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Nyxus
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Posted - 2005.04.01 19:12:00 -
[1]
Can anyone explain why the requirements are so completely varied for these 2 modules? Isn't it *already* too easy for low skilled players to hop into a missle spewing BS and shield tank? And for those who have trained the skills missles and shield skills all the way up, why are the tech 2 modules requirements not there to reward them?
Large Armor Rep II Activation: 400mw Grid Req: 2000mw CPU Req: 50tf Duration: 15s Armor Repaired: 800 Reqs: REPAIR SYSTEMS IV, MECHANIC V
XLarge Shield Booster II Activation: 400mw Grid Req: 500mw CPU Req: 200tf Duration: 5s Shield Restored: 600 Reqs: SHIELD OPERATIONS IV, Engineering I
When these modules are obviously so comparable, why does one have a rediculously low Tech 2 req of a lv 4 1x training multiplier (shield operations) and the other require a lvl 5 1x training multiplier AND a lvl 4 one 1x training multiplier.
Why the disparity? Why are the tech 2 requirements for shields so much lower than armor? I can understand if the XLarge T2 only req'd Shield Op 5.....but shield op 4??
That seems patently rediculous and needs to be remedied prior to patch day.
Nyxus
OTOH....I am so thankful that T2 booster and Reppers are finally in! Uber-offence will no longer rule the small engagement battlefield!
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Sadist
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Posted - 2005.04.01 19:15:00 -
[2]
While we are at it - please lower the skill req for Energized membranes Tech II to Hull upgrades lvl 4 from lvl 5. _______________________________________________
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RollinDutchMasters
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Posted - 2005.04.01 19:18:00 -
[3]
Edited by: RollinDutchMasters on 01/04/2005 19:17:53 Why do large armor rep IIs have the same fittings as Is, when neither medium nor small do, and why do the large and XL shield booster IIs have the same fittings as the Is, when neither the medium nor the small do?
Originally by: Sochin CCP has provided you with the tools you need to avoid crime. You're just too lazy/stupid to use them.
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Akaviri
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Posted - 2005.04.01 19:32:00 -
[4]
Originally by: RollinDutchMasters Edited by: RollinDutchMasters on 01/04/2005 19:17:53 Why do large armor rep IIs have the same fittings as Is, when neither medium nor small do, and why do the large and XL shield booster IIs have the same fittings as the Is, when neither the medium nor the small do?
I think that's already been changed with the upcoming patch. Right now on the test server Large Armor Rep II needs 55 cpu, 2300 grid. XLarge SB II needs 230 cpu, 550 grid. Large SB II needs 115 cpu, 165 grid (compared to 100 cpu, 150 grid for the tech I version). ````````````` _ |\_ ````````````` \` oo\ ````````_____/ =__Y= `````` /` `````` ) `_``` / ` , ``` \/\_.(\_/) ((____| `` )_--\ \_-`(x.x) `------'`------` `--` (> <) Kitty pwns Bunny! |
Letifer Deus
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Posted - 2005.04.01 22:12:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Sadist While we are at it - please lower the skill req for Energized membranes Tech II to Hull upgrades lvl 4 from lvl 5.
*signed*
I am the OG PIIIIIMP |
Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2005.04.01 22:15:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Letifer Deus
Originally by: Sadist While we are at it - please lower the skill req for Energized membranes Tech II to Hull upgrades lvl 4 from lvl 5.
*signed*
Why ?
High requirements are a good thing, remember ? _______________________________________________
Yes yes, blogging is passÚ I know. Rod's Ramblingz on Eve-Online Solutions to your issues. |
Meridius
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Posted - 2005.04.01 22:26:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Rod Blaine
Originally by: Letifer Deus
Originally by: Sadist While we are at it - please lower the skill req for Energized membranes Tech II to Hull upgrades lvl 4 from lvl 5.
*signed*
Why ?
High requirements are a good thing, remember ?
Agreed. ________________________________________________________
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Namelesz
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Posted - 2005.04.01 22:51:00 -
[8]
Tech2 SHOULD have very high requirements. Why have 2 week alts being able to fit tech2? that kinda ruins the whole point of it. and then also having low skill reqs for them kinda ruins the named/faction loot cause then those would go down in price. You will pay more for named modules cause of their normal skill reqs and good stats. For good stats at a lower price, you gotta train high to tech2. Plain and simple.
-Namelesz
"I never run away. I merely advance in the opposite direction." -Judicator "She was so dumb, the smartest thing to ever come out of her mouth was my *****." |
Hampstah
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Posted - 2005.04.01 23:34:00 -
[9]
[sarasm]Personally I would like to be able to have 2 week old alts in suicide Kessies devastating n00b miners in empire with T2 mods [/sarcasm]
----- Beware Rodentz with Gunz
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Elve Sorrow
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Posted - 2005.04.01 23:55:00 -
[10]
In all honesty, which BS pilot flying Armor Tanked ships does NOT have Mechanic V?
/Elve
New Video out! Watch me!
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CCP Hammer
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Posted - 2005.04.02 00:03:00 -
[11]
The XL shield booster will need skill level 5 when it hits TQ.
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Meridius
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Posted - 2005.04.02 00:52:00 -
[12]
Originally by: CCP Hammer The XL shield booster will need skill level 5 when it hits TQ.
Gasp, could this be the first lvl 5 skill required by a Raven pilot
________________________________________________________
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Mejare
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Posted - 2005.04.02 01:10:00 -
[13]
You need Missile Operation V to use cruise missiles. -Mejare
Originally by: Meridius
Originally by: CCP Hammer The XL shield booster will need skill level 5 when it hits TQ.
Gasp, could this be the first lvl 5 skill required by a Raven pilot
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garishwinner
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Posted - 2005.04.02 02:21:00 -
[14]
the normal mission running raven pilot does not use cruise missiles
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Sorja
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Posted - 2005.04.02 03:24:00 -
[15]
I'm very glad to see the Devs care about balance, so could we please have a skill that reduces cap usage on shield booster like armor tankers have a skill to reduce repair duration ? And the same total resistances from shields than armor ? And invulnerability fields using the same cap than their armor counterpart ? And viable passive shield tanking modules ? And cap relays that don't hit shield boosting ? And Moa/Hawk shield bonuses moved to armor tanking (or to anything usefull) ?
As Nyxus said, I demand that be fixed before rolling the new patch.
I hope we get the same fast response.
Thank you.
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Zenst
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Posted - 2005.04.02 03:47:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Meridius
Originally by: CCP Hammer The XL shield booster will need skill level 5 when it hits TQ.
Gasp, could this be the first lvl 5 skill required by a Raven pilot
LOL, indeed. oh b4 the Sheild vs Amour balance peeps jump in and winge, rememebr there aint no such thing as a armour repair amp ;p
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Sorja
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Posted - 2005.04.02 04:15:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Zenst
LOL, indeed. oh b4 the Sheild vs Amour balance peeps jump in and winge, rememebr there aint no such thing as a armour repair amp ;p
Of course, armor tanking is already much more powerfull. But I'm all for an armor repairing booster, maybe this would force the needed changes to shield tanking.
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Question2
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Posted - 2005.04.02 04:22:00 -
[18]
why is armor tanking more cap efficient than shield tanking?why is armor tanking better because it has better resists by default?why does armor tanking repair armor(so if it gets damaged,no biggie,shield tanks have to dock,fit armor reps,and repair it,while armor tanks just wait for shields to recharge)while their 2nd layer gets to recharge for free?
This all might answer the question of why that mod is better than the armor tanking mod,but i doubt thats why the devs had those stats.
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Pottsey
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Posted - 2005.04.02 07:58:00 -
[19]
ôwhy is armor tanking more cap efficient than shield tanking?ö Passive shield tanking is more cap efficient then Armor tanking :) . But why wonÆt CCP give us our T2 shield relays, Cap relays and Shield Flux modules?
_________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
Minuz1
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Posted - 2005.04.02 09:16:00 -
[20]
btw.... Where are the bloody structure hardeners!!! :D
-Win if you can, lose if you must, but always cheat!!!!! |
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Elve Sorrow
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Posted - 2005.04.02 09:39:00 -
[21]
God, it's him again.
Let me explain it to you. Every single usefull module was always released later. Why are passive hardners out, but the ones every uses, the active ones, are not? Why were Cap IIs released, but Cap Relay IIs not? Because at the time everyone shieldtanked, So Cap IIs were deemed useless.
Why were Small Shield Booster IIs and Small Armor Rep IIs released and Large Armor Rep II and XL Shieldbooster II not? Because that the later two would cause bigger imbalance then the former.
Oh and Pottsey, weren't you like, trying to cut down the Passive shieldtaning campaign? See, there's 50k players and 49.999 of them don't passive shieldtank. Quit whining that your mods aren't out. Please.
/Elve
New Video out! Watch me!
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Shirei
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Posted - 2005.04.02 09:42:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Question2 why is armor tanking more cap efficient than shield tanking?why is armor tanking better because it has better resists by default?why does armor tanking repair armor(so if it gets damaged,no biggie,shield tanks have to dock,fit armor reps,and repair it,while armor tanks just wait for shields to recharge)while their 2nd layer gets to recharge for free?
With this t2 gear, armor tanking won't be better to be honest.
2 large armor repairer II: 142.22 HP/s 2 HP/cap
XL shield booster II + shield boost amplifier: 156 HP/s 1.95 HP/cap
So you get almost 10% more HP repaired with the shield booster than with the armor repairer, which should be enough to counteract the higher resistances you get on armor, and the difference in cap efficiency is almost negligible.
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Kara Kaprica
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Posted - 2005.04.02 11:35:00 -
[23]
please also keep in mind "shield vs armor guys" that when your shield tank breaks you have apporx 5k armor and 5k hull to warp out with
the Armor tanked guy has 5k hull with very poor resists.
"Vengence delivered, on time and cold as ordered" |
Elve Sorrow
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Posted - 2005.04.02 11:37:00 -
[24]
The whole shieldtanking vs armortanking is all a load of bull****. There's situations where a shieldtank would've saved my life. There's situations where im perfectly fine armor tanking. Each have their pros and cons and theyre fine.
Im not going to list the pros and cons, if you can't figure that out yourself, quit EVE please.
Silly whining.
/Elve
New Video out! Watch me!
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Pottsey
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Posted - 2005.04.02 14:21:00 -
[25]
ôOh and Pottsey, weren't you like, trying to cut down the Passive shieldtaning campaign? See, there's 50k players and 49.999 of them don't passive shieldtank.ö ItÆs more then that youÆre underestimating. Sure itÆs not as popular as active tanking but every other day I get mails and people opening up chats with me, either say thanks for the new method itÆs useful or just to swap notes. Contrary to popular believe I am not the only one anymore and the amount of people doing it is growing.
I am trying to cut down and not spamming every single tread with it. But I thought this case was valid. Its about time we got T2 modules now lots of people use the method. But I wont go and post about it in every single thread to do with XLarge Shield Booster II and if you catch me doing that tell me to stop. As you donÆt like my posts I wont post in this tread anymore apart form direct questions. Will stick to the main patch tread.
_________________________________________________ Gallente defensive innovation comes from unexpected source. |
Sorja
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Posted - 2005.04.02 14:22:00 -
[26]
Elve... you should be thankfull for Pottsey trying to use passive tanking modules. She's being creative, no need to be arrogant dude.
Thanks to her 'studies' I've been able to passive tank a Ferox with very satisfactory results. Unfortunately, the Ferox is one of it's kind, with high shield regeneration and low shield points, which make a large shield extender II an incredibly powerfull module on that ship.
I don't see passive tanking viable for PvP even on a Scorp, the tech II modules aren't available and the penalties to cap recharge are so high that it prevents any passive tanked ship to travel around without a cap injector (which is not possible because of the charges size anyways).
Now, I have better results armor tanking a Moa than shield tanking it despite his +5% shield boosting ability... and still won't achieve the same results than a Duramaller. But you are Amarr, so everything's fine
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Grimpak
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Posted - 2005.04.02 14:25:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Meridius
Originally by: CCP Hammer The XL shield booster will need skill level 5 when it hits TQ.
Gasp, could this be the first lvl 5 skill required by a Raven pilot
indeed... finally ravens will be a bit more hard to fly -------------------
Quote: Fragm's Oversized Ego Cannon barely scratches the forums, inflicting omgnoonecares damage
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Nero Scuro
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Posted - 2005.04.02 14:37:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Grimpak
Originally by: Meridius
Originally by: CCP Hammer The XL shield booster will need skill level 5 when it hits TQ.
Gasp, could this be the first lvl 5 skill required by a Raven pilot
indeed... finally ravens will be a bit more hard to fly
I hardly see how spending weeks watching little bars going up is 'hard', or requires any real skill of any sort, but yeah, Ravens needed more SP intensive mods. ---------------- Haha, stupid monkey! Now I'VE got the Oscar! Enjoy your worthless gun! |
babylonstew
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Posted - 2005.04.02 16:20:00 -
[29]
i may be wrong here, but a raven doesnt 'need' this mod tho does it?
its actually doing fine without it to be honest, else there wouldnt be so much anti raven whining going on
so i dont think this will change 'the raven's skill reqs' 1 tiny little bit will it
and yes i fly a raven, so ill get the skills to use the tech 2 XL
(\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination. |
Elve Sorrow
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Posted - 2005.04.02 17:23:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Pottsey
ItÆs more then that youÆre underestimating. Sure itÆs not as popular as active tanking but every other day I get mails and people opening up chats with me, either say thanks for the new method itÆs useful or just to swap notes. Contrary to popular believe I am not the only one anymore and the amount of people doing it is growing.
I use it myself on certain setups, and have for quite a while now.
Originally by: Pottsey
I am trying to cut down and not spamming every single tread with it. But I thought this case was valid. Its about time we got T2 modules now lots of people use the method. But I wont go and post about it in every single thread to do with XLarge Shield Booster II and if you catch me doing that tell me to stop. As you donÆt like my posts I wont post in this tread anymore apart form direct questions. Will stick to the main patch tread.
The part about cutting down was semi-sarcastic to be honest, because you mentioned it earlier. Not meant to cause offend, i appreciate your efforts to get it some attention. The thing is, alot of modules are missing. Not only the ones for passive tanking. And hey, guess what. The majority still active tanks. So honestly, you're going to have to live with not having Tech2 mods untill CCP get off their lazy ass.
Originally by: Sorja
I don't see passive tanking viable for PvP even on a Scorp, the tech II modules aren't available and the penalties to cap recharge are so high that it prevents any passive tanked ship to travel around without a cap injector (which is not possible because of the charges size anyways).
It's not viable. You can get a recharge near the level of active tanking, but then you have no hardners, or only one, possibly. The cap use for warping around would be even worse. Warping a fleet 20-30 jumps and having to wait every 10 because someone capped out doesnt work. Atall.
Originally by: Sorja
Now, I have better results armor tanking a Moa than shield tanking it despite his +5% shield boosting ability... and still won't achieve the same results than a Duramaller. But you are Amarr, so everything's fine Rolling Eyes
My alt uses a shieldtanked Moa, works very good matter of fact. Use your imagination. As for the 'You're Amarr' part. I'm Amarr yes. That bother you? I was Amarr when Apocs had to use 425s and 1400s aswell. Didnt stop me using Lasers. And honestly. Do i really need to point out how utterly and completely useless Amarr frigates and cruisers are? They all suck. Period.
/Elve
New Video out! Watch me!
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