Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Klarion Sythis
Bite Me inc Bitten.
81
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 20:41:00 -
[1] - Quote
To be fair, I haven't read all 113 pages yet, but it seems POSes are back down the priority list. Possibly far down the list. I'll leave this here:
"UAxDEATH disagreed and brought up an example of priorities like POSes, GÇ£you promised us those thingsGÇ¥. Greyscale replied that coming into meetings with the mindset of CCP promising a certain feature is a fallacious, and flat-out wrong, mindset. With conversation now completely deteriorating, Unifex took control of the conversation and spoke about POSes.
Unifex stated that what CCP did was spend effort and prototype what would make a good POS system. It would, however, only affect the group of people who manage POSes. Focusing that amount of time and effort on some small singular aspect of the game and delivering only that GÇ£is what will kill the businessGÇ¥.
The atmosphere was notably tense at the point."
Source: Page 37
|
Tisisan
Hard Knocks Inc.
49
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 20:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
Klarion Sythis wrote:To be fair, I haven't read all 113 pages yet, but it seems POSes are back down the priority list. Possibly far down the list. I'll leave this here: "UAxDEATH disagreed and brought up an example of priorities like POSes, GÇ£you promised us those thingsGÇ¥. Greyscale replied that coming into meetings with the mindset of CCP promising a certain feature is a fallacious, and flat-out wrong, mindset. With conversation now completely deteriorating, Unifex took control of the conversation and spoke about POSes. Unifex stated that what CCP did was spend effort and prototype what would make a good POS system. It would, however, only affect the group of people who manage POSes. Focusing that amount of time and effort on some small singular aspect of the game and delivering only that GÇ£is what will kill the businessGÇ¥. The atmosphere was notably tense at the point." Source: Page 37
Mmm... so not only am I now facing the likelyhood of waking up one morning to find my BMW, the purpose and product of working my hands to the bone, has been stolen and replaced with a Crysler, now I also have to keep living in a smelly, leaky storage shed with 4 other guys who cant keep their paws off my stuff???
W T F. |
WInter Borne
Cold Station 12 Surely You're Joking
35
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 20:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
Glad to know CCP is back to their old ways...
On the plus side, I can now go ahead and buy those faction towers I've been wanting since it will probably be another decade before CCP deigns to work on something so trivial as POS mechanics. |
Xindi Kraid
The Night Wardens Viro Mors Non Est
90
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 21:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
Only affect the group that manages POSes? Bullshit. it affects anyone who lives at a pos.
That is not a small group. It includes most people in wormholes and a large number of people in null. It even affects some people in HS who are running indy POSes. Beyond that, an improvement could help industry everywhere. imagine being able to sell ME slots to the masses in HS.
CCP spent time to revamp Bounty Hunting. They need to revamp a much more important system: POSes. They have said on multiple occasions they are going to do it, so they need to actually step up and deliver. |
WInter Borne
Cold Station 12 Surely You're Joking
37
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 21:37:00 -
[5] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:Only affect the group that manages POSes? Bullshit. it affects anyone who lives at a pos.
That is not a small group. It includes most people in wormholes and a large number of people in null. It even affects some people in HS who are running indy POSes. Beyond that, an improvement could help industry everywhere. imagine being able to sell ME slots to the masses in HS.
CCP spent time to revamp Bounty Hunting. They need to revamp a much more important system: POSes. They have said on multiple occasions they are going to do it, so they need to actually step up and deliver. Only been waiting about 7-8 years...whats one or two more while they handle all the REALLY IMPORTANT stuff? |
Ayeson
Hard Knocks Inc.
160
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 21:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
Seems like theyre flipping the bird to everyone who lives in a POS when they decided that fixing/replacing the broken, antiquated POS system wont actually help people that live in POSes. How's that for logic? Ask me about Rengas-dar, HRDKX's Most recent, groundbreaking, game-changing, wormhole-collapsing research endeavour. |
chris elliot
EG CORP Talocan United
93
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 21:40:00 -
[7] - Quote
And as soon as they say that they are working on it they will be bombarded by people wanting details and whining.
At least now they can experiment a bit and when the first few ideas they have go **** up, which they probably will hence the term prototyping, they can just scrap it and do something else.
I would imagine they took a look at the code base for pos's and decided it would be easier to update everything around it (read all of Eve) with new code base and then drop an entirely new system into that nice pretty framework than it would be to mess with the legacy code and subsequent fallout. |
WInter Borne
Cold Station 12 Surely You're Joking
37
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 21:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
chris elliot wrote:And as soon as they say that they are working on it they will be bombarded by people wanting details and whining.
At least now they can experiment a bit and when the first few ideas they have go **** up, which they probably will hence the term prototyping, they can just scrap it and do something else.
I would imagine they took a look at the code base for pos's and decided it would be easier to update everything around it (read all of Eve) with new code base and then drop an entirely new system into that nice pretty framework than it would be to mess with the legacy code and subsequent fallout. Right, cuz kicking the can down the road works so well..... |
Jack Miton
Aperture Harmonics K162
1256
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 21:59:00 -
[9] - Quote
Everyone in all regions of space use POSs... Go hit Dscan in any system anywhere and youre almost guaranteed to see a dozen+ POSs. How EXACTLY are they a "small singular aspect of the game"???
POSs are a major infrastructure of EVE. CCP need to spend less time 'fixing' thing like mining barges, bounties, ect. which ironically actually ARE minor niche aspects of the game and actually think about what the major things are. Things like POSs, moon goo, ore mining are what makes EVE run and they deserve some bloody attention. |
Winthorp
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
1
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 22:33:00 -
[10] - Quote
Wow, how completely disappointing that it is their view that POS shittiness only affects those that have to smash their face into a brick wall when they build them. What i find even more disappointing is the minutes show that Two Step did not step up more at this point and explain how POS's affect more than just POS operators.
They affect our whole way of life and our ability or lack thereof to grow in WH space because of the crappy platforms we have been forced to live off.
WH space forgotten yet again.... |
|
WInter Borne
Cold Station 12 Surely You're Joking
39
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 22:44:00 -
[11] - Quote
Winthorp wrote:Wow, how completely disappointing that it is their view that POS shittiness only affects those that have to smash their face into a brick wall when they build them. What i find even more disappointing is the minutes show that Two Step did not step up more at this point and explain how POS's affect more than just POS operators.
They affect our whole way of life and our ability or lack thereof to grow in WH space because of the crappy platforms we have been forced to live off.
WH space forgotten yet again.... Twostep was probably too busy chewing on his tongue. After the beating he's received in the forums only to have this bullshit thrown at him... That has to be mildly frustrating. |
Winthorp
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
1
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 22:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
WInter Borne wrote:Winthorp wrote:Wow, how completely disappointing that it is their view that POS shittiness only affects those that have to smash their face into a brick wall when they build them. What i find even more disappointing is the minutes show that Two Step did not step up more at this point and explain how POS's affect more than just POS operators.
They affect our whole way of life and our ability or lack thereof to grow in WH space because of the crappy platforms we have been forced to live off.
WH space forgotten yet again.... Twostep was probably too busy chewing on his tongue. After the beating he's received in the forums only to have this bullshit thrown at him... That has to be mildly frustrating.
But to say nothing at all and to be a lot more vocal in other areas of the minutes is well disappointing to say the least.
CCP pulling this crap and changing their mind is pretty ****** but i would have had a lot more respect for Two Step if he ballsed up at this point, he didn't. |
Klarion Sythis
Bite Me inc Bitten.
84
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 22:55:00 -
[13] - Quote
To be fair, Two step can't win. Someone will always say he should have done more here or there but overall it sounds like he's highly involved and hard working. I don't blame him for not running again. I wouldn't. |
Xen Solarus
Inner 5phere
263
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 23:23:00 -
[14] - Quote
I've been waiting years for upgraded POS mechanics. The current system is a nightmare! Living out of a POS is truely a challenge, especially if you are looking to have more than a small number of players. Though the discussions of the removal of the POS shield altogether (for reasons they were unwilling to explain!) kind of changed my mind on the subject. All i wanted was a "station-like" system, where players had seperate and individual tabs. Even something as simple as making a new structure that it has storage individual to each player, or changing the current structures to do the same. I never thought docking would be something that should be possible at a POS, they seemed to suggest that it might be a good idea.
These suggested changes to the POS mechanics seemed drastic and far-reaching, and certainly didn't seem to me to be something they could slap together in a short space of time. It's almost as if they imagined what they ultimately wanted POS' to be like far down the line in the distant future. Meanwhile, we're all left just wanting a simple and fast solution that makes things simpiler.
I guess i'll just have to wait some more years. |
Sassums
Wormhole Exploration Crew R.E.P.O.
63
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 23:26:00 -
[15] - Quote
I was disappointed to read the lack of information about the POS update as well.
A small part of the community? Really? Every WH corporation resides in a POS, multiple POS's at that.
I'd be safe in saying most every corp has at least 1 POS somewhere in the universe. To say its a small part of the community is a slap in the face. |
Fradle
Bite Me inc Bitten.
16
|
Posted - 2013.01.16 23:27:00 -
[16] - Quote
Those of you going to the next fanfest bring it up! Don't let CCP sit back and just dictate to the CSMs let them know that the EVE WH players want new POSs and it's not a small group. This really is bullshit. |
Xindi Kraid
The Night Wardens Viro Mors Non Est
91
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 00:05:00 -
[17] - Quote
Winthorp wrote: WH space forgotten yet again....
I love W-Space, and I have lived there for quite some time now because I enjoy it, but with regards to the issue of POSes: **** W-Space.
The POS issue affects more than just us in W-Space. POses need to be fixed for highsec, for lowsec and for nullsec as well as for wormholes, and really, many of the fixes applicable to Null, would make our lives easier, and making them less of a pain to manage in general will improve everybody's lives; beyond that, what ever happened to the suggestion that they were putting forward last year about making it scalable enough for us to make personal POSes? Those would add some new gameplay options. POSes affect all aspects of EvE in all regions, so it needs to be fixed for all of us. Before Apocypha, I lived out of nullsec in back woods systems; that's as much, if not more trouble than living out of a lower end wormhole (since many of the lower end w-space systems have statics to empire). I was also briefly in a corp that had a research POS in highsec.
Where the hell are the null bear complaints? Why didn't their CSM advocates speak up? |
bubble trout
Sky Fighters Talocan United
55
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 00:32:00 -
[18] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:Everyone in all regions of space use POSs... Go hit Dscan in any system anywhere and youre almost guaranteed to see a dozen+ POSs. How EXACTLY are they a "small singular aspect of the game"???
This is an important point. Just because only a small percent of people actively manage and set up poses doesn't mean it isn't something that effects a much larger player base.
All wormholers live in poses and have to deal with the restrictions on a daily basis. Hi-sec/low-sec indy people deal with it every day. Pirates in low-sec use them, as do ratters in null. Titian bridges, moon mining.
Frankly if poses were "Done right", I'd expect more people to use them. Many people want to have a "star base", or a place to call home, but are driven away by the pure shittyness that poses are today. |
Kusum Fawn
State War Academy Caldari State
282
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 00:53:00 -
[19] - Quote
The one and only burning question i have at this juncture is :
Is anyone really that surprised about this? Its not possible to please all the people all the time, but it sure as hell is possible to Displease all the people, most of the time.
|
DenForX
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
29
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 01:16:00 -
[20] - Quote
I am more pleased that they are looking seriously at doing it right rather than a major cluster tossed out as a bone that everyone chokes on. |
|
Tisisan
Hard Knocks Inc.
52
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 01:46:00 -
[21] - Quote
DenForX wrote:I am more pleased that they are looking seriously at doing it right rather than a major cluster tossed out as a bone that everyone chokes on.
I would be more comforted by this interpretation if the word "wormhole" had appeared anywhere in the explanation... |
Klarion Sythis
Bite Me inc Bitten.
85
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 02:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
DenForX wrote:I am more pleased that they are looking seriously at doing it right rather than a major cluster tossed out as a bone that everyone chokes on. They didn't say anything about the feature being delayed due to development time. They basically said it wasn't important enough to work on. |
Mocam
EVE University Ivy League
212
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 03:51:00 -
[23] - Quote
Klarion Sythis wrote:To be fair, I haven't read all 113 pages yet, but it seems POSes are back down the priority list. Possibly far down the list. I'll leave this here: "UAxDEATH disagreed and brought up an example of priorities like POSes, GÇ£you promised us those thingsGÇ¥. Greyscale replied that coming into meetings with the mindset of CCP promising a certain feature is a fallacious, and flat-out wrong, mindset. With conversation now completely deteriorating, Unifex took control of the conversation and spoke about POSes. Unifex stated that what CCP did was spend effort and prototype what would make a good POS system. It would, however, only affect the group of people who manage POSes. Focusing that amount of time and effort on some small singular aspect of the game and delivering only that GÇ£is what will kill the businessGÇ¥. The atmosphere was notably tense at the point." Source: Page 37
POS management is one of the very few things in this game that cross all areas of space - highsec, lowsec, nullsec, wormholes -- all are effected and all gain benefits from them.
Unlike tweaking things like aggression flags or super caps or what not -- it enhances play for all those who deal with it. The absolute worst case is "I don't care" - extremely few negatives on such repairs.
Bluntly put - addressing how they work is a "benefits without penalties" effort that would grant returns to those who have shown they are both interested and willing to invest in "longer term" efforts within the game. A POS *IS* that "home away..." gig and takes a good deal of forethought to do right.
I honestly don't see a downside to addressing these concerns and issues. It looks more like a win-win dev effort than pissing off folks by changing things around all the time. "Someone" tends to get hacked off at almost any changes that happen. |
Klarion Sythis
Bite Me inc Bitten.
86
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:03:00 -
[24] - Quote
Two step has made a post for us to show CCP our disagreement on the issue. Many of you are probably aware of it, but for those who aren't, go chime in.
Also, well said by Mocam. |
Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
759
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:09:00 -
[25] - Quote
who needs POSes when e COULD have ponies?
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |
Klarion Sythis
Bite Me inc Bitten.
86
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Or if Two step plays his cards right we could get anchorable space dicks. Apparently they're in high demand. |
Slaktoid
Aperture Harmonics K162
19
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:21:00 -
[27] - Quote
Tbh I think the extensive laundrylist of features we've "demanded" the new modular POS'es provide has made CCP hesitant. That being said, I doubt that Modular POS'es would be so hard to implement as CCP make it out to be. I'm still optimistic that we'll get a POS overhaul at some point. Something as simple as password protected SMAs/CHAs, as well as personal rights (on a pr moon basis) for Anchoring/Onlining would suffice (while keeping Starbase Config role unchanged).
A few simple tweaks would go a long way, but I liked the vision of Modular dockable POS'es for many reasons. It wouldn't be perfect, but I'd regret it if it all got canned. |
Mocam
EVE University Ivy League
214
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:55:00 -
[28] - Quote
Kusum Fawn wrote:The one and only burning question i have at this juncture is :
Is anyone really that surprised about this?
Honestly, yes.
Changes here make more sense than revamping ship slot layouts, powergrids, etc. You will **** some people off changing such things around - enough that they will scream about it - but this change? The worst you'll get is "I don't care about this" - which is a trivial negative compared to "back in the game, what happened to my hurrican? I can't fit it anymore... what happened to my ... - it no longer fits what I had on it ..."
FFS - how hard is it to see that this is the most positive/least negative area to change in the game, which also rewards those who *ARE* playing regularly, *WITH* risks, because it takes logistics to keep one up and running?
Dumping this a revamp here doesn't make sense and you may use a /bogggle CCP but they usually don't go this far off the mark -- most changes usually *WILL* negatively impact some sizable portions of the community; this won't. |
Vjorn Angannon
Fleet Escort Services Union 0f Revolution
71
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 07:12:00 -
[29] - Quote
Klarion Sythis wrote:Two step has made a post for us to show CCP our disagreement on the issue. Many of you are probably aware of it, but for those who aren't, go chime in. Also, well said by Mocam.
Thanks for pointing me in the right direction....
+1 chime
|
Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1605
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 07:18:00 -
[30] - Quote
As mentioned above
Yes another cancelled promise by CCP
See this two-step Dev blog http://twostep4csm.blogspot.com.au/2013/01/i-am-small-portion-of-community.html
Post into this thread https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194625&find=unread
Thanks you for your time. It will only take a minute or 2 and this one is really important. Oh and like Two steps initial thread or for that matter all of them.
Also pass this message on to anyone you know in any alliance.
If we yell load enough then maybe CCP might understand that after years and years we are pi$@ed that we are once again on the bottom of the heap.
For once in CSM7, I will say thank you Two Step for trying your hardest. Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=192717&find=unread
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |