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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
2210
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:28:00 -
[1861] - Quote
I don't think that CCP disagrees that POS's need to be redone. From what I've read it seems to be just a couple of things:
1) CCP Doesn't think enough players care. You guys are doing a good job of correcting that here.
2) Will modular POSs bring more NEW players into the game? That's a little harder to say... let's be honest: most players don't even think about setting up a station in their first couple of months. I sure didn't come to EvE for the stations. Stations are a little more complex and require a lot of game knowledge to understand all of their functions... and to set one up you need to read a friggin' phonebook written in Greek. That's a hard sell to a newcomer especially. The real crux of this thread is whether POS's are going to bring in fresh meat or coming out with panda avatars or something will do better.
...that's the last I'll say on this. It's *popcorn* time for me.
GL o7
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Opes2
The Red Circle Inc.
2
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:29:00 -
[1862] - Quote
Signed |
Wenthrial Solamar
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:29:00 -
[1863] - Quote
Taking a small steps approach would be fine, it need not be the new-shiny fix all... a team Paper-cuts style project for POS's ... but please some progress on them.
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Korin Traise
The Drunken Empire Fatal Ascension
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:29:00 -
[1864] - Quote
Zagdul wrote:Let me queue "Onlining"
Just do this... Let me do this very freaking simple thing. Please.
I mean, you don't need a re-vamp for this.
just... Queue onlining.
This. |
Spike Hellthrod
DucKtape Unlimited SpaceMonkey's Alliance
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:30:00 -
[1865] - Quote
+1 POS revamp. I completely gave up on any type of POS management roles either for personal or corp use. After running a POS for about 6 months I told my corp that I would never mess with POS management and fueling again!!! I would rather not play EVE then manage or fuel a POS....granted I was fueling before the fuel block update. But still!!! |
Eve Orwell
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
8
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:32:00 -
[1866] - Quote
Definitely would love a pos revamp all my +1s |
Shinzann
Dead poets society The Laughing Men
2
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:32:00 -
[1867] - Quote
I support this notion. +1 for POS revamps |
Sha'Uri Dark
Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing
4
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:32:00 -
[1868] - Quote
CCP Gargant wrote wrote:THE OVERHAUL CANNOT HAPPEN ALL AT ONCE
Personally I don't think anyone ever expected it to be, what we are/were expecting is that it is/was already being worked on. Those of us that are familiar with programming and development know it takes time to design, code, test, bug fix, retest, bug fix, etc and the last thing we want is a rushed POS revamp. Stop kicking the can down the road and start working on it now so that in 12-24 months you can deliver a player owned structure system that not only meets the players expectations but exceeds them and becomes something the rest of the MMO game industry envies and copies.
One day I'd love to actually have player owned structures in space, all we have now are corporation and alliance owned structures in space...
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Vaschel Novak
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:33:00 -
[1869] - Quote
+1 definitely would love to see |
Kathern Aurilen
State War Academy Caldari State
7
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:37:00 -
[1870] - Quote
Silvonus wrote:They have a lot of potential applications in solving a lot of the other problems across EVE (such as being able to have higher refining for nullsec with some nullsec-only anchorable module), or to upgrade a system that a small force could fight over. The possibilities are endless, so why not incorporate those possibilities into the other fixes? Things like this would help cure the wasteland that Null dwellers claim it to be. Give them the ability to make null and low at least as profitable as high sec is. |
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Baby Dady
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
2
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:38:00 -
[1871] - Quote
I am just some nub in RvB, And even I know that POS's are the most broken thing in the game!
More broken than Capitals!
More broken than Tec!
More broken than off grid boosting!
More broken than minning!
More broken than (insert broken thing here)!
If POS's only effect a small number of players, then why is ther one on every moon within 7 jumps of Jita?
Please make fixing POS's and Corp Management high on the list to fix! |
Arronicus
Vintas Industries Mistakes Were Made.
98
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:39:00 -
[1872] - Quote
CCP Gargant wrote: CCP has only stated that THE OVERHAUL CANNOT HAPPEN ALL AT ONCE
From page 38:
"On top of that, Soundwave added, the POS system by itself would only affect a small portion of the community."
This is a LARGE part of the issue at hand, which neither dev post in this thread has addressed, and was used in the CSM meeting to justify not having worked on POS'es, when there was much discussion the previous year indicating that they would infact.
This is part of what we, contest. What we say is not true. |
Crack Kills
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
3
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:43:00 -
[1873] - Quote
I don't think CCP actually has any idea how many players would be impacted by changes to the POS system.
I'd be curious to hear what the ratio is of POS per active player is. I bet they've never attempted to quantify how many players POS mechanics actually impact.
I am one of them, and I believe a POS rework is long overdue. |
Asuri Kinnes
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
701
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:43:00 -
[1874] - Quote
Gogela wrote:
2) Will modular POSs bring more NEW players into the game? That's a little harder to say... let's be honest: most players don't even think about setting up a station in their first couple of months.
Can't speak for anyone else, but I wanted a place of my own, right from the Get Go! Of course, I didn't know how much I didn't know. And when I found out how much I didn't know...
Interdict Hi-Sec - it's the only way to be sure... |
Celly Smunt
Viziam Amarr Empire
30
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:48:00 -
[1875] - Quote
Gogela wrote: 2) Will modular POSs bring more NEW players into the game? That's a little harder to say... let's be honest: most players don't even think about setting up a station in their first couple of months. I sure didn't come to EvE for the stations. Stations are a little more complex and require a lot of game knowledge to understand all of their functions... and to set one up you need to read a friggin' phonebook written in Greek. That's a hard sell to a newcomer especially. The real crux of this thread is whether POS's are going to bring in fresh meat or coming out with panda avatars or something will do better.
Actually, I've shared this story a few times before, but not sure if I've shared it here in the EvE forums yet.
I said no to about a year's worth (or more) of requests from friends and even customers of my RL job to "Come play EvE with me Bro, you'll love it!!!"
to my own personal regret, they were right, I do love it, but that's not what's important in this post, what's important is how the one friend "sold" EvE to me or sold me on EvE. (whichever way makes more sense to you)
We played Navyfield, and we were damn good at it, but, like most MMORPG games, you never got anywhere unless you were at the helm of your ship battling, or in your armor, or riding your steed/mount or whatever and one night my friend said to me "Bill, dude you have to come play this, they have these books that help you learn and if you want to fly a certain ship, you stick this book in your head and learn it, and even better, if that book takes 2 days to learn, you can be logged off for 2 days and come back and you can fly that ship, or use the item the book is for" (as close to verbatim as I can get after all these years)
and that did it for me.. I tried the trial and I was hooked.
Now imagine telling someone the same basic thing, the build your own empire thing and adding, "you can even have your own private house in space complete with a garage, workshop and whatever you want to have..."
I think it would help, for me personally, I would have played a year or more sooner if I had been told that or had the game explained to me in such a way.
o/ Celly Don't mistake fact for arrogance, supposition for fact, or disagreement for dismissal. Perception is unique in that it can be shared or be singular. Run with the pack if you wish, but think for yourself. A sandwich can be a great motivator. |
Avalloc
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:51:00 -
[1876] - Quote
As a previous member of the CSM I want to see the POS revamp. As they are now they present a high barrier of entry for newer players. Not to mention if more players get into POS using it'll stimulate the EVE economy even more.
Revamp will impact too few players? Do you have figures on number of people who ignored POS use because of their complexity?
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Czar Vilinous
Distinguished Gentleman's Boating Club Test Alliance Please Ignore
2
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:52:00 -
[1877] - Quote
please pos fix now? |
Janeway84
Masters Of Destiny Pride Before Fall
2
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:54:00 -
[1878] - Quote
Please CCP take pos management into the same awesomeness as inferno & retribution ship rebalancing efforts and propel pos managing part of the game into the future |
ivor windybottom
Northstar Cabal Fatal Ascension
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:54:00 -
[1879] - Quote
fix the pos system |
Royal Jedi
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
92
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Posted - 2013.01.18 00:56:00 -
[1880] - Quote
94 pages and counting.
Signed!
:-) |
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Wagner Alves
SUPERNOVA SOCIETY Tribal Conclave
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 01:00:00 -
[1881] - Quote
Alx Warlord wrote:We NEED POS revamp, don't you guys understand!? We are in PAIN with the current system!!!
I Just lost the hope that CCP will do something as significant as a "Sand Castle POS" where you could shape it with 99% freedom... but not even a modular POS1?!?!? WTH!!!! WTF!!!!
I totally agree with you Alx. You have my +1. |
Sorxus
High Intellion Exhale.
19
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Posted - 2013.01.18 01:04:00 -
[1882] - Quote
Gogela wrote:I don't think that CCP disagrees that POS's need to be redone. From what I've read it seems to be just a couple of things:
1) CCP Doesn't think enough players care. You guys are doing a good job of correcting that here.
2) Will modular POSs bring more NEW players into the game? That's a little harder to say... let's be honest: most players don't even think about setting up a station in their first couple of months. I sure didn't come to EvE for the stations. Stations are a little more complex and require a lot of game knowledge to understand all of their functions... and to set one up you need to read a friggin' phonebook written in Greek. That's a hard sell to a newcomer especially. The real crux of this thread is whether POS's are going to bring in fresh meat or coming out with panda avatars or something will do better.
...that's the last I'll say on this. It's *popcorn* time for me.
GL o7
You are not completely right about 2nd point. I remember when i was rookie in this game, i've heard other players talking about player owned stations and control towers. I was very excited by the idea of having my own "space base", building it. Thought that some day i will have it, my own base of operations. Remember how awesome it looked back then.
And now as a CEO i have to look after multiple POS'es and mark my word - i am getting tired of this outdated and incomplete game mechanic. |
Nair Alderau
EVE University Ivy League
55
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Posted - 2013.01.18 01:08:00 -
[1883] - Quote
Sorxus wrote:Gogela wrote:I don't think that CCP disagrees that POS's need to be redone. From what I've read it seems to be just a couple of things:
1) CCP Doesn't think enough players care. You guys are doing a good job of correcting that here.
2) Will modular POSs bring more NEW players into the game? That's a little harder to say... let's be honest: most players don't even think about setting up a station in their first couple of months. I sure didn't come to EvE for the stations. Stations are a little more complex and require a lot of game knowledge to understand all of their functions... and to set one up you need to read a friggin' phonebook written in Greek. That's a hard sell to a newcomer especially. The real crux of this thread is whether POS's are going to bring in fresh meat or coming out with panda avatars or something will do better.
...that's the last I'll say on this. It's *popcorn* time for me.
GL o7 You are not completely right about 2nd point. I remember when i was rookie in this game, i've heard other players talking about player owned stations and control towers. I was very excited by the idea of having my own "space base", building it. Thought that some day i will have it, my own base of operations. Remember how awesome it looked back then. And now as a CEO i have to look after multiple POS'es and mark my word - i am getting tired of this outdated and incomplete game mechanic.
This. If well done, the smaller/cheaper end of a scalable POS system would be HUGE attraction to new players.
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Jotaro Haake
EVE University Ivy League
1
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Posted - 2013.01.18 01:09:00 -
[1884] - Quote
+1 in support of keeping POS changes (ideally, bringing in modular POSes) as a priority.
Perhaps game metrics at CCP measure POSes as only being used by a relatively small number of players in the game, but this:
A) Assumes that the low use is by choice B) Does not predict how many players would potentially use POSes if they added several layers of awesome and friendly to them. C) Ignores their absolute importance to the wormhole resident community. D) Ignores the fact that the small number of players using POSes have a disproportionate impact on the game - corp directors, industrialists, logistics managers, etcetera - and that the in-game communities these players support suffer disproportionately as well if they burn out or disengage from using POSes.
In other words: metrics need to be understood in their context and not used to justify arguments beyond their ability to substantiate.
As far as CCP being worried about putting too many resources into what would be a giant project: I respect that CCP has to worry about the bottom line, and balancing adding new features with improving existing ones. Surely a proper re-do of POSes could be introduced as the ideal combination of both options? As well as a great jumping-off point to making meaningful changes to production, science, sovereignty, etcetera?
At the very least, if CCP is not going to bring in modular POSes, then improve what is there. To have an answer such as was communicated in the minutes makes eve players everywhere worry that POS changes will be either perfunctory or postponed to oblivion. That, too, will 'kill the business'. |
Callum Hughes
Northstar Cabal Fatal Ascension
0
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 01:09:00 -
[1885] - Quote
+1 |
Arduemont
Rotten Legion Ops THE ROYAL NAVY
1136
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 01:11:00 -
[1886] - Quote
I think it's frankly disgusting how CCP get their player base so excited about very close to promised features and then once the player base is riled up by the idea, they drop it.
I'm not just talking about POSes here. I have been very much looking forward to some Avatar based game-play content since the release of Incarna. The CSM minutes show that CCP are very much interesting in pursuing their own goals with a complete disregard for the feelings of their players. They can't just raise and dash out hopes like this. "In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." |
Paldur the Wary
Frozen Dawn Inc Arctic Light
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 01:11:00 -
[1887] - Quote
+1 to POS changes |
Willow corpus
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.01.18 01:12:00 -
[1888] - Quote
I read in the csm, (now I am about to greatly simplify the issue for timesake) that they are giving up working on posses.
Why
because the amount of work to revamp posses is not = the amount of players who use them.
Thats the end of there thinking.
But wait, why do so few use posses?
1. Because it is broken
2. BECAUSE IT IS RETARDLY BROKEN.
(And here is why it is broken)
1. The roles needed to set your own pos up, also lets you take down every pos in your corp (BROKEN)
Maybe (no hear me out here) maybe when a game mechanic as cool as setting up a starbase is so rarely used by the majority of players, maybe its time to fix it and make it so more people can and will use it, make it so we all want a little base we can go to at the end of the day. Or a little base where in hi-sec mission agents will require us to pick up a mission there.
That being said I am a nullsec carrier pilot, and I want a pos where I can manufacture a couple of things (because the outposts all have like 2 slots)
In summary Revamp posses not because everyone uses them, but because very few use them, revamp them so that they are interesting and cool to own, as well as make it so you can have personal ones with very little connection to the corp you are in.
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recky markaira
NullOcular Order THORN Alliance
1
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Posted - 2013.01.18 01:13:00 -
[1889] - Quote
+2 |
Alx Warlord
SUPERNOVA SOCIETY Tribal Conclave
331
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Posted - 2013.01.18 01:13:00 -
[1890] - Quote
Silvonus wrote:POS are some of the oldest code, and were never fully developed from the start. Most players understand this, we are not expecting miracles but we do want to see some concrete development happening. POS have been talked about for years as needing fixes, and while there are many areas of the game that also need improving, none is more glaring than POSs. The time is ripe for change.
The arm of POSs is far reaching, affecting nearly every area of the game in one form or another. This is what I feel CCP is worried about when potentially overhauling the entire system. POS affect nearly all of industry, life in null and w-space and corporation management. It is nearly impossible to separate POS from any of these (and more) systems. The risk that something would go wrong is high, even for the slightest of changes. Since the effects are wide, this also has the potential of being the most powerful fix/expansion ever especially if linked to systems like sovereignty, industry and CREST.
Here is what I see are the major areas of EVE that need to be developed:
POS and other player controlled structures Industry, production and group mining (ring) Nullsec sovereignty Corporation management Yes, there are more things, but those in my opinion are the largest ones bringing EVE into a GÇ£completeGÇ¥ state with no major areas lacking. Now, of those areas, industry is already tied significantly to POS, and while it does not need to be released at the same time as POS, having a new POS backbone to tie into would help it significantly. Nullsec sovereignty is a thorny path. It works currently but has a lot of room for improvement. A POS revamp has the potential not to just affect how we think of POS right now, that is a stick in the bubble, but rather extend onto other player owned and controlled structures, such as I-Hubs, stations, and whatever else we could imagine, which could be then tied into new sov mechanics and methods to maintain and control areas. Corporation mechanics are already so closely tied with POSs, that separating one form the other is hard to do and trying to fix one and not the other only prolongs the issue.
CCP, you want to have themed expansions? How about this for a theme: GÇ£Build your empire.GÇ¥
Task half the teams to work on Corporation management and UI, and the other half to POSs. Nothing draws players into game more than being able to claim a piece of land (or in this case, space). Not just something that has your name on it in the corner, but something that you as a player build. You gathered the resources, you teamed up with other players, you fought off those who would compete with you and you prevailed. And these aren't just vanity homes to display pictures, these are the workhorses and the backbone of your military might, your production chain to control the market, the bastion where you live.
CCP, we know you can pull this off. You pulled off a beautiful interface with planetary interaction in Tyrannis, you've delivered content in Apocrypha on an unprecedented scale, you've paid attention to the details in Crucible and Inferno, you've shown us that you can make a game like none other. The path to greatness isn't easy, but only those who dare the most difficult road reap the greatest rewards.
Pretty much This!! "Build Your Empire" and your Sandcastles!!! Please read this! > New POS system (Block Built) Please read this! > Refining and Reprocess Revamp |
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