Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Winthorp
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
4
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 03:47:00 -
[1] - Quote
http://community.eveonline.com/council/transcripts/2012/CSM_CCP_Meetings_December_2012.pdf Page 37
As a WH dweller this affects me greatly, unlike the way CCP believes POS's current form only affects those that have to deal with the POS interface it actually affects every WH dweller, corps in WH's can even struggle to grow solely as an effect of how crappy the current POS mechanics are.
POS's infrastructure does not just affect Wh dwellers however, it affects everyone. WH POS's. HS Research and invention. LS Research/invention/living. Nullsec living in the far reaches.
I think CCP clearly underestimates the amount of the EVE population that has had to at some point deal with the drama that is POS infrastructure and some even given up.
Saying that "Focusing that amount of time and effort on some small singular aspect of the game and delivering only that GÇ£is what will kill the businessGÇ¥. Is saying that all those cross segments of players just don't matter enough to you to bother spending the time on it and that is absurd.
CCP clearly also hasn't considered that the POS mechanics are actually that bad that they force people to not even consider using them as an option. You CCP should be looking at this as an opportunity to invigorate other sections of the game not as how wasteful it is.
Get vocal people or you will get nothing. |
Varius Xeral
Galactic Trade Syndicate
345
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 03:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
Yes, the decision not to focus on it is not the big deal, the worrying aspect is the complete lack of awareness of how important it is. |
John DaiSho
Applied Creations The Fendahlian Collective
65
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
Fixing the interface of POS management would not help the general WH citizen, it would only help those actually managing the POS. Keeping your stuff safe would be as hard as before, the basic mechanic would not change, only which buttons you have to press. I know as good as you how bad POSes are and I cant wait for them to properly rework them but I can understand that they dont want to squeeze out a management fix, that wouldnt help with the real problems but still cost substantial development recources and Unifex understands that.
They showed that they can actually really rework a system and polish it over time, like they did with FW. I really really hope they start doing that with POSes soon, but getting angry because they wont go for the management interface first isnt needed.
Edit: What really gets me a bit going is Soundwave, as much as I like him: "Soundwave added, the POS system by itself would only affect a small portion of the community." That is just wrong. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
2911
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:21:00 -
[4] - Quote
Minutes wrote:Unifex stated that what CCP did was spend effort and prototype what would make a good POS system. It would, however, only affect the group of people who manage POSes. Focusing that amount of time and effort on some small singular aspect of the game and delivering only that GÇ£is what will kill the businessGÇ¥.
A good POS system would impact upon the play style of:
- W-space dwellers (all of them, regardless of roles)
- Manufacturers
- Researchers
- Inventors
- Miners
- People using POSes as logistics bases in hostile territory
- People competing with any of the above
- People relying on any of the above for income or support
Of all the players in EVE, the only ones whose play style will not be impacted by revamped POSes are the ones who only ever spin their ships in stations (and even that is up for debate).
Revamped POSes will go a long way to ameliorating the sucking chest wounds of nullsec.
Revamped POSes will go a long way towards moving the entire EVE economy into player hands.
NOT revamping POSes will kill the game more certainly than spending a year fixing them.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Winthorp
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
5
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:40:00 -
[5] - Quote
John DaiSho wrote:Fixing the interface of POS management would not help the general WH citizen, it would only help those actually managing the POS. Keeping your stuff safe would be as hard as before, the basic mechanic would not change, only which buttons you have to press. I know as good as you how bad POSes are and I cant wait for them to properly rework them but I can understand that they dont want to squeeze out a management fix, that wouldnt help with the real problems but still cost substantial development recources and Unifex understands that.
They showed that they can actually really rework a system and polish it over time, like they did with FW. I really really hope they start doing that with POSes soon, but getting angry because they wont go for the management interface first isnt needed.
Edit: What really gets me a bit going is Soundwave, as much as I like him: "Soundwave added, the POS system by itself would only affect a small portion of the community." That is just wrong.
Well no you are a little off base here, personal player ship storage is all a corporation needs to ensure asset safety and thus allow the smaller corps to actively change recruitment procedures and start filling up WH space so indeed it affects every player in WH's. If small corporations in WH space are forever stuck in this stage of not being able to expand a few things happen, they either stay small and carebear forever, they join into a large alliance, or they inevitably fold.
There are some current ways around this but they are expensive and not really ideal for small low end WH corps to even consider, and yet not fool proof in larger high end corps so that clearly needs to be addressed.
But that isn't the "fixer" for POS's there is a lot wrong with them. |
Winthorp
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
5
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:57:00 -
[6] - Quote
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194625
Two Step has since made a post about this, i recommend everyone please go comment on this to get CCP to further acknowledge the situation. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
3352
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 04:58:00 -
[7] - Quote
So if I'm reading this right, CCP stated that they're not going to devote an entire expansion to POS revamp and instead work on it piece by piece.
So it's not as if they're not working on it at all. I don't get what the problem is. Nothing else is getting a full revamp in the space of a single expansion, especially according to this devblog. Phrases like "you can't nerf / buff X EVE is a Sandbox" have the same amount of meaning as "If this is a sack of potatoes then you can not carrot." - Alara IonStorm |
Winthorp
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
5
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 05:03:00 -
[8] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:So if I'm reading this right, CCP stated that they're not going to devote an entire expansion to POS revamp and instead work on it piece by piece. So it's not as if they're not working on it at all. I don't get what the problem is. Nothing else is getting a full revamp in the space of a single expansion, especially according to this devblog.
No you infact did read it wrong, they clearly state Sov is such a large issue that they will be working on over time and is too large for one expansion, they have said POS is not enough of an issue to spend DEV time on and is a business killing option for them. |
mynnna
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
223
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 05:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
Winthorp wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:So if I'm reading this right, CCP stated that they're not going to devote an entire expansion to POS revamp and instead work on it piece by piece. So it's not as if they're not working on it at all. I don't get what the problem is. Nothing else is getting a full revamp in the space of a single expansion, especially according to this devblog. No you infact did read it wrong, they clearly state Sov is such a large issue that they will be working on over time and is too large for one expansion, they have said POS is not enough of an issue to spend DEV time on and is a business killing option for them.
This is how I and most other players are reading it as well. I suspect it's probably a case of awful messaging, or maybe not realizing how important the POS revamp is or something, but still. Look for my comments on it tomorrow over at themittani.com, but here's a preview: I'm not happy and think, if the general interpretation is correct, that CCP is doing a Pretty Dumb Thing. This post was crafted by a member of the GoonSwarm Federation Economic Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
3352
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 05:13:00 -
[10] - Quote
Winthorp wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:So if I'm reading this right, CCP stated that they're not going to devote an entire expansion to POS revamp and instead work on it piece by piece. So it's not as if they're not working on it at all. I don't get what the problem is. Nothing else is getting a full revamp in the space of a single expansion, especially according to this devblog. No you infact did read it wrong, they clearly state Sov is such a large issue that they will be working on over time and is too large for one expansion, they have said POS is not enough of an issue to spend DEV time on and is a business killing option for them. I have a hard time believing that they understood how important this was and then all of a sudden turned around and said NOPE LOL. I mean I'd love to see Sov fixed as well, but CCP has trained multitasking to at least 2 or 3... I think. Phrases like "you can't nerf / buff X EVE is a Sandbox" have the same amount of meaning as "If this is a sack of potatoes then you can not carrot." - Alara IonStorm Want to enable BBcode on the forums? Here's how. |
|
Winthorp
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
6
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 05:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Winthorp wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:So if I'm reading this right, CCP stated that they're not going to devote an entire expansion to POS revamp and instead work on it piece by piece. So it's not as if they're not working on it at all. I don't get what the problem is. Nothing else is getting a full revamp in the space of a single expansion, especially according to this devblog. No you infact did read it wrong, they clearly state Sov is such a large issue that they will be working on over time and is too large for one expansion, they have said POS is not enough of an issue to spend DEV time on and is a business killing option for them. I have a hard time believing that they understood how important this was and then all of a sudden turned around and said NOPE LOL. I mean I'd love to see Sov fixed as well, but CCP has trained multitasking to at least 2 or 3... I think.
Yeah this is pretty much the case, please go take a look at the above link to Two Steps thread and subsequent blog about the issue and tell your corpmates to respond to it. |
Kuseka Adama
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 05:22:00 -
[12] - Quote
mynnna wrote:Winthorp wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:So if I'm reading this right, CCP stated that they're not going to devote an entire expansion to POS revamp and instead work on it piece by piece. So it's not as if they're not working on it at all. I don't get what the problem is. Nothing else is getting a full revamp in the space of a single expansion, especially according to this devblog. No you infact did read it wrong, they clearly state Sov is such a large issue that they will be working on over time and is too large for one expansion, they have said POS is not enough of an issue to spend DEV time on and is a business killing option for them. This is how I and most other players are reading it as well. I suspect it's probably a case of awful messaging, or maybe not realizing how important the POS revamp is or something, but still. Look for my comments on it tomorrow over at themittani.com, but here's a preview: I'm not happy and think, if the general interpretation is correct, that CCP is doing a Pretty Dumb Thing.
Uhh. Yeah no you guys basically control CCP and the CSM with your actions. You use James 315 as a proxy to push your everyone must pvp agenda and now yhou wanna *****? No. You think its a problem. GET IT FIXED! |
Winthorp
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
6
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 05:22:00 -
[13] - Quote
mynnna wrote:Winthorp wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:So if I'm reading this right, CCP stated that they're not going to devote an entire expansion to POS revamp and instead work on it piece by piece. So it's not as if they're not working on it at all. I don't get what the problem is. Nothing else is getting a full revamp in the space of a single expansion, especially according to this devblog. No you infact did read it wrong, they clearly state Sov is such a large issue that they will be working on over time and is too large for one expansion, they have said POS is not enough of an issue to spend DEV time on and is a business killing option for them. This is how I and most other players are reading it as well. I suspect it's probably a case of awful messaging, or maybe not realizing how important the POS revamp is or something, but still. Look for my comments on it tomorrow over at themittani.com, but here's a preview: I'm not happy and think, if the general interpretation is correct, that CCP is doing a Pretty Dumb Thing.
More advertising for the issue will be welcomed, look forward to reading the article. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
3352
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 05:24:00 -
[14] - Quote
Kuseka Adama wrote:Uhh. Yeah no you guys basically control CCP and the CSM with your actions. You use James 315 as a proxy to push your everyone must pvp agenda and now yhou wanna *****? No. You think its a problem. GET IT FIXED! Oh look, moronic conspiracy theorizing already on page 1. This should be fun. Phrases like "you can't nerf / buff X EVE is a Sandbox" have the same amount of meaning as "If this is a sack of potatoes then you can not carrot." - Alara IonStorm Want to enable BBcode on the forums? Here's how. |
|
CCP Navigator
C C P C C P Alliance
1728
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 05:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
Hi guys,
The CSM minutes thread is located here and this is the thread that all of the development teams are following. Spreading your feedback across multiple threads in multiple channels is difficult to follow so please ensure you reply in the thread linked above.
This one will be locked. CCP Navigator -Community Manager |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |