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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 72 post(s) |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9837
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:48:00 -
[61] - Quote
Noriko Mai wrote:With this, there will be a way to find out that a corp with 10 members has only two active pilots. IIRC you tried to avoid exactly this (find out how many players are active in a corp) in the wardec price calculation. I suppose the difference is that, with the wardec calculation, you would have gotten that information for free when you GÇ£triedGÇ¥ to dec them and there would be no way to get it wrong. With this system, you first have to find every member in the corp (which may or may not be possible) and then you have to poll each one of them. That's an awful lot of work for information that might not even be accurate. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
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Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
514
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:48:00 -
[62] - Quote
Bloodpetal wrote:CCP Paradox wrote:some dude wrote:
Yeah, this is a bad thing, and respectfully I would ask you to take a second look at it and its potential to be abused, especially since I can now place a bounty, anonymously, on anyone at all for any reason. The victim should at least know who did it, y'know?
We have been actively discussing this for a while. This is one of the key reasons for the dev blog, we are asking you guys for your thoughts. And I see more and more people ask about this. So that is good to see. I think with the opening of the bounty system to anyone and anywhere, this has nothing to do with "you have been bad". You will see people tagging everyone for bounties for s***s and giggles. I like the anonymity, and I like the idea of knowing who put a bounty on my head. Perhaps you can make it a fee. Pay 5m ISK to find out who put a bounty on my head. It's an ISK sink, and it puts a layer of "do I really want to know that much?".
I very much like this idea as a compromise. More Isk Sinks Is More Better |
Tetsel
Heretic Army Heretic Nation
36
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:49:00 -
[63] - Quote
Salpad wrote: No.
A bounty is about getting revenge. If I place a bounty of, say, 1 billion ISK on you, it's because I want you to experience an amount of suffering that's proportional to the size of the bounty. You cannot achieve that proportionality with a "take it all"-bounty system.
You perv ! It will not bring you more delicious tears
Karl Planck wrote:hahahahhahahahahahaah, The new killrights functionality is SUPERB. God, this almost makes me want to raise my sec, ALMOST
Ho stop it you !! Raise you sec what a silly idea ! Twitter:-á-á-á-á@EVE_Tetsel-á-á-á@HereticArmy |
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
53
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:49:00 -
[64] - Quote
CCP Paradox wrote: We haven't nailed down exact percentages yet, but when we do we will let you guys know for feedback and discussion.
I think 20% is fine. When I thought about it half a week ago or so, that was my own conclusion: 20% of Total Induced Grief Value.
Or 15% or 25%, but I opted for 20%, which I think is good.
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CCP Paradox
504
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:49:00 -
[65] - Quote
darius mclever wrote:Bloodpetal wrote:CCP Punkturis wrote:we're going to make it so you can't place bounty on inactive characters I like that you still hate him though after all this time (I just realized I only replied to the first question) Do you think this can be abused to "Test" who is actually currently activated? THere is a degree of anonymity when it comes to those things, combined with other tools, a corp could easily suss out how many players in a corporation are actually "active" players? I believe that when the new War Dec system was being initiated, this was one of the things they wanted to avoid, was the ability for a war deccing corp to figure out how many characters on an alliance were actually "not playing" when calculating dec costs (but trials didn't count). could a dev comment on this?
read above comments. CCP Paradox | EVE Quality Assurance | Team Super Friends @CCP_Paradox |
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darius mclever
40
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:50:00 -
[66] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Noriko Mai wrote:With this, there will be a way to find out that a corp with 10 members has only two active pilots. IIRC you tried to avoid exactly this (find out how many players are active in a corp) in the wardec price calculation. I suppose the difference is that, with the wardec calculation, you would have gotten that information for free when you GÇ£triedGÇ¥ to dec them and there would be no way to get it wrong. With this system, you first have to find every member in the corp (which may or may not be possible) and then you have to poll each one of them. That's an awful lot of work for information that might not even be accurate.
in times of evewho. this isnt really that a big hurdle anymore. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9837
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:51:00 -
[67] - Quote
darius mclever wrote:in times of evewho. this isnt really that a big hurdle anymore. EVEWho isn't exactly accurate, thoughGǪ
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
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Dirael Papier
Nevermined Inc Storm of Souls
21
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:51:00 -
[68] - Quote
Bloodpetal wrote:I like the anonymity, and I like the idea of knowing who put a bounty on my head.
Perhaps you can make it a fee. Pay 5m ISK to find out who put a bounty on my head. It's an ISK sink, and it puts a layer of "do I really want to know that much?". Even better, make it a percentage of the bounty, and have a percentage of that paid to the person that placed the bounty.
So then the bounty issuer KNOWS you know who did done do'd it and can start sweating bullets that you'll seek out revenge against their sought out revenge. |
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
3401
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:52:00 -
[69] - Quote
Salpun wrote:Kill right icons will those also show in space, be in chat, and in the overview?
it'll be in the selected items window, show info window and we're thinking about making a new overview setting for it with some cool color (pink, I hope) and icon Gÿà EVE User Interface Programmer Gÿà GÖÑ Team Super Friends GÖÑ @CCP_Punkturis My Dev Blogs |
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MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
609
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:52:00 -
[70] - Quote
CCP RedDawn wrote:This new feature should come with a brand new bounty hunter tinfoil hat that is free on the NeX.
Just a thought.
FYP Ok, so you've corrected my spelling,do you care to make a valid point? -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... |
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Noriko Mai
620
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:52:00 -
[71] - Quote
darius mclever wrote:Tippia wrote:Noriko Mai wrote:With this, there will be a way to find out that a corp with 10 members has only two active pilots. IIRC you tried to avoid exactly this (find out how many players are active in a corp) in the wardec price calculation. I suppose the difference is that, with the wardec calculation, you would have gotten that information for free when you GÇ£triedGÇ¥ to dec them and there would be no way to get it wrong. With this system, you first have to find every member in the corp (which may or may not be possible) and then you have to poll each one of them. That's an awful lot of work for information that might not even be accurate. in times of evewho. this isnt really that a big hurdle anymore. And with 100k minimum it's nearly free. And this way you can exactly find out who is active and who's not. |
darius mclever
40
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:53:00 -
[72] - Quote
CCP Paradox wrote:read above comments.
which exactly?
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Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
340
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:53:00 -
[73] - Quote
I am confused. I have read the dev blog twice. I see the part in the blog where the -1 sec status requirement has been removed, so that makes me think anyone in the game, in any sec area, can have a bounty on them, and be a target if someone if some bounty hunter is willing to accept high sec consequences of Concord.
So what is to stop someone like goons from placing a 10 billion isk bounty on someone they dislike, which pays out with 50 billion ISK in ship and implant losses, then restarting the bounty again, until the person they have set the bounty on has had their assets completely wiped out?
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Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
53
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:53:00 -
[74] - Quote
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote: I very much like this idea as a compromise. More Isk Sinks Is More Better
It needs to be proportional to the size of the bounty. If I place a 2 billion ISK bounty on someone, he should have to pay NPC Bounty Office Guys a lot more than 5 million to find out it was me who did it.
Probably not 1:1 proprotional, but some kind of proportionality. If 100k is the minimum bounty, then a starting point for the Discover cost could be the square root of the bounty deposit. Square root, times 20? Just to throw a number on the table.
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MeBiatch
Republic University Minmatar Republic
609
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:54:00 -
[75] - Quote
CCP Bro wrote:I want one of those brofists! Also, this is pretty awesome stuff!
every dev needs to post in the like and get likes thread... i should never have more likes then any ccp dev... well maybe goliath but thats a different story. Ok, so you've corrected my spelling,do you care to make a valid point? -áThere are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... |
Erik Finnegan
Polytechnique Gallenteenne
76
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:54:00 -
[76] - Quote
Nil mortifi sine lucre. |
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
3413
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:55:00 -
[77] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:I am confused. I have read the dev blog twice. I see the part in the blog where the -1 sec status requirement has been removed, so that makes me think anyone in the game, in any sec area, can have a bounty on them, and be a target if someone if some bounty hunter is willing to accept high sec consequences of Concord.
So what is to stop someone like goons from placing a 10 billion isk bounty on someone they dislike, which pays out with 50 billion ISK in ship and implant losses, then restarting the bounty again, until the person they have set the bounty on has had their assets completely wiped out?
I don't see how that's different than just ganking him over and over without the bounty? Gÿà EVE User Interface Programmer Gÿà GÖÑ Team Super Friends GÖÑ @CCP_Punkturis My Dev Blogs |
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Matt Grav
Wrath of the Pea
4
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:55:00 -
[78] - Quote
My first thoughts are:
* Should we be able to retract a bounty that we have placed ? Maybe at the loss of a % of the remaining bounty isk.
* Aren't players with a 30 day kill right for sale hanging over them just going undock in a very cheap or rookie ship to get a friend or alt to kill them ? I guess for this to work well you will need to find the right price point. Cheap enough for players to buy to allow kill rights but expensive enough for it not to be just a trivial cost to remove with an alt. At the moment it feels as if it is going to be too easy to avoid.
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Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
514
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:55:00 -
[79] - Quote
Salpad wrote:Tiberious Thessalonia wrote: I very much like this idea as a compromise. More Isk Sinks Is More Better
It needs to be proportional to the size of the bounty. If I place a 2 billion ISK bounty on someone, he should have to pay NPC Bounty Office Guys a lot more than 5 million to find out it was me who did it. Probably not 1:1 proprotional, but some kind of proportionality. If 100k is the minimum bounty, then a starting point for the Discover cost could be the square root of the bounty deposit. Square root, times 20? Just to throw a number on the table.
I disagree with this. Flat fees work great in this case, whereas making it proportional to the bounty size puts even more of the power in the hands of the issuer. |
Ravcharas
GREY COUNCIL Nulli Secunda
181
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:56:00 -
[80] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Ravcharas wrote:Quote:Kill Rights will now be created at the same time a Criminal flag is put on a player, but only for attacking in hi sec or podding in low sec. Wait, what? Unless I'm mistaken, under the old system a kill right is granted when your ship gets destroyed. Is this being changed to granting a kill right for merely aggressing? Yes. I believe it was mentioned in passing on the crimewatch blog. Flags and penalties being front-loaded was mentioned, yes. But the current system is 'a ship for a ship' - as it were. If aggrressing causes a kill right, that definitely changes the balance of crime and punishment.
I'm not saying I think it changes it for the worse, necessarily - but it is potentially a very significant change. |
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
3413
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:56:00 -
[81] - Quote
MeBiatch wrote:CCP Bro wrote:I want one of those brofists! Also, this is pretty awesome stuff! every dev needs to post in the like and get likes thread... i should never have more likes then any ccp dev... well maybe goliath but thats a different story.
some of us just like to earn likes with good posting! Gÿà EVE User Interface Programmer Gÿà GÖÑ Team Super Friends GÖÑ @CCP_Punkturis My Dev Blogs |
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Deornoth Drake
Cybermana
6
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:56:00 -
[82] - Quote
Kill rights Excellent idea that killing a ship in low sec won't great a kill right anymore. This is good news for casual pirates which don't kill the pods. So thumbs up for making low sec a bit more interesting (less painful) for the local pirates |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
9837
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:56:00 -
[83] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:So what is to stop someone like goons from placing a 10 billion isk bounty on someone they dislike, which pays out with 50 billion ISK in ship and implant losses, then restarting the bounty again, until the person they have set the bounty on has had their assets completely wiped out? For one, the target might wise up to the scheme and start flying ships that pay out less than it costs to kill them, making it worthless to pursue him.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
703
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:56:00 -
[84] - Quote
Here's a thought.
People used the bounty system for advertising.
Add an advertising system, so people can buy (with ISK) time to show up on the billboards and CQ screens, for themselves or their Corporation, with it linking through to the bio.
(helps a little with the TTP.)
It's another ISK sink. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities. |
Ravcharas
GREY COUNCIL Nulli Secunda
181
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:57:00 -
[85] - Quote
Also; I like the corp and alliance bounties. Cool beans. |
Roll Sizzle Beef
Space Mutiny
1263
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:57:00 -
[86] - Quote
Killrights could easily be manipulated to disappear with alts just shooting your killright character in a frig or shuttle. Could the Killright be modular like a bounty, it wont pay out isk but will deduct the proper amount of loss depending on the initial loss that gave you a killright? So if they ganked a frig, them losing 20% value of the frig completes the kill right contract. If you lost a BS, they can continually lose cruisers and frigates via kill rights for weeks tell 30 days has passed or 20% of the BS value has been deducted.
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Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
1043
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:57:00 -
[87] - Quote
Looks Nice! A few questions/notes:
It would be nice if I could set the payout percentage. If I place a bounty on a large alliance, it would quickly go away at 20%. But at 2% it persist awhile. 20% would still be the limit. If multiple people place bounties on one target, and they all add up to over 20% there would be a proportional payout system, limiting any given payout to 20%.
For that matter, how is the payout proportioned with your system now? That is:
I place a 1 million isk bounty on someone, you place a 2 million isk bounty on the same person. He dies, generating a payout of 600,000. I assume we both get eve-mail saying "XXXX of your bounty was awarded for killing....." what will the value of XXXX be for each of us? Proportional, like 200,000 from me, 400,000 from you? He then goes inactive and we both get the remaining bounty back. How much do we each get back?
Will bounties be iterated so I can place a bounty on classes of players? Like "all players with a sec status below -5, but not members of corp qqqq". Or "any Drake kill"?
Will I be able to set which players can collect a bounty? Example: A bounty on all members of alliance gggg, but not available to members of alliance aaaa or ttttt, or any loss that occurs in Null sec. The idea with this last one is to reward killing alliance gggg supply line ships traveling between null and high sec, but not reward kills associated with ongoing null sec wars. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
925
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:57:00 -
[88] - Quote
Salpad wrote:CCP Paradox wrote: We haven't nailed down exact percentages yet, but when we do we will let you guys know for feedback and discussion.
I think 20% is fine. When I thought about it half a week ago or so, that was my own conclusion: 20% of Total Induced Grief Value. Or 15% or 25%, but I opted for 20%, which I think is good.
Why not higher?
It takes a LOT of work to hunt down a person and make sure they suffer. Not to mention, you are basically forcing kill rights to be on paid rental (otherwise alt will activate and kill themselves) - and a good PVPer will make a group of mercs SUFFER for that chance at a pretty minimal bounty.
Come at me, and you will die repeatedly to collect the bounty on my head. EVE-Kill lists your chance of survival at about 13%. i.e. I have a 7 to 1 kill ratio, and those are against combat targets.
So, some dude comes up to me and kills my 80m hurricane and gets... what? 15m ISK? Oh, did I mention I have an army of killers at my side?
20% is too low to promote ACTUAL "bounty" hunting. Combine that with 1-5m ISK rental costs, and most of your ISK is going to the rental fee. Where I am. |
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
55
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:57:00 -
[89] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:I am confused. I have read the dev blog twice. I see the part in the blog where the -1 sec status requirement has been removed, so that makes me think anyone in the game, in any sec area, can have a bounty on them, and be a target if someone if some bounty hunter is willing to accept high sec consequences of Concord.
So what is to stop someone like goons from placing a 10 billion isk bounty on someone they dislike, which pays out with 50 billion ISK in ship and implant losses, then restarting the bounty again, until the person they have set the bounty on has had their assets completely wiped out?
Keep in mind, there are still the usual CONCORD consequences.
If the Goons dump a 50 billion ISK bounty on me, and I undock in a ship worth 250 million ISK with another 150 million in modules, rigs, ammo, implants, then the payout for suicide ganking me (including a pod kill on me) is 80 million ISK, and there'll be 49920 million bounty remaining.
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Bubanni
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
466
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:57:00 -
[90] - Quote
I see 2 problems
1: "This allows anyone in the vicinity of the suspect to engage him legally." As in when someone buys the kill right... this is way too effective, it should only work for the person buying the kill right
2: when anyone can buy the kill right, what stops the guy with the kill right on from using an alt to kill himself while he is in a rookieship?
I like everything else :) but there should probably be a very close look at how people get these kill rights... because with this change you effectively nerfed suicide ganking into the ground :) (mainly because of ability to activate suspect flag on the spot) Christmas wish list https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134275 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934 |
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