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Samroski
Games Inc.
79
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 12:08:00 -
[1] - Quote
In anticipation of the heavy missile nerf, I'm trying out some of the other ships I have. I tried the following Golem fit for Worlds Collide (Guristas), but I could not catch the BSs at the initial gates, thus I think the fit needs an AB or MWD.
Not sure how well this ship tanks, but I suppose one could easily fit an AB, and possibly a third target painter? Maybe get rid of the boost amplifier? Are the rigs and good?
Please help.
[Golem, Melog] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Republic Fleet Target Painter Republic Fleet Target Painter Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster Pith A-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Pithum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field Pith B-Type Kinetic Deflection Field Pith B-Type Thermic Dissipation Field
Salvager II Small Tractor Beam I Small Tractor Beam I Kaikka's Modified Torpedo Launcher, Mjolnir Torpedo Kaikka's Modified Torpedo Launcher, Mjolnir Torpedo Kaikka's Modified Torpedo Launcher, Mjolnir Torpedo Kaikka's Modified Torpedo Launcher, Mjolnir Torpedo
Large Rocket Fuel Cache Partition II Large Warhead Calefaction Catalyst I
Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5 |
John Ratcliffe
Sausy Sausages
63
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Posted - 2012.11.08 12:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
Samroski wrote:In anticipation of the heavy missile nerf, I'm trying out some of the other ships I have. I tried the following Golem fit for Worlds Collide (Guristas), but I could not catch the BSs at the initial gates, thus I think the fit needs an AB or MWD.
Does it absolutely have to be a Golem? A SNI would be better IMHO. Of if you have decent turret skills, then a Mach.
The men waved their hats, the ladies their umbrellas. One felt they would have liked to touch the steel muscles of the most courageous champions since antiquity. Who will carry off the first prize, entering the pantheon where only supermen may go? |
Riot Girl
RADIO RAMPAGE Initiative Mercenaries
384
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Posted - 2012.11.08 12:38:00 -
[3] - Quote
I think it might be an idea to scrap that fit and start again from scratch. You're not going to catch anything without a prop mod and you're not cap stable or even close to it. With this fit, you'll have to warp out by the time you get close enough to shoot anything.
Personally, I'd recommend using a different ship like a CNR. Try and get it cap stable or at least have a cap booster, but still try to get it as close to cap stable as possible so you don't burn through your cap boosters too fast. A prob mod will also burn a lot of cap and an AB isn't going to help your range issues too much. It will be too slow, so you'd need a MWD which will burn all your cap boosters. I think it's a bad idea.
My advice would be to take a CNR with cruise missiles instead. |
Kasutra
Tailor Company Hashashin Cartel
72
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 12:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
Stash those officer launchers until we get range modules that affect torps. WC is a really tough mission for torps to begin with, you want the javelins that come with T2 launchers.
You probably want another range rig too.
A third painter is going to be useful. As would an AB in gated missions. How much tank you are comfortable with losing is best found out with gradual experimentation. |
dethleffs
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
122
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 12:55:00 -
[5] - Quote
nice lootpi+¦ata.
wouldn't it be more practical to save 1 bill in launchers and CN bcu's and just get tech two with faction torps? |
John Ratcliffe
Sausy Sausages
63
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Posted - 2012.11.08 12:59:00 -
[6] - Quote
dethleffs wrote:nice lootpi+¦ata.
wouldn't it be more practical to save 1 bill in launchers and CN bcu's and just get tech two with faction torps?
No. It'd be more practical to use a ship better suited to the task.
The men waved their hats, the ladies their umbrellas. One felt they would have liked to touch the steel muscles of the most courageous champions since antiquity. Who will carry off the first prize, entering the pantheon where only supermen may go? |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
181
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 13:24:00 -
[7] - Quote
Samroski wrote:In anticipation of the heavy missile nerf, I'm trying out some of the other ships I have. I tried the following Golem fit for Worlds Collide (Guristas), but I could not catch the BSs at the initial gates, thus I think the fit needs an AB or MWD.
Not sure how well this ship tanks, but I suppose one could easily fit an AB, and possibly a third target painter? Maybe get rid of the boost amplifier? Are the rigs and good?
Please help.
[Golem, Melog] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Republic Fleet Target Painter Republic Fleet Target Painter Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster Pith A-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Pithum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field Pith B-Type Kinetic Deflection Field Pith B-Type Thermic Dissipation Field
Salvager II Small Tractor Beam I Small Tractor Beam I Kaikka's Modified Torpedo Launcher, Mjolnir Torpedo Kaikka's Modified Torpedo Launcher, Mjolnir Torpedo Kaikka's Modified Torpedo Launcher, Mjolnir Torpedo Kaikka's Modified Torpedo Launcher, Mjolnir Torpedo
Large Rocket Fuel Cache Partition II Large Warhead Calefaction Catalyst I
Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5
Would definitiv gank you in that...and I would only need a jammer and a pair of neuts...
"Also, your boobs " -á CCP Eterne, 2012
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Riot Girl
RADIO RAMPAGE Initiative Mercenaries
384
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Posted - 2012.11.08 13:32:00 -
[8] - Quote
You don't even need a jammer or neuts. All you need is a point. |
Samroski
Games Inc.
79
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 13:41:00 -
[9] - Quote
John Ratcliffe wrote: Does it absolutely have to be a Golem? A SNI would be better IMHO. Of if you have decent turret skills, then a Mach.
Not really. Just trying. I have an SNI which I may try out as well. I already tried a Mach before the Golem, which was pretty good, but I had problems with frigates (I think). Turret skills are reasonable, but not enough level 5s. Probably had a loser fit on the Mach as well, though I looked at the forums and went with the fit that had most support.
Riot Girl wrote: My advice would be to take a CNR with cruise missiles instead.
kk. Will try the CNR next. Pity that the Golem appears to be useless.
Kasutra wrote: Stash those officer launchers until we get range modules that affect torps. WC is a really tough mission for torps to begin with, you want the javelins that come with T2 launchers. You probably want another range rig too. A third painter is going to be useful. As would an AB in gated missions. How much tank you are comfortable with losing is best found out with gradual experimentation.
Will add the range rig (current range is about 35km), and train for T2 torps and come back to this ship later.
Would a web be better than a 3rd TP?
dethleffs wrote: nice lootpi+¦ata. wouldn't it be more practical to save 1 bill in launchers and CN bcu's and just get tech two with faction torps?
Thanks for liking :) Will switch to your advice as soon as I can. |
Samroski
Games Inc.
79
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 13:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:You don't even need a jammer or neuts. All you need is a point. Hmmmm.
Unfortunately/fortunately it appears that the ship is going into another hibernation. |
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John Ratcliffe
Sausy Sausages
63
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Posted - 2012.11.08 13:51:00 -
[11] - Quote
Samroski wrote:Not really. Just trying. I have an SNI which I may try out as well. I already tried a Mach before the Golem, which was pretty good, but I had problems with frigates (I think). Turret skills are reasonable, but not enough level 5s. Probably had a loser fit on the Mach as well, though I looked at the forums and went with the fit that had most support.
If you already have an SNI, then try that before trying the CNR. They are both great ships, the only differences really are that the CNR has an extra launcher, so slightly more DPS, but the SNI has better targeting range and more Mid slots so has a better tank.
Try this fit for your SNI:
Low:
4 x CN BCU
Mid:
Gist A-Type X-large Shield Booster Gist A-Type Shield Amp 4 x T2 Mission Specific Active Resists Imperial Navy Cap Booster & Navy 800 Charges Domination 100MN AB
High:
6 x CN CM Launcher Either T2 Drone Link or T1 Tractor Beam
Rigs:
3 x T1 Rigor
That's it - easy... The men waved their hats, the ladies their umbrellas. One felt they would have liked to touch the steel muscles of the most courageous champions since antiquity. Who will carry off the first prize, entering the pantheon where only supermen may go? |
Samroski
Games Inc.
79
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 14:27:00 -
[12] - Quote
John Ratcliffe wrote:Samroski wrote:Not really. Just trying. I have an SNI which I may try out as well. I already tried a Mach before the Golem, which was pretty good, but I had problems with frigates (I think). Turret skills are reasonable, but not enough level 5s. Probably had a loser fit on the Mach as well, though I looked at the forums and went with the fit that had most support.
If you already have an SNI, then try that before trying the CNR. They are both great ships, the only differences really are that the CNR has an extra launcher, so slightly more DPS, but the SNI has better targeting range and more Mid slots so has a better tank. Try this fit for your SNI: Low: 4 x CN BCU Mid: Gist A-Type X-large Shield Booster Gist A-Type Shield Amp 4 x T2 Mission Specific Active Resists Imperial Navy Cap Booster & Navy 800 Charges Domination 100MN AB High: 6 x CN CM Launcher Either T2 Drone Link or T1 Tractor Beam Rigs: 3 x T1 Rigor That's it - easy... Sounds good. Will try this first. Thanks. |
Cryissa
Caldari Navy Operations Kraken.
12
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 15:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
I thought the return on a 4th BCU was so low that it wasn't worth fitting it?
Therefore I would fit a damage control II |
John Ratcliffe
Sausy Sausages
64
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Posted - 2012.11.08 16:03:00 -
[14] - Quote
Cryissa wrote:I thought the return on a 4th BCU was so low that it wasn't worth fitting it?
Therefore I would fit a damage control II
My understanding is that it's still worth having. Personal preference applies though obviously.
The men waved their hats, the ladies their umbrellas. One felt they would have liked to touch the steel muscles of the most courageous champions since antiquity. Who will carry off the first prize, entering the pantheon where only supermen may go? |
Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
413
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 16:06:00 -
[15] - Quote
Cryissa wrote:I thought the return on a 4th BCU was so low that it wasn't worth fitting it?
Therefore I would fit a damage control II when fitting for missions, your philosophy should always be 'as much tank as necessary and as much damage as possible'. a fourth BCU gives you another ~10% damage; a suitcase only gives you more EHP than you will ever need. there is only one good reason for fitting a damage control: discouraging suicide gankers. but since there are several other ways of dealing with them, you micht as well skip it.
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |
stoicfaux
1751
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 16:17:00 -
[16] - Quote
T2 torps for range (aka Javelin torps.) You'll want two T2 range rigs (2xspeed or 1xspeed/1xflight time) since range greatly affects the Golem's performance in missions.
Retribution's torp and TP ship bonus buff should reduce the number of TPs you need to 0-1 for battleships and 1-2 for cruisers.
The "missiles now affected by tracking mods" change that happens sometime after Retribution could possibly, maybe, hopefully fix the Golem's range problem and/or reduce TP juggling once again.
You can tell me what is and isn't Truth when you pry the tinfoil from my cold, lifeless head. Feature Request: -áDamnation Ship Codpiece-áfor the NeX store.
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Goldensaver
Vorbild Industries Inc.
90
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 18:02:00 -
[17] - Quote
Personally, once Retribution hits, I think the Golem's going to be a much better ship. Buff to TP's, buff to torps explosion radius (a decrease, since it's getting buffed), and they're removing the penalties from T2 missiles.
Honestly, I'd stick with the Golem. Go with T2 torps, 2 range rigs, forget cap stability and go for a large burst tank, after all, you should be killing enemies fast enough that you shouldn't have to worry about incoming damage. Unless things are somehow different for the Golem, and it does less damage...
Of course, I have to say my CNR is doing quite well right now, and the SNI is a fantastic ship. It's just that the Golem should have a higher damage output than either of those, allowing you to finish missions much more quickly. I'd think... |
Firestorm Delta
Wiki Industrialists Wiki Conglomerates
8
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 18:41:00 -
[18] - Quote
Oh the golem most certainly does more dmg then the CNR, the issue is range, t2 launchers with javs as primary ammo, faction for everything else. Maybe Rage as well after the buff, burst tank with a nice XL and boost amp, 2-3 paints, and 4 BCUs.
If your skills are where they are at for a golem then you should be getting around 70km with the javelins. If not, then get it there. |
Bleedingthrough
Raptor Navy
0
|
Posted - 2012.11.08 19:12:00 -
[19] - Quote
I am mainly doing missions to help our corp members to get standings for JCs. So i am not an expert on mission fits by any means. This fitting i used last week and it kinda worked:
- Range on EFT is 65km in reality it is more like 60km. - DPS is quite good but delayed and if you don't count, volleys get lost and these nasty defenders. - Big bonus is the ability to use whatever dmg-type is the best. - The "oh ****" XL-ASB was not used in any mission once. (exception was a storyline with 15 drone BSs shooting me at the same time) - Kinda slow for my taste. But i don't know how to squeeze in a propulsion module. - Kills BS rather fast, struggles with some frigs (4 volleys). Would love to have a 3rd painter but will not be needed after patch.
The mach looks way more fun to fly. If i ever do missions again i'll buy one.
Hope this post helped you :-)
[Golem, L4 golem] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Ballistic Control System II Damage Control II
X-Large Ancillary Shield Booster, Cap Booster 400 EM Ward Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Gist A-Type Large Shield Booster Target Painter II Target Painter II
Torpedo Launcher II, Nova Javelin Torpedo Torpedo Launcher II, Nova Javelin Torpedo Torpedo Launcher II, Nova Javelin Torpedo Torpedo Launcher II, Nova Javelin Torpedo [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot]
Large Hydraulic Bay Thrusters II Large Rocket Fuel Cache Partition II
Vespa II x5
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Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
414
|
Posted - 2012.11.09 13:59:00 -
[20] - Quote
Firestorm Delta wrote:Oh the golem most certainly does more dmg then the CNR, the issue is range, t2 launchers with javs as primary ammo, faction for everything else. Maybe Rage as well after the buff, burst tank with a nice XL and boost amp, 2-3 paints, and 4 BCUs.
If your skills are where they are at for a golem then you should be getting around 70km with the javelins. If not, then get it there.
false. the navy raven has 9.33 effective launchers whereas the golem only has 8. the golem does have better damae application if you are willing to juggle TPs (which i find silly tbh).
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |
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Goldensaver
Vorbild Industries Inc.
92
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Posted - 2012.11.09 16:37:00 -
[21] - Quote
Daniel Plain wrote:Firestorm Delta wrote:Oh the golem most certainly does more dmg then the CNR, the issue is range, t2 launchers with javs as primary ammo, faction for everything else. Maybe Rage as well after the buff, burst tank with a nice XL and boost amp, 2-3 paints, and 4 BCUs.
If your skills are where they are at for a golem then you should be getting around 70km with the javelins. If not, then get it there. false. the navy raven has 9.33 effective launchers whereas the golem only has 8. the golem does have better damae application if you are willing to juggle TPs (which i find silly tbh).
After this patch, you'll only need to juggle one or two. GMP is going to do fantastic things to Torpedoes. Of course, same could be said for the Torps on the Raven, except for the TP bonus. |
stoicfaux
1753
|
Posted - 2012.11.09 18:00:00 -
[22] - Quote
Goldensaver wrote: After this patch, you'll only need to juggle one or two. GMP is going to do fantastic things to Torpedoes. Of course, same could be said for the Torps on the Raven, except for the TP bonus.
In regards to the torp raven, tentatively speaking, no. Limited TP slots (and no TP bonus) means the torp CNR is mostly gimped against cruiser size targets. The torp Raven would be even more problematic with its reduced volley damage.
You can tell me what is and isn't Truth when you pry the tinfoil from my cold, lifeless head. Feature Request: -áDamnation Ship Codpiece-áfor the NeX store.
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Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
243
|
Posted - 2012.11.09 18:04:00 -
[23] - Quote
Well even in a Golem I still prefer using cruise launchers rather than torps.
I have not flown a CNR as I keep spending my LP on other mods. But I plan to have one soon. I did however go right from a standard raven to a golem. With my skills the standard raven was great for level 4 missions, and fairly fast.
Although the paper DPS is much lower, T2 cruise launchers are the way to go for level 4 missions.
First of all when running torps you need to get close to apply anywhere near your max damage. In level 4 missions close range means much more incoming DPS. Combine this with a prop mod burning your cap, your tank will not hold.
With a cruise missile fit you gain range reducing incoming DPS and with no need of a prop mod you have more cap to pulse an X-large SB. Tank on a Golem is not much better than a standard Raven but is enough for level 4 missions.
A T2 rigor and T2 Flare rig do wonders for cruise missile DPS. These rigs allow Fury cruise missiles to hit almost as hard as Javelin torps, plus have a huge range advantage. On top of this the rigor and flare rigs allow Precision cruise missiles to hit smaller ships much harder. I often one volley cruisers and 2 volley BC's. If you fly a Golem like a standard Raven you tank about the same, with a little bonus from the role bonus to shield boosters. You also get a big DPS boost. It effectively has 8 launchers compared to the Ravens 6. I have just never been able to do well with a Raven, or Golem with torps. The limited range just seems to gimp the ship to much. Great for shooting POSes if you do not ind the ammo cost, but the applied damage to smaller ships just does not seem to work in most missions.
I have had success flying a Typhoon with 800mm AC's Torps, and heavy drones, But even it has faster completion times with cruise launchers and sentry drones. Paper DPS over 1000 is nice to see. But the applied DPS when you actually get it in a mission is what really matters.
I expect with the changes coming in the expansion on Dec 4th torps will get much better. more DPS with the former guided missile skills now applying to them(and hopefully the rigor rigs will also then work on torps) combine that with the new micro jump drive being able to instantly close a 100km gap torps could become the new I win button. not to mention how much more effective stealth bombers will become. |
John Ratcliffe
Sausy Sausages
64
|
Posted - 2012.11.09 18:44:00 -
[24] - Quote
Bugsy VanHalen wrote:Although the paper DPS is much lower, T2 cruise launchers are the way to go for level 4 missions.
No.
Faction CM Launchers & Faction Ammo are the way to go for Lvl 4 missions. The men waved their hats, the ladies their umbrellas. One felt they would have liked to touch the steel muscles of the most courageous champions since antiquity. Who will carry off the first prize, entering the pantheon where only supermen may go? |
Samroski
Games Inc.
80
|
Posted - 2012.11.09 19:49:00 -
[25] - Quote
I tried the following cruise missile fit, and it worked great. Slightly over-tanked at the moment. Will swap the invuln field for a web probably. May also go with an XL booster instead of L, along with an AB instead of the boost amp.
[Golem, Melog] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Republic Fleet Target Painter Republic Fleet Target Painter Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster Pith A-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Pithum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field Pith B-Type Kinetic Deflection Field Pith B-Type Thermic Dissipation Field
Salvager II Small Tractor Beam I Small Tractor Beam I Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5 |
John Ratcliffe
Sausy Sausages
64
|
Posted - 2012.11.09 20:19:00 -
[26] - Quote
Samroski wrote:I tried the following cruise missile fit, and it worked great. Slightly over-tanked at the moment. Will swap the invuln field for a web probably. May also go with an XL booster instead of L, along with an AB instead of the boost amp.
[Golem, Melog] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Republic Fleet Target Painter Republic Fleet Target Painter Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster Pith A-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Pithum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field Pith B-Type Kinetic Deflection Field Pith B-Type Thermic Dissipation Field
Salvager II Small Tractor Beam I Small Tractor Beam I Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5
You have enough calibration for 2 T2 Rigors, so what haven't you fitted 2?
The men waved their hats, the ladies their umbrellas. One felt they would have liked to touch the steel muscles of the most courageous champions since antiquity. Who will carry off the first prize, entering the pantheon where only supermen may go? |
Samroski
Games Inc.
81
|
Posted - 2012.11.09 22:00:00 -
[27] - Quote
John Ratcliffe wrote: You have enough calibration for 2 T2 Rigors, so what haven't you fitted 2?
I ran out of rigs. Had bought a bunch at Jita, but only had one T2 left over at my mission hub.
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Samroski
Games Inc.
81
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Posted - 2012.11.13 06:50:00 -
[28] - Quote
Samroski wrote:I tried the following cruise missile fit, and it worked great. Slightly over-tanked at the moment. Will swap the invuln field for a web probably. May also go with an XL booster instead of L, along with an AB instead of the boost amp.
[Golem, Melog] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Republic Fleet Target Painter Republic Fleet Target Painter Pith A-Type Large Shield Booster Pith A-Type Shield Boost Amplifier Pithum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field Pith B-Type Kinetic Deflection Field Pith B-Type Thermic Dissipation Field
Salvager II Small Tractor Beam I Small Tractor Beam I Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile Caldari Navy Cruise Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5
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Mike Whiite
Keystone Industrial
77
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Posted - 2012.11.13 08:49:00 -
[29] - Quote
After the expantion, torps will get all the benefits of explosion range reductions cruisemissiles already have.
and the TP bonus will make the use or rigors less needed on the Golem which leaves room for range mods.
I think it's worth a try. |
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