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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 8 post(s) |
Oraac Ensor
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
65
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Posted - 2012.11.06 21:21:00 -
[31] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Exploration Tutorials You require a civilian analyser or salvager for the Mag site and a civilian codebreaker for the Radar site, they aren't issued by the exploration agent and it's unclear that you can use an equivalent module purchased off the market if you have the skills. This probably needs fixing so that the agents issue the required modules when they give you the mission. Currently the modules are issued during the business tutorials.
Business Tutorials The business tutorials issue all of the civilian modules required for both the business & exploration tutorials, however there is nothing to say that a new player doing the tutorials should do the business ones before the exploration ones.
Then something went wrong.
I've just taken my latest character through the career tutorials and both the Exploration and Business agents supplied the civilian modules.
Not only that, but I always take my characters through the career tutorials for all races so as to pick up all the freebie racial skills etc, and the modules were provided by every agent involved. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Holistic Materials Research Council
2883
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Posted - 2012.11.06 21:41:00 -
[32] - Quote
Hmm in that case there appears to be a slightly inconsistent behaviour with the tutorial missions. I'm going to grind the other 2 sets of Amarr tutorial agents because of the standings boosts they give so I shall see if there's a difference between agents and update as I go.
Thanks for pointing it out Oraac Blessed are the meek, for they shall be slaughtered -á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á-á---CCP can't patch stupid---
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Oraac Ensor
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
65
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Posted - 2012.11.06 23:15:00 -
[33] - Quote
I did Aire Arryns on 27 October with no problem. |
Madyson Tyrus
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.11.27 21:58:00 -
[34] - Quote
I would like to see a set of tutorial missions for Planetary Interaction.
I'm down to Adv. Military as my final tutorial agent, and thus far I think that the Tutorials are pretty good. Far better than they were years ago when I first tried(and gave up on) this game.
I don't know what changes you made to the combat, but it seemed a lot more fun and engaging to me now than it did then. could be cause last time i was caldari, throwing missiles at stuff from 2 solar systems away. *shrug*
I joined with the intent to be an Industry type, Manufacturing and Mining. But through the tutorials I have developed a liking for Exploration and Salvaging. The tutorial does a very good job of giving you a taste of a variety of roles, and giving you enough ships and a balanced skill set to eventually venture in whichever direction you choose.
Bravo, CCP. You just may have won me over this time. |
J'Poll
KIngs of the Underground Side Effect.
562
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Posted - 2012.11.27 22:03:00 -
[35] - Quote
Madyson Tyrus wrote:I would like to see a set of tutorial missions for Planetary Interaction.
I'm down to Adv. Military as my final tutorial agent, and thus far I think that the Tutorials are pretty good. Far better than they were years ago when I first tried(and gave up on) this game.
I don't know what changes you made to the combat, but it seemed a lot more fun and engaging to me now than it did then. could be cause last time i was caldari, throwing missiles at stuff from 2 solar systems away. *shrug*
I joined with the intent to be an Industry type, Manufacturing and Mining. But through the tutorials I have developed a liking for Exploration and Salvaging. The tutorial does a very good job of giving you a taste of a variety of roles, and giving you enough ships and a balanced skill set to eventually venture in whichever direction you choose.
Bravo, CCP. You just may have won me over this time.
I fully support the idea of something like Adv. Industry which will explain PI and bit of research etc. Inject your skillbook before you leave the station. Neo didnGÇÖt learn Kung-Fu by having it sit in his usb drive.-á If it moves, shoot it. If it doesn't move, poke it with your gun and then shoot it. We are not running, we are advancing in the opposite direction |
Ralph Vynneve
The Yaar Offices of Pointe Webb and Podemall Easily Distracted.
0
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Posted - 2012.12.14 22:51:00 -
[36] - Quote
There are redundant and (I believe) missing rewards in the tutorials. In the career agent missions the Propulsion Jamming skill book is offered twice. In a later tutorial, you are asked to fit an afterburner to your ship, but it is not mentioned beforehand that you have to buy the skillbook. I think that one of the Propulsion Jamming rewards is meant to be the Afterburner skillbook.
The rewards in the tutorials need to have better progression. The redundant rewards and apparently missing ones are confusing to a new player. |
Lilian Halcombe
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.12.21 11:10:00 -
[37] - Quote
Dallas Apuri wrote:Exploration - I loved these tutorials. Setting up the probes, scanning for different types of spots and using the mods to open them up. I wouldn't change this at all.
I despise this part of the tutorial with a passion. I'm still stuck on the first of the advanced ones after 2 hours because the stupid gravimetric thingy I'm supposed to be finding keeps disappearing on me.
I can find it within 1 AU, I move all the probes to 0.5 AU and it vanishes, every single time. I move one back out to 1 AU it appears again. Dozens of attempts now and I still can't find it.
Not to mention the tutorial doesn't explain how to manipulate the map to focus on the probes instead of your ship so I'm stuck with the map focused on my ship trying to manipulate the locations of probes half a system away.
As a tutorial for a new player it is a frustrating, boring annoyance.
If as another poster says I need modules from the business tutorial to complete the exploration one then I'm screwed because I got rid of all of those once I finished the business one for minerals to use in the industrial one.
As for the the other tutorial missions,
Military - OK Advanced Military - OK Business - OK Industry - Not a crafter, couldn't work out how to make stuff properly so I bought them off the market place and finished it that way. |
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ISD Athechu
ISD STAR
150
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Posted - 2012.12.21 14:32:00 -
[38] - Quote
Lilian Halcombe wrote:
As a tutorial for a new player it is a frustrating, boring annoyance.
Just wanted to say that you could always skip the tutorial if you wanted to it's not required to do but hit's very highly recommended. If you wanted to skip one part of the tutorial you can go into F12 > tutorial tab and then just select the next tutorial down.
Also if you are missing some items for the tutorial or career missions just file a petition under Game Play > Missions in Progress and I'm sure a GM can help out.
But as I suggest it's all Highly Recommended to do. ISD Athechu Commander ISD STAR (Support Training and Resources) EVE New Citizens Q&A Resources |
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Lilian Halcombe
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2012.12.23 09:28:00 -
[39] - Quote
ISD Athechu wrote:[quote=Lilian Halcombe]Also if you are missing some items for the tutorial or career missions just file a petition under Game Play > Missions in Progress and I'm sure a GM can help out.
It does seem that the tutorial gives all the required item, the only hard part was working out how to scan but once I watched that youtube video it all made perfect sense and scanning is now one of my preferred professions (although I'm primarily running missions and salvaging stuff at the moment).
Fortunately the in game assistance from other players has been very good so far. Any problems, I ask and someone will usually answer straight away. |
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ISD Athechu
ISD STAR
150
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Posted - 2012.12.23 16:57:00 -
[40] - Quote
Lilian Halcombe wrote:ISD Athechu wrote:[quote=Lilian Halcombe]Also if you are missing some items for the tutorial or career missions just file a petition under Game Play > Missions in Progress and I'm sure a GM can help out. It does seem that the tutorial gives all the required item, the only hard part was working out how to scan but once I watched that youtube video it all made perfect sense and scanning is now one of my preferred professions (although I'm primarily running missions and salvaging stuff at the moment). Fortunately the in game assistance from other players has been very good so far. Any problems, I ask and someone will usually answer straight away.
That's excellent to hear. Just every so often the tutorials act up and only way to fix them is to petition it. It's rare but it happens so just wanted to make you aware of that option as well in case it's something that you can't get an answer to. ISD Athechu Commander ISD STAR (Support Training and Resources) EVE New Citizens Q&A Resources |
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Maire Gheren
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
51
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Posted - 2012.12.28 20:16:00 -
[41] - Quote
Would it be possible to put pictures into the instructions? Maybe a link to a tutorial webpage with pictures (or video that would play in the ingame browser)?
A lot of important concepts need pictures to understand.
Sig radius is hard to explain. Three pictures, showing something like a shotgun hit on targets of different sizes, would explain the concept perfectly. "Turret radius smaller than target *target with small hole blown in it* Turret radius same as target *target shredded with holes* turret radius bigger than target *tiny target, mostly untouched, with holes around it*". How it's described in tutorial is a bit dry and unintuitive, because it speaks to the mathematical aspect.
Tracking confuses people; an animation of a big cartoon gun turret trying unsuccessfully to follow something zooming around it with labels of "tracking" and "angular velocity" would explain the concept perfectly.
Exploration is a beast to explain and people in the rookie channel have to tell people to google the video all the time. the video doesn't have shift-drag and alt-drag, iirc.
Other stuff: Vital, PvP-specific skills are not being taught, and the UI is a bear on all of them. Nothing teaches how to really read the star map, or to bookmark, or WHY to bookmark. None of those are really intuitive things. Nobody learns them.. which means when they wander into lowsec, they get popped fast, and then tell everyone never to leave high sec. Also, kill rights aren't explained. The way the overview is set up by default is a bit confusing, because it splashes people who aren't legal to shoot with ominous colors. Does anyone really need a color for someone at -2 status? You can't attack them..?
The Business tutorial still gives out things like Tormentors and Navitas and Bantam and tells people it's a mining ship. Fix please.
People accidentally drop tutorial missions and get locked out of the tutorials.
The Caldari military agent gives people who just stumbled dizzily away from Aura a frigate that can only use a weapon type they have no ability to arm. The Ibis has launcher hardpoints, switch Caldari skills to launcher and Civvie rocket launcher as default.
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Maire Gheren
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
51
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Posted - 2012.12.30 23:33:00 -
[42] - Quote
I hadn't thought of this, but shouldn't the Business tutorial at least make a half hearted attempt to get people to research the price history on an item? |
Cornelius Wulfson
In The Goo EVE Trade Alliance
0
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Posted - 2013.01.11 18:48:00 -
[43] - Quote
I have just started with Eve and have been palying for the past few months. I have been very lucky to have had a mentor to explain stuff to me, I had tons of Noob questions on everything. The tutorial missions were very good to give a sense to za Noob on how things work. I got lost a couple of times on what to do but that is where my experianced friend told me what needed to be done. I can't recall specifics on what I had problems with. A mentor program may help Noobs that does not have the luck of having someone explain stuff to them. I think you have a chat channel on that but I don't recall which one it is. After finishing the training I started the missions stuff and joined a half decent corps to bring me along further in this sandbox called Eve. After the training I am hesitant to do PvP and going to lowsec. If there is a way to make it more atractive during the career training that may have changed my paying style since all I do now is Agent missions and mine. Overall, the career training missions are very well done, I can see tweaking required but for a game of this type that will always be the case. Cheers |
Bud Austrene
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2013.01.21 19:56:00 -
[44] - Quote
I have been playing for some time and in the beginning i found the tutorials to be barely adequate to teach the bare mechanics of the game. I had to go on YouTube to find out how to scan effectively. I think it would be in EVE's best interests to have advanced tutorials available. In a game where paranoia is good, relying on other players to teach new players is a mistake.
I have found relying on the other players for guidance is cumbersome as most players do not really understand what they are doing and the ones that do know what they are doing, don't really want to be bothered with someone always asking for help. A person can get lucky and find a mentor but just trusting someone to be giving you good advise is hard.
I have spent a lot of time sifting through blogs, forum, web sites and have come to enjoy and appreciate EVE so much more. This game can be so much more than "let's go see how many we can blow up before we are blown up" and laugh at the victims.
I feel that the missions should be better designed to cause the mission runner to have his ship outfitted so he is not at a disadvantage if the need arises that he needs to defend himself against another player. What is the point of having a nifty tricked out mission ship if you are afraid to take it out.
I suspect that a lot of new players are just checking the game out and have no real clue as to the features of the game. How can a new player know what he wants to do? He doesn't know about what it is like to PVP in null sec, FW, millita, low sec, wormholes and what ganking is.
Some more guidance in the beginning i feel would go a long way to increase new player retention.
Also it would be helpful if declining or failing a mission in the tutorials does not stop that group of tutorials. The tutorials should be more forgiving. A new player doesn't even know what to ask questions about, (he doesn't know what it is he doesn't know) (I was doing missions and building up a negative standing with Amarr with out realizing the consequences until i joined a corp. that was based in the Amarr region.)
Of course, if the player base was more knowledgeable, that would change the game in a major way. That would remove a lot of easy victims from the killmails. And a lot of the PVPers are already crying about not having enough easy victims and want easier access to high sec players. So I suppose, the more psychopathic player would be unhappy and leave to be replaced by a different kind of player that is more in control of his destiny in the game.
It will be interesting to see how the game progresses.
Yes I am an alt. I see no reason to make it easy for bullies and greifers |
Sofia Kuovo
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.01.27 02:28:00 -
[45] - Quote
Many things mentioned here that I agree with, such as the Business tutorial not really being about business and some of the things you need to complete missions aren't actually provided.
Specifically though, the Exploration tutorial is probably the most frustrating in that the required equipment isn't given by the agent. (Also already stated.) In addition, in the two missions that require passkeys (gravimetric and ladar) the player isn't notified that you are undocking without whatever is required to complete the mission. This is very frustrating for people who've scanned down the site and warped there, only to have to go back to station. I know there are other missions where the player is reminded of a necessary component, and it should be part of this, too. |
Vherana
Valkyrie Industries Valkyrie Coalition
2
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Posted - 2013.02.05 18:17:00 -
[46] - Quote
Oraac Ensor wrote:Leading on from my comments in Usdom Chaffmen's thread, Mission 3 of the business tutorial 'Balancing the Books' should provide a Miner 1 when the mission is accepted. As it is, it causes a huge amount of frustration and annoyance to new players who have not already done the industry tutorial and therefore have nothing to mine with.
J'Poll wrote:Or merge industry and business and make them normal and adv. like the militairy ones. Sounds good. Part 1 Industry (which hands out the mining lasers and a really good mining frigate) which does resource gathering, refining and the first productions (simple things). Part 2 More production, salvaging, hacking, analysing and distribution. Buying and selling.
And think of the drones With the Venture all players need at least Drones to 2 and Scout Drone Operation at 1.
Eternal Montage wrote:Perhaps including fits in the later tutorials, or perhaps a designated fitting tutorial. Show new players, roughly, what a missioning ship needs; what a PVP ship needs; exploration; etc. Why not think up a few simple fittings for frigates, destroyer and maybe cruisers and add them to the corp fitting window in the fitting browser - those NPC corps are there for a reason
And now some of my own experiences/ideas:
Advanced Military: Redoing the Caldari one gets you stuck with "Civilian Scourge Light Missiles" missing, those are not handed out in the Mission. A new Caldari gets them from Aurora in the tutorial window.
Industry/Business: There is a big problem with the lack of build slots at the stations. For an experienced player it's fine to load everything (BPC and minerals) into a ship and move to another system to build and move those items back - for a new player, it's deadly frustrating, a show-stopper. (This comes from personal experience while helping new players in 'Hilfe')
Possible solution to this: Add a new "Prod. Category" for those tutorial BPCs/items and add some production slots of the same category. Make sure you only hand out BPCs of the correct category in the missions and this will be far less frustrating for our new sisters and brothers |
Keras Authion
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
117
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Posted - 2013.02.05 19:21:00 -
[47] - Quote
One of the most asked questions in the noobcorp channel is "I have mined enough minerals but the agent is not letting me complete the mission" when referring to making mountains of molehills 1/10. Usually the problem is that the player mined the ore at an asteroid belt instead of the mission location.
The source of the problem seems to be with the mining tutorial that pops up after accepting the mission and tells that asteroids can be found at asteroid belts. While it is true, it does misdirect people for the mission. The mission says "a bookmark has been uploaded to your people & places databank; use it to find the asteroid field". A new player probably wouldn't be able to know the difference between a specific people & places bookmark and an unlocked ability to look for asteroid belts as seen in many other games and might be confusing.
Possible solutions:
Make a special mention to the mining tutorial that pops up that for the mission you've got you need to use the specific location.
Make the popup happen later, say when you are mining the asteroid or at the beginning of 2/10. This post was rated "C" for capsuleer. |
Niveuss Nye
The Advent of Faith
21
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Posted - 2013.02.26 02:34:00 -
[48] - Quote
One of the things I wish I had when I was on trial was at least one of the certificates at the end of my training.
It would give you a head start without feeling as useless when you get into a PC corp a week or whenever later.
Just one of the "basic" starter profession certs depending on what you selected after you "graduate". Not like you could not change your mind if say you hated trading but wanted to PvP. |
Ylariana
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.02.27 11:18:00 -
[49] - Quote
Was doing the tutorials recently and when asked to manufacture goods for the agents imagine my joy to find every single manufacturing bay in the system and the neighbouring system full for at least 12 hours...... YAY !
How about a One-Time-Use bay that becomes available when the rookie tutorial missions needing them are accepted, that will only allow the supplied Blueprints to be used (so that people cant use high-en BPs in the slot instead).
It would need to show up in the standard Science and Industry window so new players learn where to look but be flagged or highlighted to make it obvious its for this mission. Text in th emission stating to use it etc. |
Nice Hair Bro
State War Academy Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2013.02.28 16:57:00 -
[50] - Quote
A Weapon of Choice in Advanced Military career mission chain for Amarr and Minmatar is useless.
If you're Caldari, you're given Missile Launcher Operation skillbook and Weapon of Choice requires you to blow an enemy up with provided missiles.
If you're Gallente, you're given the Drones skillbook and Weapon of Choice requires you to destroy an enemy ship using provided drones.
But if you're Amarr/Minmatar... you're given Small Energy Turret/Small Projectile Turret skillbook, and are required to kill an enemy with a provided... civilian version of either weapon. You know. The ones that can be found on rookie ships.
In case you didn't know, Amarr players start with Small Energy Turret skill trained to level 2, and Minmatar players start with Small Projectile Turret trained to level 2. So the books are completely redundant.
Suggestion: pretty obvious, give Amarr the drones tutorial and Minmatar the missile one. Especially after tiericide, now Amarr and Minmatar have more drone/missile ships than before.
Another thing, ideally I'd post it in Features & Ideas but I can't on a trial account:
The summer update ship changes include removing racial frigate requirements from rookie ships. This is nice.
Hovewer, do note that the civilian weapons the rookie ships come equipped with do require the appropiate turret skills(so i.e. you need the Small Hybrid Weapons 1 to use the Civilian Gatling Railgun found on the Ibis). It would be silly to be automatically given a ship fitted with module that you can't use, so removing these requirements from the civilian versions of weapons(and only keeping the Gunnery 1 as a requirement) would be a good idea. |
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J'Poll
The Fiction Factory Tribal Band
1928
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Posted - 2013.02.28 18:57:00 -
[51] - Quote
Nice Hair Bro wrote:A Weapon of Choice in Advanced Military career mission chain for Amarr and Minmatar is useless.
If you're Caldari, you're given Missile Launcher Operation skillbook and Weapon of Choice requires you to blow an enemy up with provided missiles.
If you're Gallente, you're given the Drones skillbook and Weapon of Choice requires you to destroy an enemy ship using provided drones.
But if you're Amarr/Minmatar... you're given Small Energy Turret/Small Projectile Turret skillbook, and are required to kill an enemy with a provided... civilian version of either weapon. You know. The ones that can be found on rookie ships.
In case you didn't know, Amarr players start with Small Energy Turret skill trained to level 2, and Minmatar players start with Small Projectile Turret trained to level 2. So the books are completely redundant.
Suggestion: pretty obvious, give Amarr the drones tutorial and Minmatar the missile one. Especially after tiericide, now Amarr and Minmatar have more drone/missile ships than before.
Another thing, ideally I'd post it in Features & Ideas but I can't on a trial account:
The summer update ship changes include removing racial frigate requirements from rookie ships. This is nice.
Hovewer, do note that the civilian weapons the rookie ships come equipped with do require the appropiate turret skills(so i.e. you need the Small Hybrid Weapons 1 to use the Civilian Gatling Railgun found on the Ibis). It would be silly to be automatically given a ship fitted with module that you can't use, so removing these requirements from the civilian versions of weapons(and only keeping the Gunnery 1 as a requirement) would be a good idea.
On the F&I part:
You do know that as a Caldari you can't get a free Amarr rookie ship. And thus can't receive a free civilian laser, which means you will have to buy it from the market which is totally useless as you could have bought a normal laser instead. |
Nice Hair Bro
State War Academy Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2013.02.28 19:41:00 -
[52] - Quote
You can get other factions' rookie ships by going into any starter station for a particular race and just doing the Aura part of the tutorial.
Also, it is likely that CCP will change how the rookie ships are being distributed; instead of always getting your faction's rookie ship you will get the ship of the faction that controls the station you docked in. This is why they're changing the skill prereqs(they're meaningless with the current system in place) and why they're adding pirate faction rookie frigs. |
J'Poll
The Fiction Factory Tribal Band
1930
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Posted - 2013.02.28 19:47:00 -
[53] - Quote
Nice Hair Bro wrote:You can get other factions' rookie ships by going into any starter station for a particular race and just doing the Aura part of the tutorial.
Also, it is likely that CCP will change how the rookie ships are being distributed; instead of always getting your faction's rookie ship you will get the ship of the faction that controls the station you docked in. This is why they're changing the skill prereqs(they're meaningless with the current system in place) and why they're adding pirate faction rookie frigs.
Link to source of that please?
And you can only do Aura once where she gives you stuff, all the next times it's just text boxes.
The only thing you can do multiple times (12 specifically) are the career agents. |
Nice Hair Bro
State War Academy Caldari State
5
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Posted - 2013.03.01 11:23:00 -
[54] - Quote
Link to what? Speculation? It's just speculation. But why would CCP bother in changing the rookie ship prerequisites otherwise when everyone starts with skills necessary to fly them already? And of course pirate rookie ships are already on SiSi.
As for Aura, okay, this is getting confusing. There are three parts to EVE tutorial:
Tutorial: the Aura text boxes. You get stuff only once(hovewer you can get other factions' stuff too - it's as simple as launching the appropiate tutorial topics manually)
Aura missions: This is the short mission chain in which you get your rookie ship, blow up the silo and two hopeless pirates, then get the recommendation papers for Career Agents. Since this is, mechanics-wise, a normal mission chain and Aura is, mechanics-wise, a normal agent, you can do this mission chain up to twelve times(Three starting locations times four empires). The rewards are largely identical(and minimal) across factions, except you get a rookie ship appropiate to the starting system you're in - so for example, even if you're Gallente, if you go to Sehmy VII - Moon 2 - Hedion University and talk to Aura there, an Impairor will be waiting for you in Deadspace, not a Velator. You also get the basic tank skill book based on the faction you're in(Repair Systems for Amarr/Gallente, Shield Operation for Caldari/Minmatar).
Career Agents: These work just like Aura missions but have them as a prerequisite. So you can do these up to twelve times as well. |
Oraac Ensor
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
168
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Posted - 2013.03.06 13:15:00 -
[55] - Quote
We're getting a bit o/t here, but just to tidy up:
You can do Aura's introductory tutorial missions as many times as you wish at any starter station.
You will receive a rookie ship, defensive module and relevant defence skill book appropriate to the starter system's faction.
The offensive module/ammo seems to default to your character's racial type and will not be given if you have already received them by doing the tutorial elsewhere. |
Negrebskoh
Doomcallers
0
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Posted - 2013.03.11 21:40:00 -
[56] - Quote
First of all, this is my first post on the forums. So: hi! Played EVE years ago, quit, recently started again, yadda yadda yadda.
Now, my suggestion is quite simple: sandbox the tutorial.
I know, I know. EVE is all about how the world is open-ended and you're free to do whatever you want and so on and so forth, but hear me out. We don't need to immediately kill the people who start out with all these features. More importantly, though, is that almost all of the questions I've seen new players ask have to do with them somehow messing up some part of the tutorial they shouldn't have been able to mess up but they did because they've been thrown in the deep end right from the start.
Sandboxing the tutorial a little more makes many of these problems go away, which means more newbies, which means more people ultimately keep playing EVE, which means we're all happy together and can go party. In my opinion, what would work best is to keep the career agents in the big, scary world of EVE, but to make the first tutorial with Aura more limited to beginners. This way, we might well stop them from making too big a mess (which is good).
I'm obviously not sure how hard this would be to implement, or whether it's even possible. Thought I'd throw it out there, though, in case someone thinks it's worth considering. Constructive criticism is - obviously - appreciated. :) |
Sabriz Adoudel
Resurgent Threat
74
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Posted - 2013.03.13 04:34:00 -
[57] - Quote
Just made a new alt for AWOXing purposes and/or anti-mining operations and so ran the tutorials again. Some feedback from the point of view of a person that knows the basics of EVE already.
- Firstly, the exploration tutorial leads to a lot of questions in Rookie Help about wormholes because people that get scanning quickly tend to find them. Despite my best efforts at telling people 'DO NOT go into the wormhole until you can solo level 4 security missions in a ship you can afford to lose and know how to D-scan', people kept going in to them. Needless to say, newbies in Catalysts last about as long in wormhole space as an untanked AFK Hulk in Kamio's ice belt. Describing how to self-destruct a pod in rookie help is not pleasant.
- Suggested action: Remove wormholes entirely from the starting constellations.
- Secondly, there is no tutorial for directional scanning, which really, really needs to be learned by newbies, and likewise for other PVP intel tools like the 'how many pods have been killed in the last hour' tool on the star map.
- Suggested action: Add a hauling tutorial that takes place in highsec deadspace but goes through the precautions PVP aware players take when taking a ship into lowsec. 'Check your star map, two pod kills in a system in the last hour should worry you, five is proof of a gate camp and you must avoid that system at all costs', then also a 'use D-scan to determine roughly how far away a wreck is' tutorial ('I've placed a wreck of a ship 500, 5000, 25000 or 50000km away, use D-scan to discern which, and use the appropriate gate, if you get it wrong you will be attacked and will need to start the tutorial again'). You could also add a tutorial for the directional element of D-scanning, but the distance tool is more important for someone trying to avoid a hunter. The directional element becomes relevant when you are the hunter not the hunted.
- Third, some more advice on fitting would be good. When I first did the tutorials as a newbie, I attached a mix of blasters and railguns to my new Catalyst and had shield resist mods and armor repairers. (Oops). While the tutorials point you to some out-of-game resources for fittings, a basic explanation of WHY you shouldn't mix armor and shield tanks, and WHY you want to avoid mixed guns would be a good idea. Likewise explanation of the differing uses of active tanks, buffer tanks and ASB-style unsustainable burst tanks would help. - Suggested action: Add tutorials covering in detail why you'd swap fittings from situation to situation. Example: one mission against Guristas where you are advised to fit ECCM to deal with their jamming and are given two ECCM modules, then another against Serpentis where you are told 'remove those ECCM modules, they won't help here, instead you want a SeBo to counter their tracking disruption. '... you cannot reason with the mining bots, you cannot negotiate with them, you can only bring them judgement in the form of Navy Antimatter, turn their Mackinaws to salvage and dust, smartbomb their pods, and burn their Mining Link implants with sweet incense...'- The Gospel according to St James 315 |
Oraac Ensor
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
170
|
Posted - 2013.03.17 10:21:00 -
[58] - Quote
I thought CCP were supposed to be making a genuine effort to improve the tutorials, but I've just noticed that they've perpetrated a piece of arbitrary utter nonsense in the Caldari military tutorial: Quote:When running the Caldari military tutorial a Merlin will be awarded rather than a Condor. Previously this tutorial followed the same patern as the other three races' versions, with the racial T1 fast interception frigate given in Mission 2 and the tougher, more powerful combat frigate in the final mission. Now the Caldari version awards a Merlin in both cases.
Not only does the Caldari tutorial now not follow the same pattern, but the new version is totally illogical. In the original version following up the Condor with the award of two rocket launchers in the next mission made perfect sense but giving launchers after awarding a Merlin is just plain daft. |
J'Poll
The Fiction Factory Tribal Band
1975
|
Posted - 2013.03.17 10:31:00 -
[59] - Quote
Oraac Ensor wrote:I thought CCP were supposed to be making a genuine effort to improve the tutorials, but I've just noticed that they've perpetrated a piece of arbitrary utter nonsense in the Caldari military tutorial: Quote:When running the Caldari military tutorial a Merlin will be awarded rather than a Condor. Previously this tutorial followed the same patern as the other three races' versions, with the racial T1 fast interception frigate given in Mission 2 and the tougher, more powerful combat frigate in the final mission. Now the Caldari version awards a Merlin in both cases. Not only does the Caldari tutorial now not follow the same pattern, but the new version is totally illogical. In the original version following up the Condor with the award of two rocket launchers in the next mission made perfect sense but giving launchers after awarding a Merlin is just plain daft.
CCP and making decisions that are both logical and make sense...that is something new.
But I agree. Fix it now or delete the whole tutorials as a wrong tutorial is even worse then no tutorial.
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Oraac Ensor
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
176
|
Posted - 2013.03.17 18:31:00 -
[60] - Quote
Well, it's actually even more confusing.
When I first spotted this change I ran the military tutorial in Uitra to check that it meant what I thought it meant. I got two Merlins.
When the business tutorial was supposed to start giving out Ventures, not all agents did so, so I thought I'd test the consistency of the Caldari military tutorial and ran it again in Jouvulen. Guess what? Yep, I got a Condor and a Merlin! |
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