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Daakar Vish Ashtadu
Amarr Royal Amarr Institute
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Posted - 2011.06.27 02:26:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Daakar Vish Ashtadu on 27/06/2011 02:27:41 Edited by: Daakar Vish Ashtadu on 27/06/2011 02:27:01 Alright. I'm still newbin' at this, so please bear with me. I've recently lost in my first PvP encounter. I'm not fretting it, since it's part of the game and I expected that, but there were a couple of thing that bothered me:
The first is that I had no idea how to react except as I had for my PvE encounters (orbit and shoot). This I expect to change with experience, plus I'm finding plenty to read on tactics, so I'm not really concerned here. I expect to lose plenty more ships in working out the kinks on this front.
However, the one thing that I haven't found much information on is how to size up one's opponent. When someone shows up, how can I tell whether I should run or whether I can stand and fight? Is it purely a matter of knowing what fit-ups are common for what ship? Are there modules that are handy for this (and are they worth fitting)? I also imagine that time is of the essence, so are there any tips on how to assess another ship efficiently?
Any and all advice accepted.
Edit: slightly unrelated question: is there a way to get notification on thread updates? I'd like to try and stay on top of this without having to search for my own posts all the time.
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Fuzzy Pickle
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Posted - 2011.06.27 04:02:00 -
[2]
Knowing what ships are capable of what is a big part of it, and another is simply show info on the pilot. His employment history will give you a fair guess of the skill points of the pilot. If you're facing someone with large lead on you and has actively chosen to fight you chances are they are confident of their victory. They've checked you out long before they decided to engage. A quick view of the ship can also tell you if this ship is setup for close or long range engagement. Knowing that can help you try to dictate a range that is most beneficial to you and least to him. |
Gunner Cid
The Carebear Stare
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Posted - 2011.06.27 04:08:00 -
[3]
You have the basic idea.
For example, if you were in a rifter and they were in a shuttle you would immediately know the capabilities of that shuttle and your chance for winning.
As you continue to develop in Eve and grow in basic ship fitting knowledge you will be able to make better informed decisions.
Couple factors to consider;
*What ship they are flying and what are likely fits (for example if you see a hurricane and zoom in and notice he has shield hardeners, he is probably nano fit 2-2.5kms max speed, 425s, neuts, with an effective dmg range of around 30-35km)
*Your surroundings (50 people in local? he has 10 corpmates in local? You saw he had 5 corpmates staged in an adjacent system? Jamming rats in the belt?)
*How you plan to control the field (fight in the middle of belts, close range obit etc) and what they may do to prevent that, how will you adjust? Is it a successful plan?
Those are just a couple but I reckon as basic as it gets. Different people go about things differently, pvp in Eve is basically understanding game mechanics, the enviroment and how to leverage them to benefit your engagement plan. A different solution is to just leverage numbers, the more people you have compared to your targets the more "things" you can just ignore.
I highly reccommend that you try to meet like minded individuals and sponge some informaiton. There are a lot of corporations that are willing to assist a newcomer and can provide you with a foundation to build from.
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BlinDeamon
Asteroid Liberation Force
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Posted - 2011.06.27 04:26:00 -
[4]
Start with mining barges and work your way up.
Rifter > all other frigates Rupture > all other cruisers Hurricane > all other BCs Don't learn in battleships
These are not always true, but a decent guide on what you'll see a lot...
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Khanh'rhh
Sudden Buggery Situation: Normal
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Posted - 2011.06.27 13:52:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Daakar Vish Ashtadu Alright. I'm still newbin' at this, so please bear with me. I've recently lost in my first PvP encounter.
Can we assume that this loss is the first encounter?
The first thing to bear in mind, is your ship wasn't PVP fit, or even fully fit. You'd apply some damage, but in the end, choosing to engage was always going to result in your defeat (at minimum, you'd need a way of stopping him from leaving). I imagine you're wondering how to fully fit that thing, being limited on CPU and powergrid. Dropping the 'medium' small (try to stay with me..) for the dual pulse versions will free up a lot of fitting room. They also track frigates better.
Now there's 101 different threads and guides on how to turn that punisher into a PVP workhorse, so I will stick to your basic question.
The first thing to look at is his character age. A huge gap between his and yours, and you need to be very skilled for it to work. Even still, he could never have done anything but mine rocks for 8 months, so to get a better idea, lookup his combat record. His is here. You can see he has a 14:1 K/D ratio and a habit for PVP. Probably not the best first encounter possible. Arnon, in general, is habituated by a special subset of ****** who think they're awesome for blowing up 2 week old noobs in frigates, day in and out.
If you would like to learn PVP, I suggest heading to a corp who will support you and help you learn. Despite losing, its good that you engage and don't run away.
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Drykor
Minmatar Aperture Harmonics K162
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Posted - 2011.06.27 14:14:00 -
[6]
The only way to learn is by losing a lot of ships to various other ships. Keep at it and you'll get a feeling for it. If you run level 4 missions occasionally you can lose T1 frigates or even cruisers all day long. To make things go a little faster you could just study common pvp ships and see what they're generally capable of. As you play for longer and longer, you'll just keep adding ships and their likely fits to your knowledge base. --- Drykor - AHARM |
Daakar Vish Ashtadu
Amarr Royal Amarr Institute
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Posted - 2011.06.27 14:25:00 -
[7]
Good info all around. Thanks, gang.
I figured it might just come down to experience. I was wondering whether there was some trick to quickly assessing someone. I think I'll start looking around for a corp.
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Darryl Ward
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Posted - 2011.06.27 17:58:00 -
[8]
The trick to knowing whether or not to engage or run comes down to knowing what ships are capable of. The only thing you will know when someone warps into your grid is what type of ship they are flying, from there you need to make a judgment call to run or stay.
The actualy combat is not a lot different from typical PVE encounters, orbit and shoot, but a lot of players use manual flying instead of relying on the AI to choose the path for you.
Their are modules to scan down ship fittings, but they aren't used on the actual combat ship. You would do something like warp in at 100+ km, target and scan the ship, then warp away. From there, you would really know if you should engage or not.
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Tza Omi
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Posted - 2011.06.27 18:22:00 -
[9]
I've always had a couple questions on the subject of scanning a ship, obviously if you use a regular target lock to target your scanner then they should see that you are targeting them. If you use the passive targeting module do they have any clue they are being scanned?
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GavinGoodrich
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Posted - 2011.06.27 18:35:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Tza Omi I've always had a couple questions on the subject of scanning a ship, obviously if you use a regular target lock to target your scanner then they should see that you are targeting them. If you use the passive targeting module do they have any clue they are being scanned?
Yes and no. They can still see the graphics effect of the scanner aimed at their ship if they're paying attention (probably not), and once the passive targeter finishes it's cycle, it's possible for them to see your lock. Hence, why highsec gankers/ship scanners scan and unlock quickly before they get spotted. \o |
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Varrik Kayne
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.06.27 18:43:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Tza Omi I've always had a couple questions on the subject of scanning a ship, obviously if you use a regular target lock to target your scanner then they should see that you are targeting them. If you use the passive targeting module do they have any clue they are being scanned?
The passive Targeter has been broken for a long time. One of Eve's thousanDs of little things that needs fixing. -------
I have a Sig Radius, therefore I am. |
Grombel
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Posted - 2011.07.10 21:03:00 -
[12]
It's not broken you just don't know how to use it properly.
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I likegirls
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.07.11 00:54:00 -
[13]
Ship bonuses, common fittings for the ships, damage type(if they are firing lasers at t2 minmatar hulls for example)
Your own ship. Do your guns require cap and you are going against a curse?
Browse killboards and fitting sections of forums to better familiarize yourself.
The corporation/alliance the pilot is in you are squaring up. <3 |
vorneus
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Posted - 2011.07.11 12:53:00 -
[14]
What everyone else has said is really sound advice, and I have just one thing to add.
USE THE TEST SERVER.
Singularity is an invaluable source of experience in a completely safe and lossless environment. Hell, you even MAKE money on Sisi (not that it's useful for anything) because the base insurance payout is more than the combined cost of all modules, rigs and ships you lose.
Get yourself some fits together for WHAT YOU'LL BE FLYING ON TQ (I stress this point because lots of people fly ridiculous ships that they'll never use on Sisi just because they can, eg: alliance tournament reward ships, limited edition ships, faction etc..)
Sure it's tempting to try out these fancy ships, but won't serve you very well when you're in a standard T1 cruiser on TQ and getting your behind handed to you :)
In short, get on Sisi and engage everything you feel like. You can dock and refit in a jiffy and you'll learn more than you ever can in the same time on TQ.
More importantly, have fun!
-Ed
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NoLimit Soldier
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Posted - 2011.07.11 13:50:00 -
[15]
My process is as follows:
1. What is he flying relative to what I am? If I'm in a Merlin and he is in a Vexor than this is a BAD idea. If he is in a Brutix and I'm in a Jag it is go time.
2. Assuming #1 was to close to tell, do a check info on the pilot. You are doing 2 things here: A: Checking sec status / wanted status. If he is +5.0 security I'll go a ship class up. B: Setting his corp to negative status and doing a local sweep.
** I personally don't look at age, I personally don't find it as relevant as sec status or wanted status.
3. If I am still debating it (IE: Looks like he knows what he is doing but is in a comedy fit) I'll check his killboard real quick.
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