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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Brisk Frisk
1
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Posted - 2012.12.18 07:02:00 -
[31] - Quote
OP does not say remove off grid boosting. It says do something about neutral links in low sec and high sec, and make links have a reasonable sig when linking. Make links a valid targets, gate guns and concord shouldn't defend them. AGAIN I'M NOT ARGUING ABOUT OFF GRID BOOSTING! I'm saying balance the RISK vs REWARD of using them. There is 0 risk using them in high sec of low sec. |
Vizvig
Savage Blizzard Bora Alis
27
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Posted - 2012.12.18 07:40:00 -
[32] - Quote
DR BiCarbonate wrote:lol at the people butthurt about OGB. just because someone running with a booster alt doenst make it not solo. They're still fighting with ONE ship So i can fight with one ship and use 2 logistic behind me, true solo pvp.
He just ganking solo pilots via no KMwhoring second GANKmate. |
jjohnpaul xvii
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
54
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Posted - 2012.12.18 12:57:00 -
[33] - Quote
Brisk Frisk wrote: There is 0 risk using them in high sec of low sec.
This is a very common misconception that's bounded around. In reality, of course there is risk in using them in lowsec. People lose them at gates/in space every single week.
There is (near) 0 risk of losing them at a POS if you stay within that one system. Also consider that the impacts of losing a T3 booster are relatively large in terms of around about a billion isk and skill points lost. (low risk/fairly high impact)
Again, i am not saying that they don't need balancing/swapping bonii with CS/blocked from boosting with POS/brought OG etc - they clearly do need looking at - but you should try to frame this accurately.
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Zoe Panala
Blobcats
31
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Posted - 2012.12.18 15:26:00 -
[34] - Quote
Thomas Gore wrote:Bad Messenger wrote:there is nothing wrong on OGB, everyone can use them so no need to cry. True that. So maybe the "fair" word should be removed from the topic, as there is nothing unfair involved. Maybe the question is, why does it exist? What purpose does it promote?
It promotes paying for another account. |
DR BiCarbonate
Basgerin Pirate SCUM.
24
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Posted - 2012.12.18 19:08:00 -
[35] - Quote
Vizvig wrote:DR BiCarbonate wrote:lol at the people butthurt about OGB. just because someone running with a booster alt doenst make it not solo. They're still fighting with ONE ship So i can fight with one ship and use 2 logistic behind me, true LOWSEC solo pvp. He just ganking solo pilots via no KMwhoring second GANKmate. Wouldn't know anything about logi, hardly used them. |
Cage Man
Evil Guinea Pigs
42
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Posted - 2012.12.18 19:16:00 -
[36] - Quote
Don't see whay a boosting ship should be made stronger, it servers a different role. Imagine if falcon's had strong tanks?? |
Thomas Gore
State Protectorate Caldari State
33
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Posted - 2012.12.19 17:21:00 -
[37] - Quote
Zoe Panala wrote:Thomas Gore wrote:Bad Messenger wrote:there is nothing wrong on OGB, everyone can use them so no need to cry. True that. So maybe the "fair" word should be removed from the topic, as there is nothing unfair involved. Maybe the question is, why does it exist? What purpose does it promote? It promotes paying for another account.
I think you might be on to something there... |
Kirkwood Ross
AWE Corporation Intrepid Crossing
9
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Posted - 2012.12.20 05:40:00 -
[38] - Quote
Because the on-grid boosting would require a lot of coding and other issues like grid-fu. I believe they will make it so you cannot turn on Warfare links while on grid with a station or a POS. |
Disposable Drunkard
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
2
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Posted - 2012.12.25 11:05:00 -
[39] - Quote
Thomas Gore wrote:Bad Messenger wrote:there is nothing wrong on OGB, everyone can use them so no need to cry. True that. So maybe the "fair" word should be removed from the topic, as there is nothing unfair involved. Maybe the question is, why does it exist? What purpose does it promote? It exists in order to harvest tears. Its purpose is to give bad pilots an excuse for why they lost the fight to the smaller gang. It promotes dispute and forum warrioring.
We're using ogb a lot; we typically fly 5-6 crapships and 2 alt offgrid boosters, and we kick ass of much bigger, 20-40 guy gangs in their station systems. Interestingly, those guys attribute their continuing losses to ogb, and not to their fc:s being complete idiots. If ogb were lifted, they would have to face the reality, but we don't want that, do we? |
Bad Messenger
Nasranite Watch The Bloody Ronin Syndicate
313
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Posted - 2012.12.25 15:04:00 -
[40] - Quote
Brisk Frisk wrote:OP does not say remove off grid boosting. It says do something about neutral links in low sec and high sec, and make links have a reasonable sig when linking. Make links a valid targets, gate guns and concord shouldn't defend them. AGAIN I'M NOT ARGUING ABOUT OFF GRID BOOSTING! I'm saying balance the RISK vs REWARD of using them. There is 0 risk using them in high sec of low sec.
I've seen once in the lowsec when big 0.0 blob came to shoot some pos with big fleet, they killed 2 ogb ships on that system which were hard to probe.
Hard to probe is just balancing the fact that you can use those inside pos shields.
CCP plans to nerf boost strength is on right track although way they will change ships does not get my full support. |
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Pinaculus
Aliastra Gallente Federation
161
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Posted - 2012.12.25 16:38:00 -
[41] - Quote
I've never understood why they have an entire skill tree and ship class that basically requires zero player involvement at all. Boosting needs to be completely redone to require an active player actually making decisions to fill that ship's intended role. Until that happens none of the tweaks being proposed really matter. Currently it's a tinker toy for alt accounts. It should be a viable fleet role for a flesh and blood player.
Just some ideas that I think would work ok: Boosts are on-grid only Only one boost module per ship max I know sometimes it's difficult to realize just how much you spend on incidental things each month or year, but seriously, EVE is very cheap entertainment compared to most things... If you are a smoker, smoke one less pack a week and pay for EVE, with money left over to pick up a cheap bundle of flowers for the EVE widow upstairs. |
Zenethalos
Mecha Enterprises Fleet Villore Accords
12
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Posted - 2012.12.25 18:50:00 -
[42] - Quote
Pinaculus wrote:I've never understood why they have an entire skill tree and ship class that basically requires zero player involvement at all. Boosting needs to be completely redone to require an active player actually making decisions to fill that ship's intended role. Until that happens none of the tweaks being proposed really matter. Currently it's a tinker toy for alt accounts. It should be a viable fleet role for a flesh and blood player.
Just some ideas that I think would work ok: Boosts are on-grid only Only one boost module per ship max
Way before T3 came out I took the time to train up all of the command ships and their mindlinks. During those days if I told someone I could bring any command ship with any links they wanted I was gold because pilots that sank 10 months into doing so were rare. During those days I was always in the fight, usually acting as bait and i was loved for it.
Now I tell people I can do that and I am told to **** off that my role has been filled by a t3 cruiser in an alt.
It is really disheartening to think I sank so much time into being a specialized and once valued commodity that has been replaced by the safety of off grid alts doing the boosting. Nothing was more thrilling then sitting in a super tanked command ship and taking a pounding while my allies worked hard to keep my alive. I miss those days.
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Bad Messenger
Nasranite Watch The Bloody Ronin Syndicate
328
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Posted - 2012.12.26 05:35:00 -
[43] - Quote
Pinaculus wrote:I've never understood why they have an entire skill tree and ship class that basically requires zero player involvement at all. Boosting needs to be completely redone to require an active player actually making decisions to fill that ship's intended role. Until that happens none of the tweaks being proposed really matter. Currently it's a tinker toy for alt accounts. It should be a viable fleet role for a flesh and blood player.
Just some ideas that I think would work ok: Boosts are on-grid only Only one boost module per ship max
Boost are on-grid only does not work really, if you are fighting for system you have to be constantly on move so your tacklers etc never really get boosts, and also EVE grids has weird behavior that makes on-grid only boost unreliable because grid has holes and it keeps changing.
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March rabbit
Federal Defense Union
316
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Posted - 2012.12.26 17:05:00 -
[44] - Quote
Olerie Viliana wrote:/FACEPALM
Did anyone even read the post?
you are new here aren't you?
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Riven Varlass
Perkone Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.12.26 17:58:00 -
[45] - Quote
I did not bother reading the post, there is no "fix" to this. Just plain removal. Buffbots as they're known for in other games have always been a source of much hate and anger, not to mention it breeds new buffbots, all of a sudden you can't play unless you have a buffbot yourself. |
psycho freak
Snuff Box
82
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Posted - 2012.12.27 10:13:00 -
[46] - Quote
Nothing to fix with ogb tbh only thing needs fixing is the amount of whineing players on these forums that cry change this change that
i dont deny command ships need bit ov love but ogb is fine my spelling sux brb find phone number for someone who gives a fu*k
nop cant find it |
Thomas Gore
Blackfyre Enterprise
66
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Posted - 2012.12.27 13:38:00 -
[47] - Quote
Bad Messenger wrote: Boost are on-grid only does not work really, if you are fighting for system you have to be constantly on move so your tacklers etc never really get boosts, and also EVE grids has weird behavior that makes on-grid only boost unreliable because grid has holes and it keeps changing.
So you're saying they cannot be brought into the fight reliably?
Then the whole boosting system should be scrapped and either removed with an "ahwell" or redesigned from the start.
Again, I still wonder wth was in the devs' heads when they thought about this system.
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Pinaculus
Fweddit I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth
179
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Posted - 2012.12.28 15:41:00 -
[48] - Quote
Thomas Gore wrote:Bad Messenger wrote: Boost are on-grid only does not work really, if you are fighting for system you have to be constantly on move so your tacklers etc never really get boosts, and also EVE grids has weird behavior that makes on-grid only boost unreliable because grid has holes and it keeps changing.
So you're saying they cannot be brought into the fight reliably? Then the whole boosting system should be scrapped and either removed with an "ahwell" or redesigned from the start. Again, I still wonder wth was in the devs' heads when they thought about this system.
The game is 10 years old. They had no clue that people would multibox everything they possibly could as much as they possibly could. Once they realized I think they welcomed it as additional revenue and took steps to make it easier (multiple clients on the same machine, PLEX for ISK, Power of Two, etc, etc). I think original design intent was for people to skill up "Fleet Leader" and be more valuable as group leaders because of the stat boosts they gave out.
The problem is that being a "pure booster" is a very very boring job fitting only for an AFK, gunless ship. They've created a role that's so easy it can be done completely AFK, so boring that nobody would actually want to do it full time, and so passive that there's zero reason for boosting ships to be piloted anyway.
I still like the On-Grid only idea, but with a specific range limit (let's say 40km). They could also redesign gang boost modules so there's only ONE boost module, and it uses scripts to change which boost it gives out. Suddenly it makes sense for a boost frigate to accompany your tackle to make them faster, or to swap scripts and help it tank better or tackle further away. If they did it alongside the BC rebalance they could revisit the fitting requirements of gang booster mods and the BC bonus to them.
Whatever they do (if anything) should make boosting an ACTIVE role in a fleet, with actual risks and decision making involved. Making it a job for AFK alts is insulting, and CCP should find it embarrassing. I know sometimes it's difficult to realize just how much you spend on incidental things each month or year, but seriously, EVE is very cheap entertainment compared to most things... If you are a smoker, smoke one less pack a week and pay for EVE, with money left over to pick up a cheap bundle of flowers for the EVE widow upstairs. |
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
424
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Posted - 2012.12.28 22:39:00 -
[49] - Quote
Pinaculus wrote:...Whatever they do (if anything) should make boosting an ACTIVE role in a fleet, with actual risks and decision making involved. Making it a job for AFK alts is insulting, and CCP should find it embarrassing. And there it is, that most elusive of internet phenomenon, reason.
Given what we know so far, that CS (Fleet ones in particular) are being made proper monsters worthy of their names, one can hope and should think that CCP came to the very same conclusion as that which I quoted but a snippet of above.
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Gunship
FATAL Warfare Hopeless Addiction
84
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Posted - 2012.12.29 01:50:00 -
[50] - Quote
Riven Varlass wrote:I did not bother reading the post, there is no "fix" to this. Just plain removal. Buffbots as they're known for in other games have always been a source of much hate and anger, not to mention it breeds new buffbots, all of a sudden you can't play unless you have a buffbot yourself.
Amen to that
Countless times I have seen the OGB alts jumping into system with there mains. Some people simply can't fight without 2-3 alts boosting them.
Does people really think this is A) fun? B) real? C) great skills? Come join us for Amarr FW pvp-áaction. More info here:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2145548&#post2145548
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Sevgei Ertekin
Comin' in Hot
13
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Posted - 2012.12.29 20:50:00 -
[51] - Quote
The only problem I have with links, is that T3's are better at it for less training time. Not to mention you can fit a Cov Ops cloak/emergent locus/nullifier etc. Commands should at least get a better bonus, since they get the short straw on everything else. Not having to fit command processors for more than one link is the only upside, which is kind of negligible. |
Bella Dera
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.12.29 21:03:00 -
[52] - Quote
This argument is getting tired fast. Its very simple really. Just remove boosts altogether. Make everyone equally skilled by removing skill points and have 4 kinds of ships in the entire game, one for each race. Level the playing field so much so that no one anywhere ever can have the advantage unless they bring more numbers. Oh but then there will be tears from one race that their ship isn't good enough.... Ok then just have one ship in the game, yea thats it.
I think that pretty much solves it.
Now would you all STFU already, bunch of whiny babies!!!!! |
Bane Nucleus
The Kairos Syndicate Transmission Lost
281
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Posted - 2012.12.30 04:41:00 -
[53] - Quote
Honestly, after carefully reading over each post in this thread, I have come to the conclusion that steak is best cooked medium rare. Then, it must be eaten WITHOUT steak sauce. Because if you prep and cook it correctly, it should never need sauce. Alliance CEO, Diplomat, Recruiter |
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