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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
523
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Posted - 2012.12.22 10:57:00 -
[151] - Quote
Kingpin Nil wrote:again why would you decide to go AFK? why would you get an advantage over someone that logged off as opposed to someone deciding to go AFK for a while?
so now I need to log off every time I take a ****? what if I have diarrhoea? or need to take a ****? or grab some food? or go at the door to see who knocked? feeding the pets?
I could put here several reasons why.
also, if the afk cloaker is attacking you, he isn't really afk now is he? [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Pak Narhoo
Knights of Kador
753
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Posted - 2012.12.22 11:21:00 -
[152] - Quote
AFK cloaking the problem that isn't a problem while we're heading for page 9! Hi, I'm CCP Arrow, I screwed up the.. ummm... |
jamesoverlord
Death or Glory inc. The Bloody Ronin Syndicate
4
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Posted - 2012.12.22 11:33:00 -
[153] - Quote
all i can see is more tears from the carebears jesus guys you idiot carbears are going to finish this game off carrying on the way you are change this change that since you lot started getting your own way with ccp nearly all elements of pvp are dieing stop moaning and learn to fight |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
10888
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Posted - 2012.12.22 11:37:00 -
[154] - Quote
Pak Narhoo wrote:AFK cloaking the problem that isn't a problem while we're heading for page 9! That's because people make suggestions, without understanding the subject. Then refuse to accept their failings, when others point them out.
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
10743
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Posted - 2012.12.22 11:49:00 -
[155] - Quote
Kingpin Nil wrote:it's irrenlavent because my argument inst about reds making locals paranoid its about addressing being AFK GǪand the question we keep coming back to is: why does being AFK need to be addressed? What's the problem with people being AFK when they're doing absolutely nothing while they're away? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan. |
Jhagiti Tyran
Muppet Ninja's Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns
246
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Posted - 2012.12.22 11:53:00 -
[156] - Quote
First hour back after a nearly a year away and what threads top in GD? AFK cloaking...... |
cBOLTSON
Star Frontiers THORN Alliance
104
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Posted - 2012.12.22 12:03:00 -
[157] - Quote
Sigh.... this topic again.
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THE CLOAKING MECHANIC!
The only problem is how people react (OR lack of proper reaction)
Nullbear see cloaker and instead of going - "Hey guys theres a enemy cloaked in our system, lets bait him / trap him / form a fleet in the next system / ANY other idea"
No, instead the nullbear goes - "Waaaahhh theres a cloaker , im going to go dock up as im scared of what he might do to me"
never even realising he could just move a jump or two over or try and kill that cloaker.
Its sad and pathetic. "Were not elitists, were just tired of fail" - The Sorn |
Alice Fiorina
Viziam Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2012.12.22 12:07:00 -
[158] - Quote
Kingpin Nil wrote:
so far only one person has been able to understand the whole point of this thread.
Not agreeing with you is not the same as not understanding.
You think there is a problem with AFK cloaking.
There is not.
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Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
97
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Posted - 2012.12.22 12:11:00 -
[159] - Quote
Xessej wrote: And why would a cloaker attack a lone drake when he wants to bomb a mining op or light a cyno for a hotdrop? I'm interested in actual gameplay not in some wild fantasy where a guy wastes hours on end to pick up a Drake KM..
Omg, was only a damned example, since the discussion was about AFK cloackers denying ratting. But can adapt the concept, don't have to litteraly send out a drake everytime there's someone cloacked! The sense was: find a proper way to make him decloack in a situation where you can trap him.
And since when bombing a mining op or hotdropping a fleet is not "active gameplay"??
The only problem yhis thread (as many others of the same kind) adress is the inability for few players to accept the idea (a base idea in EvE) that their gameplay can be influenced by other players and their will to negate any challange and any kind of player to player interaction if not with their consent and in their specific terms.
So, instead of adapting and putting some gameplay effort the only way they find "to counter" is sitting in station doing nothing and asking for CCP to do the job they're too lazy or too inable to do, adding/nerfing some well-known, consolidated amd fun for the rest of EvE, game mechanic.
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Xessej
Darqsyde Exploration Limited Mass - Effect
2
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Posted - 2012.12.22 16:15:00 -
[160] - Quote
Sura Sadiva wrote:Xessej wrote: And why would a cloaker attack a lone drake when he wants to bomb a mining op or light a cyno for a hotdrop? I'm interested in actual gameplay not in some wild fantasy where a guy wastes hours on end to pick up a Drake KM..
Omg, was only a damned example, since the discussion was about AFK cloackers denying ratting. But can adapt the concept, don't have to litteraly send out a drake everytime there's someone cloacked! The sense was: find a proper way to make him decloack in a situation where you can trap him. And since when bombing a mining op or hotdropping a fleet is not "active gameplay"?? The only problem yhis thread (as many others of the same kind) adress is the inability for few players to accept the idea (a base idea in EvE) that their gameplay can be influenced by other players and their will to negate any challange and any kind of player to player interaction if not with their consent and in their specific terms. So, instead of adapting and putting some gameplay effort the only way they find "to counter" is sitting in station doing nothing and asking for CCP to do the job they're too lazy or too inable to do, adding/nerfing some well-known, consolidated amd fun for the rest of EvE, game mechanic. I accept my gameplay will be affected by other players. That's why I use available means to gather intel and adjust my gameplay to match the existing circumstances.
The point people have been trying to make, since the sov changes over a year ago that made this more of an issue, is that an AFK cloaker does, and should, affect the use that can be made of an upgraded system. Which reduces the income the system can generate for the sov holders which discourages players from moving out to nullsec.
As to why does an AFK cloaker affect players use of a system because those other players do not view their non PvP oriented ships as nothing but your future km.
That does not mean those players expect to do their thing totally unmolested. But it does mean they have some way of measuring risk which my proposal would give them note that a not AFK cloaker would be in next to no danger from my idea.
BTW precisely what part of being AFK is a fun "game mechanic."
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initiatives
University of Caille Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.12.22 17:23:00 -
[161] - Quote
I agree with op, afk cloaking blows.
Afk cloaking usually hurts smaller nullsec corps to which is horrible in my opinion anyway.
The argument that afk cloakers are not hurting anyone therefore no one should be able to hurt them is pretty stupid.
Afk cloakers clearly hurt industry and ratting in system that they afk in (pretty obvious, that there action of afk cloaking does serious damage)
1. I propose that afk cloakers have a 10 minute penalty to lighting a cyno after they uncloak (unless they switch systems, dock, or perform any type of related change) (the penalty would only come into effect after 15 minutes of continuous cloaking)
This would make it so afk cloakers are really only dangerous for the first 15 minutes logged in, or in your system. (ofcourse they are still dangerous as they can uncloak and tackle or gather intelligence
or
make it so all characters show up on the account under bio or another tab, so afk cloakers can no longer use anonymity to harass null sec operations.
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Kingpin Nil
Care-Bears UNITED Silent Infinity
0
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Posted - 2012.12.23 03:20:00 -
[162] - Quote
Alice Fiorina wrote:Kingpin Nil wrote:
so far only one person has been able to understand the whole point of this thread.
Not agreeing with you is not the same as not understanding. You think there is a problem with AFK cloaking. There is not.
Understanding the idea of my thread has nothing to do with agreeing or disagreeing with me either! |
Kingpin Nil
Care-Bears UNITED Silent Infinity
0
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Posted - 2012.12.23 03:21:00 -
[163] - Quote
initiatives wrote:I agree with op, afk cloaking blows.
Afk cloaking usually hurts smaller nullsec corps to which is horrible in my opinion anyway.
The argument that afk cloakers are not hurting anyone therefore no one should be able to hurt them is pretty stupid.
Afk cloakers clearly hurt industry and ratting in system that they afk in (pretty obvious, that there action of afk cloaking does serious damage)
1. I propose that afk cloakers have a 10 minute penalty to lighting a cyno after they uncloak (unless they switch systems, dock, or perform any type of related change) (the penalty would only come into effect after 15 minutes of continuous cloaking)
This would make it so afk cloakers are really only dangerous for the first 15 minutes logged in, or in your system. (ofcourse they are still dangerous as they can uncloak and tackle or gather intelligence
or
make it so all characters show up on the account under bio or another tab, so afk cloakers can no longer use anonymity to harass null sec operations.
another interesting good idea |
Kingpin Nil
Care-Bears UNITED Silent Infinity
0
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Posted - 2012.12.23 03:31:00 -
[164] - Quote
cBOLTSON wrote:Sigh.... this topic again.
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THE CLOAKING MECHANIC!
The only problem is how people react (OR lack of proper reaction)
Nullbear see cloaker and instead of going - "Hey guys theres a enemy cloaked in our system, lets bait him / trap him / form a fleet in the next system / ANY other idea"
No, instead the nullbear goes - "Waaaahhh theres a cloaker , im going to go dock up as im scared of what he might do to me"
never even realising he could just move a jump or two over or try and kill that cloaker.
Its sad and pathetic.
Maybe if you understood why this thread was created you would understand none of what you just said is relevant! ItGÇÖs about going AFK and abusing the use of the cloak! Nothing I have proposed would change the cloak as it stands! The same arguments are being used again and again for no reason none of the opposition thus far has even touched upon why someone needs to go AFK while logged into eve for hrs. We all know why they do this and yet players seem to think thereGÇÖs no consequence or advantage to doing so! Then why do it? Would any of you stay docked AFK in jita for hrs on end just to relog back into the game and do it again? Or create multiple accounts to do so? Then try to pass on the excuse that you need to do this because you have some real life issues that need to be attend to? Because we all know that creating multiple accounts for the sake of going AFK and having the need to leave for toilet breaks and food is warrant enough right? lol
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Johan Civire
Dirty Curse inc.
247
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Posted - 2012.12.23 03:31:00 -
[165] - Quote
Roime wrote:Two better options:
A. Remove local from nullsec
...but since they couldn't find fights or use their bots and will ragequit, plan B:
B. Make cynos only mountable on BLOPS, change the skill from 5x to 8x, and add Electromagnetic Physics V to prerequisites.
This should deal with the general power projection problem as well.
no. |
Kingpin Nil
Care-Bears UNITED Silent Infinity
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 05:03:00 -
[166] - Quote
Johan Civire wrote:Roime wrote:Two better options:
A. Remove local from nullsec
...but since they couldn't find fights or use their bots and will ragequit, plan B:
B. Make cynos only mountable on BLOPS, change the skill from 5x to 8x, and add Electromagnetic Physics V to prerequisites.
This should deal with the general power projection problem as well.
no.
I donGÇÖt know why they keep bringing stuff like this up! So many times players trying to hijack this thread! |
James Amril-Kesh
RAZOR Alliance
1535
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 06:03:00 -
[167] - Quote
Your whining is getting to be pretty unbearable. -áObjects in mirror aren't as red as they appear. |
James Amril-Kesh
RAZOR Alliance
1536
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 06:05:00 -
[168] - Quote
And I know exactly why players afk cloak in a ratting system. Yeah, it's annoying. When that happens to me I move to another system. You don't see me crying on the boards about afk cloakers, because I think it's a valid tactic. It's psychological warfare. -áObjects in mirror aren't as red as they appear. |
Ittos
Beards Confirmed
3
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Posted - 2012.12.23 06:16:00 -
[169] - Quote
Kingpin Nil wrote:initiatives wrote:I agree with op, afk cloaking blows.
Afk cloaking usually hurts smaller nullsec corps to which is horrible in my opinion anyway.
The argument that afk cloakers are not hurting anyone therefore no one should be able to hurt them is pretty stupid.
Afk cloakers clearly hurt industry and ratting in system that they afk in (pretty obvious, that there action of afk cloaking does serious damage)
1. I propose that afk cloakers have a 10 minute penalty to lighting a cyno after they uncloak (unless they switch systems, dock, or perform any type of related change) (the penalty would only come into effect after 15 minutes of continuous cloaking)
This would make it so afk cloakers are really only dangerous for the first 15 minutes logged in, or in your system. (ofcourse they are still dangerous as they can uncloak and tackle or gather intelligence
or
make it so all characters show up on the account under bio or another tab, so afk cloakers can no longer use anonymity to harass null sec operations.
another interesting good idea
I'm skeptical that this will fix the afk problem at all let alone fix it without hurting atk cloakers. Seeing as afk cloakers are there for psychological warfare and, by virtue of being afk, cannot light cynos. As far as the characters showing up on the bio, that would **** off a lot of people and severely ruin some meta gamining capabilities. |
Regan Rotineque
Rl'yeh Interstellar Ltd. Lawful Insanity
47
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Posted - 2012.12.23 06:44:00 -
[170] - Quote
3 simple things. Just 3
1 - let me hunt them, give me probes or special cov ops ship with special probes....would love to hunt em
2 - make cloak consume fuel not gazillion gallons, but say 1hr or 2hr worth of ozone or something like that
3 - cycle the cloak....don't let it run forever - force a reactivation.
My personal preference is to have new tools to hunt cloakies ... But fuel would also provide reasonable limits on them.
~R~ |
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Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
10893
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 06:52:00 -
[171] - Quote
OP why do you avoid my questions?
Please answer them.
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
1360
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 07:32:00 -
[172] - Quote
Since the OP is not actually discussing anything we point out is a problem with any of his ideas and instead is just parroting the same old overused material, let's get down to his level and do something similar.
If you remove cloaked ships from local AND add a 15 sec timer for decloaking (which does make you show up in local before you actually decloak) if last cloaking session lasted more than 15 seconds, how can an AFK cloaker hurt you AT ALL anymore ?
He sure as hell can't make you afraid anymore (the only thing he was actually doing before). You can still see him in local before he can do anything, and now you know he's not AFK anymore since he had to manually cut the cloak. If he doesn't cloak (so is still showing up in local) you know you can find him and kill him. Essentially, he's pretty much the same thing as a logged-off person as long as he's actually AFK.
What problem would still remain AT ALL regarding AFK cloaking with that change ? No, seriously, is there ANY problem left if you do that ? ANY sort of drawback for ANYBODY ? What exactly is it ? http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T T2 BPO poll: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=114789 Buying this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=147098 |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
10746
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 10:55:00 -
[173] - Quote
Kingpin Nil wrote:ItGÇÖs about going AFK and abusing the use of the cloak! GǪand those are issues, why exactly? How is the cloak being abused?
Quote:Nothing I have proposed would change the cloak as it stands! You mean aside from the idea you proposed in the OP?
Quote:The same arguments are being used again and again for no reason Well, why don't you stop doing that then and instead start to address the many many issues people have been bringing forth about your ideas? Why don't you start answering the fundamental questions about this whole problem you're seeing? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
10894
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 11:04:00 -
[174] - Quote
Regan Rotineque wrote:3 simple things. Just 3
1 - let me hunt them, give me probes or special cov ops ship with special probes....would love to hunt em
2 - make cloak consume fuel not gazillion gallons, but say 1hr or 2hr worth of ozone or something like that
3 - cycle the cloak....don't let it run forever - force a reactivation.
My personal preference is to have new tools to hunt cloakies ... But fuel would also provide reasonable limits on them.
~R~ What about the cause of AFKing? If you want to keep balance, then the cause should also be nerfed at the same time.
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
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ISD Praetoxx
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
742
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 12:10:00 -
[175] - Quote
Thread moved to the Features & Ideas Discussion
- ISD Praetoxx ISD Praetoxx Lieutenant Community Communication Liasons (CCLs) Interstellar Service Department |
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Michael Harari
The Hatchery Team Liquid
418
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 17:32:00 -
[176] - Quote
If anything, I think afk cloaking needs a buff. Maybe allow covops ships to hack poses and offline their modules, or a covops interdictor or something.
Edit: I know, how about covops combat probes that dont show up on dscan? |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc Relativity Alliance
832
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Posted - 2012.12.23 18:04:00 -
[177] - Quote
Kingpin Nil wrote:Actually for the most part youGÇÖre just trying to justify playing eve while AFK! The whole point of eve is to play! Why do you think CCP have tried so hard to eliminate the AFK players! When I ask you why players engage in these tactics itGÇÖs not always done just to annoy others! ThereGÇÖs a lot of isk to be made while doing so! Great words of wisdom!
If we have determined that AFK play is against the core principles of EVE, let us address this more completely!
This is just a start, but letting people clutter up the list in local who CANNOT BE FOUND is making this source of intel questionable at best.
Sure, it's an outpost. The guy in it should not be there, but he is. You can dock, and see him in the list. What good is local doing us if docked up people can be listed? They ain't even in space to BE found, that's worse than cloaking. It's ridiculous to suggest we need to camp the outpost in case he decides to undock. Local is not telling us anything useful beyond being in system, and he is using it against the legitimate residents.
Put him on a timer to be undocked automatically, if he makes no actions. This is a PvP game, and his behavior is violating the quality of intel we use.
How are we supposed to play with this threat hanging above our heads?
Also, I want to eliminate POS shields entirely. Too many off grid boosters mucking up things.
And if a pilot enters system that has kill rights on you, by war dec or regular means, only stations owned by your alliance will allow you to dock, otherwise not allowing you to dock in the interests of remaining neutral in a conflict. You can face them, run in circles from them, or leave the system to avoid them.
D-Scan should allow you to track their IFF signal and get a direction for such targets, creating opportunities for more PvP. Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata) Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
1364
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 21:29:00 -
[178] - Quote
ISD Praetoxx wrote:Thread moved to the]Features & Ideas Discussion May it rest in peace there
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T T2 BPO poll: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=114789 Buying this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=147098 |
Kingpin Nil
Care-Bears UNITED Silent Infinity
0
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Posted - 2012.12.24 04:41:00 -
[179] - Quote
Akita T wrote:ISD Praetoxx wrote:Thread moved to the]Features & Ideas Discussion May it rest in peace there
Kinda hilarious how such simple discussions can bring people to such anger and misunderstanding! |
Kingpin Nil
Care-Bears UNITED Silent Infinity
0
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Posted - 2012.12.24 04:45:00 -
[180] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Kingpin Nil wrote:ItGÇÖs about going AFK and abusing the use of the cloak! GǪand those are issues, why exactly? How is the cloak being abused? Quote:Nothing I have proposed would change the cloak as it stands! You mean aside from the idea you proposed in the OP? Quote:The same arguments are being used again and again for no reason Well, why don't you stop doing that then and instead start to address the many many issues people have been bringing forth about your ideas? Why don't you start answering the fundamental questions about this whole problem you're seeing?
1) again why would you considering going AFK for hrs on end?
2) how would discontinuing to allow players to AFK cloak hurt the mechanics of cloak warfare? while their actively playing!
3 ) I'm trying to keep people on topic! i have addressed the many issues hopefully from both sides of this argument! remember my first post? |
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