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Doctor Zoe
Republic University Minmatar Republic
3
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Posted - 2013.02.04 12:31:00 -
[31] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:Hir Miriel wrote:Working on my second month here.
It looks like the average account age is 4 years?
Not sure I'll make it that long, but I am glad I came to try out EVE. Was on my to-do list a long while.
Nah I wouldn't say the average account age is 4 years. That seems really old. -Liang
Are you chinese? I kno the meaning of LIang NvRen , its means that betiful lady Im -áPHD-áfor R&D,not medical doctor.
-á
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Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
1269
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Posted - 2013.02.04 17:15:00 -
[32] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote:Actually, it's very obvious that you think this is an exceedingly low number. So low, in fact, that the tired old meme "Eve is Dying" is actually true. Obviously, the player retention efforts that CCP have put in place are so terrible that they have one of the only MMOs in the world with a positive growth rate for a ******* decade.
Seriously, if you have ideas for how to help the NPE, then spit them out. If you want to tell everyone you know how to run a game company better than CCP... well, you're free to try. Get some venture funding, start a company. Hire a bunch of people. Find out just how much you didn't know.
-Liang
Good old Liang, cutting to the heart of the matter in one single post lol.
As for me, i would hope the answer is "not that many, but enough to keep positive growth". EVE is cool to me in part because it's Exclusive.
Some of us like exclusive. EVE is like a night club where scrubs and thundersluts are unwelcome. Unfortunately, the "EVE would get so many more subs if" crowd wants to take our exclusive club and turn it into Dennys....... The WoW of the restaurant world. |
Vexen Lyre
Serious Player Corporation
6
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Posted - 2013.02.04 17:22:00 -
[33] - Quote
eve is exclusive in the same way your mum's basement is. Docked in Jita - Moon 4 - Caldari Navy Assembly Plant |
Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
1269
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Posted - 2013.02.04 17:25:00 -
[34] - Quote
Vexen Lyre wrote:eve is exclusive in the same way your mum's basement is.
OMG, such wonderful content, not only do you win post of the day, the noble prize people called looking for your phone number!
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Vexen Lyre
Serious Player Corporation
7
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Posted - 2013.02.04 17:28:00 -
[35] - Quote
and your mum picked up. Docked in Jita - Moon 4 - Caldari Navy Assembly Plant |
Caldari Citizen 20120308
State War Academy Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2013.02.04 18:55:00 -
[36] - Quote
I'd say it's pretty bad. Most of my friends that have tried EVE have mostly complained about one thing: skill training and throwing things into queue. Not once have I heard about how "hard" the game is which is a cover up for the lack of character progression.
What sandbox when you are restricted by a queue that player's have no control over.
A true sandbox = Elder Scrolls Skyrim. I would hate to know I couldn't use an axe for 16 hours since I haven't added it to my queue yet. |
Demolishar
United Aggression
775
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Posted - 2013.02.04 19:11:00 -
[37] - Quote
Liang Nuren wrote: Nah I wouldn't say the average account age is 4 years. That seems really old.
2009 is now 4 years ago. Bet you still think of 2009+ players as noobs though, I know I do :D |
Mikhael Taron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
13
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Posted - 2013.02.04 19:20:00 -
[38] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:On a two week trial, your average player gets 'free stuff'' can griefed on his first day. Can flipped on his second day. Ganked on the third while mining in his noob mining ship. Gate ganked on the fifth day hauling his stuff to a market hub and robbed in a corp recruitment scam on the sixth. He stops logging in on the seventh day. Mr Epeen
Not sure if this was tongue-in-cheek but in any case it's accurate. You can fool some of the people all of the time. You can fool all of the people some of the time. You can make a fool out of yourself anytime.
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Liang Nuren
Heretic Army Atrocitas
2911
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Posted - 2013.02.04 19:26:00 -
[39] - Quote
Demolishar wrote:2009 is now 4 years ago. Bet you still think of 2009+ players as noobs though, I know I do :D
Hmm, in Amamake right now: 1 - 2005 1 - 2006 1 - 2007 1 - 2008 6 - 2009 8 - 2010 5 - 2012 2 - 2013
So that makes the average late 2009, and likely 2010 (I neglected months). 2010 is basically 2 years still.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
83
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Posted - 2013.02.05 12:38:00 -
[40] - Quote
10 or 12 jumps south of Amarr, highesec but close to null, I forget the system name.
1 - 2007 4- 2011 3- 2012 1- 2013
I talked to 3 or 4 people, of those 1 had started from scratch last year. He said that he read an Eve fiction book (I think about Dust) while stuck at an airport and became hooked.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
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LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
285
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Posted - 2013.02.05 16:30:00 -
[41] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:What % of new players stick with the game? Of the people who started within the past 2 or 3 years what % do you think stayed with the game?
Then think back 7 or 8 years. What % of the new players back then stuck with the game?
And not retread players who have been in and out of the game for a long time, rather brand new blood.
Honestly, I doubt CCP knows.
They may track the % of accounts that stick around, but I can start a new account for 51 days for free.
I use my open buddy invite. Activate that new account with a PLEX provided to the new toon by my main, and then my main gets the month and the alt gets 51 days paid subscription. Within a day and a half, that new account can be flying a big industrial, hauling more ore to station than 2 hulks can mine. Within a couple weeks, that free account can be flying a mining barge. By that time, I can start yet another new free account using a PLEX for another of my main accounts... again, another 51 free days.
CCP has a hard time getting accounts to renew more than just that first month. DUH, I'd guess a very large % of the new accounts are just older players taking advantage of the 51 free days. |
Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
85
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Posted - 2013.02.05 19:08:00 -
[42] - Quote
I've been talking to people and asking on help a bit. Seems like a lot of people under a million SP, and very few of them stay to develop their characters. Which is what the pretty girl coalition all said at the beginning of this thread.
The new players have all these grand plans and ideas that wont work. One I spoke w this morning wants to be a pirate. I said "go bump miners off of rocks and bump transports out of align at the gates. Then demand ransoms." She didnt seem to think that was the way to go, wanted to gun into lowsec and jump miners there =-P
I explained that the guys who do mine lowsec are not going to be caught. She wanted to be a gun totting pirate though...
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
286
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Posted - 2013.02.05 19:31:00 -
[43] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:I've been talking to people and asking on help a bit. Seems like a lot of people under a million SP, and very few of them stay to develop their characters. Which is what the pretty girl coalition all said at the beginning of this thread.
The new players have all these grand plans and ideas that wont work. One I spoke w this morning wants to be a pirate. I said "go bump miners off of rocks and bump transports out of align at the gates. Then demand ransoms." She didnt seem to think that was the way to go, wanted to gun into lowsec and jump miners there =-P
I explained that the guys who do mine lowsec are not going to be caught. She wanted to be a gun totting pirate though...
As if there are all these miners just hanging out in low sec waiting to be killed by that one rouge pirate that just signed up for the game.
1) Miners don't mine where they can get easily blown up. 2) If they did, there would already be 10,000 pirates hanging around blowing them up... and those existing pirates wouldn't be too happy about a new pirate coming along and attacking their prey.
Could you imagine if at install time there was an option: 1) Spend your time in game blowing up other, defenseless players. 2) Spend your time in game being defenseless and other players constantly coming along and blowing you up.
Who would chose option 2?
We industry, because the game provides mechanisms through which we can do so in relative safety. Take away those mechanism that keep us relatively safe (local, CONCORD, intel channels out in 0.0, ability to drop to an NPC corp if war dec continues too long, etc) then we just wouldn't play the game. |
Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
85
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Posted - 2013.02.05 19:40:00 -
[44] - Quote
Maybe CCP could offer FtP for players who agreed to mine in lowsec! lol, I might actually get in on that action =-)
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
286
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Posted - 2013.02.05 19:48:00 -
[45] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Maybe CCP could offer FtP for players who agreed to mine in lowsec! lol, I might actually get in on that action =-)
It is.. for 51 days anyway.
Of course, it would just be the existing pirate corps using mining alts to lure in other "wanna-be" pirates, so they could blow up the wanna-be pirates. |
Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
85
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Posted - 2013.02.05 19:58:00 -
[46] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:Maybe CCP could offer FtP for players who agreed to mine in lowsec! lol, I might actually get in on that action =-) It is.. for 51 days anyway. Of course, it would just be the existing pirate corps using mining alts to lure in other "wanna-be" pirates, so they could blow up the wanna-be pirates.
That's a great idea! You indy guys are wasted on invention and manufacture.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Liang Nuren
Heretic Army Atrocitas
2922
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Posted - 2013.02.05 20:45:00 -
[47] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:Who would chose option 2?
I've always chosen option 3: doing industry in a non-stupid way. Honestly I can't imagine how someone can sign up for a pure PVP game and not expect to have to defend their industry assets from PVP people? When I first signed up for Eve I wanted to be "the brains behind the brawn" - but at no point did I want to be a wimp ass carebear hiding from PVP all the time.
Man up and use your brain a bit.
-Liang
Ed: And before you go "LOL LOW SUCK PIRATE HATES ALL INDUSTRY" on me, please bear in mind that I ran a WH corp for a long time. I've also done missions and done industry all the way from basic T1 mods to capital, T2, and T3 production. It's a PVP game. Treat it as such. Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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Etidorhpa
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
63
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Posted - 2013.02.06 22:28:00 -
[48] - Quote
PVP makes the game fun, but a lot depends on finding the right corp....which is hard starting out. I'd be interested knowing how many people start solo and keep on going solo for a goodly while (playing in general, not only PVP). I wouldn't have stuck round without having joined a corp early on. I am the name of a book. |
Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
87
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Posted - 2013.02.06 23:28:00 -
[49] - Quote
Etidorhpa wrote:PVP makes the game fun, but a lot depends on finding the right corp....which is hard starting out. I'd be interested knowing how many people start solo and keep on going solo for a goodly while (playing in general, not only PVP). I wouldn't have stuck round without having joined a corp early on.
Corps are over-rated. There's plenty of stuff to do outside of a corp, and your not limited by what others want to do. I swap corps all the time, and have more contacts for doing so. There's a ton of chat channels for all types of different activities and locations. Meeting people and developing relations in Eve is as easy as you want to make it. From what I have seen corps just limit people in scope and opportunity.
I don't mean to say that you are "wrong" in any sense, If that's what kept you in Eve then you made the right choice.
There is a lot of convo here in the forums that really push the idea that players who are not in a PC corp should suffer for it, mostly because player corps are seeking to have an advantage for themselves. It has nothing to do with what is best for the game or best for the players or best for CCP.
So by all means support the game that you like to play, but please don't assume that is the game that is best for everyone.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Anndy
The Evocati
61
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Posted - 2013.02.07 02:12:00 -
[50] - Quote
LHA Tarawa wrote:Corey Fumimasa wrote:What % of new players stick with the game? Of the people who started within the past 2 or 3 years what % do you think stayed with the game?
Then think back 7 or 8 years. What % of the new players back then stuck with the game?
And not retread players who have been in and out of the game for a long time, rather brand new blood. Honestly, I doubt CCP knows. They may track the % of accounts that stick around, but I can start a new account for 51 days for free. I use my open buddy invite. Activate that new account with a PLEX provided to the new toon by my main, and then my main gets the month and the alt gets 51 days paid subscription. Within a day and a half, that new account can be flying a big industrial, hauling more ore to station than 2 hulks can mine. Within a couple weeks, that free account can be flying a mining barge. By that time, I can start yet another new free account using a PLEX for another of my main accounts... again, another 51 free days. CCP has a hard time getting accounts to renew more than just that first month. DUH, I'd guess a very large % of the new accounts are just older players taking advantage of the 51 free days.
i think theres actually quite a few legit new players but they would have to go through all the IPs to really sort it out, not worth the effort
older characters are a bigger issue, CCP would have to track all the character transfers to see how many are still playing and in the hands of their original owner, again not worth the effort |
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Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
88
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Posted - 2013.02.07 03:23:00 -
[51] - Quote
Anndy wrote:
i think theres actually quite a few legit new players but they would have to go through all the IPs to really sort it out, not worth the effort
older characters are a bigger issue, CCP would have to track all the character transfers to see how many are still playing and in the hands of their original owner, again not worth the effort
I have been making an effort to convo people in help chat who have questions. There are a lot of new people there. People who have never player eve before. I don't think CCP has any problem getting players to try the game out. Do they stay? idk. If they do leave then why?
Anyone know why Bioware's recent SW MMO flopped? It looked really cool. Not my thing, but it seemed like they had a great idea.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Travito Omerta
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.02.07 03:54:00 -
[52] - Quote
Considering Eve Online has the worst community ever of any game anywhere, I'd say not that many. |
Anndy
The Evocati
61
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Posted - 2013.02.07 04:05:00 -
[53] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Anndy wrote:
i think theres actually quite a few legit new players but they would have to go through all the IPs to really sort it out, not worth the effort
older characters are a bigger issue, CCP would have to track all the character transfers to see how many are still playing and in the hands of their original owner, again not worth the effort
I have been making an effort to convo people in help chat who have questions. There are a lot of new people there. People who have never player eve before. I don't think CCP has any problem getting players to try the game out. Do they stay? idk. If they do leave then why? Anyone know why Bioware's recent SW MMO flopped? It looked really cool. Not my thing, but it seemed like they had a great idea.
lots of reasons why most leave, the biggest is the learning curve and right behind it is getting treated like crap with scams and suicide ganks, low sec market scams, some just wanted to try the game or cant afford it once the trial runs out
SWTOR had a lot of issues, its biggest was being almost an exact wow clone, pvp was all about grinding for pvp gear and there really wasnt much for end game content. server population was also a huge issue they had like 200 servers at launch which resulted in people being very spread out and unable to find groups. i know they have done a lot of patching but not sure if its much better
1 thing SWTOR was really great for was the story, they did an amazing job in that department but really thats the only good thing i can say about the game and now that its f2p its worth downloading just to run through the storys |
Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
88
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 04:17:00 -
[54] - Quote
Travito Omerta wrote:Considering Eve Online has the worst community ever of any game anywhere, I'd say not that many.
Well that is the question. Are new players looking for a "good" community? Do people want a memepark where everything is safe? Bioware's latest experiment might be worth looking at here.
So WTF, what do people really want? What will they come back for? What will they spend their money on, and their time, and tell their friends about? Do people leave Eve because they got screwed, schooled and lost their PLEX. Or do they leave for some other reason?
Idk, retention is not what it could be, maybe it is what it should be though. To keep the game smashrock rough and challenging. Are you going to stay?
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
88
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 04:28:00 -
[55] - Quote
Anndy wrote:
lots of reasons why most leave, the biggest is the learning curve and right behind it is getting treated like crap with scams and suicide ganks, low sec market scams, some just wanted to try the game or cant afford it once the trial runs out
SWTOR had a lot of issues, its biggest was being almost an exact wow clone, pvp was all about grinding for pvp gear and there really wasnt much for end game content. server population was also a huge issue they had like 200 servers at launch which resulted in people being very spread out and unable to find groups. i know they have done a lot of patching but not sure if its much better
1 thing SWTOR was really great for was the story, they did an amazing job in that department but really thats the only good thing i can say about the game and now that its f2p its worth downloading just to run through the storys
I hate gear grind myself, I'm really surprised Bioware went that route.
As for no end content, I can't believe that people wanted "end content" in the first 3 months of game play. *I'm not arguing with you, I've heard that myself, months ago actually. I'm just incredulous about it is all. The other thing is that Eve has no well defined end content either.
I wonder if some end content would help Eve?
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Travito Omerta
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.02.07 04:37:00 -
[56] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote:Travito Omerta wrote:Considering Eve Online has the worst community ever of any game anywhere, I'd say not that many. Well that is the question. Are new players looking for a "good" community? Do people want a memepark where everything is safe? Bioware's latest experiment might be worth looking at here. So WTF, what do people really want? What will they come back for? What will they spend their money on, and their time, and tell their friends about? Do people leave Eve because they got screwed, schooled and lost their PLEX. Or do they leave for some other reason? Idk, retention is not what it could be, maybe it is what it should be though. To keep the game smashrock rough and challenging. Are you going to stay?
Who the f*ck cares if new players stay is a better question. You're all to manly, strokin the epeen and kill mail whoring. For anyone who plays this to give a raped goats a$$ about new players coming or going is pure lulz.
Oh and actually eve is not a game of skill it never was.....it's a game of senority. |
Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
88
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Posted - 2013.02.07 05:03:00 -
[57] - Quote
Travito Omerta wrote:
Who the f*ck cares if new players stay is a better question. You're all to manly, strokin the epeen and kill mail whoring. For anyone who plays this to give a raped goats a$$ about new players coming or going is pure lulz.
Oh and actually eve is not a game of skill it never was.....it's a game of senority.
I care! Eve is a game in which we can experiment with alternate ways to be. In the RW we can't afford to take the risks that we take everyday in Eve. And yet there are consequences for those choices, consequences that feel almost as significant as rl.
So I think the most interesting thing about Eve and the thing that makes it what it is for all of us who play through the horribleness is this direct comparison to RL. And without RL people the simulation becomes meaningless, the challenge becomes a game against other gamers, and not a sandbox with endless possibility.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Corey Fumimasa
Perkone Caldari State
88
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 05:21:00 -
[58] - Quote
Travito Omerta wrote:
Oh and actually eve is not a game of skill it never was.....it's a game of senority.
In Eve there's always someone with a bigger hammer. You don't try to make things flatter than he can, he after all has a bigger hammer. You throw some dust in his eyes and then hit him in the knee, then the head, then kick him.
RW skill is a huge part of Eve. And the skill system is the ultimate equalizer, even a person who is limited in rl can be competitive in Eve, either through good skill choices or careful planning or through situational awareness or luck and on and on. Every human advantage is also applicable in Eve.
This is a youtube playlist going over my first 30 ship losses. Video sucks but the audio came out well.There are some good lessons, and if you know the game there's some funny stories. |
Travito Omerta
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.02.07 05:29:00 -
[59] - Quote
So thats why null is a numbers game and blob warfare prevails. Suddenly it's all much clearer, I had no idea individual skill was such a deciding factor. The skilling system encourages an afk community. |
Liang Nuren
Heretic Army Atrocitas
2929
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 05:56:00 -
[60] - Quote
Corey Fumimasa wrote: There is a lot of convo here in the forums that really push the idea that players who are not in a PC corp should suffer for it, mostly because player corps are seeking to have an advantage for themselves. It has nothing to do with what is best for the game or best for the players or best for CCP.
So by all means support the game that you like to play, but please don't assume that is the game that is best for everyone.
I think it's pretty safe to say that NPC corps bypass certain risk mechanics that are central to the game itself. I'd further argue that social interaction is a mainstay player retention mechanic and studies have time and time and time and time again shown that increasing player interaction increases user engagement and retention.
Joining PC corps is good for the game.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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