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Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
628
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Posted - 2012.11.01 14:06:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hans as you know soon after inferno came out an alliance mate of yours, susan black, started complaining that she felt minmatar were being punished for winning too much. Specifically she wrote several blogs to support her notion that minmatar should be able to farm lp even after they take a system through defensive plexing.
Of course, as you know, the comments to her blog had certain amarr and other explaining that the GÇ£no lp for defensive plexingGÇ¥ was one of the few mechanics that provided any sort of balance under inferno.
You chose to side with your alliance mate, in spreading the view that winners were being punished too much. Here is a quote from your blog:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote: GÇ£*Defensive plexing - it blows. "Punishing" players for "winning too much" by boring them to death leads to a lot of people not wanting to play at all.GÇ¥
Ok now you have pushed your alliance mates request through and rewards for defensive plexing have been implemented.
But as amarr I still feel that inferno really did not GÇ£punish the winners too much.GÇ¥ In fact I still think if anything it was too unbalanced in their favor. But I try to be objective on such matters. So I ask:
Q 1: Could you please ask ccp to provide the actual data on how much isk worth of items the minmatar received from the lp store and how much the amarr received from the time inferno was implemented until the time these new rules were implemented?
Of course you might already have these numbers, after all, IGÇÖm sure you were trying to be objective in reaching the conclusions you did before you recommended changes. If so please share them. I think then we could all draw our own opinions as to whether the minmatar were really being GÇ£punished for winning.GÇ¥
During your campaign you were very clear that you only wanted economic rewards that would not ubalance the war. But at some point after you were elected you decided there did not need to be any economic balance at all. You decided people will join the side the economical foolish to play for because of some vague notion of better pvp.
Here is what you said, after you were elected, about the new pay scale that you successfully requested ccp implement:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote: "You are absolutely correct that economically it doesnt make much sense for someone to join the losing faction, I've said every step of the way that the PvP incentive will always be stronger, and there is over four years of evidence to support that."
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1882291#post1882291
So my questions are this:
Q 2: What made you decide to change your position on this matter?
Also In game it shows that minmatar have about 10,000 players and the amarr have about 6000. This is by far the biggest disparity that ever existed until inferno. (I wonGÇÖt even go into the huge number of corps and alliances that left amarr yet no major entity left minmatar)
Q 3: Do you think there something other than economics explains this gap?
Q 4: Might you reconsider you position on this? If so how long do you want to give this notion that people will choose less isk due to some vague notion they might get more pvp? In other words when can we expect to see this gap close?
Hans I know you promised everyone a free hand job if you were elected. In some ways I feel amarr got a bit less than that in that plexing is no broken to the point where itGÇÖs foolish for amarr to do it as we just pay minmatar double for every plex we capture. But in other ways I feel like amarr got so much more than a hand job. I feel like you gave us an actual *******.
Oh and I know there are tons of people who are eager to be obsequious to any csm member. Please go ahead and take a stab at these questions too. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Anya Lunebleu
Royal Order of Security Specialists Late Night Alliance
0
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Posted - 2012.11.01 14:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
Seriously, dude. Give it a rest already. Your so called question is so loaded. If I were Hans I would ignore your ass.
There were a lot of good changes made in this pre-Retribution patch and it appears that most comments on these forums from FW people are favorable. I understand you are disappointed that you didn't get the big cash out you expected or your pipedream of a tier 5 (probably shouldn't have held on to those perma-farmed invuln systems so long. greed is not always good.). But, DAMN Boy,, you are freakin hysterical. Get a grip. |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
628
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Posted - 2012.11.01 14:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
Anya Lunebleu wrote:Seriously, dude. Give it a rest already. Your so called question is so loaded. If I were Hans I would ignore your ass.
.
I would not be surprised if Hans ignores the questions claiming that are somehow "unfair." But they are simply questions based on what he has said.
You are from his alliance so clearly you have better insights as to your boy's view. Please like I said feel free to answer the questions yourself if you think you know.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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kraiklyn Asatru
T.R.I.A.D Ushra'Khan
21
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Posted - 2012.11.01 14:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
Meh I suggest not only Hans ignores this guy, but everyone does. |
Anya Lunebleu
Royal Order of Security Specialists Late Night Alliance
0
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Posted - 2012.11.01 14:46:00 -
[5] - Quote
I don't have any special insight, nor would I presume to speak for anyone. Hans would have every right to ignore you, since you keep publicly accusing him of impropriety. Why can't you be a gentlemen and have a one on one chat with Hans to get whatever this sh*t is off your chest? |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
628
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Posted - 2012.11.01 14:47:00 -
[6] - Quote
kraiklyn Asatru wrote:Meh I suggest not only Hans ignores this guy, but everyone does.
Yeah, how dare I give quotes from him, and ask him some questions about how he arrived at those views.
It's so unfair.
Everyone should just give the csm member a blowjob and hope they get something in return.
In the meantime, Hans will reamain bewildered why so many people from opposing factions suggest he is biased.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Anya Lunebleu
Royal Order of Security Specialists Late Night Alliance
0
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Posted - 2012.11.01 14:52:00 -
[7] - Quote
Cearain wrote:kraiklyn Asatru wrote:Meh I suggest not only Hans ignores this guy, but everyone does. In the meantime, Hans will reamain bewildered why so many people from opposing factions suggest he is biased.
Who are these many people? You and that fruitcake, Damar? hehe |
Markius TheShed
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
112
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Posted - 2012.11.01 15:27:00 -
[8] - Quote
The situation isn't that Black and White you can't work out how much each faction has by looking at the LP store data as you don't know which characters are Mains or Alts.
**Murientor Tribe** Killing Slavers, Ammatar and Nafantar Traitors since YC107 |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
628
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Posted - 2012.11.01 15:48:00 -
[9] - Quote
Markius TheShed wrote:The situation isn't that Black and White you can't work out how much each faction has by looking at the LP store data as you don't know which characters are Mains or Alts.
It would have all gone to the winning side so it would still be a good measure if the winning side was being punished too much. The fact that other militias up and joined the winning side would only prove that the game was too lopsided. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
628
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Posted - 2012.11.01 15:50:00 -
[10] - Quote
Anya Lunebleu wrote:Cearain wrote:kraiklyn Asatru wrote:Meh I suggest not only Hans ignores this guy, but everyone does. In the meantime, Hans will reamain bewildered why so many people from opposing factions suggest he is biased. Who are these many people? You and that fruitcake, Damar? hehe
Read the fw blogs and the forums. You will find plenty of people who agree he has failed to understand the underdog's view.
Also are you still thinking the questions are unfair? Is it unfair to look at the actual data to see if it supports his claim that the winning side was being punished in inferno? Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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jjohnpaul xvii
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
37
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Posted - 2012.11.01 15:54:00 -
[11] - Quote
Cearain - you lose so much of your argument because of the way you phrase it.....
Your a smart guy, you ask some very good questions, and i know for a fact you have a passion for FW and PVP (all these are great things to my mind and exactly what FW need!) but please, please, please try and drop the snide stuff.
Its a space game. A computer game, that we all play, based in space, where we are all flying around in little spaceships shooting at each other.
Lighten up!
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Anya Lunebleu
Royal Order of Security Specialists Late Night Alliance
1
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Posted - 2012.11.01 15:55:00 -
[12] - Quote
Cearain wrote:Markius TheShed wrote:The situation isn't that Black and White you can't work out how much each faction has by looking at the LP store data as you don't know which characters are Mains or Alts.
It would have all gone to the winning side so it would still be a good measure if the winning side was being punished too much. The fact that other militias up and joined the winning side would only prove that the game was too lopsided.
Actually, I recall a post you made on these very same forums about you, yourself (via your Minnie alt), cashing in on the Minnie T5 store. I guess you are on the winning side as well. |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
628
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Posted - 2012.11.01 16:07:00 -
[13] - Quote
Anya Lunebleu wrote:Cearain wrote:Markius TheShed wrote:The situation isn't that Black and White you can't work out how much each faction has by looking at the LP store data as you don't know which characters are Mains or Alts.
It would have all gone to the winning side so it would still be a good measure if the winning side was being punished too much. The fact that other militias up and joined the winning side would only prove that the game was too lopsided. Actually, I recall a post you made on these very same forums about you, yourself (via your Minnie alt), cashing in on the Minnie T5 store. I guess you are on the winning side as well.
Your memory fails you. No such post was made.
Beside that what is your point? That the winning side was being punished so badly that even the opposing militia was rolling alts to cash in? That hardly seems proof to support Han's and Susans claim that we need to address the fact that minmatar were being punished for winning too much. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Anya Lunebleu
Royal Order of Security Specialists Late Night Alliance
2
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Posted - 2012.11.01 16:13:00 -
[14] - Quote
Such a post does exist. I'll be damned if I am going to weed thru all the bs on this forum to find it though. I recall it was around the time when your leading argument was that since the Goons got busted Minimatar would never get another T5.
Anyway, I am not trying to prove or disprove any of your accusations. |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
628
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Posted - 2012.11.01 16:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
jjohnpaul xvii wrote:Cearain - you lose so much of your argument because of the way you phrase it..... Your a smart guy, you ask some very good questions, and i know for a fact you have a passion for FW and PVP (all these are great things to my mind and exactly what FW need!) but please, please, please try and drop the snide stuff. Its a space game. A computer game, that we all play, based in space, where we are all flying around in little spaceships shooting at each other. Lighten up!
After this set of rule changes I am no longer going to play this computer game involving fw occupancy. Which was the only part of eve that ever really interested me. So yeah I care about eve enough to ask a few questions of the guy who decided to kill the game off for me.
To the extent any amarr continue in the occupancy war they are just lining the minmatar pockets. These rules are too slanted. No amarr should continue with this part of the war effort unless they want to help the minmatar make isk.
Our best bet economically is just to let the minmatar take all the systems and treat the game like we did preinferno. Sure minmatar will make isk taking the systems but then the bleeding will stop. The quicker we can stop the bleeding the sooner we can move on to the new normal which should be to ignore occupancy.
If they keep this stupid tier system for missions amarr (and every militia) should just roll minmatar alts to run the missions. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
628
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Posted - 2012.11.01 16:22:00 -
[16] - Quote
Anya Lunebleu wrote:Such a post does exist. I'll be damned if I am going to weed thru all the bs on this forum to find it though. I recall it was around the time when your leading argument was that since the Goons got busted Minimatar would never get another T5.
Anyway, I am not trying to prove or disprove any of your accusations.
You are right that I admitted I had an alt after I said that. I did indeed say that so you guys would hurry up, hit tier 5 and allow my alt to cash out. But you are wrong to claim I posted that with the alt.
Again though what is your point? The minmatar were being punished for winning so much that even the opposing militia was rolling minmatar alts? Your proving my point. That the system needed more balance not that it needed what little balance it had removed so the winning side wouldn't be "punished." Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Lucy Ferrr
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
205
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Posted - 2012.11.01 16:26:00 -
[17] - Quote
Cearain wrote: Also In game it shows that minmatar have about 10,000 players and the amarr have about 6000. This is by far the biggest disparity that ever existed until inferno. (I wonGÇÖt even go into the huge number of corps and alliances that left amarr yet no major entity left minmatar)
Q 3: Do you think there something other than economics explains this gap?
.
Uhhh yes. This giant gap is formed not by economics but by idiots, idiots like you. You idiots come to the forum going on and on about how if you want to be rich you need an alt in the minmatar militia. All the blind sheeple lead by the blind forum idiots join the minmatar militia because they are told to. In reality Minmatar militia is the worse militia for a farmer, you make significantly less isk per hour in minmatar militia than any other. Look how much more amarr faction ships and datacores are than minmatar. Especially now that implants aren't that profitable without the T5 cost reduction. With so few places for a minmatar to plex, you can usually expect to have to fight for you plex. Other militia's can get in a gunless frig and find a out of the way system, minmatars cannot.
You want to close the gap between minmatar and amarr, quit misleading people and telling them if you want to be rich you need to join minmatar militia. If Amarr militia would quit sucking ( I know its hard to fight one's nature) enough to get and hold T3 it would be way way more profitable to be amarr than minmatar.
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X Gallentius
Justified Chaos
575
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Posted - 2012.11.01 16:32:00 -
[18] - Quote
Cearain wrote:After this set of rule changes I am no longer going to play this computer game involving fw occupancy. o/ later man. gf, have fun, enjoy eve retirement. You'll be better off than the rest of us addicts. Blood pressure will stabilize, less stress, all that. |
Anya Lunebleu
Royal Order of Security Specialists Late Night Alliance
2
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Posted - 2012.11.01 16:55:00 -
[19] - Quote
Cearain wrote:Anya Lunebleu wrote:Such a post does exist. I'll be damned if I am going to weed thru all the bs on this forum to find it though. I recall it was around the time when your leading argument was that since the Goons got busted Minimatar would never get another T5.
Anyway, I am not trying to prove or disprove any of your accusations. You are right that I admitted I had an alt after I said that. I did indeed say that so you guys would hurry up, hit tier 5 and allow my alt to cash out. But you are wrong to claim I posted that with the alt. Again though what is your point? The minmatar were being punished for winning so much that even the opposing militia was rolling minmatar alts? Your proving my point. That the system needed more balance not that it needed what little balance it had removed so the winning side wouldn't be "punished."
I didn't mean to imply you posted with an alt, but that you profited on Minnie t5 via an alt.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1601907#post1601907 |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
629
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Posted - 2012.11.01 17:22:00 -
[20] - Quote
Anya Lunebleu wrote:Cearain wrote:Anya Lunebleu wrote:Such a post does exist. I'll be damned if I am going to weed thru all the bs on this forum to find it though. I recall it was around the time when your leading argument was that since the Goons got busted Minimatar would never get another T5.
Anyway, I am not trying to prove or disprove any of your accusations. You are right that I admitted I had an alt after I said that. I did indeed say that so you guys would hurry up, hit tier 5 and allow my alt to cash out. But you are wrong to claim I posted that with the alt. Again though what is your point? The minmatar were being punished for winning so much that even the opposing militia was rolling minmatar alts? Your proving my point. That the system needed more balance not that it needed what little balance it had removed so the winning side wouldn't be "punished." I didn't mean to imply you posted with an alt, but that you profited on Minnie t5 via an alt. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1601907#post1601907
Ok the placement of the qualifier wasn't clear.
Yes I have been open about the fact that after inferno the awards were so slanted in favor of the winning side that for the first time after years of faction war I made an alt in the opposing faction. Do you see how that tends to prove that the minmatar really were not punished too much for winning?
You seem to be missing the point in all of this. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
629
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Posted - 2012.11.01 17:25:00 -
[21] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:Cearain wrote:After this set of rule changes I am no longer going to play this computer game involving fw occupancy. o/ later man. gf, have fun, enjoy eve retirement. You'll be better off than the rest of us addicts. Blood pressure will stabilize, less stress, all that.
LOL sorry I didn't say I was leaving eve or even faction war. I just won't be capping any plexes because it is foolish for amarr to bother with it.
But yeah I have been taking a bit of a break from eve. Its been nice. You might want to give some thought to doing the same. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Lady Ayeipsia
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
391
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Posted - 2012.11.01 17:31:00 -
[22] - Quote
Cearain wrote:kraiklyn Asatru wrote:Meh I suggest not only Hans ignores this guy, but everyone does. Yeah, how dare I give quotes from him, and ask him some questions about how he arrived at those views. It's so unfair. Everyone should just give the csm member a blowjob and hope they get something in return. In the meantime, Hans will reamain bewildered why so many people from opposing factions suggest he is biased.
It's at that point you lose all credibility OP. If you must resort to such childish antics, why should I care about your views. You've just shown the level of your mentality, and I, along with many others, stop caring about your issue. Good luck, as if that is your best, you will need it. |
Super Chair
Project Cerberus Caldari State Capturing
339
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Posted - 2012.11.01 17:59:00 -
[23] - Quote
Cearain wrote:X Gallentius wrote:Cearain wrote:After this set of rule changes I am no longer going to play this computer game involving fw occupancy. o/ later man. gf, have fun, enjoy eve retirement. You'll be better off than the rest of us addicts. Blood pressure will stabilize, less stress, all that. LOL sorry I didn't say I was leaving eve or even faction war. I just won't be capping any plexes because it is foolish for amarr to bother with it. But yeah I have been taking a bit of a break from eve. Its been nice. You might want to give some thought to doing the same.
And here I thought you'd finally stop **** posting.... |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
629
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Posted - 2012.11.01 19:12:00 -
[24] - Quote
Super Chair wrote:Cearain wrote:X Gallentius wrote:Cearain wrote:After this set of rule changes I am no longer going to play this computer game involving fw occupancy. o/ later man. gf, have fun, enjoy eve retirement. You'll be better off than the rest of us addicts. Blood pressure will stabilize, less stress, all that. LOL sorry I didn't say I was leaving eve or even faction war. I just won't be capping any plexes because it is foolish for amarr to bother with it. But yeah I have been taking a bit of a break from eve. Its been nice. You might want to give some thought to doing the same. And here I thought you'd finally stop **** posting....
I stopped the **** posting a while back, but I see you're still at it. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
466
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Posted - 2012.11.01 19:42:00 -
[25] - Quote
A lot of the actual people you are fighting are still poor as **** bro. Min FW was farmed to ****, but not usually by actual Minmatar. Sa souvraya niende misain ye. |
Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
629
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Posted - 2012.11.01 20:37:00 -
[26] - Quote
Vordak Kallager wrote:A lot of the actual people you are fighting are still poor as **** bro. Min FW was farmed to ****, but not usually by actual Minmatar.
I believe it. But that doesn't answer why we had to remove the minimal balance that existed to protect the underdog. Why did Hans feel he had to act on the belief that the winning side was being wrongly punished? Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
Imperial Outlaws
629
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Posted - 2012.11.01 20:48:00 -
[27] - Quote
Lady Ayeipsia wrote:Cearain wrote:kraiklyn Asatru wrote:Meh I suggest not only Hans ignores this guy, but everyone does. Yeah, how dare I give quotes from him, and ask him some questions about how he arrived at those views. It's so unfair. Everyone should just give the csm member a blowjob and hope they get something in return. In the meantime, Hans will reamain bewildered why so many people from opposing factions suggest he is biased. It's at that point you lose all credibility OP. If you must resort to such childish antics, why should I care about your views. You've just shown the level of your mentality, and I, along with many others, stop caring about your issue. Good luck, as if that is your best, you will need it.
Really you made it that far before you stopped? You made it through all the hand job stuff but as soon as I mention a blowjob, it's at that point I Iost you?
Isn't there a song "you had me at 'hello' but you lost me at 'blowjob'" or something?
Anyway, thanks for sharing, I took your advice and deleted the word blowjob from that post. Good luck to you as well. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Silence iKillYouu
KA POW POW Inc Late Night Alliance
203
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Posted - 2012.11.02 01:18:00 -
[28] - Quote
kraiklyn Asatru wrote:Meh I suggest not only Hans ignores this guy, but everyone does.
http://fw-frontline.blogspot.com/ |
Zarnak Wulf
Imperial Outlaws
685
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Posted - 2012.11.02 01:29:00 -
[29] - Quote
Hans,
How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Roll Popsicle? |
Rezig Huruta
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
55
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Posted - 2012.11.02 01:32:00 -
[30] - Quote
Zarnak Wulf wrote:Hans,
How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Roll Popsicle?
Trick question! Trick question! Its a lollipop!
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