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Drennon Nas
Wabbit Fabbit Industries Beacon Light Alliance
0
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Posted - 2011.10.13 08:25:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'm trying to decide what race I want to train advanced cruisers for.
Which is race best for pve? which race is best for pvp? Which race would be better to train for to be able to easily pvp/pve interchangeably?
I'm a newish player, and I've heard that the caldari's the best for pve due to the tengu and basilisk. I know amarr has the curse and guardian. Is the legion any good? Minmatar has the loki... and what else is worth using? I've heard the Ishtar was a great drone boat for galentte. Do they have anything else worth looking at? |
Sven Hammerstorm
Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.13 08:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
PvE - Caldari for the tengu. Also works fine for pvp. As for pure pvp, all the other races have good options. Virtually every recon ship is worth flying. Having recon V and all cruisers V offers some very good choices |
Salvia Olima
Carnivale. Merciless.
6
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Posted - 2011.10.13 09:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
I recommend Caldari/Minmatar.
Tengu simply rules above all other T3, capstable 100MN AB is awesome both for PvE and PvP, (in nullsec I mean) while Loki is one of the most versatile T3, from solo hunter to sniper or brawler, lots and lots of good setups available. Basilisks are used more often these days then in the past. Passive shield tanking skills come very useful in PvP, so whether you fly Drakes or Vagabond/Cynabal every sp you invested in it pays off. Huginns are welcome in most roaming gangs.
Gallente shines in the capital range, unknown how the hybrid unnerf will affect it. Legion is not very good, Zealot/Guardian is king only in AHAC-gangs, Curse.. maybe in lowsec, not seen a single one in nullsec in the past few months. Also, it is nearly always called primary, which is bad on an empty stomach. |
Shayla Sh'inlux
Eve Space Exploration Guild
2
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Posted - 2011.10.13 09:11:00 -
[4] - Quote
Quote: Which is race best for pve?
Caldari. Tengu.
Quote: which race is best for pvp?
Winmatar
Quote: Which race would be better to train for to be able to easily pvp/pve interchangeably?
Probably Amarr. Although Tengu/Drake are decent at PvP too. And Cane/Sleip are just fine for PvE as well. |
Mocam
EVE University Ivy League
27
|
Posted - 2011.10.13 09:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
Drennon Nas wrote:I'm trying to decide what race I want to train advanced cruisers for.
Which is race best for pve? which race is best for pvp? Which race would be better to train for to be able to easily pvp/pve interchangeably?
I'm a newish player, and I've heard that the caldari's the best for pve due to the tengu and basilisk. I know amarr has the curse and guardian. Is the legion any good? Minmatar has the loki... and what else is worth using? I've heard the Ishtar was a great drone boat for galentte. Do they have anything else worth looking at?
Quite an open ended question with a hell of a lot of opinion involved in answering it.
I'll touch on them a bit but understand - everyone is going to think this or that ship "sucks" or "is good" or "is best". All of them tend to see a good deal of use.
Logistics - Guardian (Amarr) - best for a group of logistics backing up armor tanked ships. Basalisk (Caldari) - best for group of logistics backing up shield tanked ships. Scimitar (Minmatar) - best for a single logistics to back up a small gang of shield tanked ships. Oneiros (Gallente) - arguably the worst - best for a single logistics to back up a small gang of armor tanked ships.
The last 2 pretty much require logistics 5 training to use them well. They aren't that difficult to get cap stable which the first 2 don't do easily at all. They also do not get energy transfer bonuses vs the first 2 - so Amarr and Caldari ships, in teams, can exceed 'cap stable' and actually provide extra energy to others in a fleet. *IF* they have other logi there to share energy transfers with.
What type of support would you like to provide if you flew one?
HIC's - All are decent - Onyx seems to be one of the most popular but they all can get the job done well.
Role is heavy tackler from hell. They tend to pack battleship level tank on a cruiser hull so can take a healthy beating - especially being as battleship class weapons don't hit them all that decently.
In highsec and lowsec, they use a script to turn their bubbles into beams that can tackle any ship in the game - from a titan to a deep space transport. The only way to break the tackle is to get outside their range or make them stop using the device - kill it or neut it.
In nullsec they are moving bubbles that only T3's can "ignore" by fitting a special sub-system. Nothing else can warp out of that bubble and it surrounds the ship which can fly around a bit - albeit slowly.
HAC's - a lot of variances here. Mass opinions. These are the damage dealing cruiser class ships.
I suppose you'd want to look at the "weakest" ones but all of them are decent. Minmater - Munnin is less popular than the Vagabond It's bonuses are to optimal range vs the vaga being falloff. Projectiles tend to "live in" falloff and the minmatar ships are about speed - the vaga also gets a speed bonus.
Gallente - Demios is less popular than the Ishtar The Demios is a gun ship - primarily blaster fit. As such it needs to be up close and personal to do it's task and... "hybrids have issues". The Ishtar is a drone boat - solid drone skills and it shines like any drone boat can/will. It can also field a full flight of 5 sentry drones (battleship class weaponry).
Caldari - Eagle is less popular than the Cererbus. Eagle is a hybrid gun ship. Hybrids have issues and Caldari tend to avoid guns over missile skills. Cererbus is a missile ship - Caldari? Yeah. Cererbus is more popular.
Amarr - no clue really. I hear good things and mutters about both.
T3's - Expensive compared to the other options but - In order of popularity: Caldari Tengu - top contender for "best PvE' ship in the game. Also used in PvP but less popular than other options. Minmatar Loki - can do decently at PvE but PvP it does seem to shine better. Booster fits seem common but DPS use from them is also popular. Fast, agile and able to do the usual "flexibility" gig.
Almost a toss up on which is thought less of - Legion or Proteus. Armor tends to be less popular in these smaller mid-sized ship classes. They tend to be far less agile and lacking in the GTFO ability.
Amarr Legion - but the Legion is a nice ship for armor HAC gangs. It can do PvE well but tends to be a bit slow for most folks tastes in PvP. Proteus - Hard to get solid tank and good DPS on it. Armor tanked makes it less agile but it can show some serious damage numbers *IF* it can get in blaster range.
Recon's - All are thought well of by their pilots. The Curse and Pilgrim are held in fairly high esteme due to their abilities at soloing. If it's soloing you are into - they may be your best options but all of them work very nicely in the right types of gangs.
Again, a hell of a lot of opinion in how this stuff works out. "Best" is often more aligned to your style of play and which ship fits it. Trying to solo the world? Like "in your face" or "long range"? Into Support style stuff - command or repair? ...
Don't ignore one just because it's not as popular as another. Figure out your style and find the one (or ones) that fit(s). |
Jill Antaris
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
5
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Posted - 2011.10.13 09:24:00 -
[6] - Quote
Amarr:
Zealot: Very good at bigger gangs, ok in some more tanky fits for small gang stuff. Can be used for med range armor HAC gangs.
Sacrilege: Outside of 1o1 not really good, even then it is a close range HAC, what makes it kind of limited in eve.
Curse\Pilgrim: Good for gangs/solo. Basically the most offensive recons out there, by the ability to shut down movement/dps/active tanks with neuts.
Legion: More tanky Zealot for PVE with Lasers, not to bad, noting really awesome. Works ok as heavy HAM brawler in solo/small gang pvp if you are into expensive fits and imps. Also works as super tanked curse to cap out capitals.
Gallente:
Diemost: Terrible.
Ishtar: Like a cruiser sized domi, very flexible for PVE. Ok ship for small gang pvp.
Lachesis\Arazu: Long range scram with a heavy shield tank for gate camping under sentry agro or long range gang tackler. The arazu is basically a cloak with a long point, weak tank, the ability to stop a single slow target from shooting you and terrible cap and dps issues, making it more or less meh for solo.
Proteus: Cloaky long range point with ok dps or EHP brick with ok dps. Ok for small gang/solo not really useful for other stuff.
Caldari:
Cerberus: Extreme long range missile ship, works as support/anti support ship in big gangs(vs Falcons and stuff). For any thing else a drake a cheaper and more effective.
Eagle: Terrible.
Rook\Falcon: Because of Falcon, excellent small to med gang support ships.
Tengu: Excellent at PVE by combining the gank of a CM raven with a much better tank and the ability to deal more damage against small hulls and a massive range. Can be used similar to the HAM Legion for PVP, but got a lot more range.
Minmatar
Vagabound: Pretty much the solo skirmish hac, high speed, range, ok DPS. A weak capacitor is his main drawback, beside nearly everybody in it is terrible at flying it.
Muninn: Like a Zealot, but more flexible and with more alpha as a trade off for DPS as long range HAC.
Huginn/Rapier: Solid support ships, mostly used for long range webs and quite effective against most nano setups. Have not seen so much rapiers since the nano age.
Loki: Super tanked huginn for fleet pvp or super rupture for solo/small gang. It is ok for PVE, similar to the legion, however it is a pain to get a tanked arti setup working with the ac subs(that give you a lot more dps because of her extra drones) and you need tons of ammo for the ac setups. |
Drennon Nas
Wabbit Fabbit Industries Beacon Light Alliance
0
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Posted - 2011.10.13 10:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
I just want to say thank you for the educated in depth responses. You've been very helpful. |
Captain Nares
O3 Corporation
3
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Posted - 2011.10.13 14:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
Best PvE SC - Tengu. Best PvP SC - Tengu.
The only problem is that it is going to be nerfed over some time (next 10 years probably)
I have all lvl5 Loki and what can I say about it:
PvE - much worse than Tengu. PvP - much less interesting to fly than Cynabal and much more xpencive than Huginn/Rapier. |
Goose99
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
49
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Posted - 2011.10.13 15:26:00 -
[9] - Quote
Captain Nares wrote:Best PvE SC - Tengu. Best PvP SC - Tengu. The only problem is that it is going to be nerfed over some time (next 10 years probably) I have all lvl5 Loki and what can I say about it: PvE - much worse than Tengu. PvP - much less interesting to fly than Cynabal and much more xpencive than Huginn/Rapier.
Check your kb stats.
Most numerous t3: Tengu Least numerous t3: Proteus T3 most killed: Tengu T3 that get most kills: Proteus
Pve and pvp are different, undock moar |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
18
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Posted - 2011.10.13 19:35:00 -
[10] - Quote
Drennon Nas wrote:I'm trying to decide what race I want to train advanced cruisers for.
Winmatar yesterday, winmatar today, winmatar tomorrow and the days after. |
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Mfume Apocal
Origin. Black Legion.
25
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Posted - 2011.10.13 20:17:00 -
[11] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Check your kb stats.Most numerous t3: Tengu Least numerous t3: Proteus T3 most killed: Tengu T3 that get most kills: ProteusPve and pvp are different, undock moar
Quote:Top 20 Kills by Shiptype 1 Drake 76819 2 Hurricane 50394 3 Abaddon 23947 ... 11 Tengu 6728 |
Captain Nares
O3 Corporation
3
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Posted - 2011.10.13 23:04:00 -
[12] - Quote
Goose99 wrote: Check your kb stats.
1) Stats differ from KB to KB. Stats depend on KB owner. 2) After getting KB stats, you must interprete them properly.
Seems like you've failed at both points.
Btw, here are monthly top20 killers according to eve-kill:
RankShipsKills 1Drake79626 2Hurricane51451 3Abaddon26180 4Maelstrom20024 5Armageddon14584 6Tempest13030 7Scimitar10041 8Dramiel8337 9Zealot7843 10Hound6978 11Tengu6951 12Sabre6930 13Cynabal6694 14Rifter6391 15Rapier6259 16Vagabond6136 17Harbinger5618 18Manticore5581 19Capsule4822 20Loki4643 |
Tanya Powers
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
20
|
Posted - 2011.10.14 16:47:00 -
[13] - Quote
Captain Nares wrote:Goose99 wrote: Check your kb stats.
1) Stats differ from KB to KB. Stats depend on KB owner. 2) After getting KB stats, you must interprete them properly. Seems like you've failed at both points. Btw, here are monthly top20 killers according to eve-kill: RankShipsKills 1Drake79626 2Hurricane51451 3Abaddon26180 4Maelstrom20024 5Armageddon14584 6Tempest13030 7Scimitar10041 8Dramiel8337 9Zealot7843 10Hound6978 11Tengu695112Sabre6930 13Cynabal6694 14Rifter6391 15Rapier6259 16Vagabond6136 17Harbinger5618 18Manticore5581 19Capsule4822 20Loki4643
I'm looking for some Gallente ship but I can't see it, do you think I have some bug??
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JackStraw56
Bayesian Motion Knights of Tomorrow
12
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Posted - 2011.10.14 16:53:00 -
[14] - Quote
Tanya Powers wrote:I'm looking for some Gallente ship but I can't see it, do you think I have some bug??
Working as intended. |
Neo Rainhart
Guerilla Republik Excuses.
0
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Posted - 2011.10.14 17:17:00 -
[15] - Quote
Tanya Powers wrote:I'm looking for some Gallente ship but I can't see it, do you think I have some bug??
I'm sure you had too much PUDDI |
Cipher Jones
93
|
Posted - 2011.10.15 14:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
Captain Nares wrote:Goose99 wrote: Check your kb stats.
1) Stats differ from KB to KB. Stats depend on KB owner. 2) After getting KB stats, you must interprete them properly. Seems like you've failed at both points. Btw, here are monthly top20 killers according to eve-kill: RankShipsKills 1Drake79626 2Hurricane51451 3Abaddon26180 4Maelstrom20024 5Armageddon14584 6Tempest13030 7Scimitar10041 8Dramiel8337 9Zealot7843 10Hound6978 11Tengu695112Sabre6930 13Cynabal6694 14Rifter6391 15Rapier6259 16Vagabond6136 17Harbinger5618 18Manticore5581 19Capsule4822 20Loki4643
Hmm, so capsules kill more ships than loki's according to your information.
You have clearly done your research and are infallible.
See what happens when fat neckbeards try to ride little ponies? The ponies die. |
Mocam
EVE University Ivy League
33
|
Posted - 2011.10.16 00:39:00 -
[17] - Quote
Captain Nares wrote:Goose99 wrote: Check your kb stats.
1) Stats differ from KB to KB. Stats depend on KB owner. 2) After getting KB stats, you must interprete them properly. Seems like you've failed at both points. Btw, here are monthly top20 killers according to eve-kill: RankShipsKills 1Drake79626 2Hurricane51451 3Abaddon26180 4Maelstrom20024 5Armageddon14584 6Tempest13030 7Scimitar10041 8Dramiel8337 9Zealot7843 10Hound6978 11Tengu695112Sabre6930 13Cynabal6694 14Rifter6391 15Rapier6259 16Vagabond6136 17Harbinger5618 18Manticore5581 19Capsule4822 20Loki4643
I monitored that list for about 8 months - it changes around quite a bit.
Examples: - Tengu wasn't on it for a chunk of time then suddenly rose up very high as, I believe it was PL, stated to use gangs of them. - Melstrom was on their big many months back as the "alpha mael" was very popular. - Gallente ships show at times and other times don't.
FOTM style uses.
Another thing to look at is the WEAPONS used in kills - that gives a slightly different picture being as you'll often find hybrids in that list but few hybrid packing ships in the ships listing.
If a bit more looking is done, you'll get a better feel for the actual usage versus just hulls but that hulls list does help folks see what is currently popular for use. |
Songbird
16
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Posted - 2011.10.16 01:11:00 -
[18] - Quote
What do you mean you don't see gallente ships, all these capsules are all of gallente pilots !!! |
Mfume Apocal
Origin. Black Legion.
28
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Posted - 2011.10.16 06:04:00 -
[19] - Quote
Cipher Jones wrote:Hmm, so capsules kill more ships than loki's according to your information.
You have clearly done your research and are infallible.
You are at any point free to show us anything indicating that the Proteus has more kills than the Tengu. |
Zillam Reynardine
Red Soul Black Dream
0
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Posted - 2011.10.16 06:35:00 -
[20] - Quote
Ishtar is awesome for zzzz PVE. Jump into a pocket, turn on your tank, get [u]all[/b] of the aggro, drop sentries, orbit, come back in half an hour. Everything dead all around you.
I hear tell the Proteus makes for a good cloaked gankboat... since by the time someone is close enough to disrupt your cloak, they're close enough for you to facemelt with blasters. Plus, scrams out to ~15km.
Also, it's possible to 300k EHP buffertank a Proteus, if you just want to bore you foe into conceding the fight.
I PVE'd for a few months in both an Ishtar and a Blasteus. Both are pretty boring, but at least the Ishtar I could leave alone and it'd still explode things. Blasteus melts the hell out of cruisers and battleships, but can't hit frigates for anything (this is why you keep a bay full of hobs and hammers), and 7km shooting range means scooting around at 1.5km/s to get into range. |
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Theodoric Darkwind
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
28
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Posted - 2011.10.16 07:53:00 -
[21] - Quote
Ok for the who and what of T2/T3 cruisers.
Gallente: Diemost - thorax on roids, terrible ship Ishtar - cruiser size droneboat with BS size dronebay, can viably shield or armor tank, gila is still arguably better Lachesis/Arazu - loooonnnngggg point, in cloaky or tanky versions Phobos - worst hictor Onerios - worst logi, dont waste your time Proteus - some pvp use as a super heavy tackler or extreme close range damage dealing, can fit largest tank of the T3s but is still much worse than the loki or tengu.
Caldari: Eagle - moa on roids, terrible ship Cerberus - missile sniper, can make a good kiting missile boat, but a drake is better in most situations, also usable for shield incursion fleets. Falcon/Rook - ECM gods, in cloaky and tanky flavors, very nasty ships Onyx - hictor, decent, kinda like a tankier drake with a bubble Basilisk - the shield logi that needs cap transfers, good in large fleets and shield incursion fleets Tengu - best solo PvE ship in the game, also quite a nasty PvP boat, probably the most overpowered subcap in the game.
Minmatar: Munin - artillery sniper, VERY effective in medium size fleets Vagabond - fastest HAC, very nasty skirmish ship Rapier/Huginn - looonnngggg webs, in cloaky or tanky version Broadsword - arguably the best hictor, especially in shield fleets Scimitar - the shield logi that doesn't need cap transfers, good in any size fleet less vulnerable to ewar than basis Loki - probably the most versatile T3 cruiser, the only one that can shield or armor tank equally well, excellent PvE ship, probably the best T3 for PvP and very popular in incursion fleets (usually in armor tanked web bonused version)
Amarr: Zealot - best HAC in the game, the standard "armor hac" in PvP fleets, also VERY popular in armor incursion fleets and WH fleets Sacrelige - armor tanked short range missile boat, not one of the better hacs out there. Pilgrim/Curse - very nasty neut boats can cap out almost anything, in cloaky and tanky versions Guardian - best armor logi, probably the only armor logi worth using, the cornerstone of armor pvp fleets and armor incursion fleets Legion - generally shares the bottom of the T3 barrel with the proteus, mostly used like a tankier zealot, works well in armor incursion fleets and WH fleets, considered the worst T3 for PvP. |
Ruah Piskonit
PIE Inc.
9
|
Posted - 2011.10.17 02:40:00 -
[22] - Quote
Tanya Powers wrote:Drennon Nas wrote:I'm trying to decide what race I want to train advanced cruisers for. Winmatar yesterday, winmatar today, winmatar tomorrow and the days after.
you must be new here. . . the minmatar thing is pretty recent actually. It was historically always Gallente and X. With the batton being passed between Amarr and Caldari for a few years. It is only in the past 3 years that minmatar have come up, and its only since the TE (the extra damage mod just for ACs) and proj. ammo changes (those changes should have been for hybrids - not proj.) that ACs went from crappy weapon system to zomg good. But even with these changes, Mini are not that great in the T2 department, they are however, great in the T1 department with Ruppy and Hurri.
Ok the Q is advanced cruisers.
T2, Amarr.
Zelot is arguable the long range fleet hac of all fleet hacs - armor tanked, great range, good tracking, constant and good dps, pretty fast and all that.
Curse - if uses cap, its dead. A little issues with heavy drone and missile users, but you can always neut the tackler and zip off.
--
T3:
Tengu - its the alpha and omega, the pinnicle of Caldari pvp - missles that reach far out and do good damage, a seemingly infinite tank. Sure some peopl will say the proteus or the loki as second, but these are distant seconds. The legion has the advantage of not needing ammo. . .which is great. . .but not with the pricetag.
So its really Caldari/Amarr - which surprisingly, is how it used to be in the very very beginning.
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Mfume Apocal
Origin. Black Legion.
29
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Posted - 2011.10.17 07:16:00 -
[23] - Quote
Ruah Piskonit wrote:Zelot is arguable the long range fleet hac of all fleet hacs - armor tanked, great range, good tracking, constant and good dps, pretty fast and all that.
Muninn poos all over the Zealot for fighting at range. Nearly identical speed and align time, but the Muninn has utility high slots, a dronebay, balanced shield resists and alpha on it's side. During the kite, it's damned easy for a Zealot to cap out clearing tackle and focusing on approaching primaries; Muninns can run run their MWD nearly cap stable (with skills and the aid of two cheap implants) and still kill anything that can keep up in a single volley.
Quote:Curse - if uses cap, its dead. A little issues with heavy drone and missile users, but you can always neut the tackler and zip off.
In a world of autocannons as FOTM and cap injectors, the Curse looks pretty bad. To it's credit, it at least can solo (cap using turrret boats) effectively, unlike the other recons. However, it's effectiveness is never guaranteed. You can notice you're being neuted and ride out your MWD to get out of neut range with 0 cap. You can inject at the right time to keep your mods running. Contrast the Huginn: your options with being webbed? Turn on your prop mod, but odds are you won't be fast enough to catch whatever you were going for.
And the Huginn scales with damn near any gang size; from 2 right up to 249. The Curse in large fights is too squishy, too short range (in typical setups) and too situational.
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Theodoric Darkwind
PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore
29
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Posted - 2011.10.17 08:22:00 -
[24] - Quote
Zealots are great ..... if you can get a perfect warpin. They are a traditional counter to maelstrom alphafleets, but only if you can land at zero on them (a smart alphafleet FC will have bubbles set up to prevent warpins at zero), if you land out of range on an alphafleet your zealots will get blapped in seconds. They will get torn apart by hurricane welpfleets and kiting drake fleets.
Zealots are generally best in small gang work or in lowsec where they cant be bubbled out of range. They are still probably the most versatile of all HACs and are a good ship in their element. To work well in fleets they require a high level of individual pilot skill and a very good FC hence why they are mainly only effectively used by alliances like PL. In the hands of a good FC a zealot AHAC fleet is deadly, with a lacking FC they just become a mass of expensive lossmails.
Munins are better snipers |
Mocam
EVE University Ivy League
40
|
Posted - 2011.10.17 11:15:00 -
[25] - Quote
Songbird wrote:What do you mean you don't see gallente ships, all these capsules are all of gallente pilots !!!
Man that's evil. lol
Capsules weren't shown for a long time. I wonder who modified it and put the code in there to show them as ships.
Mega pops up at times and Taranis has been up there. Domi was up for a week or so but it's an old warhorse that's pulled out for the disco or neut games and is very good at being flexible in such ways.
Arazu also did a short appearance but so did a couple other recon's - I think some folks had a bit of fun with hot-drop covert ops stuff around that time.
They do pop up and things shift around a bit. It's why I watch the weapons as well as the ships. Hurricane was tops at one point on hulls but weapons systems had missile launchers as "top killers" - not many canes fit them so I doubt it came from that side. |
Mfume Apocal
Origin. Black Legion.
29
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Posted - 2011.10.17 11:25:00 -
[26] - Quote
Mocam wrote:Hurricane was tops at one point on hulls but weapons systems had missile launchers as "top killers" - not many canes fit them so I doubt it came from that side.
In addition to the obvious Drake and Tengu, most of the combat recons mount them as well, there was brief period where someone thought HML Sacrileges would be awesome, etc. Also, I'm not sure how KMs determine what weapon to display, but most of my Cane kills display "unknown"; possibly due to ACs, medium neut, point and drones all competing. I'm not exactly sure how it works. |
Ruah Piskonit
PIE Inc.
9
|
Posted - 2011.10.19 07:40:00 -
[27] - Quote
Mfume Apocal wrote:Ruah Piskonit wrote:Zelot is arguable the long range fleet hac of all fleet hacs - armor tanked, great range, good tracking, constant and good dps, pretty fast and all that. Muninn poos all over the Zealot for fighting at range. Nearly identical speed and align time, but the Muninn has utility high slots, a dronebay, balanced shield resists and alpha on it's side. During the kite, it's damned easy for a Zealot to cap out clearing tackle and focusing on approaching primaries; Muninns can run run their MWD nearly cap stable (with skills and the aid of two cheap implants) and still kill anything that can keep up in a single volley.
Don't get me wrong, my 0.0 character was mini and I flew the Munin all the time (before mini became a little imba) but even after the buff, the zelot still has better range, better dps, and while it can't run its MWD 23/7 - if you pulse it right and manage your cap well, you can keep it going. Just group them well. In hac fleets, I find the utility slots and the drones to be pretty useless - i used to keep light rep drones just in case there was a chance for a quick rep (rare), and the point blank missile high or the neut highs I don't think i ever used.
I still think the zelot is superior for 0.0.
in low/FW stuff - why bother, the rupture does everything just as well. |
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