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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3588
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Posted - 2013.02.20 18:01:00 -
[61] - Quote
Quote:This value is not, and was never intended to, act as a replacement mechanism for viewing distant markets within game.
Quote:When you find items with wildly out-of-whack price v. estimate values, I'm stuck trying to figure if it's bad code, or bad implementation of an idea, or if CCP is deliberately trolling the estimates.
Prices are local, estimates ought to be local. Indeed, in other respects, your financial capabilities are range-limited (depending on skills)... So why not the estimates, too? Wildly out of whack average values merely reflect (accurately) ongoing market maniupulation. This is not an unusual occurance in EvE. Even if your information was from the local market hub, if the manipulation was occuring in that location your results would be just as skewed, if not more so.
If anything, that price being so far off from your average local price tells you that somewhere there is a market well worth investigating. You just need to figure out where it is, and try not to get ripped off in the process.
You need to keep two things in mind.
This data is not only used to give you an idea of how much the item is worth. A number of other game mechanics use this information and need to be a global average as this makes it much more difficult to manipulate the prices in a significant way on most items.
CCP has no way of knowing where you are going to sell those goods, so local pricing would likely cause more hate and discontent from players than the current system by a large margin. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Xearal
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
486
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Posted - 2013.02.20 18:10:00 -
[62] - Quote
I find the feature to be highly usefull when moving things.. Yes, it's not exactly accurate, but it's not meant to be, it's an estimated price. It gives me a good ballpark figure of what something is worth, for some items, the price will be quite 'out of whack' probably due to small amounts being sold or manipulations going on. For Bulk items, it's a very accurate estimate and gives you a good idea what price to look for to sell it.
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neo smith
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
20
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Posted - 2013.02.20 18:15:00 -
[63] - Quote
im also with those that like it . i find it usefull when out exploring and deciding when to head back to high and sell. better that getting calculator out |
Mr Ignitious
Red Federation
8
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Posted - 2013.02.20 18:27:00 -
[64] - Quote
mechtech wrote:baltec1 wrote:Its the average across EVE, its not ment to be accurate. They really just should hardcode it in to use the 4-4 price if at all possible.
That would be dumb. While a huge portion of all sales go on in jita and jita has become the player designated main trade hub, CCP has never influenced what systems are trade hubs. Hardcoding in jita as what items is worth means that if we as players ever want to no longer use jita then CCP have wasted their time.
If the estimated value thing wants to be misleading, then let it. Maybe it'll bait some noobs into make a mistake. We didn't need it before, we'll get along just fine ignoring it. |
Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
199
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Posted - 2013.02.20 20:05:00 -
[65] - Quote
It should take into account all transaction in the 5 main hub for the last week.
but I guess the cost of it would be too great. |
Joran Dravius
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
121
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Posted - 2013.02.20 21:19:00 -
[66] - Quote
silens vesica wrote:Agreed that it's often misleading, sometimes outright false. Dump it for now. The other day it told me a ~60k piece of loot was worth over a mil. I wish I was making that up. I agree. They should either fix it or get rid of it. The "lowest price in the region" section of the market is almost always wrong too. |
Sir Substance
Quantum Triplines
579
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Posted - 2013.02.20 21:36:00 -
[67] - Quote
Halete wrote:As said, it's extremely useful in Wormholes. It's much handier to get a rough idea of a price on the fly than to log in a trading alt.
Your head may actually explode when I show you eve-marketdata. Ishtar Starfire: As a pure caldari pilot i feel that with the deployment of the new tier 3 battlecruisers you have given an unfair advantage to everyone except caldari pilots. an example would be like giving a fat kid a whole cake while the skinny kid has to watch and get nothing.
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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3603
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Posted - 2013.02.20 21:38:00 -
[68] - Quote
Joran Dravius wrote:silens vesica wrote:Agreed that it's often misleading, sometimes outright false. Dump it for now. The other day it told me a ~60k piece of loot was worth over a mil. I wish I was making that up. I agree. They should either fix it or get rid of it. The "lowest price in the region" section of the market is almost always wrong too. It has just told you that somewhere in EvE that item is or has recently been sold for a significantly higher value than normal (whether thru manipulation or a successful scam, or a simple error)... and you want to throw that information away a broken. It's good information to know, potentially something you could cash in on (or get ripped off by). You are simply misunderstanding what the information represents. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3603
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Posted - 2013.02.20 21:42:00 -
[69] - Quote
Sir Substance wrote:Halete wrote:As said, it's extremely useful in Wormholes. It's much handier to get a rough idea of a price on the fly than to log in a trading alt. Your head may actually explode when I show you eve-marketdata. This is the sort of tool you should use if you need a detailed analysis of market value, and is an example of using the right tool for the job. The EvE wide average that you are provided with in game in not intended to take the place of a tool like this. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
790
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Posted - 2013.02.20 22:02:00 -
[70] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:Joran Dravius wrote:silens vesica wrote:Agreed that it's often misleading, sometimes outright false. Dump it for now. The other day it told me a ~60k piece of loot was worth over a mil. I wish I was making that up. I agree. They should either fix it or get rid of it. The "lowest price in the region" section of the market is almost always wrong too. It has just told you that somewhere in EvE that item is or has recently been sold for a significantly higher value than normal (whether thru manipulation or a successful scam, or a simple error)... and you want to throw that information away as broken. It's good information to know, potentially something you could cash in on (or get ripped off by). You are simply misunderstanding what the information represents. That piece of 'information' isn't actually information. Its a datum which is of little value absent other information which you probably won't have - Like where that inflated price was paid. In short, it's not data; it's an anecdote.
Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |
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Eram Fidard
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
33
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Posted - 2013.02.20 22:59:00 -
[71] - Quote
A little something for those inclined to post these things...
http://imgur.com/NOTa2Pf
p.s. I'm terrible at flow charts, I know, but not as terrible as this posting... |
Remiel Pollard
Intergalactic Trade and Harm
1361
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 23:04:00 -
[72] - Quote
I find the estimated price feature very useful. If I'm hauling loot, I can check its local market value compared to the estimated price to determine whether or not I sell, reprocess for ore, or take it somewhere else if I can be bothered. You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
2293
|
Posted - 2013.02.20 23:10:00 -
[73] - Quote
Eram Fidard wrote:A little something for those inclined to post these things... http://imgur.com/NOTa2Pfp.s. I'm terrible at flow charts, I know, but not as terrible as this posting...
This is the most informative thing i have even seen on these forums. You sir have won the forums. +100. Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |
Styth spiting
Ion Corp. NightSong Directorate
287
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Posted - 2013.02.20 23:58:00 -
[74] - Quote
Gryphon Infinite wrote: The estimated price, when you hover over an inventory item, is pretty pointless right now. Many discussions throughout the past have talked about it, and have verified that it isn't working properly.
You're complaining how an estimated price of an item is not an accurate price based on what you determine to be the accurate price?
An estimate is simply a generalized value based on, in this case the price of an item over a period of time and throughout the Eve universe. It should be used to only give you a general idea of an items value, which is exactly what it was intended to be. New players can easily see that an an item they just looted is worth far more isk then what it is currently being bought for in their region, and helps players who do not use 3rd party tools know what the over all value of an item has been on average though the universe, not just their region or just Jita..
Gryphon Infinite wrote: Please just disable it for now, it literally doesn't do much, and is an annoyance.
You cannot simply ignore the number in the bottom right corner? Does this value being displayed somehow directly affect you're ability to play the game or cause additional steps for you?
Gryphon Infinite wrote: With more effort, make this price just reflect like the cheapest buy order in the region / constellation / system / etc.
That would be just silly and would make the feature completely useless. The point of the estimated price is so players know what other players have been overall buying or selling the item at over time. Showing prices based on region/system would give far more inaccurate results then the current system. That and you know, if you want to view the regional price just right click > view market data.
I'm guessing this is less of a "This game mechanic is broken and stupid and smells bad" and more about how you're pissed that players are now going out of the regions of space you have buy orders setup for considerably less then the average market value and are unwilling to adapt to how players who are now more informed about the value of the items they are selling. |
Bane Veradun
Black Sun Dawning
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 00:00:00 -
[75] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Its the average across EVE, its not ment to be accurate.
Then it is useless, and therefore needs to be removed until it can become more accurate. If this is not possible, then we can do without it. Eve players have managed pretty well without it before, we'll survive without it. While you only co-opt the darkness for your petty purposes, I was borne of the darkness. |
Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
1163
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 00:25:00 -
[76] - Quote
Gryphon Infinite wrote:The estimated price, when you hover over an inventory item, is pretty pointless right now. Many discussions throughout the past have talked about it, and have verified that it isn't working properly.
Please just disable it for now, it literally doesn't do much, and is an annoyance.
OR
With more effort, make this price just reflect like the cheapest buy order in the region / constellation / system / etc.
Hope to hear everyone's feedback on this phenomena and my idea.
If you don't like it you know you could always just like, I dunno, ignore it. And then the people who do seem to like it could not ignore it. |
silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
795
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 00:28:00 -
[77] - Quote
Eram Fidard wrote:A little something for those inclined to post these things... http://imgur.com/NOTa2Pfp.s. I'm terrible at flow charts, I know, but not as terrible as this posting... Crap. Time to roll up my tent and go home.
Or not.
Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |
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ISD Tyrozan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
29
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Posted - 2013.02.21 00:42:00 -
[78] - Quote
Topic moved from General Discussion to Features and Idea forum. ISD Tyrozan Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
956
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 03:42:00 -
[79] - Quote
Sir Substance wrote:It makes far more sense to make it work rather then scrap it.
Just link it to Jita averages. Ta-da! Done.
I mean, that's what we all compare everything to anyway... CCP may as well run with it.
EvE Forum Bingo |
Sir Substance
Quantum Triplines
583
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 05:33:00 -
[80] - Quote
Katran Luftschreck wrote:Sir Substance wrote:It makes far more sense to make it work rather then scrap it. Just link it to Jita averages. Ta-da! Done. I mean, that's what we all compare everything to anyway... CCP may as well run with it. You didn't read the thread. We can all tell. Ishtar Starfire: As a pure caldari pilot i feel that with the deployment of the new tier 3 battlecruisers you have given an unfair advantage to everyone except caldari pilots. an example would be like giving a fat kid a whole cake while the skinny kid has to watch and get nothing.
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Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
960
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Posted - 2013.02.21 11:11:00 -
[81] - Quote
Sir Substance wrote:You didn't read the thread. We can all tell.
You're right! In fact, I hardly ever read an entire thread. I read the OP and skip to responding to the OP. Why? Because I know that everything between the OP and my own will be nothing but trolling, so why bother?
Go ahead, try to tell me I'm wrong.
EvE Forum Bingo |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14154
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 11:16:00 -
[82] - Quote
Katran Luftschreck wrote:Sir Substance wrote:You didn't read the thread. We can all tell. You're right! In fact, I hardly ever read an entire thread. I read the OP and skip to responding to the OP. Why? Because I know that everything between the OP and my own will be nothing but trolling, so why bother? Go ahead, try to tell me I'm wrong. You are wrong. Reading the thread would tell you that.
As far as the OP is concerned, I agree with the majority in the thread. It works rather well as is and nothing makes you use it. If you wish to use, say Jita prices as a guide, then have an alt parked there.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |
Reiisha
Evolution The Retirement Club
231
|
Posted - 2013.02.21 14:32:00 -
[83] - Quote
Irya Boone wrote:It could be More accurate , more usefull if
The system admit the existence of Hubs ( jita, rens , hek , amarr ,dodixie) And set the estimated Price on the Top buy order in the NEAREST hub from You as simple as it. or more simple Choose only one HUB .. you know which one i'm talking about and set the estimated price on the top buyer order.
Simple simple like a GM said : i'm sure it's only one Line code....
That's only for people who can't be bothered to a) move stuff and b) have patience.
Selling stuff outside of hubs can be very profitable.
And still, as other people have said, the feature it's meant to give an exact price, but a ballpark figure, and in this regard it works perfectly.
If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all... |
Ya Huei
Imperial Collective
100
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Posted - 2013.02.21 15:54:00 -
[84] - Quote
You can copy and paste your inventory listing to google docs these days. From there on u can use API calls to eve-central for instance to pull up all sorts of pricing information.
If you're too lazy to spend some time to set this up, you probably aren't using this stuff for anything important anyway and shouldn't be whining on the forums about it in the first place.
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Jalequin
StarHunt
7
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Posted - 2013.02.21 17:06:00 -
[85] - Quote
Removing this feature would make it more difficult for people to know the rough average worth of their item stack. Currently you only need to hover over it, removing it would mean you need to right-click view market to see the worth. More clicks for the same result.
What we do need is a way to sort them by stack worth. Better yet, have settings to allow us to see the highest buy order or lowest sell order if we wish.
Ya Huei wrote:You can copy and paste your inventory listing to google docs these days. From there on u can use API calls to eve-central for instance to pull up all sorts of pricing information.
If you're too lazy to spend some time to set this up, you probably aren't using this stuff for anything important anyway and shouldn't be whining on the forums about it in the first place.
I'm interested in this, link please. The hot tub is cool now, but they poisoned it. Then they started clapping for the mad cow until someone sold him. When they died, they had him stuffed -like that water buffalo, stuffed-. |
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