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An overdue apology and request for parley

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 19 post(s)
Nika Dekaia	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:26:00 - [2431] Originally by: glepp Ok CCP, since you said you're reading everything in this thread, here goes. I've cancelled 2/3 accounts, and will be cancelling the last one as well. All run out in sep-nov, so that is the time window for me to get interested in the game again. Why am i unsubscribing? 1. I don't like being lied to. You said to the CSM and us a few months back that Microtransactions would only ever be for vanity items. You lied. You are not only discussing it internally, you're implementing it, as confirmed by Scott Holden in your internal newsletter. 2. Microtransactions for non-vanity items will ruin the sandbox. The PLEX system is good, because it deals with RMT, however game-imbalancing it may be. I can accept that. What i cannot accept is that in a player-driven sandbox, you introduce non-player made items that give an advantage, available for RL money. That goes against the very basis of the Sandbox idea, and will ruin the game for me. 3. Forcing unwanted game elements on your customers because you want them to be Awesome. Captains Quarters suck. They make it harder for me to use your actual content, internet spaceships. I don't want to watch my characters bum in station, i want to be out flying. You're making that harder. If Incarna and CQ at some point becomes awesome and adds content to the game, then people will use it. Don't force us to watch your stupid space-barbie showcase when it adds no content to the game. How can you fix this? 1. HTFU and admit that you lied, and apologize so I can believe you. 2. Confirm once and for all that EVE will have no microtransactions for non-vanity items. 3. Make CQ and Incarna optional. Don't do this and lose your cash cow. If you don't see the writing on the wall, then you deserve to failcascade and die along with the other failed MMOs. I can understnd you want as many people to betatest your WoD engine. But you're basically making us pay to be your QA department. And although you had gotten much feedback before release on TQ, you completely ignored it. Although I will not quit just yet - be sure I will as soon as there is anything non vanity in your store. You ****ing promised it would be vanity only.
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:26:00 - [2432] Originally by: El'Niaga Originally by: Hoya en Marland lol they won't make CQ optional you ppl can forget about it - they didn't spend years developing... something... to be only a mere checkbox in your game settings You think they spent years on CQ...oh Lord what a maroon. At best this was 6 months of coding. Given performance so far I doubt their engine can handle interaction between players with their avatars. The system is far to taxing. Remember your just loading your own quarters and your own avatar now and even good machines are risking overheating. Add more polygons to the equation and you'll melt some. Oh no no no, don't forget about the first iteration they scrapped after Apocrypha! They had that **** at fanfest remember?
Sahvi Morvaalis R U D E	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:27:00 - [2433] Originally by: Elondris Singh Originally by: Sahvi Morvaalis Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 24/06/2011 09:19:42 Originally by: Elondris Singh I THINK that was soundwave, not manifest - but I could be wrong. I don't feel like going back over the threadnaught. Nonetheless CCP as an entity said this. It was CCP Shadow - he replied here a few months later. His excuse is that he basically said "there won't be" when all he really could have said with certainty would have been "I am unaware of any plans". Note how less than one year ago most posters were like "microtransactions no way" and now the prevailing attitude is "microtransactions for vanity items only is ok". As long as you behave like that CCP won't change... My main issue with the AUR system is not the concept of it... it works in OTHER games. It's the whole idea of adding yet another step to THIS GAME's currency transactions that is completely superfluous. MT or Subscriptions. Not both. Like I said earlier (not that I imagine any sane person can keep up): My ideal would be to ditch Aurum as a whole. Agreed on that one... the implementation is utter fail in this type of game. If you want your players to drive your economy, you don't implement MT. :\
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:27:00 - [2434] Originally by: Alexis Sachs Originally by: Hoya en Marland lol they won't make CQ optional you ppl can forget about it - they didn't spend years developing... something... to be only a mere checkbox in your game settings Well, the problem then is that while they spent those years making it, they also spent those years telling us it in fact would be optional. ^ This. At first I was against making it optional; but I've reconsidered my position, as the guy with the 'zoom-out' idea (somewhere above) makes it so immersion isn't broken for either side of the argument. I find his to be an equitable solution to all. -- "All your monies AUR belong to us." -- CCP
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:27:00 - [2435] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Originally by: Eyup Mi'duck Originally by: PC l0adletter Parlay proposal: Next expansion: EVE online: return of the spaceships. Me slobbers at the mere thought of this... Screw it. EVE Online: TOTAL HELL DEATH! It gets my vote. +1. this, along with alot of other stuff mentioned here, would definatly get my attention. as long as its not half-assed that is. (past 2 years of expansions, i'm looking at YOU.) heres something for your lore guys to work with. The Amarr, after rebuilding strength following the Jovian defeat/Minmatar rebellion, decide enough is enough and decide to bring the Minmatar "back into the fold" After the initial assault, The Gallente, no longer willing to be just "Shady supporters" Join the conflict on behalf of the Minmatar. This Obviously Brings the Caldari to the aid of the Amarr, Missile bays blazing. All sides release new ships that have been in development since the T3 Cruiser breakthroughs. (T3 frigs? T3 BCs? ect ect) then again, it kinda sounds like FW, and we all know where that ended up. It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Oosel The Nightwatch Night Coven	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:27:00 - [2436] us real oldies could never forget the one and only Pann....Hi by the way and props to you for taking what must be a huge one for the team (shame on ccp for offering you up as the sacrificial lamb lol) having been back about 3 months after break to try other games (i know shame on me also) eve was like a whole new amazing game and from the good old days the 2 patches ive done are no worse than the ones of old but the fact that there was utter silence for 2 days from you is what annoyed a great many people. i know it must have been difficult but anything at all even a we are aware of peoples concerns and are taking stock would have done
Shasz Royal Black Watch Highlanders Warped Aggression	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:27:00 - [2437] Originally by: CCP Pann Edited by: CCP Pann on 24/06/2011 00:50:29 Hi, everyone ... Like I said, I wonFt be able to answer all of your questions tonight, but I promise weFll start getting some info out tomorrow. As I see it, the chief complaint is regarding the high cost of goods in the Noble Market. Second, many people are unhappy about the CaptainFs Quarters. Third, there are some performance issues with Incarna. I would appreciate it if you would confirm my observations or tell me what IFm missing, but I do ask that you do it in a productive way. I will remove posts without prejudice if they are counterproductive to the conversation I hope to have with you. ... The Noble market is just fluff anyway, it has nothing to do with gameplay to me, so its my bottom complaint. The chief issue to me is the continued breaking of the user interface. Functionality keeps being lost in little ways patch after patch: 1) CTRL-key meta ability still doesn't work if the EVE window doesn't start with application focus. (Ever since the new hotkey system went in) 2) Drone bay groups don't maintain their status anymore if you launch the entire drone bay - it disappears and redraws itself with all groups closed again. ~Incarna~ 3) The jump from in a ship to in CQ should have the intermediary step of being in a hangar. I'm all for CQ, think its a great way to expand the universe. But don't do it at the expense of the hangar interface we had! It worked! Give us an "enter CQ" button to choose when we go into the paper doll mode, and then _completely_ change the interface to the CQ mode - don't just overlay the typical EVE interface onto the CQ stuff - they don't mesh well at all and get in each other's way. 4) Drag ships from ship window to main window was THE main way to activate and know what ship was active. I thought that functionality to drag the ship into the window was going to stay with CQ, but it is gone. Major useability loss there. 5) The new guns look great - their icons look like crap, load slowly in inventory (are they dynamically generated?) and in many cases cannot be seen against the dark blackness of space when activated on a target. (One can't easily see minmatar artillery icons that are activated on a target - black on black is poor contrast) Overall - Incarna just feels poorly thought out. I have the patience to see it all be fixed, but if its going to drag out until the next expansion and then be forgotten, I'll probably find a new home. The harder the game is to use, the less fun it is. ___________________________________
Cosmoes Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:28:00 - [2438] Originally by: DeathCam HOW ABOUT SOME ANSWERS? Haahahah, CCP aren't going to give you any answers. This was an attempt to release some rage while they all promptly ignored this thread. They can't even answer all the question in their own answer thread, and that was before we got hit with a couple of massive **** storms that drove up the rage/dangerous question levels. This coming blog, if you are expecting anything other than corporate run around empty words and vague references along the lines of "We aren't planning RMT for game play items...... yet" you are kidding yourself. ------------------- piccy
Ozymondias Harshe	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:28:00 - [2439] As of now there are eighty pages of response to this topic. I think that the answers to your questions have been provided, two or three or five dozen times over. I have little to add to those who have come before me. I can only add my voice in the hope that enough people come to you and say enough so that you realize this isn't a problem that will go away. That we are just "adjusting to change" Yes we know already people who have couple billion ISK have the advantage, they can buy faction ships an items. Yes we realize that with plex sales the opportunity to just throw real world money into the game to buy these things is available. No that does not give you the right to sell ANYTHING other than vanity items for RL money. Unless there was a character who mined his ore risked can flip and sat through hours of staring at roids, just to get the isk to buy the plex. Unless there was a blueprint carefully researched and gathered and used. Unless that item came from us the players....You are letting anyone come in a pay you for the privilege to use what amounts to a cheat code so he can compete. I don't even PvP and I still that's is some major bull. My subscription runs out soon and I don't think I will be renewing. Thanks for the great memories.
Mikal Morataya	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:28:00 - [2440] Originally by: DeathCam HOW ABOUT SOME ANSWERS? This

Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:28:00 - [2441] You know there is a real upside to all this. Empire carebears and people who joined after Dominion now get to see first hand a proper corp fail-cascade. Originally by: Nika Dekaia Although I will not quit just yet - be sure I will as soon as there is anything non vanity in your store. You ****ing promised it would be vanity only. You've missed the point like a couple of others. This stuff proves what many have been saying for 2-3 years, CCP itself if the broken thing. Not the game or implementation of features. The thing you say you will quit over has already happened and past. Unsubscribe before you're the only one left. His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Sahvi Morvaalis R U D E	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:29:00 - [2442] Originally by: Token Afrodude Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Originally by: Eyup Mi'duck Originally by: PC l0adletter Parlay proposal: Next expansion: EVE online: return of the spaceships. Me slobbers at the mere thought of this... Screw it. EVE Online: TOTAL HELL DEATH! It gets my vote. +1. this, along with alot of other stuff mentioned here, would definatly get my attention. as long as its not half-assed that is. (past 2 years of expansions, i'm looking at YOU.) heres something for your lore guys to work with. The Amarr, after rebuilding strength following the Jovian defeat/Minmatar rebellion, decide enough is enough and decide to bring the Minmatar "back into the fold" After the initial assault, The Gallente, no longer willing to be just "Shady supporters" Join the conflict on behalf of the Minmatar. This Obviously Brings the Caldari to the aid of the Amarr, Missile bays blazing. All sides release new ships that have been in development since the T3 Cruiser breakthroughs. (T3 frigs? T3 BCs? ect ect) then again, it kinda sounds like FW, and we all know where that ended up. Don't tell me I could get a frig hotter than my Dramiel... makin' me all tingly 'n stuff...
Veryez	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:29:00 - [2443] Originally by: Vyktor Abyss Can you at CCP now promise that any "micro-transaction" plans will be permanently shelved regarding any transactions that would give players an in-game advantage or advancement such as standing, ammo, ships, skillpoint boosts etc?[/b] This is a major game breaking question, I play eve (and have for the last 5 years plus) because: 1) It's a single server. 2) Skills can only be improved in real time, there is no advantage for some one who can play 20+ hours a day or has rl money. The second part is vital since it weeds out the ones looking for instant gratification and leads to dedicated players. It's one of your core strengths in my eyes. The second you allow people to improve their in-game position through MT, you break the core. If you allow people to buy ships, guns, ammo, or god forbid skill points, eve might as well be wow. Ironically enough it's your longer termed players who could really abuse this system anyway. You might argue about the character bazzar, but there aren't many 100+ mil sp characters for sale. Yes MT will make CCP more money, but at what cost? Do you want your long term players to leave? Do you really want a large bunch of 6 month or less players to be your core players?
Alexis Sachs	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:30:00 - [2444] Originally by: Ranka Mei Originally by: Alexis Sachs Originally by: Hoya en Marland lol they won't make CQ optional you ppl can forget about it - they didn't spend years developing... something... to be only a mere checkbox in your game settings Well, the problem then is that while they spent those years making it, they also spent those years telling us it in fact would be optional. ^ This. At first I was against making it optional; but I've reconsidered my position, as the guy with the 'zoom-out' idea (somewhere above) makes it so immersion isn't broken for either side of the argument. I find his to be an equitable solution to all. Agreeing with you agreeing with me lol. I happened to like that zoom-out idea myself. It makes it so everyone can be happy. You want it? You got it. You don't want it, you don't have to have it. Hugs for all!
Dopesick Ice Hogz	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:30:00 - [2445] Originally by: CCP Pann Edited by: CCP Pann on 24/06/2011 00:50:29 Apologies and stuff There is only one reason my 6 accounts have been shut down... Many years ago, CCP assured the playerbase that microtransactions would never be a part of Eve. When PLEX came out, I was concerned that it was a sign of what was to come, but continued to play. Now, we see... You guys ruined a pure gaming environment. Since I doubt the MT you have introduced will be removed, it is time for me (as well as many others) to move on to other ventures. I thank you CCP for 7 years of online entertainemnt. I'm disappointed in you CCP for going back on your word.
Morrow Borric Minmatar Reikoku	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:31:00 - [2446] "Posted - 2011.06.24 00:30:00" Already up to 82 pages, I hope you are paying real good attention to this CCP. You all need to go back through your meeting notes and identify when the term ' player community' was replaced with the term 'subscriber base' and sack the person who did it. ------------------------------------------ "I used to play Eve Online because I enjoyed how it made me feel, now I play to stop from getting sick."
Cutter Isaacson Minmatar Fearsome Engine	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:32:00 - [2447] THREAD NEEDS GLUE PLEASE NAVIGATOR, OR FALLOUT, OR WRANGLER, OR PANN OR ANYONE!!!!! Originally by: Urban Dictionary Bro we just got monocled by CCP
Sahvi Morvaalis R U D E	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:32:00 - [2448] Edited by: Sahvi Morvaalis on 24/06/2011 09:32:46 Originally by: Morrow Borric "Posted - 2011.06.24 00:30:00" Already up to 82 pages, I hope you are paying real good attention to this CCP. You all need to go back through your meeting notes and identify when the term ' player community' was replaced with the term 'subscriber base' and sack the person who did it. I left for a dev team meeting late last night and this thread was at 5 pages.... I got home and it was in the 70s.
Bomberlocks Minmatar CTRL-Q	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:33:00 - [2449] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: CCP Manifest Still reading. Progress? I am at post 325. Good luck, you might catch up to the thread in about two days at this rate ... I might as well mention again since I'm posting that this rage boils down to an issue with the direction of the company. There may not be much that CCP can do about it at this point for various reasons, but it has to be dealt with. No tiptoeing around the elephant anymore. This is a very good post. There's no point in trying to avoid the direct questions any more because people are very suspicious of anything you say at the moment and will see through those attempts. There may well be people willing to pay you a subscription as well as money for extra services and in game advantages and goods as Soundwave described. You have a better chance of succeeding as a company if you admit to this. --------------------- Countdown to sub running out: 9 days.
Lady Aleena	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:33:00 - [2450] Edited by: Lady Aleena on 24/06/2011 09:34:03 I didn't read the whole 81 pages so I apologize if I repeat what already has been said. Therefore I respond to your first post only. In my humble opinion you miss the order of the main points of concern. Imho people do not like (in that order): a) Micro-Transactions that affect the game play. I think most people like or do not care about vanity items. b) Not being able to have the option to keep the status quo of their station screen (spinnable ship). c) CQ having performance issues. d) CCP developing stuff that the current population does not care that much about when you could hone the game the people like to play (though most people understand you want to address a broader audience). e) The actual items and prize of the shop (mind this is the last point of concer).

Rakshasa Taisab Caldari Sane Industries Inc. Initiative Mercenaries	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:34:00 - [2451] What would Sir Digby Chicken Ceasar do?
robbyx	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:34:00 - [2452] No one is coming to answer questions...they dont give a s**t...in fact i bet they are all sitting around laughing their a$$es of right now...thats why they sent some useless, clueless bint to make this thread, she was the only one who could keep a straight face long enough.
Demure Guise	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:34:00 - [2453] Originally by: Ozymondias Harshe As of now there are eighty pages of response to this topic. I think that the answers to your questions have been provided, two or three or five dozen times over. Very true.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:34:00 - [2454] One thing I'd like to point out, although my memory is a bit off. During the fanfest presentations about Incarna, at least once it was said we'd be able to build shops & bars and that stations would have sockets we could bolt our builds on to (for a price in ISK much like renting a corp office somewhere) and these would be limited so prime locations would be expensive... fair enough. It was intimated that CCP would be providing us templates with some tools and be left pretty much to our own devices so we, as players, could build our brands in EVE. True there was some pshawing about this being SL in Space and a few comments about furries inbound but it seemed agreed by the majority that yes, this would be a good thing. There are a lot of talented EVE players after all and it seemed the most cost effective way of generating all the content Incarna would need. So... with NeX providing all of our Incarna content... why, exactly, would I build a bar/shop/coffee house/hash bar/whatever in a station?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:34:00 - [2455] Originally by: Lady Aleena Edited by: Lady Aleena on 24/06/2011 09:34:03 I didn't read the whole 81 pages so I apologize if I repeat what already has been said. Therefore I respond to your first post only. In my humble opinion you miss the order of the main points of concern. Imho people do not like (in that order): a) Micro-Transactions that affect the game play. I think most people like or do not care about vanity items. b) Not being able to have the option to keep the status quo of their station screen (spinnable ship). c) CQ having performance issues. d) CCP developing stuff that the current population does not care that much about when you could hone the game the people like to play (though most people understand you want to address a broader audience). e) The actual items and prize of the shop (mind this is the last point of concer). f) all of the above = CCP management. His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:35:00 - [2456] My 2 cents to fix the ****storm: - Lower NEx prices so a full set of vanity items is worth less than a PLEX -i.e., (feet + bottom + top clothes) < 3500 aur. Give money back to people who already bought the stuff and owe it - Develop a way to switch between hangar view and CQ view. That's how should had been done since the beginning for sake of immersion and performance. Make CQ the default so newbies won't miss it, but for christ's sake, allow people to choose something better than a depressing picture of a door if they don't want to use(?) the CQ - spend the next year seriously regaining all the trust and confidence you have thrown away with the endless row of stoopid PR mistakes you've been making lately, not the least that the shadowy leaking of a internal memo has been the loudest and clearest statement of intent your company has made in a year
Cham Palaung	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:36:00 - [2457] Originally by: Aria Jenneth Keep your worlds as pure as you can, even as everybody else is going "freemium." We'll pay for that courtesy, because it, too, will be unique. That's wonderfully said, and exactly what i think, thank you Aria.
Tergiminius Binary Star	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:36:00 - [2458] I'm not sure if it's been said above but I'm guessing a lot of people accept that as a company you need to make more revenue, it's just the way of all MMO's today to have some form of micro-transactions. The issue a lot of people have though is your forcing a feature onto everyone that only a percentage of the community really wants; even if you're not actually buying the vanity items yourself you're still paying for them through increased plex pricing. A solution I think that would work for all is to keep Aurum but as a tradeable commodity on the marketplace (like gold bars have a value in RL) and remove the connection from plex - people can buy the Aurum in their account and sell it on the market or use it to buy clothes, other people who don't want to pay their own money for the clothes can buy the Aurum from the market and get them that way. Of other MMO's I can think of everyone knows people spent stupid amounts of money on the vanity items but at the same time them that don't want them aren't paying for them. Another point that makes people angry is you've introduced a concept of vanity items but the whole point of vanity is to show off to others your styles, what's the point if only you can see it ? I'm sure some will argue about the forum avatar which is fair but it's not like you can flaunt your stuff around others. Once we actually have the ability to walk around other people you're going to get a huge uptake in this, it's just the way things work. The bottom line is you should have made it non-dependable on the whole community (PLEX) and actually gave us the ability to mingle with other vain people to show off our clothes. Until both of these cases were true you should have held back on releasing this feature.
Leon Tango	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:36:00 - [2459] Think about the NGE expansion for SWG and its consequences. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_Galaxies We've learned a thing or two with our experiences with the NGE and don't plan on repeating mistakes from the past and not listening to the players. yJohn Smedley, president of Sony Online Entertainment
Aineko Macx	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:36:00 - [2460] ________________________ CCP: Where fixing bugs is a luxury, not an obligation.



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HOW ABOUT SOME ANSWERS?

HOW ABOUT SOME ANSWERS?

His name was John Turbefield!

THREAD NEEDS GLUE PLEASE NAVIGATOR, OR FALLOUT, OR WRANGLER, OR PANN OR ANYONE!!!!!

His name was John Turbefield!