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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Tanthos
Tanthos Corp
53
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Posted - 2012.10.15 21:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
When dealing with balance issues, I'd rather ccp buffed ships and mods, rather than nerfed them. For example, buffing other ships to match the drake and hurricane, rather than nerfing those ships, or buffing other ammo and tech to match missile advantage, rather than just nerfing missiles.
It would enhance immersion, and provide a feeling of tech advancement. For example, due to the Hurricane's success, other manufacturer's finally manage to reverse engineer and duplicate its power grid layout. It would also provide a better impression of the game going forward, rather than back. Also, getting better ships for free is always a good feeling, and might be better received than nerfing popular ships. |
Nanatoa
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
61
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Posted - 2012.10.15 21:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
Yeah we need an endless buff cycle so we can get more Infinity+1 items. ((Warning: tvtropes.org link)) It is never too late to turn from the errors of your ways: He who repents of his sins is almost innocent.
MinerBumping.com |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2576
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Posted - 2012.10.15 21:43:00 -
[3] - Quote
Tanthos wrote:When dealing with balance issues, I'd rather ccp buffed ships and mods, rather than nerfed them. For example, buffing other ships to match the drake and hurricane, rather than nerfing those ships, or buffing other ammo and tech to match missile advantage, rather than just nerfing missiles.
It would enhance immersion, and provide a feeling of tech advancement. For example, due to the Hurricane's success, other manufacturer's finally manage to reverse engineer and duplicate its power grid layout. It would also provide a better impression of the game going forward, rather than back. Also, getting better ships for free is always a good feeling, and might be better received than nerfing popular ships. Most of the ships that have been rebalanaced so far have been/are being buffed considerably. BC's were pretty out of whack not only with each other but with the rest of the ship classes. Most of the Missiles are being buffed as well, the only one being brought into line with all the other weapons in game are the heavy missiles. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
973
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Posted - 2012.10.15 21:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
It's easier to nerf the one or two things that are "out of line" with everything else than to bring everything else up to the same level.
Oh yeah... "power creep" is something best avoided. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Corina Jarr
Spazzoid Enterprises Purpose Built
1335
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Posted - 2012.10.15 21:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
Isn't a buff just a nerf to everything else?
Also, haven't most of the rebalances so far been buffs? |
Reicine Ceer
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
92
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Posted - 2012.10.15 21:59:00 -
[6] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:"power creep"
CCP said in... something/somewhere/somewhen.... that "power creep" was something they specifically wanted to avoid. Plus, by buffing certain things, you'll end up eliminating a ship's worthiness in comparison to others, when buffing ends up with overlap.
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Roll Sizzle Beef
Space Mutiny
1304
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Posted - 2012.10.15 22:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
Nerfing and buffing leads to the same outcome across the board. Nerfing just leads to all items with lesser values. One thing EvE is not short on, place values. |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
1027
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Posted - 2012.10.15 22:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
Tanthos wrote:When dealing with balance issues, I'd rather ccp buffed ships and mods, rather than nerfed them. .
you realize that ccp buffed almost every ship up to cruisers after the retribution patch? a eve-style bounty system https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked |
La Nariz
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
209
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Posted - 2012.10.15 22:16:00 -
[9] - Quote
power creep, this is a bad idea
Goonwaffe is now recruiting feel free to message me in game for information about joining! |
Katsami
Sancta Terra
10
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Posted - 2012.10.15 22:40:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ship balancing in my EVE?
I'd much rather more clothing for my Barbie dolls. |
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rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
780
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Posted - 2012.10.15 22:41:00 -
[11] - Quote
Nerf HML missiles. I will not be voting in the CSM election, so you need to go vote to make up for me. |
Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
825
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Posted - 2012.10.15 22:54:00 -
[12] - Quote
Tanthos wrote:When dealing with balance issues, I'd rather ccp buffed ships and mods, rather than nerfed them. For example, buffing other ships to match the drake and hurricane, rather than nerfing those ships, or buffing other ammo and tech to match missile advantage, rather than just nerfing missiles.
-Missiles are getting buff, not nerf.
-Hurricane despite some kind of apparent "nerf" is actually getting also a nice buff as long as you look at it differently.
-Drake/Tengu are getting a tremendous buff at the point you actually might forget the "shoot from there" from now on and actually avoid to get closer if you don't want to taste the huge buff short range missiles are getting.
Quote:It would enhance immersion, and provide a feeling of tech advancement. For example, due to the Hurricane's success, other manufacturer's finally manage to reverse engineer and duplicate its power grid layout. It would also provide a better impression of the game going forward, rather than back. Also, getting better ships for free is always a good feeling, and might be better received than nerfing popular ships.
On this point and at least at this right moment, only attack and support cruisers next revamp eventual changes are available on dedicated dev blog. Until battlecruisers dev blog is out, and information related to these other than the already more or less stated changes that will hit some popular ships, no one can predict something else than a much needed small nerf to battlecruisers over all efficiency, and for some of them (T1) probably enough changes so they become actually worth flying. T2 battle cruisers are also in need of deep changes, be it in boosting, dps, tanking and of course important mobility.
Next T1 cruisers seem already in the good route to become a nice and valuable choice for multiple purposes, I'm waiting for BC changes expecting at some point their mobility/dmg projection nerf and after this the most important part for me, because this was my first goal: Battleships revamping! yey brb |
Smiknight
The Plebian Republic
15
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Posted - 2012.10.15 22:56:00 -
[13] - Quote
rodyas wrote:Nerf HML missiles.
Yeah, cause, like, they are totally overpowered. Like, totally.
Another unnecessary nerf to missiles, for whatever reason. For player driven, CCP likes to break things on the car. I am what you refer to as a Carebear...I care very much about the future New Eden and Eve and couldn't bear the Chicken Littles destroying that. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
198
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Posted - 2012.10.15 23:19:00 -
[14] - Quote
Nerf buffs, then buff nerfs. Problems = solved. Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Zagdul
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
1064
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Posted - 2012.10.15 23:29:00 -
[15] - Quote
I've made this exact argument that the reason drakes are used so often is because other races (minus the Hurricane) lack the ships in the same class to compete.
It's quite simple:
Buff the Harbi with more CPU and better cap efficiency.
Buff the myrm so it has more drone bandwith and can field 5 heavies or sentrys.
Dual Pane idea: Click!
CCP Please Implement |
Olleybear
I R' Carebear
124
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Posted - 2012.10.16 04:19:00 -
[16] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:...and after this the most important part for me, because this was my first goal: Battleships revamping! yey This. Oh yea. Remembering the days of when the pirates we feared were rolling around in rofl stomping battleships and then finally getting up there myself. Was one hell of a goal to reach and felt worth the effort put into it.
Yea. Battleship revamp. Looking forward to seeing these on gates again instead of the standard flavor today of, "Oh look. Yet another gang of drakes and hurricanes on gate." When it comes to PvP, I am like a chiwawa hanging from a grizzley bears pair of wrinklies for dear life. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
2576
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Posted - 2012.10.16 05:20:00 -
[17] - Quote
Smiknight wrote:rodyas wrote:Nerf HML missiles. Yeah, cause, like, they are totally overpowered. Like, totally. Another unnecessary nerf to missiles, for whatever reason. For player driven, CCP likes to break things on the car. Yeah... that's why nobody ever uses them. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
780
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Posted - 2012.10.16 05:32:00 -
[18] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Smiknight wrote:rodyas wrote:Nerf HML missiles. Yeah, cause, like, they are totally overpowered. Like, totally. Another unnecessary nerf to missiles, for whatever reason. For player driven, CCP likes to break things on the car. Yeah... that's why nobody ever uses them.
No need to feed the troll, Ranger 1 I will not be voting in the CSM election, so you need to go vote to make up for me. |
Webvan
State War Academy Caldari State
96
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Posted - 2012.10.16 05:43:00 -
[19] - Quote
Tanthos wrote:When dealing with balance issues, I'd rather ccp buffed ships and mods, rather than nerfed them. For example, buffing other ships to match the drake and hurricane, rather than nerfing those ships, or buffing other ammo and tech to match missile advantage, rather than just nerfing missiles.
Don't worry, after the nerf, we can start our "nerf them now" campaign. After that is done, they can start their petitions to nerf us back. Like the old UO forums, the fighting can just rage, flame, and grow with calls for nerfs until the forums are simply shut down while the player-base is at each others throats.
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rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
780
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Posted - 2012.10.16 05:47:00 -
[20] - Quote
^ Sadly only most players fly OP drakes and canes around, not all.
So that scenario probably won't happen, but good luck. I will not be voting in the CSM election, so you need to go vote to make up for me. |
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Webvan
State War Academy Caldari State
96
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Posted - 2012.10.16 05:52:00 -
[21] - Quote
rodyas wrote:^ Sadly only most players fly OP drakes and canes around, not all.
So that scenario probably won't happen, but good luck. But the nerfing doesn't only effect drakes, it effects 80% of a races ships whether they were "overpowered" or not, mostly not. Next they should nerf the Gallente out of existence me thinks, that'll be a solid next "iteration". There will always be something overpowered, god help that race, us all. |
Webvan
State War Academy Caldari State
96
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Posted - 2012.10.16 06:08:00 -
[22] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:
Oh yeah... "power creep" is something best avoided.
Yeah and I read the devs explanation of that, but it's no different than nerfing a races primary weapon, on all the ships in one shot. Why not just fix the drake? If the drake is too powerful, too powerful in groups, I would think it would be logical to just mess with the stats on that ship or how it functions in groups. If you nerf multiple ships or go the other way and buff multiple ships, what's the difference? ...when all that needed doing was to fix that one ship?? Or in the case for two ships, fix the two ships. The power creep argument is bs just like the nerfing creep is bs.
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rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
780
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Posted - 2012.10.16 06:10:00 -
[23] - Quote
Webvan wrote:rodyas wrote:^ Sadly only most players fly OP drakes and canes around, not all.
So that scenario probably won't happen, but good luck. But the nerfing doesn't only effect drakes, it effects 80% of a races ships whether they were "overpowered" or not, mostly not. Next they should nerf the Gallente out of existence me thinks, that'll be a solid next "iteration". There will always be something overpowered, god help that race, us all.
They already have done that, mostly why I don't care what happens to your drakes and canes. I will not be voting in the CSM election, so you need to go vote to make up for me. |
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
235
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Posted - 2012.10.16 06:16:00 -
[24] - Quote
rodyas wrote:Nerf HML missiles.
Nerf Heavy Missile Launcher Missiles Wat? |
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
780
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Posted - 2012.10.16 06:18:00 -
[25] - Quote
^ The missile terms are too fun for me to type. I will not be voting in the CSM election, so you need to go vote to make up for me. |
Webvan
State War Academy Caldari State
96
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Posted - 2012.10.16 06:27:00 -
[26] - Quote
rodyas wrote:
They already have done that, mostly why I don't care what happens to your drakes and canes.
See, that's what I'm talking about, and have seen it go really bad in other games over time. It'll never end until people get fed up with the constant nerf crying and go play something else. The problem is with CCP, they introduce things with overpowered or over ISK fauceted WOW factors to draw people in. Then when it all breaks down they let it fester for years as they formulate the next WOW factor thing to draw people there. Iteration and balancing shouldn't be blanket fixes with a pipe wrench, it's just another quick fix attempt rather than taking the time to fine tune. fail
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rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
782
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Posted - 2012.10.16 07:22:00 -
[27] - Quote
^ I only see that when pvp is involved, and it is as bad as you say it is.
With you complaining about medium guns getting nerfed, that is what you are probably complaining about. The pvp side of it. But with pvp being borked, don't know what to say to you. I will not be voting in the CSM election, so you need to go vote to make up for me. |
Riot Girl
RADIO RAMPAGE Initiative Mercenaries
158
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Posted - 2012.10.16 07:27:00 -
[28] - Quote
We're already getting plenty of buffs in the form of ship rebalancing. The problem with too many buffs is they raise the bar higher and make the game harder for new players to get into.
Ship rebalancing benefits old players more than new players because old players already have the skills to make good use of the rebalanced ships. New players are going to suck at flying them, but what happens when the cruisers are rebalanced and buffed to make them closer to BCs? Well level 2 missions are also buffed to reflect the stronger ship designs, making it harder for new players to run those missions and also making it harder for them to succeed in PvP due to stronger opponents making better use of the buffs. |
Webvan
State War Academy Caldari State
96
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Posted - 2012.10.16 07:33:00 -
[29] - Quote
rodyas wrote:^ I only see that when pvp is involved, and it is as bad as you say it is.
With you complaining about medium guns getting nerfed, that is what you are probably complaining about. The pvp side of it. But with pvp being borked, don't know what to say to you. You mean for missiles? I have minimal missile skills, hardly touch them. I use the same weapons as Gallante, hybrids, some various racial ships, this character being 2m SP and counting then going into fw soon, around winter patch. A second alt doing the same, and with no missile skills either. I just don't want to see any guns or missiles nerfed, but just individual ship balancing regarding all ships.
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Hazen Koraka
HK Enterprises
51
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Posted - 2012.10.16 07:44:00 -
[30] - Quote
I'm not sure if this is excessive sarcasm regarding HML nerf, or just an old thread that is out of context, but aren't they already going to nerf HML in the Winter expansion? See features and ideas (Hurricane tweak etc thread). |
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