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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 14 post(s) |
Mik kyo
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
3
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:14:00 -
[331] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:Jackk Hammer wrote:David Carel wrote:Jackk Hammer wrote:you're just another goonNoob talking what you know nothing about...
stacking penalties combined with the fact that you end up with a higher tracking speed by using 3 x faction/officer tracking computers than having 3 x tracking link put on you means they are nowhere near as useful as you think. I, too, fit my titans with Tracking Computers instead of Cap Rechargers. you guys are so dumb...how do you think the PL titans that **** you are fit? seriously i want you to go into eft and play with serpentis tracking links and figure out why all I bothered to do was quote your post so you couldn't edit it
Quoting to prevent edit. |
Anile8er
Origin. Black Legion.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:14:00 -
[332] - Quote
CCP really?
I understand the need to nerf super carrier drone options, however limiting super carriers to a load out of fighters OR bombers based on drone bay size doesn't make sense. Allow supers to fit a flight of 20 bombers AND 20 fighters in a drone bay.
EHP nerf is really un-called for. Supers die pretty quick as it is. Perhaps considering a change to the Aeon's slot layout is in line, like 7 lows 5 mids, but sub and cap gangs can down a super pretty quickly in today's EVE.
You really didn't do anything for dreads. What is the logic behind the timer reduction? To benefit large alliance in sov warfare? Are you going to drastically reduce POS hit points? At current in EVE if you have enough dreads to down a large tower in 5 minutes, no one is going to want to "hot drop' that gang, or at least 99.99% of the time wouldn't have the force put together in the 10 minutes the dreads are sat there for. So I ask what does the 5 minute timer do for a small group of dreads when they will have to sit on the tower for 20 to 30 minutes anyway?
The results I see from your changes: Titans will still dominate in large cap fights, super carriers will suck unless you are in a massive blob, dreads will still suck, sub caps will own super caps even more than they do at current in EVE.
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Kelly O'Connor
Resilience. Northern Coalition.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:14:00 -
[333] - Quote
20% less of everything on my already pretty 'lacking in tank' Rag.
Sad day indeed :(
Kelly |
Zhade Lezte
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:16:00 -
[334] - Quote
Dirk Tungsten wrote:Ok heres the bread and the butter of things.
Thers are by all means alot of pros that will mean fleet fights could be more Ballz deep coming from the patch, but alot of crutial badly influenced cons. The loggoff timer relooping, yes a good idea, but why introduce 20% decrease in shield/armor/structure aswell. This is giving supers/titans relatively no chance. with the aggro relooping, should keep the stats tank wise for supers/titans, but maybe balance out what currently is there. For instance Aeon should have less HP as has an isaine tank, wyvern and Nyx should tank wise be relatively unchanged. The Poor Hel should get a buff. Make it competitive.
DDs on titans should be able to hit BSs if not give them a slight tracking bonus so they are at least able to hit BSs well and have some sort of a tank lol
It seems ccp are carebearing up eve for newer players or alot of the subcap players. What they are failing to realise is that this patch will be a tradgedy for a few of those crutial points. Alot of other vets are thinking of hanging up there boots when this patch is released.
It seems heirachy has been too influenced by certain GMs CSMs that revolve around fountian region,we all know who they are. What this patch allows is certain entities that live in fountian (cough cough) to use mass blob fleets of 2000+ again and lagg out systems. There is no counter to this. What this patch is going to allow is lagg tactics and mass 2000+ man fleets to rule eve over better organised,structured & skilled alliances. Its basically allowing a bunch of noobs with no structure in there fleet to be successful. Carebearing it down. If you want to kill a titan/super then an aggressing fleet should at least have a well thought through structure an plan to there fleet, they do not deserve and should not expect to kill any supers/titans unless that is implemented.
When alot of the narrow minded people out there eventually realise what this patch will do, the pros from this patch will be massively overlooked, as this will not balance things, its only going to be putting the weight on the other end of the scales.
I love this post so much. "Carebearing" is apparently now extended to all pvp pilots who don't fly capital ships.
:tinfoil: Developerswarm :tinfoil:. Look up time dilation in the latest blogs, no one likes lag. With all hope there will be one less excuse for the losers of a fight soon enough. Blobbing will happen no matter what so v0v, chuckling at the thought that Goonswarm and allies are never outnumbered in, say, Euro TZ.
I wouldn't particularly mind battleships being doomsdayable, but if they put a crucial support role in the battleship class that might make things difficult. A tracking bonus to titans when they can already track subcaps with links is laughable.
And I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you that minmatar supercaps (and capital missile weapons) could use some looking at.
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Weaselior
BUTTECORP INC Goonswarm Federation
484
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:16:00 -
[335] - Quote
Mik kyo wrote:Weaselior wrote:Jackk Hammer wrote:David Carel wrote:Jackk Hammer wrote:you're just another goonNoob talking what you know nothing about...
stacking penalties combined with the fact that you end up with a higher tracking speed by using 3 x faction/officer tracking computers than having 3 x tracking link put on you means they are nowhere near as useful as you think. I, too, fit my titans with Tracking Computers instead of Cap Rechargers. you guys are so dumb...how do you think the PL titans that **** you are fit? seriously i want you to go into eft and play with serpentis tracking links and figure out why all I bothered to do was quote your post so you couldn't edit it Quoting to prevent edit.
oh i'm not agreeing with the cap recharger guy either |
steave435
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
4
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:17:00 -
[336] - Quote
Nagapito wrote:demonfurbie wrote: the sc should be able to have 20 fighters and 20 bombers in its drone bay, seeing thats all it can use now anyway the fighter change is a little too drastic, a triple extended shield rigged rokh thats being painted cant be hit if the changes go3 it also hurts the less used carrier.
CCP Tallest wrote: Increase signature resolution to 400
Why you say that you need to paint a ship that already as a sig radius higher then 400? BS's have a sig radius higher then 400, so I dont understand this problem with the fighters. In my opinion, FB should have a higher sig resolution, like 1000! They are not meant to shoot sub-caps!!! demonfurbie wrote: less ability for the bigger ships to kill the smaller means more people in smaller ships
I like the way you realize the objective but still in denial! You don't understand how tracking works, sig is just a multiplier to tracking. This change cuts the fighters tracking down to one third of what it used to be.
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Yeep
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:17:00 -
[337] - Quote
Sakaali wrote:Also, has anyone looked at the math of giving the moros a rate of fire bonus? It seems like with the way hybrids currently function its going to be brutal on its cap usage.
I'd really appreciate some comment on this. My cap usage in a Moros is borderline unstable without the reps running as it is now and I have almost perfect skills. Stick a rate of fire bonus on and you risk being unable to fire constantly for a whole siege cycle, especially if you're sieging straight from a jump. |
David Carel
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
9
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:17:00 -
[338] - Quote
Jackk Hammer wrote:That reply to my previous post. I misquoted and cannot be arsed to find that abomination of his.
https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_kill.php?id=342709 Like that perhaps? |
Needa3
BURN EDEN Northern Coalition.
9
|
Posted - 2011.10.10 19:18:00 -
[339] - Quote
thank you CCP for just making me not really want to care about your game anymore
I like how certain groups in Eve got their "things" implemented
was a fun 6 years but if this is what needs to bring your players back .... keep trying... someday you might get it right |
Metis Laxon
Zero Point Group
1
|
Posted - 2011.10.10 19:18:00 -
[340] - Quote
Dirk Tungsten wrote:Ok heres the bread and the butter of things.
I knew not you could deliver such things upon us lesser folk! Guide us oh prophet.
Dirk Tungsten wrote: Thers are by all means alot of pros that will mean fleet fights could be more Ballz deep coming from the patch, but alot of crutial badly influenced cons. The loggoff timer relooping, yes a good idea, but why introduce 20% decrease in shield/armor/structure aswell. This is giving supers/titans relatively no chance.
No chance? In that context no chance = no chance to run off using a broken game mechanic. There shouldn't have been a chance in the first place.
I know what you are trying to say, but in that regard it is faulty logic as well. The super is still super, it still has more EHP than a dozen subcaps combined. These changes will allow for the subcapitals to matter in a much greater capacity than before, your supers now need support to take out the smaller ships. Rather than wiping all the meaningful subcap primaries whenever they please. There is now some more strategy to consider, some more angles to fight from instead of barreling through with the same ****.
What does this add? More teamwork, less separation between the cap squads and subcap squads. Plus the ability for the subcaps to matter when your side has less caps but more of them.
Dirk Tungsten wrote: It seems ccp are carebearing up eve for newer players or alot of the subcap players. What they are failing to realise is that this patch will be a tradgedy for a few of those crutial points. Alot of other vets are thinking of hanging up there boots when this patch is released.
Oh I am sorry do you mean to say that you actually have to participate and get involved in the majority of your alliance membership? That you actually need to be listening in the same TS channel? Oh the tragedy of having to rely on your 'lesser' corp mates to save your back once in a while. The ******* horror!
Dirk Tungsten wrote: It seems heirachy has been too influenced by certain GMs CSMs that revolve around fountian region,we all know who they are.
More great insights into our collective minds! |
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Weaselior
BUTTECORP INC Goonswarm Federation
484
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:19:00 -
[341] - Quote
David Carel wrote:Jackk Hammer wrote:Weaselior wrote:Jackk Hammer wrote:Are goons not capable of killing a carrier putting remote tracking links on a titan? why would you put the remote tracking links on a carrier that is what the other goonNoob was saying...I guess he didn't want to say you guys couldn't kill a logi putting tracking links on a titan https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_kill.php?id=342709Like that perhaps? that was a bad fit fyi |
Ogogov
Ars ex Discordia Test Alliance Please Ignore
1
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:20:00 -
[342] - Quote
So now the Moros will suck even more?
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Nemesis Factor
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
9
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:20:00 -
[343] - Quote
Kelly O'Connor wrote:20% less of everything on my already pretty 'lacking in tank' Rag.
Sad day indeed :(
Kelly
Fakeedit: Can we have Low Sec DDs now since we can't drive by undocking BSs? :)
Go get it blown up for a change. When was the last time you got out of that ship anyway? I'll bet your pod smells like New Jersey. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
21
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:20:00 -
[344] - Quote
Ogogov wrote:So now the Moros will suck even more?
Looks that way atm. CCP Zulu.....Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Daedalus II
Helios Research Combat Mining and Logistics
45
|
Posted - 2011.10.10 19:20:00 -
[345] - Quote
steave435 wrote: You don't understand how tracking works, sig is just a multiplier to tracking. This change cuts the fighters tracking down to one third of what it used to be.
That's pretty stupid and unintuitive by the way. While CCP is on it, they should do something about that as well |
Vyktor Abyss
The Abyss Corporation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.10 19:21:00 -
[346] - Quote
Just some observations from my perspective...
While I agree supercaps are currently overpowered; I feel you're only addressing the concerns of the 0.0 power blocks here with these changes to capital ships. Don't forget the smaller groups using capital ships and smaller scale capship fights (that will hopefully now happen again more frequently).
My concerns regarding capitals (and the proposed changes) are that:
1. (a) Titan Bridging is ruining a lot of low sec (sub-capital) fleet fights. The ability for an entire subcap fleet to appear on the field with perhaps 1 second of warning is...yes I'm going to say it....unfair. 1. (b) While I'm at it I think the whole jump mechanics need changing to give a little more warning after a cyno goes up to pilots on the field. - My suggestion is that there is some delay mechanic for jumping through a portal. This could be achieved by either 30 second spool up of the cyno field, the cyno changing colour for 30s when it gets locked onto by the jump portal or some such. Perhaps even staggering the arrival of the jumping ships on grid by mass, i dunno.
2. Removing all point defense from dreadnaughts in the form of their dronebays is unnecessary. It has been a long time now since I saw a station gank Moros - I think you're unnecessarily making these ships even more vulnerable. I agree with it to a degree on supercapitals, but why dreadnaughts too? - Dreads should at least have 25m3 of light drones to stop getting killed after 3 hours from being pointed by a solo dramiel that happened to see you undock from a kickout station. I don't agree that to even undock a dread means you should need to have have some massive support fleet.
Other than that I support the changes to Titans, Supercarriers (for the most part) and the dread seige timer. One last thing, please differentiate the new Block ops cyno effect from the ordinary cyno effect and we are getting there.
Cheers. |
David Carel
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
9
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:21:00 -
[347] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:David Carel wrote:Jackk Hammer wrote:Weaselior wrote:Jackk Hammer wrote:Are goons not capable of killing a carrier putting remote tracking links on a titan? why would you put the remote tracking links on a carrier that is what the other goonNoob was saying...I guess he didn't want to say you guys couldn't kill a logi putting tracking links on a titan https://www.pandemic-legion.com/killboard/view_kill.php?id=342709Like that perhaps? that was a bad fit fyi
The only PL Avatar I could find with a fit on it. Their Erebuses all have Tracking Computers but then again they don't use lasers.
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Darius III
Interstellar eXodus BricK sQuAD.
155
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:22:00 -
[348] - Quote
The CSM has spent a lot of time working with CCP on this issue.For myself, I stayed on the logoffski issue more than anything else-as this too, will help reduce the SC hulls. While I do not think that this nerf package is 'the perfect solution' it is great steps in the right direction. As Two-Step pointed out, if you have something to add, this thread would be a good place.
This shows that CCP is taking to heart player concerns and moving forward in a timely manner. Hats off to them for taking initiative and getting this done sooner than later. It is my honest belief after having seen Hillmars blog-that CCP will be delivering us many more good fixes in the near future.
"We are changing the logoff mechanics in such a way that as long as your enemies are actively engaged in fighting you, logging off is not going to save your ship."
If Women aren't supposed to do the cooking, why are their bodies full of milk and eggs? |
gfldex
7
|
Posted - 2011.10.10 19:25:00 -
[349] - Quote
"CCP Tallest" wrote:Increase signature resolution to 400
Have a look here.
If you don't want to bring a rapier you can have the same effect with a gallente commandship/T3 giving bonus to paintes on any ship that got a few spare med slots. Drone tracking links help too, ofc. That's a huge nerf for shield tanked carrier/SC.
The main problem of dreads was not the length of the siege timer. If you require to be in siege for 5 minutes and 1 second, you are sill in siege for 10 minutes because you can't break a running siege cycle. So not only wont it solve any problems, it's not even doing the intended thing.
Real problems of dreads:
You can't have RR in siege on you. Given the lack of HP compared to SC this is a huge back draw. If you have lots of HP you can get quite a few remote repper cycles on you before you pop. Armor dreads start with less HP and can't reach the same resistance because they have to fit damage mods. Lowering base HP for SC wont change anything.
Jump in mechanics. Some dreads need capa to run their guns. Big disadvantage to SC. In a big fight you will most likely be bumped right after jump in/warp in. If you siege right away you will hit jack all and be low on capa. Another problem not addressed. (Why was that *beep* added to the game anyway?) SC _like_ being bumped because it makes them harder to hit. Big disadvantage for dreads.
Painters work much better for fighters/fighter bombers then for guns because of bigger base values. As shown above SC will still do just fine if they bring painters. At the other hand dreads can not receive tracking links while in siege.
Lock time and esp. maximum locked targets. In a lag free fight or with time dilation targets pop so quickly compared to lock time of dreads that SC/Titans have a huge advantage. You can actually get a lock on targets. You can remove SeBo supers, you can't with dreads in siege.
If your enemy is to stupid to bomb your fighters/f-bombers SC will be much much better all the time. In the situations where you use f-bombers bombs are tricky to use. There are plenty of ships that can kill a bomber before it's bomb goes off.
About the logoff mechanics: Do you intend to add the micro smart bomb back into the game too? |
Florestan Bronstein
United Engineering Services
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.10 19:25:00 -
[350] - Quote
Pilk wrote:We often enjoy comparing EVE SCs to the real-life ones. In this scenario, you're telling me that my USS Enterprise cannot do anything to stop some dude standing on the deck of a tugboat, vigorously slapping her across the bow with a piece of fresh mozzarella, from sinking her. hmm... you think the USS Enterprise was engineered to provoke fun & interesting fights? |
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Kim Wilde
Covenant
0
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:27:00 -
[351] - Quote
my only annoyance here is that titans are now completly dependant on sub caps to remove tackle for em allow the doomsday to atleast shoot on hic's/dic's so they remain with a slim chance to get out of any cluster fucks that the node create from lag etc |
Bratwurst0r
Austrian Industrial Corporation Universal Constant Alliance
1
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:27:00 -
[352] - Quote
Finally. I have been waiting so long for this, its LONG overdue.
Now, as mentioned already, a few kinks to work out:
- fighters.....well, doing it like this = making carriers suffer alot. Also, making fighters obsolete as they don't even hit BS anymore for full dmg? Its unnecessary. With the dronebay nerf and the possibility to kill the damn things you don't need to nerf them into uselessnes.
- EW immunity: it should be simple, EW immunity should also negate friendly ew, = tracking links etc. Why this wasn't like that from the beginning i don't know.
- ehp nerf. well, ok, if you need to. but there is no reason really. loggofski is fixed, more time in battle is a GOOD thing. they don't have to die faster. If you do it, look at the HEL and rebalance that ship.
- Titans: good so far, just in conjunction with remote-friendly-ew there is still a problem. you can fix this on the ship, or genereally.
- Carriers: now here it gets hairy. thy can't kill caps as it is (intended), now they have a hard time with subcaps too (fighters?). Give them fighter boni, but better yet, don't nerf fighters |
DeDe hungry
Les chevaliers de l'ordre Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:28:00 -
[353] - Quote
Quote: 1 Titan = 90,000,000,000 ISK
Wait... WHAT?
Quote: These changes are good, I guess, except they won't fix the problem of "blobbing = winning".
Sub-cap Blob? You have tools to counter them (but that requires brain, and skill ), or supercap blobing? Eh with this future modifications, without a good support fleet, You will counter them too.
So for super pilot you can, right clic and self dstruct like a B****.
Also, i love this devblog, But the Moros, with new Bonus that not really good idea (Or with the re-balancing of Hybrid weapons! mmmh! Want to see that).
Cap Usage on Hybrid... rate of fire Bonus
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Gogela
Freeport Exploration
63
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:29:00 -
[354] - Quote
...my faith is being restored...
I'm getting the itch (almost!) to return to null sec...
These are great changes!
I think the other problems addressed in this thread are being looked at... btw
I'm for one looking forward to how CCP tackles the logistics "teleporting across the galaxy" problem and logistics in general... (my personal deal maker) but I will say that this is the right way to go and the way we should have been going all along!
Nice work! Bring supercappocalypse fights!
I have ships to buy... ALL GëívGëí Ships | Odd-áGëívGëí Items | <-- Links to showInfo in-game |
Zhade Lezte
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:29:00 -
[355] - Quote
Anile8er wrote:CCP really?
I understand the need to nerf super carrier drone options, however limiting super carriers to a load out of fighters OR bombers based on drone bay size doesn't make sense. Allow supers to fit a flight of 20 bombers AND 20 fighters in a drone bay.
EHP nerf is really un-called for. Supers die pretty quick as it is. Perhaps considering a change to the Aeon's slot layout is in line, like 7 lows 5 mids, but sub and cap gangs can down a super pretty quickly in today's EVE.
You really didn't do anything for dreads. What is the logic behind the timer reduction? To benefit large alliance in sov warfare? Are you going to drastically reduce POS hit points? At current in EVE if you have enough dreads to down a large tower in 5 minutes, no one is going to want to "hot drop' that gang, or at least 99.99% of the time wouldn't have the force put together in the 10 minutes the dreads are sat there for. So I ask what does the 5 minute timer do for a small group of dreads when they will have to sit on the tower for 20 to 30 minutes anyway?
The results I see from your changes: Titans will still dominate in large cap fights, super carriers will suck unless you are in a massive blob, dreads will still suck, sub caps will own super caps even more than they do at current in EVE.
Not going to frankly even bother to go over where I strongly disagree with you ("sub caps will own super caps even more than they do at current in EVE."...uhhh) but some comments.
Giving supers (and maybe carriers just cause) a larger drone bay to be able to have a full flight of bombers and fighters compensated with an EHP nerf on those fighters/bombers would be something to consider. As a drone using pilot I like having drone versatility as well, but the idea is to make taking out a supercarrier's drones a viable strategy. Make their build costs lower as well if replacing more lost drones is a significant complaint.
The timer reduction is so that if your scouts see someone forming up to hotdrop and gank your dreads you actually have some hope to get the heck out, since currently a dreads tank is like paper to supercaps. This means that a smaller alliance can actually hope to use dreads to siege a tower or whatever without making them incredibly vulnerable to a larger alliance with a large supercapital fleet like the DRF, PL, or say...Goonswarm Federation. Note the reduction in fuel for the cycle as well, nothing is being changed to the rate dreads can siege a tower.
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David Carel
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
9
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:30:00 -
[356] - Quote
0.008 with 4x Serpentis Tracking Link, 0.009 with 2x Serpentis TC, both with Tracking Speed.
But you can't always cynoout (cap <70%), and you have reduced neut resistance. Hell yeah.
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Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
72
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:30:00 -
[357] - Quote
while i agree with most of teh changes, why are you screwing the moros again? no drones. your joking right? CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Metis Laxon
Zero Point Group
1
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:31:00 -
[358] - Quote
Florestan Bronstein wrote:Pilk wrote:We often enjoy comparing EVE SCs to the real-life ones. In this scenario, you're telling me that my USS Enterprise cannot do anything to stop some dude standing on the deck of a tugboat, vigorously slapping her across the bow with a piece of fresh mozzarella, from sinking her. hmm... you think the USS Enterprise was engineered to provoke fun & interesting fights?
^ That
This is a game, a lot of complexity in it sure, and in the end it has to be fun. These changes, and the clear iterations upon them, will bring about the said fun in far greater bundles than ever before. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
417
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:31:00 -
[359] - Quote
Pilk wrote:We often enjoy comparing EVE SCs to the real-life ones. In this scenario, you're telling me that my USS Enterprise cannot do anything to stop some dude standing on the deck of a tugboat, vigorously slapping her across the bow with a piece of fresh mozzarella, from sinking her. Suggested reading: USS Cole and Millennium Challenge 2002. GÇöGÇöGÇö GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ GÇö Karath Piki-á |
Spectre80
The Knights Templar Cascade Imminent
12
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Posted - 2011.10.10 19:32:00 -
[360] - Quote
Ale Tricio wrote:Again CCP just hoping to hold onto their new pubbie players by screwing those that have spent years earning their supercaps
-3 accounts
good riddance to you and your supers.
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