Pages: 1 [2] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
1070
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 03:32:00 -
[31] - Quote
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Op, this is what i've gathered form this thread:
You think fuel blocks are stupid because: A.) Producing fuel blocks is NOT profitable... that the "raw materials" to build them are worth more than the fuel blocks. -- You were blatantly proven wrong here...
B.) That the isotope requirements make producing them in WH's or Nullsec inappropriate/nonviable. -- Moving 40 fuel blocks requires 200 m3 of space... -- moving 150 Heavy Water, 150 Liquid Ozone, & 400 Isotopes requires 60+60+60 = 180 m3.... a 10% reduction in volume. In nullsec the HW and LO can be produced locally. Additionally, you do know that Isotopes are the fuel used in jump mechanics? Essentially, nullsec already imports/uses huge amounts of isotopes for jump logistics, so your "OMG nullsec has to import non-regional ice" is a factor all nullsec deals with regardless of POS fueling needs.
In short... none of your arguments hold water... and you should amend your first post to not come across as "someone who sells fuel blocks for less than their components are worth".
+1
OP check your math. Feel free to post it here as others have to ensure you didn't forget to carry the 1 or something
|
RubyPorto
Sniggwaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2453
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 05:57:00 -
[32] - Quote
Malcorian Vandsteidt wrote:I ahve alts in every major trade area in eve, So yes I check prices. and prices fluxuate. No I didn't do the calcs fro every single fuel block from every single region.
1. I was using the fuel blocks as an example of a reason which could be used in order to suggest the changes I desired to see in game, whether the reason for it is valid currently is Irrelevant, as it was valid when Ice products were 1500 a unit (isotopes) which thy could easily go back up to at any time.
2. This is a Suggestion forums, I can post whatever Ideas I desire, and it really doesn't matter if they are needed or not, Sometimes CCP just implements changes tot he game to Change **** and keep it interesting. Well, these changes would change the game for sure in a lot of way, Not for the worse, adn not for the better, Just make it "different" and shift peoples aspect of origination, Hell maybe even encourage a few highsecers to go into wormholes or 0.0.
Buying materials from sell orders and selling the blocks to buy orders, you can make 8k ISK per 2.5 minute run of Amarr fuel blocks(making 40 blocks). So nobody's selling them at 12.6k/unit because "minerals I mine are free," they're selling them at 12.6k/unit because "the minerals I mined are worth 12.4k/unit and a 200 ISK profit on 4 seconds of manufacturing time represents a very respectable 200k ISK/hr/manufacturing slot."
Imagining that Fuel block prices will remain stationary if Isotope prices treble is ludicrous.
So, as to your suggestions (in order):
There's a cost to using a tower whose topes you can't source locally. If you want locally sourced topes, use a tower that corresponds to your local Ice supply.
CCP has said on numerous occasions that WHs will never have Ice, because they want them tied to K-space. You're lucky you have PI, bucko.
They're already profitable. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
Drake Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
6
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 06:02:00 -
[33] - Quote
So you're complaining because the player run market has dictated that the materials are worth more than the fuel blocks themselves. Do you not see what I'm hinting? |
Malcorian Vandsteidt
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
56
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 07:26:00 -
[34] - Quote
Drake Doe wrote:So you're complaining because the player run market has dictated that the materials are worth more than the fuel blocks themselves. Do you not see what I'm hinting?
Actually I am not "complaining" at all, the fuel block thing was just an example of a reason I would like to see these changes in game.
|
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
13761
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 09:29:00 -
[35] - Quote
Malcorian Vandsteidt wrote:Drake Doe wrote:So you're complaining because the player run market has dictated that the materials are worth more than the fuel blocks themselves. Do you not see what I'm hinting? Actually I am not "complaining" at all, the fuel block thing was just an example of a reason I would like to see these changes in game. Seeing as nothing you said is correct, the change won't happen.
You seemed to avoid Gizznitt's post, so I'll quote it for you.
Gizznitt Malikite wrote: Op, this is what i've gathered form this thread:
You think fuel blocks are stupid because: A.) Producing fuel blocks is NOT profitable... that the "raw materials" to build them are worth more than the fuel blocks. -- You were blatantly proven wrong here...
B.) That the isotope requirements make producing them in WH's or Nullsec inappropriate/nonviable. -- Moving 40 fuel blocks requires 200 m3 of space... -- moving 150 Heavy Water, 150 Liquid Ozone, & 400 Isotopes requires 60+60+60 = 180 m3.... a 10% reduction in volume. In nullsec the HW and LO can be produced locally. Additionally, you do know that Isotopes are the fuel used in jump mechanics? Essentially, nullsec already imports/uses huge amounts of isotopes for jump logistics, so your "OMG nullsec has to import non-regional ice" is a factor all nullsec deals with regardless of POS fueling needs.
In short... none of your arguments hold water... and you should amend your first post to not come across as "someone who sells fuel blocks for less than their components are worth".
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
1072
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 11:45:00 -
[36] - Quote
Seeing as the OP is happily ignoring all the posts calling him out on his bad math (showing that fuel blocks are indeed profitable) I call troll. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
13766
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 11:49:00 -
[37] - Quote
Derath Ellecon wrote:Seeing as the OP is happily ignoring all the posts calling him out on his bad math (showing that fuel blocks are indeed profitable) I call troll. I would normally agree, but check his posting history and other threads regarding his ideas.
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
1072
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 13:22:00 -
[38] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Derath Ellecon wrote:Seeing as the OP is happily ignoring all the posts calling him out on his bad math (showing that fuel blocks are indeed profitable) I call troll. I would normally agree, but check his posting history and other threads regarding his ideas.
Oh you mean his constant half baked ideas that he posts here? And then defends just enough to keep the argument going, while generally ignoring all of the valid counter arguments people reply with?
Yea Troll. In this case a professiona Features and Ideas discussion forum troll. |
Malzuk
Reich Enterprise
11
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 21:20:00 -
[39] - Quote
Malcorian Vandsteidt wrote:Alright So the idea to make Fuel blocks as the main POS fuel was excellent, saves time and money.
However:
Fuel blocks are pointless to make due to the following:
1. The materials on the list if sold, Could buy you triple the amount of Fuel Blocks a Print makes. (40 per run).
2. You might say but if your in a Wormhole or 0.0 you can build them and be self sufficient!... Wrong. here's why:
* In 0.0 You must own SOV to do the PI, However if you Own sov.... Your not going to really need the fuel blocks because you'll be using a station generally. Yes I realizes POS's are still used for strategic reasons.
* If you do use POS, well lets hope it's the type of POS your space provides the right Isotope for, generally (Mini Deathstar) Are a favorite and unless your in mini space... You can forget making the fuel blocks for it. ( Unless your tower is a tower which runs on your spaces Isotope, which is Uncommon to say the least).
*"Well just haul the isotopes and materials from highsec!" Why? You'd pay more to build your fuel blocks then to simply buy them... that's a tad stupid on your part.....
3. In wormholes many prefer to build their own blocks for sustainability, However I should point out that this is pointless also because:
* Wormholes have no ice.
* You still have to freight in the ice to build them, and you'd be better off (not to mention save ISK) simply buying the fuel blocks themselves.
4. Players build them in highsec by doing PI, and Mining Ice. However this is pointless and not even remotely profitable as like I said in the beginning, The materials are worth FAR more then then Blocks themselves.
5. But if they are not profitable, why do people make them?:
* Simple. Most industrialists do not take into account the intrinsic values of the materials they use, in their perception because they mined them, made them from PI, or whatever, They are Free and thus hold no value. So they view 12k a pop for fuel blocks a profit, when in fact, it's a Huge loss to what they could have made if they had simply sold the materials.
* You would need to sell fuel blocks for around 25k - 75k a pop to make a decent profit. (Depending on the market)
In other words... People are.... (some other word more eloquent then "Stupid").
So.. the point of this post, was to ask CCP to fix this. Either by:
* Making Fuel blocks universally fit any tower (Thus allowing their use in 0.0 to be sustainable despite the choice in towers),
* By placing Ice in wormholes (To allow wormholes to be sustainable and actually make building them in there useful),
* By decreasing the minerals needed to make them (or something) (In order to actually make selling them "profitable").
* Or hey.. how about all of the above?
your calculator is broken. fuel blocks are profitable, otherwise my wallet would be negative. make a new spreadsheet dude. |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
101
|
Posted - 2013.01.31 22:07:00 -
[40] - Quote
if every item on the market was a sure fire 100% win profit maker....indy would be even more broken than with some dud items like these fuel blocks as op sees it.
Indy has its risks like everything else. Don't like fuel block returns don't make them. Yes it has lower profit margins. No crap...their primary users are pos owners. Who have a vested interest in researching their blocks (and they have the pos to) they use bpo's to get them perfect and then after building up the first batch of blocks can fuel their pos' while they seed the markets with buy orders at a price they want to pay to run cheaper there after. Don't hate the fule blocks...hate the idiots going for quick isk and filling these buy orders lol.
The wh rant....this was done to have wh's have a tie into empire beyond jsut selling t3 (components or as a whole ship) in empire. Getting the fuel not really an issue for them....they have to drop off the damn sleeper poop (or whats made from it) in empire anyway.
0.0 almost the same thing.....9 million units of ferrogel doesn't sell too well deep in the heart of goon space in a station locked so only they can use it. Someone has to take the moon goo (or products of it to jita). Its not even bears being scared of pvp here ....they can't get into the goon stations even if they wanted to make the flight out there lol. Dropping off the ferreogel, pick up your blocks or components.
And 0.0 not needing pos's.....man puff puff give the high grade you have been buying. Want to know how blob corps get their legions of pos slaves to maintain them? Most of the crews I ran with had one simple policy. If you wanted a private pos you take on a few corp pos' to maintain as well. usually not short of volunteers for this duty. As even with a 100 man corp research/build slots in a station can fill up quick to have a wait qeue not unlike an empire station. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 [2] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |