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Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
21
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Posted - 2011.10.11 10:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
Guys, look you need to start getting past the I WIN button, Carriers were changed so that they were a logistics type ship not a OMGPWN ship... Your not supposed to be using them for offensive duties! They are there for support and reps and logistics!
These changes are the best thing CCP have done for a while. No more super/titan blobs on sub caps, no more i win button, no more lets field hundred supers and that's it. This does balance things out, yes there are still a few tweaks and I personally want to see offensive capabilities of supers/titans removed from low sec.
So back to your carriers, if you want to kill sub caps, that either shooting your caps or just shooting other sub caps then your supposed to bring - wait for it - ah yes you guessed it - ANOTHER SUB CAP FLEET - taaaa daaaa
The point of the change is that carriers and scs cant just kill every damn thing around, you still have offensive capabilities that will kill BS size ships, but now you gonna have think a bit more before you undock that carrier/super. Because one thing for sure is damn annoying is yor in your sub cap fleet hoping for a fight, and then people undock 10 carriers! really!!??.....Boring....
Bravo CCP....about bloody time....
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Kitty McKitty
In Praise Of Shadows
336
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Posted - 2011.10.11 10:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
Thanks for sharing GÖÑ Haviing your portrait painted here helps INTAKI Disabled Children GÖÑ |
Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
21
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 10:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
Kitty McKitty wrote:Thanks for sharing
I just felt i needed to clear that up
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DarkAegix
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 10:47:00 -
[4] - Quote
Logistics ships get DPS nerf? UNIMAGINABLE |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
77
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 10:51:00 -
[5] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote:Guys, look you need to start getting past the I WIN button, Carriers were changed so that they were a logistics type ship not a OMGPWN ship... Your not supposed to be using them for offensive duties! They are there for support and reps and logistics!
These changes are the best thing CCP have done for a while. No more super/titan blobs on sub caps, no more i win button, no more lets field hundred supers and that's it. This does balance things out, yes there are still a few tweaks and I personally want to see offensive capabilities of supers/titans removed from low sec.
So back to your carriers, if you want to kill sub caps, that either shooting your caps or just shooting other sub caps then your supposed to bring - wait for it - ah yes you guessed it - ANOTHER SUB CAP FLEET - taaaa daaaa
The point of the change is that carriers and scs cant just kill every damn thing around, you still have offensive capabilities that will kill BS size ships, but now you gonna have think a bit more before you undock that carrier/super. Because one thing for sure is damn annoying is yor in your sub cap fleet hoping for a fight, and then people undock 10 carriers! really!!??.....Boring....
Bravo CCP....about bloody time....
carriers never could kill everything around. they are currently balanced v dreads and bs's and other sub caps. they have a roll based on the race specific bonses. and if they wernt ment to be offensive, they need to have the following bonses changed somewhat. Gallente Carrier Skill Bonuses: 50% bonus to Capital Shield and Armor transfer range per level 5% bonus to deployed FightersGÇÖ damage per level-----------------------------------rep amount is a good trade off 99% reduction in CPU need for Warfare Link modules Can fit Tactical Logistics Reconfiguration modules Can deploy 1 additional Fighter or Drone per level----------------------------------rep range/amount 200% bonus to Fighter control range--------------------------------------------------- + 100% hp when in triarge.
that would work CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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AureoLion
Etoilles Mortant Ltd. Solyaris Chtonium
8
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Posted - 2011.10.11 10:51:00 -
[6] - Quote
MATH EXISTS USE IT |
Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
21
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 10:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
Smoking Blunts wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:Guys, look you need to start getting past the I WIN button, Carriers were changed so that they were a logistics type ship not a OMGPWN ship... Your not supposed to be using them for offensive duties! They are there for support and reps and logistics!
These changes are the best thing CCP have done for a while. No more super/titan blobs on sub caps, no more i win button, no more lets field hundred supers and that's it. This does balance things out, yes there are still a few tweaks and I personally want to see offensive capabilities of supers/titans removed from low sec.
So back to your carriers, if you want to kill sub caps, that either shooting your caps or just shooting other sub caps then your supposed to bring - wait for it - ah yes you guessed it - ANOTHER SUB CAP FLEET - taaaa daaaa
The point of the change is that carriers and scs cant just kill every damn thing around, you still have offensive capabilities that will kill BS size ships, but now you gonna have think a bit more before you undock that carrier/super. Because one thing for sure is damn annoying is yor in your sub cap fleet hoping for a fight, and then people undock 10 carriers! really!!??.....Boring....
Bravo CCP....about bloody time....
carriers never could kill everything around. they are currently balanced v dreads and bs's and other sub caps. they have a roll based on the race specific bonses. and if they wernt ment to be offensive, they need to have the following bonses changed somewhat. Gallente Carrier Skill Bonuses: 50% bonus to Capital Shield and Armor transfer range per level 5% bonus to deployed FightersGÇÖ damage per level-----------------------------------rep amount is a good trade off 99% reduction in CPU need for Warfare Link modules Can fit Tactical Logistics Reconfiguration modules Can deploy 1 additional Fighter or Drone per level----------------------------------rep range/amount 200% bonus to Fighter control range--------------------------------------------------- + 100% hp when in triarge. that would work
I think thats reasonable....
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Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
77
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Posted - 2011.10.11 10:56:00 -
[8] - Quote
its ok fighters arnt getting chnaged now if i coudl link teh pot i woudl ******* **** forums
dev blog page 47 post 931 ccp tallest
Quote:#931 Posted: 2011.10.11 10:51 | Report Like In this thread, I've read several very good reasons why the fighter change is a bad idea. You are right. Fighters should stay the way they are. The change would be unfair for carriers.
The poor performance of Minmatar capital ships is being looked at and was already being looked at before the blog was posted.
Pointing out flaws and issues with the balancing plan is very much appreciated. I will look into the issues and make changes where they are needed.
Once this hits SISI, I will start a thread in the test server feedback forums. Your concerns will be listened to and acted upon if necessary. CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
22
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
forget it guys you got your wish CCP have bowed to the carrier blob pressure and decided to back track...what a JOKE!!!
I know whilst your at it CCP scrap the whole change, lets jsut have supercaps online. No back bone at all..
Ill take the well done CCP back now...useless. |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
78
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:02:00 -
[10] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote:forget it guys you got your wish CCP have bowed to the carrier blob pressure and decided to back track...what a JOKE!!!
I know whilst your at it CCP scrap the whole change, lets jsut have supercaps online. No back bone at all..
Ill take the well done CCP back now...useless.
change to supers fine, but screwing a ship class that is currently balanced v dreads and bs's make as much sence as your hate for carriers CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:10:00 -
[11] - Quote
Smoking Blunts wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:forget it guys you got your wish CCP have bowed to the carrier blob pressure and decided to back track...what a JOKE!!!
I know whilst your at it CCP scrap the whole change, lets jsut have supercaps online. No back bone at all..
Ill take the well done CCP back now...useless. change to supers fine, but screwing a ship class that is currently balanced v dreads and bs's make as much sence as your hate for carriers
I dont have any hate for carriers at all.. What will happen now is we shall see the carrier blob, instead on the super carrier blob..
Ill say it again - CARRIERS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE LOGISTICS SHIPS NOT OFFENSIVE SHIPS . |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
78
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:13:00 -
[12] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote:Smoking Blunts wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:forget it guys you got your wish CCP have bowed to the carrier blob pressure and decided to back track...what a JOKE!!!
I know whilst your at it CCP scrap the whole change, lets jsut have supercaps online. No back bone at all..
Ill take the well done CCP back now...useless. change to supers fine, but screwing a ship class that is currently balanced v dreads and bs's make as much sence as your hate for carriers I dont have any hate for carriers at all.. What will happen now is we shall see the carrier blob, instead on the super carrier blob...
no we wont, carriers can still be insta popped by sc's. that hasnt chnaged and rightly so.
but unbalancing a ship that is very well balanced currently is stupid. i dont understand why you think carriers are over powered? CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:15:00 -
[13] - Quote
Smoking Blunts wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:Smoking Blunts wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:forget it guys you got your wish CCP have bowed to the carrier blob pressure and decided to back track...what a JOKE!!!
I know whilst your at it CCP scrap the whole change, lets jsut have supercaps online. No back bone at all..
Ill take the well done CCP back now...useless. change to supers fine, but screwing a ship class that is currently balanced v dreads and bs's make as much sence as your hate for carriers I dont have any hate for carriers at all.. What will happen now is we shall see the carrier blob, instead on the super carrier blob... no we wont, carriers can still be insta popped by sc's. that hasnt chnaged and rightly so. but unbalancing a ship that is very well balanced currently is stupid. i dont understand why you think carriers are over powered?
not carriers as a whole, your right carriers are fine , i mean fighters...and with respect not everyone has supers..anyway its not relevant now mate... |
Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
78
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:19:00 -
[14] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote:Smoking Blunts wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:Smoking Blunts wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:forget it guys you got your wish CCP have bowed to the carrier blob pressure and decided to back track...what a JOKE!!!
I know whilst your at it CCP scrap the whole change, lets jsut have supercaps online. No back bone at all..
Ill take the well done CCP back now...useless. change to supers fine, but screwing a ship class that is currently balanced v dreads and bs's make as much sence as your hate for carriers I dont have any hate for carriers at all.. What will happen now is we shall see the carrier blob, instead on the super carrier blob... no we wont, carriers can still be insta popped by sc's. that hasnt chnaged and rightly so. but unbalancing a ship that is very well balanced currently is stupid. i dont understand why you think carriers are over powered? not carriers as a whole, your right carriers are fine , i mean fighters...and with respect not everyone has supers..
so what is it taht makes fighters over powered? they dont apply full damage to bc's even with a full passive set up and a massive sig. they apply nearly full damage to bs's rightly so. so why are fighters over powered? CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:24:00 -
[15] - Quote
I think you treating this as one single fighter... yes a fighter on its own isnt overpowered. But carriers deploy what 9+ on a single target...its a bit different then. I know what your trying to get at, and thats fair enough. My issue was people whining about the change, as if carriers should of been used as an offensive ship, thats not their role.
Whats annoying is eve has becoming caps/supers online. Where people can have 100+ carriers/supers/titans at once and thats it, nothing else. Its like one big giant i win button...and its killing eve.. |
Cpt Fina
The Tuskers
25
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:26:00 -
[16] - Quote
Agree on the patch changes except this one and it's tiresome to see mindless idiots like the OP who doesn't realize that this change shouldn't go thru.
Some of you are so damn spiteful about this you got to ask yourself how this reflect upon you as a person |
Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:29:00 -
[17] - Quote
Cpt Fina wrote:Agree on the patch changes except this one and it's tiresome to see mindless idiots like the OP who doesn't realize that this change shouldn't go thru.
Some of you are so damn spiteful about this you got to ask yourself how this reflect upon you as a person
i im sick of mindless idiots like yourself crying because they have to use a carrier for what its role is - oh wait ..you dont anymore...whine over
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Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
78
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:30:00 -
[18] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote:
I think you treating this as one single fighter... yes a fighter on its own isnt overpowered. But carriers deploy what 9+ on a single target...its a bit different then. I know what your trying to get at, and thats fair enough. My issue was people whining about the change, as if carriers should of been used as an offensive ship, thats not their role.
Whats annoying is eve has becoming caps/supers online. Where people can have 100+ carriers/supers/titans at once and thats it, nothing else. Its like one big giant i win button...and its killing eve..
i can with dcu field 14 fighters. 10 with just skills. this is the same as it was back before the scap blob. pre dec 2009. and they wernt over powered then and they arnt now.
the balance to scaps has been adressed and with the log off mechanic more will die.
the ship that needs a lot more love is dreads.
while the fear of caps online is understandible, it shouldnt be a reason to effectivly break a balanced ship class. whos role is is logistics as well as race specific. min for pos's gal for dps amarr for triarge caldari mmmm ratting..lol CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:34:00 -
[19] - Quote
tbh mate, it dont matter now..its not getting changed....thread is irrelavant now... |
Cpt Fina
The Tuskers
25
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:34:00 -
[20] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote:Cpt Fina wrote:Agree on the patch changes except this one and it's tiresome to see mindless idiots like the OP who doesn't realize that this change shouldn't go thru.
Some of you are so damn spiteful about this you got to ask yourself how this reflect upon you as a person i im sick of mindless idiots like yourself crying because they have to use a carrier for what its role is - oh wait ..you dont anymore...whine over
Have never flown a carrier, have never thought of getting one and last time i flew in a gang with a carrier in it was like 5 years ago.
so yeah... you are as fail as your thread. |
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Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:35:00 -
[21] - Quote
Cpt Fina wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:Cpt Fina wrote:Agree on the patch changes except this one and it's tiresome to see mindless idiots like the OP who doesn't realize that this change shouldn't go thru.
Some of you are so damn spiteful about this you got to ask yourself how this reflect upon you as a person i im sick of mindless idiots like yourself crying because they have to use a carrier for what its role is - oh wait ..you dont anymore...whine over Have never flown a carrier, have never thought of getting one and last time i flew in a gang with a carrier in it was like 5 years ago. so yeah... you are as fail as your thread.
so why the hell areyou posting, if you have no idea...
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Karim alRashid
Aliastra Gallente Federation
33
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:37:00 -
[22] - Quote
OK, so we have:
light drones == frig size weapon medium drones = cruiser/BC size weapon heavy/sentry drones = BS size weapon
Apparently the logic dictates that fighters must be a capital size weapon and as such be effective against capitals, not very effective against BS and ineffective against BC and smaller.
So I did the math and it comes that above is achieved with the new change.
What's the problem?
We don't want a carrier only blob either. Or have you forgot 2007-2008? |
ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers Galactic-Rangers
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:38:00 -
[23] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote:NOT APPLICABLE ANYMORE Guys, look you need to start getting past the I WIN button, Carriers were changed so that they were a logistics type ship not a OMGPWN ship... Your not supposed to be using them for offensive duties! They are there for support and reps and logistics! These changes are the best thing CCP have done for a while. No more super/titan blobs on sub caps, no more i win button, no more lets field hundred supers and that's it. This does balance things out, yes there are still a few tweaks and I personally want to see offensive capabilities of supers/titans removed from low sec. So back to your carriers, if you want to kill sub caps, that either shooting your caps or just shooting other sub caps then your supposed to bring - wait for it - ah yes you guessed it - ANOTHER SUB CAP FLEET - taaaa daaaa The point of the change is that carriers and scs cant just kill every damn thing around, you still have offensive capabilities that will kill BS size ships, but now you gonna have think a bit more before you undock that carrier/super. Because one thing for sure is damn annoying is yor in your sub cap fleet hoping for a fight, and then people undock 10 carriers! really!!??.....Boring.... Bravo CCP....about bloody time....
as a carrier pilot myself i CAN see where you are coming from but with the change you pretty much make fighters compleatly obsolete compared to Fighter bombers. So effectively after that fighter nerf would compleatly negate the point of having fighters on a carrier and insted folks will not take them in carriers and would turn them into massive sentry drone boats with unlimited supplys of sentrys heavys warriers and other ECM drones, and in all honesty if that happend i think most folks would rather skip the carrier and jump into a super which is something i dont belive folks would want more of.
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
236
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:38:00 -
[24] - Quote
Sliding in a sneaky INB4 "op requested" L
Will I get the possy?? Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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Smoking Blunts
Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.
78
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:39:00 -
[25] - Quote
Karim alRashid wrote:OK, so we have:
light drones == frig size weapon medium drones = cruiser/BC size weapon heavy/sentry drones = BS size weapon
Apparently the logic dictates that fighters must be a capital size weapon and as such be effective against capitals, not very effective against BS and ineffective against BC and smaller.
So I did the math and it comes that above is achieved with the new change.
What's the problem?
We don't want a carrier only blob either? Or have you forgot 2007-2008?
yeh i remember 07/08/09 what fun i had in dread fleets hot dropping carrier fleets, was awesom. can we get a role back pls CCP-áare full of words and no action. We watch what they do and its nothing but false statements and lies.
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Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:39:00 -
[26] - Quote
Karim alRashid wrote:OK, so we have:
light drones == frig size weapon medium drones = cruiser/BC size weapon heavy/sentry drones = BS size weapon
Apparently the logic dictates that fighters must be a capital size weapon and as such be effective against capitals, not very effective against BS and ineffective against BC and smaller.
So I did the math and it comes that above is achieved with the new change.
What's the problem?
We don't want a carrier only blob either? Or have you forgot 2007-2008?
keh...thats exactly might point lol...wtf....its not getting changed now anyway let the thread die already |
Cpt Fina
The Tuskers
25
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:40:00 -
[27] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote:Cpt Fina wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:Cpt Fina wrote:Agree on the patch changes except this one and it's tiresome to see mindless idiots like the OP who doesn't realize that this change shouldn't go thru.
Some of you are so damn spiteful about this you got to ask yourself how this reflect upon you as a person i im sick of mindless idiots like yourself crying because they have to use a carrier for what its role is - oh wait ..you dont anymore...whine over Have never flown a carrier, have never thought of getting one and last time i flew in a gang with a carrier in it was like 5 years ago. so yeah... you are as fail as your thread. so why the hell areyou posting, if you have no idea...
Because this change was so obviously bad that anyone could see the flaw in it, except for you and a few other who are blinded by your gloat over the nerfs. |
Just Another Toon
University of Caille Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:41:00 -
[28] - Quote
Cpt Fina wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:Cpt Fina wrote:Just Another Toon wrote:Cpt Fina wrote:Agree on the patch changes except this one and it's tiresome to see mindless idiots like the OP who doesn't realize that this change shouldn't go thru.
Some of you are so damn spiteful about this you got to ask yourself how this reflect upon you as a person i im sick of mindless idiots like yourself crying because they have to use a carrier for what its role is - oh wait ..you dont anymore...whine over Have never flown a carrier, have never thought of getting one and last time i flew in a gang with a carrier in it was like 5 years ago. so yeah... you are as fail as your thread. so why the hell areyou posting, if you have no idea... Because this change was so obviously bad that anyone could see the flaw in it, except for you and a few other who are blinded by your gloat over the nerfs.
i really cant comment, your too clever for me... |
Cpt Fina
The Tuskers
25
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 11:46:00 -
[29] - Quote
Just Another Toon wrote: i really cant comment, your too clever for me...
You don't have to be a professor or work at a chemical plant to realize that puouring hydrochloric acid in your morning coffee is bad for your health.
Just stop and think for 5 seconds before you make your next thread. |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2011.10.11 12:03:00 -
[30] - Quote
I would agree with you, but I don't. Since caps are loosing drones for self defense and have to rely on lesser ships now for protection then the reverse is true- What goes down must go up as well.
Frigs should no longer be able to kill a BS, their little ittbbitty weapons should do 1 points of damage to anything thats not another frig or small drone (5 points of damage to a cruiser/BC). No more 15 minute rifter solo kills for a BS, you got to bring 200 rifters to kill 1 BS as they self rep it back. Hulks will no longer be able to be soloed by a rifter in lowsec, even if that exhumer pilot was an idiot to bring it in.
Destroyers, remove 1/3 of their guns (5 max) and increase their base hitpoints a bit. They should be up gunned frigs, not weak cruisers in size with frig hitpoints. Oh, and following this change you will no longer be able to pop a hulk with a thrasher cause there will be a signature size hit to larger vessels (larger vessels should be beefier, smaller weapons just put alot of small holes in things so it should take alot of time to destroy a hulk), you will have to bring 50 destroyers to get 1 hulk.
Cruisers are no longer the weapon of choice for PVP, you will now do about 100 points of damage to a BS. At minimum you should need 6 friends in cruisers to take down a a BS.
Battlecruisers now become the destroyer of EVE. And I don't mean the prefered gods of PVP, I mean freaking EVE destroyers. Cut in half to hitpoints, they are now the new glass cannon. A single BC should be able to overcome a BS, but the BS will have a good chance to take it down as quickly as a destroyer is fried now. Bring 2 BC and you win against a single BS.
BS should be the standard of warfare. They should be the kings of combat and the only things that should be able to take them out is either another BS, capitals, or a freaking swarm blob of 200 rifters (if it works with hurricanes to SC, then it should be the same thing), they should be able to effectively eliminate all cruisers and BC now matter how fast they try to orbit. Another BS should be like slowly punching a thich rock wall with a jackhammer, slow but steady and you will get their eventually.
Non-combat ships from industrials to exhumers and freighters get a huge ******* bonus to hitpoints. In the area of a several million hitpoints to freighters to several hundred for industrials cause now its going to take a small blob of Arttyapocs to gank them. These things die so easy anyway, might as well boost their non-combat role in the process of lol-increasing the rest.
tl,dr? Smaller ships loose offensive ability vs bigger targets. I mean, they really loose offensive ability and its like punisher is your shooting EM/Therm damage on a T1 shield (armored tank hull though) that has 99% resist when in fact it has no modules. Your little puny ships will be no match for it except in numbers, cause CCP really fixed the blob issue as a hole and they actually just deversified it....Numbers > Numbers....who ever brings the most wins regardless of ship type (SC where just really thick walls before, now that your fleets will require small ships to protect those walls your adding in 2 meter thermal vents to exploit with smaller ships and lol we all know numbers of people can counter hokey religions so its just still going to be massive numbers of people blobbing and who can get back into the fight quicker.
Yeah and all these suggestions are just trolling. Effectively requiring you to bring smaller ships still does not fix blob warfare, its still a static-dynamic of who ever brings the most, who ever gets back the fastest, and which ever side manages to destroy the supply of smaller ships first then focus on the larger ships. |
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