Pages: 1 [2] 3 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
jukriamrr
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 13:56:00 -
[31]
Originally by: OFRogue Yes a rax could probably kill a deimos if set up probably, would just take a while.
And as for you arimas if you think you are so wise how is it that you equip your deimos? And how many gunnery skillpoints do you have? lol.
It just so happens that not all in this universe is about size ...
|
StoreSlem
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 14:09:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Dark Shikari
Originally by: OFRogue I cant fit my 5 neutrons with 6 t2 mags :(
I can't fit 8 tachyon IIs on my apocalypse with 7 t2 heat sinks.
Neither can I but I hear megas can fit 7 425mm II's with 7 MFS II
|
Cinnander
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 15:07:00 -
[33]
I'm with necro on this one, if you set out to tank the deimos, you're consigning yourself to flying around with electrons - in which case you're limiting your range to sneeze distance, or Dual 150mm IIs (which strangely are awesome on a Thorax) in which case you limit your damage to taking out Frigs and Interceptors that are not attacking you (and subsequently not orbitting at anything less than, say, 15km). While the Dual 150mm II setup is a great point defense ship ("Someone get this ceptor off me"), Thorax can do it better and cheaper.
|
Stormfront
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 15:12:00 -
[34]
Yeah been flying a dual 150 setup Rax lately. Does VERY well against frigs.
Had a Ferox pilot shooting me with 250s from 25K, MWD to him, already in half armor and orbit at 5K. HE warps out as his shields dropped and his tank couldnt keep up with my tech II dual 150s and drones.
Unfortunately, I had a dual web setup or he woulda been dead.
Tried the same on a Deimos and quite frankly, I DO NOT LIKE DUAL 150s ON THE DEIMOS.
|
Stormfront
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 15:15:00 -
[35]
However, with dual 150s you get the option to fit a better tank on the larger grid of the Deimos. It lacks the firepower of the thorax with the same setup simply because the half dronebay is not keeping up.
|
Nyphur
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 16:52:00 -
[36]
Originally by: DrunkenOne I bet a thorax setup to kill a deimos could kill it, so I don't know what you are acting all "l33t" for.
Er.. no? I had a domonix with blasters, damage mods and explosive drones on my deimos and I could tank it quite easilly. I fail to see how a Thorax could achieve the 300+DPS required to take down a tanked Deimos.
|
keepiru
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 17:03:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Nyphur
Originally by: DrunkenOne I bet a thorax setup to kill a deimos could kill it, so I don't know what you are acting all "l33t" for.
Er.. no? I had a domonix with blasters, damage mods and explosive drones on my deimos and I could tank it quite easilly. I fail to see how a Thorax could achieve the 300+DPS required to take down a tanked Deimos.
8 heavy drone IIs + 5 t2 blasters -------------
|
DrunkenOne
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 17:09:00 -
[38]
Edited by: DrunkenOne on 13/07/2005 17:10:44
Originally by: Nyphur
Originally by: DrunkenOne I bet a thorax setup to kill a deimos could kill it, so I don't know what you are acting all "l33t" for.
Er.. no? I had a domonix with blasters, damage mods and explosive drones on my deimos and I could tank it quite easilly. I fail to see how a Thorax could achieve the 300+DPS required to take down a tanked Deimos.
Who the hell tanks a deimos for pvp? Thats like tanking a zealot. I don't think many people fit more of a "tank" on a deimos than 1 med rep II and a explosive hardner, or maybe a rep and a energized adaptive nano II. Need those lows for damage mods afte rall...
A thorax with 5 med beam 2s, a 1600 plate and dual web and 8 explosive drones would probably kill you. And thats a near standard thorax fitting (though most people use 150 IIs). He could just double web you and sit at the edge of web range. The med beams do damage to your lowest resists, and so do the explosive drones.
|
Sadist
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 17:17:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Sadist on 13/07/2005 17:19:10
Originally by: Nyphur
Originally by: Reiisha Consider, though, that this is a 1v1 situation. I doubt you can tank 2 or more players with any tank.
In my Deimos, I can fit a setup for tanking all types of damage and tank a player battleship forever. I had a dominix with blasters and a swarm of Heavy drones on me and it wasn't able to break my tank. I imagine if I knew what type of damage I was coming up against, I could tank two battleships, but I sure as hell wouldn't be taking any of them down with my crappy damage.
Meet the Vampidom. 1 activation of neuts and NOSes eats somewhere around 80% of your cap. Tank? no. MWD? Dont think so. Webbed and swarmed by drones? In 15 seconds.
Even a ganker deimos can't take a dominix down fast enough (dom having 1 kinetic 1 thermal hardners), if he gets webbed. And, eventually if you run mwd and armor tank, you will run out of cap.
And this is considering my crappy skills for a dominix (10 drones total ), and maximum skills for the guy, flying the deimos.
---------------
Originally by: Dark Shikari "One Trit to rule them all, One Trit to find them, One Trit to bring them all, and in the veldspar bind them"
|
Hamatitio
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 18:31:00 -
[40]
I had a full gank setup on my deimos. Munin warped in, ~22km from me. I begin MWDing towards him. I died at about 10km away form him. This WAS before the cruiser/hac agility increase though...so maybe it would do better. (I had no shields, he killed me in 2 volleys lol) ------
Ganker Extraordinaire |
|
Nyphur
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 18:39:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Hamatitio I had a full gank setup on my deimos. Munin warped in, ~22km from me. I begin MWDing towards him. I died at about 10km away form him. This WAS before the cruiser/hac agility increase though...so maybe it would do better. (I had no shields, he killed me in 2 volleys lol)
Did you try setting a bookmark nearby and warping out to an object and back in at that object? The MWD will get you killed far too easilly with the sig radius increase, suicide if you're not running a tank at all. If you can use your warp drive to get to where he is, all the better. It pays to have bookmarks all about the place ^^.
|
Sangxianc
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 18:42:00 -
[42]
Or, warp to a planet/celestial object with no others nearby (so it's very clear where you went). His automatic warp distance will probably be 20km to use instas, so he'll land on top of you when he chases. If he warps in at 40km, just warp to another planet at 40km and wait.
- Any man's death diminishes me, as I am involved in mankinde; And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; It tolls for thee. |
Arimas Talasko
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 18:59:00 -
[43]
Originally by: OFRogue Yes a rax could probably kill a deimos if set up probably, would just take a while.
And as for you arimas if you think you are so wise how is it that you equip your deimos? And how many gunnery skillpoints do you have? lol.
I don't think I'm very wise. I just think that you aren't either. My setup is still in testing right now but for the moment I hesitate to post it for fear of ridicule :P
Supremacy Keepin it Real |
DrunkenOne
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 19:10:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Nyphur Pit a standard Deimos against a standard thorax and the thorax will get creamed.
Yeah just like a standard inty vs a standard assault.
The point is, things aren't always "standard."
60% armor em damage resistance 10 %armor explosive damage resistance 83.65 %armor kinetic damage resistance 67.55 %armor thermal damage resistance
Are the normal resists for a deimos. Now I don't even fly a deimos, but I'm fairly sure most PVP ones don't have uber tanks, as tanks are worthless. So, assume a med rep II, and an explosive hardner, with maybe a cap relay and the rest damage mods. So thats 60% EM and 67.5% thermal resists, aka what the lasers would be doing, and 55% explosive resists, aka the drones. You wouldn't have 6k armor or whatever, you'd have base + skills, cause a 1600 plate means you do crap damage so you'd most likely not have it. And the thorax WOULD have 5-6k armor, cause a 1600 plate IS standard on PVP thoraxes. So while you would have much better resists, and would be doing better damage, he would have 2-3x more armor.
But I just like arguing, a deimos would prolly win
|
Nyphur
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 19:20:00 -
[45]
Originally by: DrunkenOne
Originally by: Nyphur Pit a standard Deimos against a standard thorax and the thorax will get creamed.
Yeah just like a standard inty vs a standard assault. But I just like arguing, a deimos would prolly win
It would be an interesting fight, I'll give you that.
|
OFRogue
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 19:28:00 -
[46]
See exactly what Hamatitio said. That is what scares me the most being in a gank deimos, dropping out of warp to some form of minmatar ship that will kill me before i can probably get into weapon range. *wave 80-100m isk ship*
|
Sadist
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 19:33:00 -
[47]
Then set up a tank, dammit...Or put on 250mm rails and snipe with Iridium ammo from where the muninn does crap dmg. ---------------
Originally by: Dark Shikari "One Trit to rule them all, One Trit to find them, One Trit to bring them all, and in the veldspar bind them"
|
DrunkenOne
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 19:42:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Sadist Then set up a tank, dammit...Or put on 250mm rails and snipe with Iridium ammo from where the muninn does crap dmg.
Munin w/ 720s can shoot about the same distance as the deimos w/ 250s, cause it gets a a optimal bonus while deimos gets a falloff bonus. So I dont know how you would be able to shoot where a muninn does "crap damage" without doing crap damage yourself.
|
Sadist
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 19:51:00 -
[49]
Originally by: DrunkenOne
Originally by: Sadist Then set up a tank, dammit...Or put on 250mm rails and snipe with Iridium ammo from where the muninn does crap dmg.
Munin w/ 720s can shoot about the same distance as the deimos w/ 250s, cause it gets a a optimal bonus while deimos gets a falloff bonus. So I dont know how you would be able to shoot where a muninn does "crap damage" without doing crap damage yourself.
But you wouldn't die either. ---------------
Originally by: Dark Shikari "One Trit to rule them all, One Trit to find them, One Trit to bring them all, and in the veldspar bind them"
|
spiritfa11
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 20:02:00 -
[50]
I officially give the Deimos the title of "Most Damaging Useless Ship" in game.
Its too slow to do what its meant to do, it cant catch anything that manages to get above 10km from it. Its not agile enough to use speed and maneuverability to its advantage. Fun ship, I still fly it when I can, great for ganking, but I wouldnt dare 1 v 1 a zealot, muunin, vagabond, (would never catch an eagle of cerberus, never break the tank of a sacrilege) and an ishtar would probably nos you to death.
I guess I will give it the benefit thats its great for tackling battleships.
[/rant] ---------------------
Swallow the knife... carve the way for your pride |
|
OFRogue
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 20:08:00 -
[51]
HAHA FINALLY!
Thankyou spirit.
All of these retarded noobs calling me a noob when they probably haven't used the damn ship to do anything besides PVE. Deimos kicks some ass, but there are too many ships that kick too much more.
|
Nybbas
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 20:13:00 -
[52]
dont tell that to selim tho, because he will have to go on and on about how its the best hac (next to the ishtar which actually does rock) etc etc
|
zoturi
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 20:23:00 -
[53]
So, amarr hacs 4tw, right?
|
OFRogue
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 20:24:00 -
[54]
Ishtar probably does kick some ass now with T2 drones... perhaps i'll have to buy one... Sry for my absence nybbas havent talked to you in a bit - msg giga he's on my aim
|
Hllaxiu
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 21:31:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Stormfront TBH, I think my rax is more versatile than the Deimos.
Or maybe thats just my empty wallet making me justify not flying my deimos.
I think the primary difference between a Deimos and a Thorax is that a rail mega can't insta gank a deimos MWDing at it from 100km while it can a thorax.
Not that I discovered this today or anything.
|
Taaser
|
Posted - 2005.07.13 22:28:00 -
[56]
FFS, not XXX vs Deimos again
The outcome of ANY fight is dicey. Sure a XXX can take a Deimos IF the proper modules are fitted, but it works both ways.
Originally by: spiritfa11 I wouldnt dare 1 v 1 a zealot, muunin, vagabond, (would never catch an eagle of cerberus, never break the tank of a sacrilege) and an ishtar would probably nos you to death.
Never lost 1vs1 to any HAC in my Deimos or Ishtar.
|
Eyeshadow
|
Posted - 2005.07.14 00:25:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Nyphur Edited by: Nyphur on 13/07/2005 18:41:53
Originally by: DrunkenOne A thorax with 5 med beam 2s, a 1600 plate and dual web and 8 explosive drones would probably kill you. And thats a near standard thorax fitting (though most people use 150 IIs). He could just double web you and sit at the edge of web range. The med beams do damage to your lowest resists, and so do the explosive drones.
Can I enlighten you as to my Deimos setup? It's entirely for PVE and when I say PVE, I mean tanking complexes. Don't expect it to deal damage but don't expect to scratch its armour, either. Mid: Three cap recahrger IIs Low: Centum A-type medium armour repairer, 1600mm rolled tungsten plate, 2 50% hardeners, 2 55% explosive hardeners. When you talk about my lowest resistance, are you so sure the gap is that big? Have a look at this: EM80 Explosive76.5 Kinetic83.75 Thermal83.75
When I get my two 64% explosive hardeners, it'll look like this: EM80 Explosive83.86 Kinetic83.75 Thermal83.75 So explosive will soon be my highest resistance.
Can 5 medium beam laser IIs and 8 explosive drones really deal over 312 damage per second? Because that's what it'd take to take this thing down and even at 350 damage per second, that'd take 15 minutes to get through the armour. At 400 DPS, it'd take 6.5 minutes, at 500 DPS it'd take 3 minutes and so on. How much damage will 5 small T2 lasers and 8 drones really do?..
Also, 10km is about my optimal range. If he's not running a repairer, does he expect to survive for the many minutes it will take to nibble through my 6000 armour?
Now I'm not one for PVP myself but it seems to me that with balanced PVP setups, you're arguing that a Thorax is more powerful than its elite cousin, which is wrong. Pit a standard Deimos against a standard thorax and the thorax will get creamed.
my standard pvp setup (about 500 dps with drones) would kill that uber expensive set up of urs. Its a PVE setup, and using a deimos for such a task makes baby jesus cry. Running a 1600 plate with 4 hardners and a medium rep means at BEST, ur running electrons, but probably dual 150s, which absolutely suck. Yes it would take me 3.5 mins or whatever to kill you, but you sure as hell aint gonna kill me with such a crap setup
The deimos does not suck, people just try and tank it. DONT. The golden rule with deimos is as much dmg + speed as u can get. Screw this electron + nos crap, thats crap. more than 1 hardner is also crap.
Forums: Sharks * MC |
Eyeshadow
|
Posted - 2005.07.14 00:30:00 -
[58]
oh and there aint no way in hell a rax would kill a deimos unless the deimos pilot was a n00b.
Deimos has its good points and bad. If it gets under 10km and u aint got 2 webs, your as good as dead. Its not the fastest ship out there but is the most dmging HAC when setup up correctly. The only real weakness it has now is nos. 3 medium or 2 hvy nos will completely screw a deimos over in double quick time. Plus, when fitted with blasters. Its do or die, hence the need for as much dmg as possible
Forums: Sharks * MC |
Hanns
|
Posted - 2005.07.14 00:35:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Sadist Edited by: Sadist on 13/07/2005 17:19:10
Originally by: Nyphur
Originally by: Reiisha Consider, though, that this is a 1v1 situation. I doubt you can tank 2 or more players with any tank.
In my Deimos, I can fit a setup for tanking all types of damage and tank a player battleship forever. I had a dominix with blasters and a swarm of Heavy drones on me and it wasn't able to break my tank. I imagine if I knew what type of damage I was coming up against, I could tank two battleships, but I sure as hell wouldn't be taking any of them down with my crappy damage.
Meet the Vampidom. 1 activation of neuts and NOSes eats somewhere around 80% of your cap. Tank? no. MWD? Dont think so. Webbed and swarmed by drones? In 15 seconds.
Even a ganker deimos can't take a dominix down fast enough (dom having 1 kinetic 1 thermal hardners), if he gets webbed. And, eventually if you run mwd and armor tank, you will run out of cap.
And this is considering my crappy skills for a dominix (10 drones total ), and maximum skills for the guy, flying the deimos.
Thats because the Heavy nos is the most overpowered BS module available agaisnt frigs and cruisers, when oh when will CCP nerf them, they should act like large turrets and use sig radius. its like a "Win" button on your BS Vs frigs and cruisers.
|
elorran
|
Posted - 2005.07.14 00:46:00 -
[60]
I'd have to agree with Eyeshadow on that one, the Deimos is more of a damage output vessel than an absorbing one. Given it's natural reistance a single explosive hardener, and/or perhaps an EM shield hardener if you wanted. The rest of the setup should be geared towards damage output and movement.
The times you need to tank most HAC's are few and far between usually. But each to their own.
http://www.dryphed.com |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 [2] 3 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |