing but the graphics are killing the performance of the game.
2. The price of items on the NeX store. The price of the items are just way to steep, all of the MMO cash shop games I have played items were no more then $1 to $5 per item at the max $10 to $15 and those were "free to play" games. I do understand that you can use in game money to purchase the items however it dose translate into real money b/c the Plex has to be bought by someone initially. I can understand needing extra cash flow to help design and make the items but the prices are just too much. EDIT: I also like to note that in no way should the cash shop introduce items that would ruin an ingame economy I.E. Ships out of thin air or ammo.
3. I have read the Fearless Newsletter like most it has me worried about how CCP views EVE and its players. I do understand it was to be for employees and that it was meant for only employees that said; The memo gave very interesting insight on what some of the employees want EVE and CCP to be in the future. I honestly did not like some of the views and found it contrary to how CCP has presented its self thus far to the players. It seems like some are disconnected on what eve is in the first place and do not understand how changes of this magnitude can effect a game.
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Ciar Meara
Amarr Virtus Vindice
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:06:00 -
[2074]
Edited by: Ciar Meara on 24/06/2011 07:10:51 I remember you Pann, and I think most older people as well. It's a clear sign that not only the "old players" as some suggested are ****ed off at the recent debacles. For some reason I still link you to the simon & shuster days but I guess that's just me.
Since you are the PR and Community teams overseer I would lay at least some of the blame of this at your feet, but you admitted as much in your own post so I guess at least someone in CCP is acknowledging a Mea Culpa
All pitchforks and ranting aside (although it was justified since it finally got your attention) from the leaked internal documents it is clear that CCP's "game designers" have lost contact with their own game and are now more "market watchers" those that DO play the game are pushed into dev or analyst posities that can safely be ignored (Like John Turbefield, and I hope CCP HAMMER).
CCP needs les time managing and more time playing their own game so they'll know what the things are that people are concerned about. Their Fanfest has grown larger every year but the substance that used to be their is glossed over in marketing and PR. Note I said "their" fanfest and not "ours", and I was at the first!
Having fanfest with "new turrets" and "incarna" but not breathing a word about Aurum and MT in any practical terms and ignoring issues like Faction Warfare panels are just signs that CCP is more focused on quick flashy results and not looking their playerbase in the eye when it comes right to it. Especially since soon after the fanfest all the stuff that put the community in an aproar was released/announced.
Might I also suggest using the CSM as a genuine tool and not a PR stroke. The aurum for ships, 99$ fee and the high exchange rate for Aurum + other issues would all have encountered a "njet" for the CSM. You ignored them because of it, now you are here, not a good way to go, clearly!
In short, Less PR, more substance, don't look at what others are doing, copying is not being creative. ------------------------------------------------- A friend of death, a brother of luck and a son of a *****
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Val Arakian
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:06:00 -
[2075]
Originally by: Rotten Goat I have been playing since Mid-05 and I have disagreed or not really liked some of the changes or evolutions that Eve has made but this is the first time I've been irked enough to come forum posting regarding the changes.
'06 in my case. Just saying to give the "oh, it's just the same 2000 people" crowd something to consider.
Out with my 3 accounts.
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RougeOperator
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:07:00 -
[2076]
Originally by: Kitsunebi Sol'Rayven
3. I have read the Fearless Newsletter like most it has me worried about how CCP views EVE and its players. I do understand it was to be for employees and that it was meant for only employees that said; The memo gave very interesting insight on what some of the employees want EVE and CCP to be in the future. I honestly did not like some of the views and found it contrary to how CCP has presented its self thus far to the players. It seems like some are disconnected on what eve is in the first place and do not understand how changes of this magnitude can effect a game.
Yeah its pretty much the emperors new cloths now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emperor's_New_Clothes
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Ekon Bor
Amarr Van Diemen's Demise Merciless.
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:07:00 -
[2077]
-2 subs, but I was on three months so you've got a fair bit of time to redeem yourselves.
Incidentally, I'm a banker irl, and even I found the tone of that pdf contemptible. So there you go, you've actually caused moral disgust from a banker. Well done.
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Joe Astor
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:07:00 -
[2078]
I have been reading the threadnaught, and read the leaked PDF. Far as I can see, the part Soundwave posted in it was part of a debate.
I can still log into EVE and do what I want, missions, a bit of PVP etc. Some topics I can see why people are so mad, and others I don't see why people get so mad.
It seems people have lost confidence in CCP. CCP haven't done anything wrong by me (yet?)...so I don't really have an opinion either way in regards to this.
One thing I am hurt by though, is one of my best friends in-game is angry enough she is preparing to leave her Corporations and sell all her characters. This is one of the first friends I made when I started playing EVE, and we run missions and complexes together...friends of ours started calling us, plus another friend the 'Three Musketeers'.
We have been in the same Corp, different Corps, opposing Alliances, the biggest enjoyment I got out of the game wasn't being able to fly the nice T2 ships once I got the skills, it was running with really great friends I could trust...now because of the whole s**t storm that has brewed up, she has lost interest in the game and doesn't want to play/contribute money to the twisted entity she thinks CCP has become.
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Vikarion
Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:07:00 -
[2079]
Originally by: Kumq uat Have played this game for six years and NEVER pulled my I am cancelling my sub card. I did it today though. I have cancelled my sub and until CCP gives me a good reason to give them money again I won't.
Now if you will excuse me I feel sick to my stomach. Six ****ing years. Thought the only way I was leaving Eve was if CCP shut it down. I am gonna go be emo over in the corner here.
I know exactly how you feel, though I wasn't in quite as long. I hope, hope against hope that they at least promise no P2W items.
CCP, it is not just CQ. It is not just the prices. It's that you lied to us about your intentions and that you view us as gullible scum.
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Henrica Gaufridus
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:08:00 -
[2080]
Something else I didn't mention:
I thought the entire point of the Eve economy was to allow it to exist with minimal manipulation from CCP. Hell, I remember when they stopped seeding shuttles, so that people could make isk by producing them! There was butthurt over that, but in the end it was nice to make it completely player-based. The "invention" stuff was brilliant, took T2 out of the hands of the T2 BPO lottery winners, and put it in the hands of anyone who wanted to do it.
In short, almost everything in this game requires that you participate in order to get something. Rat, run missions, suicide gank haulers in Niarja, do what you do to get isk, which in turn gets you "stuff".
Or you could open your wallet, pull out your credit card, and get this vanity "stuff" (which will HOPEFULLY simply remain only vanity, but it doesn't look good judging by that newsletter thingy). It creates a divide in the game between station environment and space environment, like you're going from one game to the next. In space, it's all isk. In station, it's Aurum.
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xynix
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:08:00 -
[2081]
Originally by: Death Severus
^^ This I can fully support +1 to you good sir
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Vannimo
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:09:00 -
[2082]
Normally I'm not active in the EVE forums, but this time I want to use my voice.
So like many people said already, the vanity shop isn't what we wanted. EVE is a subscription game and not F2P, so make a choice there! Also, EVE has the best player driven economy ever, and now my clothes(read: future non-vanity items) just pop into existence? So either eve stops with subscriptions and turns into one of those hundreds of F2P games, or the vanity shop goes away.
I do think the CQ look good, but the whole movement is sloppy and slow. Also, I thought leaving the pod was a more private moment? Now it looks as if the character is hitting the outside, cold steel paneled deck. Hell, I can't even walk to the pod.
So what has Incarna really giving us? Updated turrets. Sorry, but that's not an expansion.
Please stay in touch
Vannimo
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Nullity
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:09:00 -
[2083]
Originally by: Vikarion
CCP, it is not just CQ. It is not just the prices. It's that you lied to us about your intentions and that you view us as gullible scum.
Exactly. Some of us figured early on that we were hurtling towards this MT oblivion, and you just kept lying through your teeth to us. It's despicable behavior.
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Baron Silverlane
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:11:00 -
[2084]
So, in the long run. You don't need to play the game anymore.
With the AUR system, and the upcoming bull****, you can just save your monthly payment and buy your "t3 battleship and turrets?". What will be the use of doing anything anymore? The whole noble exchange and microtransaction is f**ked up.
*Sigh* I really hope you'll see reason in what direction your developing the game. With the current state, i fear that you'll be loosing too much of the community that makes it EvE, and attract only gold buyers. (Oh.. perhaps that's your intent after all)
As someone stated earlier. Give us what WE (the community) want, not what YOU want.
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Parleion
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:11:00 -
[2085]
This is going to be buried, but I should probably add my voice to the chorus.
You guys are a business. It's your job to make money. You are making money, enough to fund the development of three games, all off of one game. That's awesome. But here's the thing, that money's coming from subscriptions. And yes, most of the accounts are not veterans. Most of them are not even remotely hardcore. But your veterans matter.
Sure people can come in, buy a game power up, buy skillpoints, whatever. That person buys the skill points to properly operate a supercarrier (having read that they're the big thing right now). That person then buys enough plex to fund the purchase of said supercarrier from one of the third party sellers (Guy's got a pretty great job if he can afford it). This person then flies that super carrier, all fancy and officer fitted, into lowsec to get some uber gankage going on. He promptly loses it, not having any of the requisite out of game skills to make it work.
He just spent, likely, hundreds of dollars. He just lost it all. He thought he would be invincible. He wasn't. He quits.
You guys got hundreds of dollars. That's a nice bit of cash from one person. And maybe there are quite a few more out there like him. But that one time infusion of hundreds of dollars isn't worth losing two long time players both running four accounts. That's 120 dollars a month.
That kind of long term recurring income is what a lot of people dream about, especially in this economy. It's worth far more than it appears at first, and if you're not careful you are going to lose it.
You have a very special game on your hands. It's imperfect, but it's far and away better than any other MMO out there, especially for the kind of players who want a real sandbox. For the players who want their actions to matter. For the players who want wins and losses to be more than just a scoreboard and box stats. These are the kinds of players that will keep your ship afloat. Listen to them.
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RougeOperator
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:12:00 -
[2086]
Edited by: RougeOperator on 24/06/2011 07:13:27 I can say honestly this is the straw breaking the camels back.
The Faction war panel mess was when I felt CCP no longer cared about its players.
Then the mess that was the Alliance tournament right from the drawings and its end result.
Then this current boondoggle.
And that list of things goes back further honestly but to me these events stuck out. It feels like they just dont care about EvE anymore other then what money they can bilk out of us players now.
I mean I cant think of anyone that was clamoring for this CQ stuff. Some were hopeful it might offer something new, but it turns out it was nothing but ill conceived greed.
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karrak
Muchacho's
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:12:00 -
[2087]
Im sitting on the fence right now, a full subscription and microtransactions ontop of that just dosent go well by me. More than likely you are going to continue putting out fires and show the **** down out throat anyway isnt helping.
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Rockstar from Mars
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:13:00 -
[2088]
Originally by: Vannimo Also, I thought leaving the pod was a more private moment? Now it looks as if the character is hitting the outside, cold steel paneled deck. Hell, I can't even walk to the pod.
Yeah, actually that bothers me a lot. I mean you are naked in a pod with goo. So at least getting in you are going to have to strip exposed to your crew and anyone with a good telescope and getting out I thought you would have a shower or something.
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Vladimir Ilych
Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:13:00 -
[2089]
Dear CCP Pann
I am sad to say that I was not angry before reading your post but I am now. To address your points.
As I see it, the chief complaint is regarding the high cost of goods in the Noble Market.
Second, many people are unhappy about the CaptainÆs Quarters.
Third, there are some performance issues with Incarna.
1. The issue is not the high cost of items on the Noble market. This is just funny. It means no one will buy them. The real issue (which you ignore in your statement) is that the Noble / Aurum / MT exists at all and that one day soon (unless this firestorm stops those employees driving the idea) CCP will be selling non vanity / game affecting items through it.
That day will be my last day here.
Your customers do not want this silly MT store. Businesses, so I hear, are supposed to listen to their customers.
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1395464
2. CQ. They are good. Very good in fact. A great first step into a non ship based physical environment. I have post on this elsewhere.
3. Performance issues (with CQ). I have these and I have logged a technical petition to help with the diagnosis for the problem. I am sure a patch to resolve the issues is already being created. This is just new patch bugs (been their got the t-shirt) and I am happy to wait while you fix it.
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Manos Heimenbarger
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:13:00 -
[2090]
Won't be long now and this threadnaught will surpass the original leaked document threadnaught...
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Pok Nibin
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:14:00 -
[2091]
Oh, great. The ankle biters finally made it in.
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bossanova terra
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:14:00 -
[2092]
Originally by: Veras Divinia First let me start by saying that the pre Incarna Eve was a great game. And I would venture to say that the vast majority of people responding to this post would agree. People are not THIS vocal about a game that they don't care about.
All that being said, the core issues here really boil down to those of trust and respect. Trust, once breached or broken, is very difficult to regain. Respect must be earned over time - both through words and actions.
Until the last couple of days, CCP had the trust of its players. It had crafted a unique experience in the world of gaming - exemplified by its motto of HTFU. It was a game designed for and played by players who wanted to challenge themselves in the best of ways.
There was also the impression that CCP respected its players - by creating this unique game and by asking us to be part of it and part of the ongoing cycle of developing it.
Both trust and respect have been lost in the last couple of days. The trust the players had in CCP and the sense that CCP respected them.
Internal document, working brief or diary, the Newsletter showed a blatant disregard for the trust and respect on which the Developers and players have relied on. On these forums and in posts CCP promised us that MT would not be used for anything other than vanity items. That Newsletter explicitly says otherwise. Thus is trust breached.
Even more concerning is the lack of respect for players as implied by that Newsletter. The Eve MT article speaks of hooking players on wares like addicts. The article goes so far as to compare the experience of MT to buying other forms of social interaction (eg. buying prostitutes).
Ultimately as Eve players we believed that we were partners with CCP in creating a new universe and experience in the sandbox of New Eden. Today we learned that we are simply commodities to be exploited.
CCP is a business and perhaps this exploitation should not be surprising, but CCP earned a special trust and respect by making its players feel like partners. To find out that was categorically untrue is disheartening at best.
It is unlikely that any response from CCP will satisfy everyone, but whatever response they make must begin to rebuild trust. The best and surest way for CCP to show it's respect is to read and listen to the comments here and understand how horrendously they have erred in their assessment of us.
In an ideal world, CCP would remove MT from the game - for good. That would go a long way to restoring trust and respect. More likely, a simple declaration that only Vanity (eg. non game enhancing) items will be sold would go a little way to rebuilding trust. An real apology and an acknowledgment of how badly CCP treated its player base on this issue would start it back on the road to respect.
HTFU CCP - The player base that has trusted you for years deserves your respect.
Well said V. CCP had/has something very rare in the consumer entertainment space - the loyalty and trust of its customers - as enticing as microtransactions seem to CCP executives burdened by the task of evaluating a complex balance sheet and the need to maximize monetization of years of investment and development, CCP has put at serious risk something that no amount of money, advertising, or marketing can ever regain or buy, namely LOYALTY and TRUST.
The exposure of the document in question coupled with a NeX pricing strategy that looks like pure unbridled greed has combined to expose the raw nerves of many players. When it's intimated that CCP believes their customers can be lead like lambs to the slaughter it further reinforces greed over game balance, greed over game play, and greed over loyalty and leads to a conclusion that the "Easy Button" will be purchasable by players - players will no longer have the HTFU they just have to PTFU (Pay the FU). |
Transporter Slave
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:15:00 -
[2093]
@CCP Pann
None of the stuff you mentioned breaks the BASIC PREMISE OF EVE: SANDBOX. The direction in which your beloved Lead Game Designer wants to push things, does.
That's the real issue here.
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Chandler Estidal
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:16:00 -
[2094]
There is existing content in this game that needs to be fixed. Fix it. No paying subscriber of EVE wants half ***, unfinished "new" content when the game they are playing is broken in every conceivable way.
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Vala Malderran
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:16:00 -
[2095]
!KILL THE PATCH KILL THE PATCH KILL THE PATCH KILL THE PATCH!
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Algathas
The Revenge of Auntie Freeze
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:17:00 -
[2096]
Edited by: Algathas on 24/06/2011 07:17:24
Originally by: Benilopax
Originally by: Pat Morrison
Originally by: Axemaster This is terrible and pathetic on every level.
Explain to us when you allowed money bagging fools into the company.
Then tell us when they will be leaving.
Otherwise things will most likely continue on their current path to destruction.
They're running the place. Joseph Gallo, former Citigroup managing director, is now the CFO, and is responsible for the strategic initiatives of the company.
ROFLMAO!
It's no wonder that CCP is going to fail. From the wiki:
"Citigroup suffered huge losses during the global financial crisis of 2008 and was rescued in November 2008 in a massive stimulus package by the U.S. government" The same year this guy who was a managing director for 14 years left them. Coincidence? I think not lol.
Haha CCP you hired a managing director of a crumbling bank to direct your strategic initiatives. That says it all.
This is unbelievable!
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Shawnm339
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:17:00 -
[2097]
This is nothing like someone reading your diary someone has took it upon themselves to release to the world the 'real' CCP vision for the future as seen by a leading developer of the game....we as players are a means to an end and no longer the cornerstone of the business that obv longer-serving members thought. People thought this was a great big spaceship flying family and we've just found out we're the rich obnoxious old man that no one in the family likes but puts up with cos he gives you money every month.....you know the one you all laugh about and call a cash cow???
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JaySee Denton
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:18:00 -
[2098]
DAMN CCP THEY WENT TO CHINA AND GOT ALL CHINA MONEY HUNGRY. NOM NOM NOM WANA MILK US LIKE COWS. MOOOOOO!!! .....
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VisKerric
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:20:00 -
[2099]
THE R.L. GORDON GECKO RUNS CCP NOW. OPEN THY WALLETS!
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Jehvan Sunburnadire
The Forgotten Legion Redrum Fleet
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Posted - 2011.06.24 07:20:00 -
[2100]
Originally by: Ragnar Wintermute Edited by: Ragnar Wintermute on 24/06/2011 07:00:51 Edited by: Ragnar Wintermute on 24/06/2011 06:51:57 I mentioned this earlier today. The issue simply boils down to this. The core of your gameplay is how players interface and interact with the economy. They all do it in a billion clever and not so clever ways. They are the economy.
The newsletter was maybe one of the most offensive things that I've ever read coming from a corporation. And it clearly illustrate that CCP wants to enter the player economy at the expense of completely breaking the foundation of the game. Incarna can be a miracle platform to expand your game and bring in more long term profits via subscription. I recall hearing ideas being tossed around for Incarna that would lead to the creation of new industry chains, professions, and other possible emergent events due to the fact that it would be a natural extension of the PLAYER ran Eve economy that we all know and love. Instead as mentioned in previous post we just have a GPU intensive shelf to remind us of how much REAL money we wasted on vanity items.
Was this an expansion for Eve and it's loyal citizens or an expansion for CCP?
Another note, don't ever think you can pull a fast one on your customers. You've created a product that caters to a niche market of people that wage economic warfare on each other for a past time. You're cash cow is smart, dangerous, and pretty volatile at the moment.
I'll love to resubscribe in a month or two when the micro-transactions are completely gone. I'm saying this because I know they will be or else yall might be. :(
Edit - Oh yeah, and your game is almost unplayable for people who don't have the time to commit to a corp. That should probably be a more pressing issue. And edit again because I'm ocd and have to fix typos...
QFT.
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