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BoohaEnder
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Posted - 2011.07.20 04:02:00 -
[1]
Haven't seen a Phantasm in quite some time, and it just so happens, I've come into one. I have a few empty slots and not much CPU/PG remaining. Ideas?
[Phantasm]
[High Slots] Heavy Pulse laser II - Scorch M Heavy Pulse laser II - Scorch M Heavy Pulse laser II - Scorch M Empty High Slot Empty High Slot
{Mid Slots] Large Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Disruptor II Medium Capacitor Booster II - Cap Booster 400
[Low Slots] Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
[Rigs] Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
I was thinking about a bit of faction bling like a C-type core MWD ore replacing a rig or two with some resist rigs as the resists aren't fantastic.
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Wedding Peach
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Posted - 2011.07.20 04:26:00 -
[2]
That's the problem with the Phantasm I found.
It lacks cap, power, speed and a role worth flying it for (Harbinger does it better) except for shield fleet anti-frigate ship? -------------------------------------------------- I am the Love Angel, Wedding Peach, and I am very displeased by your lack of love! |
BoohaEnder
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Posted - 2011.07.20 04:29:00 -
[3]
That's what I was afraid I was going to hear, it just doesn't seem to have the survivability to be a brawler, and zealot has the laser sniper role down pat. Oh well. Thanks.
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Wedding Peach
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Posted - 2011.07.20 07:22:00 -
[4]
Yeah, the Phantasm and Succubus need some sort of boost. Both are the worst ships of their class.
The Angel ships are obviously fast with good range The Serpentis ships are utter DPS boats with webs. The Guristas ships are drone boats with extremely powerful shields and huge drone bays. The Blood Raider ships can shut off tanks and keep things from moving for gang members to chew apart.
The Sansha ships have good tracking and have a boost to laser damage and are the only shield laser ships.
They aren't fast enough to act in a manner similar to the Angel ships. If they were, they don't nearly have the cap or power grid capable of competing.
The Serpentis ships do more damage at a shorter range, yes, but they have a bonus to webs.
The Guristas ships are strange but they don't suffer from cap issues. Heck, they're a strange oddity since you could arrange for Gurista boats to be completely immune to EWAR and Guristas ships boast some of the strongest tanks.
The Blood Raider ships are odd but they can be used well in fleets. The Bhaalgorn is a very fearsome ship due to the fact that its the only BS with a bonus to neuts and with its web range bonus, it pretty much assures that anything it catches under 30km is not going to have power and not move.
The Sansha ships are stuck in an underwhelming position. Other than the Nightmare, the Phantasm and Succubus are expensive but fairly useless ships. The Nightmare does have the honor of being a somewhat mobile ranged DPS boat since it can dedicate its lows for pure damage. The problem is that its not THAT fast and will still have some cap issues.
I suppose there is one additional plus to the Sansha ships that the other factions don't have. The Sansha have the Revenant while none of the other factions have a Super Carrier. I would rather have the Blood Raider Super or Guristas Super, personally.
My message to CCP will be to rebalance the Sansha ships unless I missed something about them. -------------------------------------------------- I am the Love Angel, Wedding Peach, and I am very displeased by your lack of love! |
Argosus
Waverunners
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Posted - 2011.07.20 10:58:00 -
[5]
actually the phantasm is not that bad. It could use a little tweek here and there but in the whole i find it ok. Incidentally it makes a not bad sniper! less range than the zealot but does better volley, locks further, has similar ehp (700 less i believe but has option to overload an invul) it has a bigger capacitor than the Z but doesn't have the zealots cap reduction bonus. has drones tho :)
regarding the gila, it does actually have cap issues. it has the smallest capacitor of all the faction cruisers. It also is quite low on cpu for pvp fitting.
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Wedding Peach
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Posted - 2011.07.20 14:13:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Argosus actually the phantasm is not that bad. It could use a little tweek here and there but in the whole i find it ok. Incidentally it makes a not bad sniper! less range than the zealot but does better volley, locks further, has similar ehp (700 less i believe but has option to overload an invul) it has a bigger capacitor than the Z but doesn't have the zealots cap reduction bonus. has drones tho :)
regarding the gila, it does actually have cap issues. it has the smallest capacitor of all the faction cruisers. It also is quite low on cpu for pvp fitting.
Maybe so but the Gila doesn't constantly need to use its cap at a rate of the Phantasm. I've actually flown a PVP Gila against a PVP Harbinger and he was forced to flee. Cap wasn't much of an issue during the fight, it was maintaining range and point at around 20km.
I suppose the trick is that you don't need damage mods on a Gila nor do you need HAMs. Its damage is its drones so you can probably get away with Assault Missile Launchers (which I did) and nano it with a MWD and long point. Most BCs won't be able to reach that far while the Gila's drones chew them apart. -------------------------------------------------- I am the Love Angel, Wedding Peach, and I am very displeased by your lack of love! |
Maisonian
Amarr The Green Machine
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Posted - 2011.07.20 14:38:00 -
[7]
If you're feeling awake, there is another school of thinking for the Phantasm. It can be active tanked quite effectively but needs rigorous cap management to perform at it's best. My last fit went somthing along the lines of:
High: 3 x T2 heavy pulse 2 x T2 small neuts
Mids: 1 x YT-8 MWD 1 x T2 Disruptor 1 x T2 Large Shield Booster 1 x T2 Cap booster (Navy 800s) 2 x T2 Invulns
Lows: 2 x T2 Heatsink 1 x T2 DCU
Rigs: 2 x Cap safeguard T2 1 x EM resist T2
Set EVERYTHING to 'autorepeat off' and drink a strong coffee. This little deamon out performs the buffer fit significantly but you will need to manage your cap useage. MWD to control range, boost when needed (overheated) and drop a blue pill to really get the most out of it. Happy hunting 07
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achoura
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Posted - 2011.07.20 14:53:00 -
[8]
Edited by: achoura on 20/07/2011 14:56:03 Problem with the active phanty is it's tank is the same as a cyclones while doing less damage, having less buffer, haiving major cap issues, carrying less boosters etc. The other cruiser all have some advantage that makes them worth the cost over hacs or bc.
Edit: actually less with that fit, if you use a couple resists rigs and one cap it can match it. ***The EVE servers and their patches***
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Hiroshima Jita
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Posted - 2011.07.20 17:00:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Hiroshima Jita on 20/07/2011 17:01:11 A while back I EFTed a shield harbinger VS a Phantasm. Here let me pull it up again... These are my conclusions:
The shield nano Harbinger does about 200 more DPS than the Phantasm.
Overheating hardeners, a fully tanked Phantasm (with MWD+Point+Tank) has 12 K more EHP than a Harbinger fit the same way (with MWD+Point+Tank) and a signature of 203 to the Harbinger's signature of 327.
The Phantasm hurts badly for lowslots. There is enough room for a DC and then to almost saturate damage mods. Otherwise you have to pick 1 of your favorite lowslot module to go with DC + Heatsink.
The Phantasm is slow and lacks agility for a cruiser. Fitting nanofiber internal structure IIs on it makes the problem feel a little better. But I personally am a Cane pilot with a skirmish warfare mindlink. Generally I run rapid deployment on my cane. I could easily run down a phantasm that has sacrificed all its heatsink slots for nanos.
The Phantasm can't beat my Cane in combat and the only utility it has my cane lacks is slightly more tank. The Harbinger could theoretically beat my Cane and it has better damage projection. More damage, able to fit a TE.
The Phantasm looks ugly.
I concluded that the Harbinger and Phantasm are about equal in combat prowess. If you think of the Phantasm as being a mid speed BC then nano canes running them down isn't as frustrating. The Harbinger has more gank and less tank. The Phantasm has more tank and less gank.
The only problem is that the Harbinger costs alot less than the Phantasm.
Also if all you want is a big shield tank on a ship with a cruiser sig radius then you need to look at the gila.
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Fyrgen Hith
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Posted - 2011.07.20 19:18:00 -
[10]
I was wondering if you could show me some of those E-war immune fits?
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Wedding Peach
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Posted - 2011.07.20 19:59:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Fyrgen Hith I was wondering if you could show me some of those E-war immune fits?
It's just theoretical
Drones and FOF Missiles = Immune to ECM Sensor Amps in the lows = Immune to Sensor Damp Passive tank = Immune to neuts Already immune to Tracking Disruptors
Not immune to Target Painters, I suppose. -------------------------------------------------- I am the Love Angel, Wedding Peach, and I am very displeased by your lack of love! |
Fyrgen Hith
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Posted - 2011.07.20 20:18:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Wedding Peach
Originally by: Fyrgen Hith I was wondering if you could show me some of those E-war immune fits?
It's just theoretical
Drones and FOF Missiles = Immune to ECM Sensor Amps in the lows = Immune to Sensor Damp Passive tank = Immune to neuts Already immune to Tracking Disruptors
Not immune to Target Painters, I suppose.
Minnie titan+gang link?
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Wedding Peach
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Posted - 2011.07.20 20:52:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Fyrgen Hith
Originally by: Wedding Peach
Originally by: Fyrgen Hith I was wondering if you could show me some of those E-war immune fits?
It's just theoretical
Drones and FOF Missiles = Immune to ECM Sensor Amps in the lows = Immune to Sensor Damp Passive tank = Immune to neuts Already immune to Tracking Disruptors
Not immune to Target Painters, I suppose.
Minnie titan+gang link?
That or a Halo set.
Maybe this will cause a new wave in EWAR proof sig-tanking Rattlesnakes. -------------------------------------------------- I am the Love Angel, Wedding Peach, and I am very displeased by your lack of love! |
Fyrgen Hith
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Posted - 2011.07.20 21:25:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Wedding Peach
Originally by: Fyrgen Hith
Originally by: Wedding Peach
Originally by: Fyrgen Hith I was wondering if you could show me some of those E-war immune fits?
It's just theoretical
Drones and FOF Missiles = Immune to ECM Sensor Amps in the lows = Immune to Sensor Damp Passive tank = Immune to neuts Already immune to Tracking Disruptors
Not immune to Target Painters, I suppose.
Minnie titan+gang link?
That or a Halo set.
Maybe this will cause a new wave in EWAR proof sig-tanking Rattlesnakes.
And don't FoF missiles make you immune to sendamp anyways(and eft'ing this).
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Nomad Vherokic
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Posted - 2011.07.21 04:39:00 -
[15]
Love the look of the Phantasm. Like a multi-kebab machine... mmm...
Used this briefly after the rebalance -
[Phantasm, Buffer PvP] Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Damage Control II
10MN MicroWarpdrive II Warp Scrambler II Stasis Webifier II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 200 Invulnerability Field II Large Shield Extender II
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Small Energy Neutralizer II Small Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Hobgoblin II x3
It didn't go well...
Main problem: getting enough cap charges into a 200m2 cargo bay... :D |
Shade Millith
Caldari Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2011.07.21 05:00:00 -
[16]
I don't think the succubus or phantasm are bad ships per say, they're just not as good as the other pirate ships. Hell, I LIKE my dual prop/dual NOS succubus, it's pretty awesome at hitting bigger things with neuts. ------------------------
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s0lar pulse
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Posted - 2011.07.22 02:19:00 -
[17]
Pirate Faction Frigate Rankings for pvp
1) Dramiel 2) Succubus (300dps!) 3) Daredevil (400dps!)
The rest dont matter!
Pirate Faction Cruiser Rankings for pvp
1) Cynabal 2) Gila 3) Phantasm 4) Vigilant
Pirate Faction Battleship Rankings for pvp
1) Machareil 2) Rattlesnake (Missile domi!) 3) Nightmare (1450 dps!) 4) Bhaalgorn 5) Vindicater
All my opion. Make sure you have some small neuts on your Phantasm. Once you have 2 damage modifiers on the thing. The rest of your setup should be focused on tank alone. So, you're good! Some pilot go with a small cap booster and 2 lse, because of less cap usage and more EHP.
-proxyyyy
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Larry Wickes
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Posted - 2011.07.22 06:20:00 -
[18]
Originally by: BoohaEnder Haven't seen a Phantasm in quite some time, and it just so happens, I've come into one. I have a few empty slots and not much CPU/PG remaining. Ideas?
[Phantasm]
[High Slots] Heavy Pulse laser II - Scorch M Heavy Pulse laser II - Scorch M Heavy Pulse laser II - Scorch M Empty High Slot Empty High Slot
{Mid Slots] Large Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Disruptor II Medium Capacitor Booster II - Cap Booster 400
[Low Slots] Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
[Rigs] Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
I was thinking about a bit of faction bling like a C-type core MWD ore replacing a rig or two with some resist rigs as the resists aren't fantastic.
Don't listen to what others say. The Phantasm is in fact a pretty good ship for it's class. That being a cruiser capable of 560 dps (640 overheated, 2 heat sinks)(Or 610 dps and 710 overheated, that's with 3 heat sinks, however.)
Albeit it's not as fast as say, a Cynabal, and doesn't offer any support like others; it can just do a lot of damage, and that's the fun aspect of it. I use a fit similar to yours except I use two Large Shield Extenders, have an anti-EM rig instead of another Extender, and have two small nos in those empty high slots.
This gives it 42,000 EHP out of fleet. Definitely not a ship for CTAs as it lacks range, but really really fun to fly on small roams.
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.07.22 08:09:00 -
[19]
CCP nerfed Phantasm's HP when they introduced the Cynabal (lol).
I fly mine, however, like the OP, but with 3 Heat Sinks, and two small neuts in the top slots. I use Cap 800 boosters.
It is an allaround decent ships, though not exceptional since it lacks just a little bit of speed and teh lost HP. Think of it like a HAC on a budget. Fun with Shcims in the gang. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Telvani
Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber
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Posted - 2011.07.22 12:29:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Telvani on 22/07/2011 12:29:24
Originally by: s0lar pulse Pirate Faction Frigate Rankings for pvp
1) Dramiel 1) Daredevil (25km 90% heated web mmm)
The rest dont matter! (Although I still love the 'mu)
Pirate Faction Cruiser Rankings for pvp
1) Cynabal
The rest dont matter!
Pirate Faction Battleship Rankings for pvp
1) Macherial 2) Bhaalgorn 3) Vindicator 4) Nightmare 5) Rattlesnake (I lol'd at this being second)
Fixed.
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s0lar pulse
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Posted - 2011.07.22 12:49:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Telvani Edited by: Telvani on 22/07/2011 12:29:24
Originally by: s0lar pulse Pirate Faction Frigate Rankings for pvp
1) Dramiel 1) Daredevil (25km 90% heated web mmm)
The rest dont matter! (Although I still love the 'mu)
Pirate Faction Cruiser Rankings for pvp
1) Cynabal
The rest dont matter!
Pirate Faction Battleship Rankings for pvp
1) Macherial 2) Bhaalgorn 3) Vindicator 4) Nightmare 5) Rattlesnake (I lol'd at this being second)
Fixed.
Oh no you didn't!
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Wedding Peach
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Posted - 2011.07.22 13:59:00 -
[22]
Here be my list...
Best Pirate Frigates for PVP. 1. Dramiel 2. Daredevil 3. Worm 4. Cruor (It's armor tanked so it's going to have trouble catching stuff without a faction web and it lacks the pure damage of the Daredevil) 5. Succubus
Best pirate cruiser for PVP 1. Cynabal 2. Gila (It can nanofit, small sig, Drake tank and a Domi drone bay. It's surprising, really) 3. Vigilant 4. Ashimmu 5. Phantasm
(2-4 were hard decisions. Ashimmu and Vigilant are very close. Ashimmu doesn't have the Vigilant's raw damage but the Vigilant can't shut ships down)
Best Pirate BS for PVP 1. Machariel 2. Bhaalgorn 3. Vindicator 4. Nightmare 5. Rattlesnake
I think that should sum it up. -------------------------------------------------- I am the Love Angel, Wedding Peach, and I am very displeased by your lack of love! |
Lady Spank
Amarr Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2011.07.22 14:07:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Wedding Peach Best Pirate Frigates for PVP. 1. Dramiel 2. Daredevil ...
Not picking on you in particular Peaches but it's funny the Dramiel takes the top of the list for so many people when I find it hard to actually get Dramiels to engage me in seemingly lesser ships unless they have their buddies with them.
The amount of time's I've landed on grid of a Dramiel and it's just scarpered before I could even come out of warp is silly; and yes, they were pilots with active PVP records.
I flew a Dramiel out of curiosity on one single occasion and killed some noob frig (rifter?) and some badly fit Vagabond. Both kills got the most local and mail rage I have ever received. In honesty I was just testing it out and ratting sec up for an hour and got lucky with finding the targets.
They might be effective in the right hands but I find a lot of the people flying them are very risk averse. ~~~
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mxzf
Minmatar Shovel Bros
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Posted - 2011.07.22 14:18:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Lady Spank
Originally by: Wedding Peach Best Pirate Frigates for PVP. 1. Dramiel 2. Daredevil ...
Not picking on you in particular Peaches but it's funny the Dramiel takes the top of the list for so many people when I find it hard to actually get Dramiels to engage me in seemingly lesser ships unless they have their buddies with them.
The amount of time's I've landed on grid of a Dramiel and it's just scarpered before I could even come out of warp is silly; and yes, they were pilots with active PVP records.
I flew a Dramiel out of curiosity on one single occasion and killed some noob frig (rifter?) and some badly fit Vagabond. Both kills got the most local and mail rage I have ever received. In honesty I was just testing it out and ratting sec up for an hour and got lucky with finding the targets.
They might be effective in the right hands but I find a lot of the people flying them are very risk averse.
The primary strength with the Dram is that they have so much speed that they can simply choose their fights. A Dram pilot usually won't engage unless he's positive he'll win, and they have the speed to simply disengage at will. They also have decent damage output for a frig and a decent tank too. They can fit a rack of 200mms, a med shield extender, and 3 T2 light drones all at once.
Their main thing though is that they will just walk away from any fight they can't win and it's all but impossible to pin them down. So it's not that they're insta-win ships, it's just that it's very hard to loose one if you have half a brain.
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Lady Spank
Amarr Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2011.07.22 14:25:00 -
[25]
Precisely the reason I find them boring and wonder why people fly them. ~~~
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Muad 'dib
Caldari The Imperial Fedaykin
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Posted - 2011.07.22 14:40:00 -
[26]
phantasm and gila got shafted with the last round of changes, really hard to get solid fits due to tough fitting or stupid slots.
Phantasm would be good with enough heatsinks to hit like a pirate cruiser, some TEs to get a little more range, nanos for some more speed dcu/pdu for tank - cant do any of that well with only 3 lows.
Gila is better but is very tight on cpu on nicly tanked fits and even then your reduced to named assaults again due to the horrid fitting resources.
Meep Meep!
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Suzu Fujibayashi
Happy Dudes
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Posted - 2011.07.22 14:52:00 -
[27]
If you can disengage with a Dramiel so easily why can't I find them even inside point range? I would say Daredevil is the top frig.
And concerning the Phantasm. Somehow it has lots of fitting but there is nothing good to do with it. I tried this fit on Sisi a bit (what ever that's worth):
[Phantasm, buffer] Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Invulnerability Field II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large Shield Extender II Warp Disruptor II Invulnerability Field II
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Small Energy Neutralizer II Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Small Energy Neutralizer II Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Warrior II x3
It looks like a shield Navy Omen. Has mediocre speed and agility. And lacks range a bit. Maybe switch a polycarbon rig for a optimal range rig.
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Lady Spank
Amarr Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2011.07.22 14:59:00 -
[28]
This thing used to be awesome at killing ratting drakes :(
[Phantasm, post nerf] Damage Control II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II Warp Disruptor II Large Shield Extender II
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M Small Energy Neutralizer II Small Energy Neutralizer II
Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Energy Collision Accelerator I Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Warrior II x3
~~~
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Wedding Peach
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Posted - 2011.07.22 17:10:00 -
[29]
Originally by: mxzf
Originally by: Lady Spank
Originally by: Wedding Peach Best Pirate Frigates for PVP. 1. Dramiel 2. Daredevil ...
Not picking on you in particular Peaches but it's funny the Dramiel takes the top of the list for so many people when I find it hard to actually get Dramiels to engage me in seemingly lesser ships unless they have their buddies with them.
The amount of time's I've landed on grid of a Dramiel and it's just scarpered before I could even come out of warp is silly; and yes, they were pilots with active PVP records.
I flew a Dramiel out of curiosity on one single occasion and killed some noob frig (rifter?) and some badly fit Vagabond. Both kills got the most local and mail rage I have ever received. In honesty I was just testing it out and ratting sec up for an hour and got lucky with finding the targets.
They might be effective in the right hands but I find a lot of the people flying them are very risk averse.
The primary strength with the Dram is that they have so much speed that they can simply choose their fights. A Dram pilot usually won't engage unless he's positive he'll win, and they have the speed to simply disengage at will. They also have decent damage output for a frig and a decent tank too. They can fit a rack of 200mms, a med shield extender, and 3 T2 light drones all at once.
Their main thing though is that they will just walk away from any fight they can't win and it's all but impossible to pin them down. So it's not that they're insta-win ships, it's just that it's very hard to loose one if you have half a brain.
Pretty much the reason why I put them top. I've seen Dramiels recon better than Covert Ops because they're so fast and impossible to catch unless you use another Dramiel or some wacky instalock high accuracy BS or a Minmatar T2 Recon.
I own almost at least one of all the pirate ships. The ones I'm missing are the Succubus and the Serpentis boats (and the Revenant for obvious reasons). I can't really compare the Daredevil to the Dramiel because I never flown one but I have heard stories of 400 DPS + webs so I can see it being an ideal Dramiel counter if it can catch one, that is. -------------------------------------------------- I am the Love Angel, Wedding Peach, and I am very displeased by your lack of love! |
Lady Spank
Amarr Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2011.07.22 17:45:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Wedding Peach I never flown one but I have heard stories of 400 DPS + webs so I can see it being an ideal Dramiel counter if it can catch one, that is.
You shouldn't be able to but a lot of incompetent people go-to the Dramiel for some reason. This is also why so many Dramiel pilots are cowards when it comes to anything potentially able to upset them.
Fortunately, a rail ranis or comet can deal with a lot of them and they think it's an easy target.
'lol hybrids' indeed. ~~~
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