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flakeys
Arkham Innovations Paper Tiger Coalition
813
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Posted - 2013.02.09 11:05:00 -
[91] - Quote
Washichu May wrote:Atomic Virulent wrote:In the upcoming expansion, there are some serious issues that can only be reconciled with free skillpoints or PLEX.
The 2 big ones.. Iteron V is/was 24d to skill for. It will be reduced to 33 minutes.. MINUTES! That's brand new noob, to ITTY V in THIRTY THREE MINUTES! This has the value of nearly an entire month of game time.
Second, the Orca is going from 40+d down to 17 days. This is unacceptable. The thought that some troll can spend his 14-day trial and be up to par with seasoned vets who spent over a month skilling is just atrocious.
WTF is this.. World of Warcraft? Get over yourself. Back in 2003 people mined in imicus for a week to buy a thorax. If you want to be a cockblocker for new people, maybe you should be pushed back into that paradigm and make ISK old-school way.
This to be honest.And let's not mention the learning boost new players got years back or a bigger starting SP then in the old days.Stuff changes , deal with it.
We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
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Dasola
Rookie Empire Citizens Rookie Empire
142
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Posted - 2013.02.09 11:07:00 -
[92] - Quote
Revman Zim wrote:
Has CCP ever let you down before? I think NOT!
Many many times. Industrial expansion newer happened, Pos mechanic is still garbage, corporate role system needs serious upgrade... Some UI elements needs serious upgrade and rethingking how they work...
0.0 has no treaty system (featured few years back in fanfest video), 0.0 ratting anomaly changes that only improved power blocks income (I have yet to see how this was supposed to help new smaller corps/alliances to gain foothold in 0.0 as developers claimed as one of the reasons for change..) Id say re-iterate it again...
Claiming CCP has not let us down ever is like saying moon dosent orbit earth. Sometimes CCP gets things right, sometimes it takes all playerbase rage and riots to set them straight... Sometimes they just drops the ball totally. But then again, none is perfect. [Insert something funny or smart here]
Good lord has set me on path, sometimes im confused about what he wants from me. But path leads on, towards why he placed me on this wonderfull planet... |
Solomunio Kzenig
East Khanid Trading Khanid Trade Syndicate
6
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Posted - 2013.02.09 11:08:00 -
[93] - Quote
Starts Building and stockpillig Iteron V's...... |
Whitehound
699
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Posted - 2013.02.09 11:16:00 -
[94] - Quote
TL;DR: Meme 1 - Meme 2 - Meme 3
SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites Echelon Rising
732
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Posted - 2013.02.09 11:25:00 -
[95] - Quote
Corbin Blair wrote:Grimpak wrote: or don't demand nothing and laugh at the OP.
it's healthier.
Or I could say it sarcastically and be doing both at once. The point I was trying to make is that anyone who has been around long enough to see an expansion come out had it worse than a post expansion newbie. If CCP starts compensating people for that they'll have to compensate almost everyone every time an expansion comes out. well yeah but... tears and laughter at somebody's expense man [img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right |
Kate stark
Perkone Caldari State
35
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Posted - 2013.02.09 11:34:00 -
[96] - Quote
Solomunio Kzenig wrote:Starts Building and stockpillig Iteron V's......
inb4 itty Vs get rebalanced to be useful. |
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet
420
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Posted - 2013.02.09 15:37:00 -
[97] - Quote
The change in initial skill requirement together with industrial tiericide would most likely mean that while Industrial I would allow you to fly an Iteron V, you'd still need Industrial V for it to have the large cargohold that it has today.
So in reality, not really any change, except that it allows for more different ships to actually be useful.
CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil.
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Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet
420
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Posted - 2013.02.09 15:50:00 -
[98] - Quote
Zaknussem wrote: # The CPU will be cut down significantly. As some of you know, T1 industrials have more CPU than they know what to do with, which has led to Industrials becoming ECM boats and other somewhat bizarro fittings. From what I remember, this was part of some old plan of CCP's to give Industrials a secondary role involving some CPU-intensive module that I can't remember the name of right now.
Take a look at the Industrial Core used in the Rorqual for a hint on the original plan for the Industrials.
Module(s) that would allow various industrial activities like refining, compressing or even building stuff directly in a ship.
It's the reason why they are named 'Industrials' in the first place.
However someone had other ideas and that functionality got moved to POSes.
Leaving the Industrial class of ships with a strange name and too much CPU.
CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil.
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cheese monkey
Peniz inc...
102
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Posted - 2013.02.09 17:06:00 -
[99] - Quote
OP went about this post in the wrong way.
He has a point tho.
I used to be proud that I had 130m SP... after this patch that isnt going to mean much!
Freighter can be flown within a week of signing up! Capital ships only needing BS lvl 4?!
CCP please give us a ship that is massive esoteric then! I want a ship that needs all racial Cruiser, BC and BS to lvl 5!! |
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1091
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Posted - 2013.02.09 17:09:00 -
[100] - Quote
I feel good knowing I'm not bitter enough to get mad, because they shortened skills I already trained. Having newbies rush into ships they aren't equipped for isn't always a bad thing. Its a good lesson to be learned. |
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RubyPorto
Sniggwaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2627
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Posted - 2013.02.09 20:06:00 -
[101] - Quote
cheese monkey wrote:OP went about this post in the wrong way.
He has a point tho.
I used to be proud that I had 130m SP... after this patch that isnt going to mean much!
Freighter can be flown within a week of signing up! Capital ships only needing BS lvl 4?!
CCP please give us a ship that is massive esoteric then! I want a ship that needs all racial Cruiser, BC and BS to lvl 5!!
How do you get Advanced Spaceship Command 5 in a week?
You know, actually reading the devblog, while it could count as work, protects you from looking like a complete whining idiot. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
Tarn Kugisa
Infinite Covenant Tribal Band
383
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Posted - 2013.02.09 20:52:00 -
[102] - Quote
I just like how they lowered the Battleship skill requirements on capitals. Although since the revisions are due for summer, I still feel kinda let down that I trained Caldari BS to 5. Not like it's not helping anything having it at 5. At least now I can get into the other capitals easier once I have the generic support skills. I Endorse this Product and/or Service EVE Online Battle Recorder When I press F1 I get ISK |
Keko Khaan
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
112
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Posted - 2013.02.10 03:13:00 -
[103] - Quote
Atomic Virulent wrote:In the upcoming expansion, there are some serious issues that can only be reconciled with free skillpoints or PLEX.
The 2 big ones.. Iteron V is/was 24d to skill for. It will be reduced to 33 minutes.. MINUTES! That's brand new noob, to ITTY V in THIRTY THREE MINUTES! This has the value of nearly an entire month of game time.
Second, the Orca is going from 40+d down to 17 days. This is unacceptable. The thought that some troll can spend his 14-day trial and be up to par with seasoned vets who spent over a month skilling is just atrocious.
WTF is this.. World of Warcraft?
Well tbh itty V is OP anyways.. So balanced they should as itty V has been best t1 industrial for like ever?
Alltho i do understand your point about getting itty V in half hour.. Another thing is how much cargospace itty V has at lvl1 with t1 modules and no rigs.. Its bit funny anyways that these t1 industrials have different requirements.. Like mammoth vs itty V for example you need currently lvl4 for mammoth and you need lvl5 for itty5.. Isnt that bit weird... |
Revajin
15 Minute Outliers Novus Dominatum
79
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Posted - 2013.02.10 03:26:00 -
[104] - Quote
I think the real topic here is whether or not Iteron I-IV even matter anymore and did they ever? I don't do much hauling but is there even a point to the smaller ships once you hit Itty V? |
Rian Kurr
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2013.02.10 03:38:00 -
[105] - Quote
Basically I think its time for new bath water in the whole game.....baby is looking a bit wrinkled after 10 years..... Point ....you played eve for a monthly fee and enjoyed it....You got what you payed for at the time.....
One thing I would ask that CCP not piece meal things together. I would say put together whole modern game, good mechanics and all. Including something for everyone...new and old. Keep us in the loop ...
Joke not a troll....Rollout........ Lets have New Eve and Classic Eve.....? For new eve: The Jovians rend the whole universe in a dragon shaped ship .....and it can be called Cata...wait been done....hmm maybe keep classic eve and update it on the fly.... maybe give panda shaped transport ships,Battleships etc. out to all the old players as compensation.....limited edition thingy ....will keep everyone happy.....then again maybe I have had too much to drink.....Fly safe... |
Yuki Shin-Jan
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.02.10 03:43:00 -
[106] - Quote
Bit outdated, I've been working on an itty 5 and to go from 4 to 5 was 13days. That is with +4 implants. |
Mihnea Tepes
Astral Silence Adult Entertainment Alliance
0
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Posted - 2013.02.10 11:12:00 -
[107] - Quote
The point is, that skilling costs time, time costs plex, plex costs money
so considering the fact, that Orca, which supposed to be capital ship, can be trained in two weeks, instead of 1 and half month ... itty5 is from almost one month to 33m ... and so on
in my eyes I lost lots of money and I am not ok with it
I understand that that orca will not be able to give boosting, nothing than hauling, but its still the question of principle and i can continue with more ships, when i needed to train like idiot to lvl5
lets make everything available to fly in few minutes for new players, maybe they will buy plexes to buy these ships ... |
Ptraci
Militaris Industries Northern Coalition.
1240
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Posted - 2013.02.10 11:21:00 -
[108] - Quote
OP, you are not thinking correctly. Think of all the crap fit/unfit itty V's and PLEX bought orcas that will be floating around just waiting to be ganked introducing the newbs to the concept of "pay to win" in EVE means you pay CCP and CCP wins... |
RubyPorto
Sniggwaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2644
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Posted - 2013.02.10 11:28:00 -
[109] - Quote
Mihnea Tepes wrote:The point is, that skilling costs time, time costs plex, plex costs money
so considering the fact, that Orca, which supposed to be capital ship, can be trained in two weeks, instead of 1 and half month ... itty5 is from almost one month to 33m ... and so on
in my eyes I lost lots of money and I am not ok with it
So... all of a sudden those skills you trained have no value?
In what way did you lose anything? This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
Mihnea Tepes
Astral Silence Adult Entertainment Alliance
0
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Posted - 2013.02.10 11:54:00 -
[110] - Quote
RubyPorto, point is that I could use this time to skill something other, this is a big thing ... lets say I wanted to have an orca just for hauling, cause boosting is provided by other players ... can you see the diference?
ability to fly capital ship in few weeks as they are planning it, thats just a fail |
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Kate stark
46
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Posted - 2013.02.10 11:58:00 -
[111] - Quote
Mihnea Tepes wrote:RubyPorto, point is that I could use this time to skill something other, this is a big thing ... lets say I wanted to have an orca just for hauling, cause boosting is provided by other players ... can you see the diference?
ability to fly capital ship in few weeks as they are planning it, thats just a fail
if you wanted something for just hauling, you should have perhaps trained a ship for hauling like, say, a freighter? |
Arduemont
Tempest Legion
1188
|
Posted - 2013.02.10 12:01:00 -
[112] - Quote
People in this thread are misunderstanding the changes to a whole new level. I would have thought that you people would actually try and read and understand the proposed changes before going ape **** over them.
These skill changes can literally only be viewed as a good thing. These n00bs your talking about who will be able to get in an Itty in 33 minutes will have such **** skills that their Itty might as well be a different ship to yours. You are not losing any skill training time, all those skills you skilled up have uses and functions and do stuff.. these newbs your talking about wont have these skills. I don't really see what your problem is. "In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." |
Kate stark
46
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Posted - 2013.02.10 12:06:00 -
[113] - Quote
Arduemont wrote:People in this thread are misunderstanding the changes to a whole new level. I would have thought that you people would actually try and read and understand the proposed changes before going ape **** over them.
These skill changes can literally only be viewed as a good thing. These n00bs your talking about who will be able to get in an Itty in 33 minutes will have such **** skills that their Itty might as well be a different ship to yours. You are not losing any skill training time, all those skills you skilled up have uses and functions and do stuff.. these newbs your talking about wont have these skills. I don't really see what your problem is.
This change has been a long time overdo and frankly there are a lot of people who will be very very happy about them. So examine your imaginary problems, realise they are imaginary, and then stop complaining.
consider the following: a player trains minmatar industrial to IV or V to get ~27k m3 cargo space in a mammoth. a new player comes along and trains gallente industrial to I and gets >30k (iirc) cargo space.
that's probably why people are upset, to be blunt. |
RubyPorto
Sniggwaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2644
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Posted - 2013.02.10 12:19:00 -
[114] - Quote
Mihnea Tepes wrote:RubyPorto, point is that I could use this time to skill something other, this is a big thing ... lets say I wanted to have an orca just for hauling, cause boosting is provided by other players ... can you see the diference?
ability to fly capital ship in few weeks as they are planning it, thats just a fail
No, you couldn't have. Not if you want the Orca to haul at any time before May. Especially considering the Orca's role as a Hauler recently took a big heavy nerf bat to the balls.
I've got an alt that trained an Orca specifically for Corp Hangar hauling. I no longer own an Orca, as the mechanic I used to great effect while it was available is no longer available. I don't have any problem with it, because I understand the concept of Sunk Cost.
You Trained to gain the use of an Orca at the time your training completed, correct? You got the use of the Orca that you trained for from the time you completed training until now, correct? You will continue to have the use of the Orca that you trained for after may, correct?
What effect does a change in what other people have to train to fly an Orca starting in may have on you?
It's the Learning skill removal ISK refund whine all over again. :Cripes:
You can complain about it being a "Capital" ship all you want, but it really isn't one. Doesn't Require Capital Ships, can't fit capital modules, doesn't even require Advanced Spaceship Command. Nowhere in its description does it say that it is a Capital ship. It is an Industrial Command Ship. And what you call it is entirely irrelevant to the discussion of your inability to understand Sunk Costs. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
RubyPorto
Sniggwaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2644
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Posted - 2013.02.10 12:21:00 -
[115] - Quote
Kate stark wrote:consider the following: a player trains minmatar industrial to IV or V to get ~27k m3 cargo space in a mammoth. a new player comes along and trains gallente industrial to I and gets >30k (iirc) cargo space.
that's probably why people are upset, to be blunt.
Consider the following:
That's probably why I no longer believe in the myth of the Literate EVE playerbase. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
Arduemont
Tempest Legion
1188
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Posted - 2013.02.10 12:23:00 -
[116] - Quote
Kate stark wrote:Arduemont wrote:People in this thread are misunderstanding the changes to a whole new level. I would have thought that you people would actually try and read and understand the proposed changes before going ape **** over them.
These skill changes can literally only be viewed as a good thing. These n00bs your talking about who will be able to get in an Itty in 33 minutes will have such **** skills that their Itty might as well be a different ship to yours. You are not losing any skill training time, all those skills you skilled up have uses and functions and do stuff.. these newbs your talking about wont have these skills. I don't really see what your problem is.
This change has been a long time overdo and frankly there are a lot of people who will be very very happy about them. So examine your imaginary problems, realise they are imaginary, and then stop complaining. consider the following: a player trains minmatar industrial to IV or V to get ~27k m3 cargo space in a mammoth. a new player comes along and trains gallente industrial to I and gets >30k (iirc) cargo space. that's probably why people are upset, to be blunt.
A couple of points.
- From what source are you getting the fact that their cargo space is getting buffed? - If they are getting buffed, and someone with Indy 1 now gets more than the others did before with max skills, then the people with max skills will be getting a massive massive buff to the size of their cargohold. So what they hell are they complaining for?
"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." |
Kate stark
46
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Posted - 2013.02.10 12:26:00 -
[117] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Kate stark wrote:consider the following: a player trains minmatar industrial to IV or V to get ~27k m3 cargo space in a mammoth. a new player comes along and trains gallente industrial to I and gets >30k (iirc) cargo space.
that's probably why people are upset, to be blunt. Consider the following: That's probably why I no longer believe in the myth of the Literate EVE playerbase.
i'm well aware that they're rebalancing them, that's why i'm not crying about it. i was just pointing out why others were. that, and the fact we have no other stats to go on except what's currently on tq. |
Kate stark
46
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Posted - 2013.02.10 12:27:00 -
[118] - Quote
Arduemont wrote:Kate stark wrote:Arduemont wrote:People in this thread are misunderstanding the changes to a whole new level. I would have thought that you people would actually try and read and understand the proposed changes before going ape **** over them.
These skill changes can literally only be viewed as a good thing. These n00bs your talking about who will be able to get in an Itty in 33 minutes will have such **** skills that their Itty might as well be a different ship to yours. You are not losing any skill training time, all those skills you skilled up have uses and functions and do stuff.. these newbs your talking about wont have these skills. I don't really see what your problem is.
This change has been a long time overdo and frankly there are a lot of people who will be very very happy about them. So examine your imaginary problems, realise they are imaginary, and then stop complaining. consider the following: a player trains minmatar industrial to IV or V to get ~27k m3 cargo space in a mammoth. a new player comes along and trains gallente industrial to I and gets >30k (iirc) cargo space. that's probably why people are upset, to be blunt. A couple of points. - From what source are you getting the fact that their cargo space is getting buffed? - If they are getting buffed, and someone with Indy 1 now gets more than the others did before with max skills, then the people with max skills will be getting a massive massive buff to the size of their cargohold. So what they hell are they complaining for?
what are you talking about? 30k is what the itty V will have at industrial I with cargo modules, that's not a buff that's just what it is. again, they aren't getting buffed, that's just what it is. |
Arduemont
Tempest Legion
1188
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Posted - 2013.02.10 12:30:00 -
[119] - Quote
Kate stark wrote: consider the following: a player trains minmatar industrial to IV or V to get ~27k m3 cargo space in a mammoth. a new player comes along and trains gallente industrial to I and gets >30k (iirc) cargo space.
that's probably why people are upset, to be blunt.
Kate stark wrote: what are you talking about? 30k is what the itty V will have at industrial I with cargo modules, that's not a buff that's just what it is. again, they aren't getting buffed, that's just what it is.
Your original post was not clear enough to put forward the point you just put forward there, which is why I misunderstood. As for your concern about the Itty V, all haulers are being changed for tieracide and they are all going to be as useful as each other but with specialisation. So that concern is ultimately unfounded. "In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." |
Mihnea Tepes
Astral Silence Adult Entertainment Alliance
0
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Posted - 2013.02.10 12:43:00 -
[120] - Quote
system on its own was working, to be honest I can see no reason to change it ...
in that case there is no need for Itty1-4 (except of building t2 ships) and no, its wasting of my time, my skilling queue and irritating in general ... and ccp is trying to be populist to get more new players with flying ships fast |
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