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DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
936
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 21:02:00 -
[121] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:People are going to clamor for special "ice probes" because all those other sigs will make them have to work.
Gotta keep up that global laziness competition you know. as far as i can tell, you don't have to probe them. just use that new discovery scanner thing and then warp to it.
huh? An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
3288
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 21:50:00 -
[122] - Quote
Use on-board system scanner to discover all anomalies. Some of those anomalies will be ice fields. Use funky new circular context menu to select "warp to" and now you are at the ice field!
Even better, you don't have to click the button to make the system scanner go, since you have already toggled the setting to keep it running all the time.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
1778
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 22:13:00 -
[123] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Vincent Athena wrote:The 4 hour respawn is an issue. If I got 1 hour to kill right now can hop in a barge and get some ice. In the new system my one hour could easily fall into that 4 hour cool-down. Saying " go elsewhere" is of little help as I only got an hour.
Now if the average ice belt takes days to get mined out, this issue is small as there will only be a small chance the four hour respawn happens at the same time as my play time. unless they announce a change in ice belts (smaller roids, less of them, or such), which they haven't done, then you're right the chance of being online during the 4hr period is small. It seems the belts will be small. CCP mentioned that even if all were mined out 5 times a day (48 minutes of mining followed by 4 hours of waiting, 5 times a day) there would be sufficient ice for 80% of the games need, just from high sec. This implies a small belt that a reasonable swarm of miners can clear in an hour or less.
I propose ice locust fleets. The fleet has a "cycle" of solar systems it harvests. It goes to one, clears it, then the next, and so on. The loop is big enough that by the time you get back to the first the 4 hour timer has expired. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
937
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 22:20:00 -
[124] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Use on-board system scanner to discover all anomalies. Some of those anomalies will be ice fields. Use funky new circular context menu to select "warp to" and now you are at the ice field! Even better, you don't have to click the button to make the system scanner go, since you have already toggled the setting to keep it running all the time.
Guess I missed that part... I thought the insta non-probe scanning was a DEV hack because Soundwave is so bad at it
So these new ICEBELTS are anoms that DO NOT NEED PROBES TO BE SCANNED DOWN? \/ An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |
Dave Stark
2872
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 22:23:00 -
[125] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Vincent Athena wrote:The 4 hour respawn is an issue. If I got 1 hour to kill right now can hop in a barge and get some ice. In the new system my one hour could easily fall into that 4 hour cool-down. Saying " go elsewhere" is of little help as I only got an hour.
Now if the average ice belt takes days to get mined out, this issue is small as there will only be a small chance the four hour respawn happens at the same time as my play time. unless they announce a change in ice belts (smaller roids, less of them, or such), which they haven't done, then you're right the chance of being online during the 4hr period is small. It seems the belts will be small. CCP mentioned that even if all were mined out 5 times a day (48 minutes of mining followed by 4 hours of waiting, 5 times a day) there would be sufficient ice for 80% of the games need, just from high sec. This implies a small belt that a reasonable swarm of miners can clear in an hour or less. I propose ice locust fleets. The fleet has a "cycle" of solar systems it harvests. It goes to one, clears it, then the next, and so on. The loop is big enough that by the time you get back to the first the 4 hour timer has expired.
2 systems, 2 jumps apart. 5 ice anoms between. |
Caviar Liberta
Moira. Villore Accords
111
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 22:24:00 -
[126] - Quote
Sentient Blade wrote: Maybe add battleship rats to ice belts as well. I can see a new profession forming, merc logistics that would rep anyone they had on their books as having paid a monthly "protection" fee when they came under attack from the NPCs.
Hmmm, On my first account about 4 years ago I was mining ice in Providence with fleet with CVA protection in the ice belt.
NPC would spawn and we would get word to dock up as hostiles were heading that way. I was out warping into the belt at 0 on the warp in the warping to the other end of the belt where I had my ice jettisoned while under NPC fire. Not much of a threat really. |
Xolve
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
1361
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 22:24:00 -
[127] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Guess I missed that part... I thought the insta non-probe scanning was a DEV hack because Soundwave is so bad at it So these new ICEBELTS are anoms that DO NOT NEED PROBES TO BE SCANNED DOWN? \ /
They mentioned later in the devblogs that ice/regular belts no longer need to be probed, and will show up similar to 'anomalies' (i.e. Not rated complexes) by using the ships onboard scanner.
Inappropriate signature removed. Navigator. |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
1778
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 22:30:00 -
[128] - Quote
Xolve wrote:DarthNefarius wrote:Guess I missed that part... I thought the insta non-probe scanning was a DEV hack because Soundwave is so bad at it So these new ICEBELTS are anoms that DO NOT NEED PROBES TO BE SCANNED DOWN? \ / They mentioned later in the devblogs that ice/regular belts no longer need to be probed, and will show up similar to 'anomalies' (i.e. Not rated complexes) by using the ships onboard scanner. Apparently ALL grav sites are going to become anomalies. I assume even the ones in W-space. No more safety by D-scanning for probes. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Loan--Wolf
Ace's And 8's
6
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 22:50:00 -
[129] - Quote
grave will be anoms in wh space is this confirmed ?
and does that mean they will spawn more then like sleeper sights ?
also will they spawn sleepers more ?
this is interesting
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Captain Tardbar
NEWB ALERT
326
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:01:00 -
[130] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:It seems the belts will be small. CCP mentioned that even if all were mined out 5 times a day (48 minutes of mining followed by 4 hours of waiting, 5 times a day) there would be sufficient ice for 80% of the games need, just from high sec. This implies a small belt that a reasonable swarm of miners can clear in an hour or less.
Wait what? That's still 20% less than 100% which means ice prices will go up by at least that much.
Secondly, if belts are mined out less than an hour that means 3 hours of downtime. Which even with double the mining rate means that 2 hours no longer being utilized compared to the old system.
But the whole idea of downtime is what nags me. What if I log on after the 2nd hour? I am suppose to spin ships until another anomaly appears? And speaking of that, how in the hell do I know if I have to wait 3 hours or 10 minutes?
That's not a very fun way to spend your day. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
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Nex apparatu5
Friendship is Podding Test Alliance Please Ignore
494
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:05:00 -
[131] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Vincent Athena wrote:It seems the belts will be small. CCP mentioned that even if all were mined out 5 times a day (48 minutes of mining followed by 4 hours of waiting, 5 times a day) there would be sufficient ice for 80% of the games need, just from high sec. This implies a small belt that a reasonable swarm of miners can clear in an hour or less. Wait what? That's still 20% less than 100% which means ice prices will go up by at least that much. Secondly, if belts are mined out less than an hour that means 3 hours of downtime. Which even with double the mining rate means that 2 hours no longer being utilized compared to the old system. But the whole idea of downtime is what nags me. What if I log on after the 2nd hour? I am suppose to spin ships until another anomaly appears? And speaking of that, how in the hell do I know if I have to wait 3 hours or 10 minutes? That's not a very fun way to spend your day.
This adds competition and a dynamic aspect to who gets to mine the ice belts, something mining sorely needs. |
Dave Stark
2872
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:06:00 -
[132] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Vincent Athena wrote:It seems the belts will be small. CCP mentioned that even if all were mined out 5 times a day (48 minutes of mining followed by 4 hours of waiting, 5 times a day) there would be sufficient ice for 80% of the games need, just from high sec. This implies a small belt that a reasonable swarm of miners can clear in an hour or less. Wait what? That's still 20% less than 100% which means ice prices will go up by at least that much. Secondly, if belts are mined out less than an hour that means 3 hours of downtime. Which even with double the mining rate means that 2 hours no longer being utilized compared to the old system. But the whole idea of downtime is what nags me. What if I log on after the 2nd hour? I am suppose to spin ships until another anomaly appears? And speaking of that, how in the hell do I know if I have to wait 3 hours or 10 minutes? That's not a very fun way to spend your day.
4 hours starts as soon as the last asteroid is popped. |
Dave Stark
2872
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:08:00 -
[133] - Quote
Nex apparatu5 wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Vincent Athena wrote:It seems the belts will be small. CCP mentioned that even if all were mined out 5 times a day (48 minutes of mining followed by 4 hours of waiting, 5 times a day) there would be sufficient ice for 80% of the games need, just from high sec. This implies a small belt that a reasonable swarm of miners can clear in an hour or less. Wait what? That's still 20% less than 100% which means ice prices will go up by at least that much. Secondly, if belts are mined out less than an hour that means 3 hours of downtime. Which even with double the mining rate means that 2 hours no longer being utilized compared to the old system. But the whole idea of downtime is what nags me. What if I log on after the 2nd hour? I am suppose to spin ships until another anomaly appears? And speaking of that, how in the hell do I know if I have to wait 3 hours or 10 minutes? That's not a very fun way to spend your day. This adds competition and a dynamic aspect to who gets to mine the ice belts, something mining sorely needs.
who gets to mine the belts is whoever warps to it. nothing changes. |
Captain Tardbar
NEWB ALERT
326
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:15:00 -
[134] - Quote
Nex apparatu5 wrote:This adds competition and a dynamic aspect to who gets to mine the ice belts, something mining sorely needs.
Competition? How are you supposed to compete when you don't know when the timers are? Say some guy comes in 30 minutes after downtime and mines out the belt. And then I log in two hour later. I don't see a belt. Does that mean I should wait 1 hour or two?
It's not competition, its just randomly picks a winer for every 4 hours for whenever you happen to log in. With an income so unreliable, people will go back to asteroid mining.
Madness. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Shepard Wong Ogeko
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
438
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:23:00 -
[135] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Nex apparatu5 wrote:This adds competition and a dynamic aspect to who gets to mine the ice belts, something mining sorely needs. Competition? How are you supposed to compete when you don't know when the timers are? Say some guy comes in 30 minutes after downtime and mines out the belt. And then I log in two hour later. I don't see a belt. Does that mean I should wait 1 hour or two? It's not competition, its just randomly picks a winer for every 4 hours for whenever you happen to log in. With an income so unreliable, people will go back to asteroid mining. Madness.
You mean you might actually have to go look for something to mine, instead of just parking yourself in an unlimited belt to mine afk for hours on end?
Truly, this is madness |
Heinel Coventina
University of Caille Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:25:00 -
[136] - Quote
Will we get Ice Harvesters made for the Venture with the change? Or would it not be feasible? |
Captain Tardbar
NEWB ALERT
326
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:31:00 -
[137] - Quote
Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:You mean you might actually have to go look for something to mine, instead of just parking yourself in an unlimited belt to mine afk for hours on end? Truly, this is madness
It might, but I enjoy this style of gameplay and pay money for it.
I posted this thread about why I enjoy ice mining:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=228866&find=unread
My point was, that if I can't enjoy a relaxing environment while doing what I enjoy then I might as well play other games. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
938
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 23:44:00 -
[138] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Vincent Athena wrote:It seems the belts will be small. CCP mentioned that even if all were mined out 5 times a day (48 minutes of mining followed by 4 hours of waiting, 5 times a day) there would be sufficient ice for 80% of the games need, just from high sec. This implies a small belt that a reasonable swarm of miners can clear in an hour or less. Wait what? That's still 20% less than 100% which means ice prices will go up by at least that much. Secondly, if belts are mined out less than an hour that means 3 hours of downtime. Which even with double the mining rate means that 2 hours no longer being utilized compared to the old system. But the whole idea of downtime is what nags me. What if I log on after the 2nd hour? I am suppose to spin ships until another anomaly appears? And speaking of that, how in the hell do I know if I have to wait 3 hours or 10 minutes? That's not a very fun way to spend your day. 4 hours starts as soon as the last asteroid is popped.
lol N.O. WILL HAVE A FIELD DAY WITH THAT!!! BUMP THE LAST PILOTS TRYING TO GET THE LAST ICE NUGGET SO NOONE GETS THE RESPAWNS An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |
Dilbert HighSeed
Pirannha Corp
6
|
Posted - 2013.04.27 00:01:00 -
[139] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:You mean you might actually have to go look for something to mine, instead of just parking yourself in an unlimited belt to mine afk for hours on end? Truly, this is madness It might, but I enjoy this style of gameplay and pay money for it. I posted this thread about why I enjoy ice mining: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=228866&find=unreadMy point was, that if I can't enjoy a relaxing environment while doing what I enjoy then I might as well play other games. Think of it like this, what if CCP removed ganking from the game? Wouldn't you be pissed that CCP removed something you enjoyed?
It's going to be even worse than you imagine, since all ice mining cycles are being halved. An organized group will be clearing out ice belts in minutes.
But that is exactly what the goon lead designer said he wanted. He said he wanted ice to be a conflict driver. He wants the strong (read as the large cartels) preying on the weak (read as solo causal players).
You can bet on the fact that the null sec cartels are already organizing mining groups that will clear out all the belts in a high sec region, and start controlling the supply of ice to anyone needing it. Yeah, I am talking about interdicting the supply, not by blowing boats up, but by out-mining everyone.
It will be simple enough. They will have their alt's in 100 MN FSI's bump any non-allied mining boat off the ice belt, leaving the allied miners in the belts to gather in the resources. |
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
587
|
Posted - 2013.04.27 00:11:00 -
[140] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Shepard Wong Ogeko wrote:You mean you might actually have to go look for something to mine, instead of just parking yourself in an unlimited belt to mine afk for hours on end? Truly, this is madness It might, but I enjoy this style of gameplay and pay money for it. I posted this thread about why I enjoy ice mining: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=228866&find=unreadMy point was, that if I can't enjoy a relaxing environment while doing what I enjoy then I might as well play other games. Think of it like this, what if CCP removed ganking from the game? Wouldn't you be pissed that CCP removed something you enjoyed?
The thing is, there is nothing wrong with ganking, but the same can't be said for highsec industry. This change was long overdue, highsec risk vs reward has broken.
Also, you're not entitled to anything just because you pay money. Don't like the changes, go play some themepark game that suits you. |
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Captain Tardbar
NEWB ALERT
326
|
Posted - 2013.04.27 00:22:00 -
[141] - Quote
Vaju Enki wrote:The thing is, there is nothing wrong with ganking, but the same can't be said for highsec industry. This change was long overdue, highsec risk vs reward has broken.
Also, you're not entitled to anything just because you pay money. Don't like the changes, go play some themepark game that suits you.
So hi-sec industry makes you mad?
Of course I am not entitled, but you'd be crying tears if CCP trammelized the game.
I am just voicing my concerns in public so that it is known. Hell for all I know, the ice belts won't be mined out in an extreme fashion.
If my words bother you that much you should just block me.
"Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Agent Trask
New Order Logistics CODE.
153
|
Posted - 2013.04.27 00:51:00 -
[142] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Guess I missed that part... I thought the insta non-probe scanning was a DEV hack because Soundwave is so bad at it So these new ICEBELTS are anoms that DO NOT NEED PROBES TO BE SCANNED DOWN? \ /
But gankers will be using combat probes and scout alts to warp directly to you while you mine.
Hope this helps, have a nice day.
Join the New Order, buy your permit today, and follow the code.
www.minerbumping.com |
Agent Trask
New Order Logistics CODE.
153
|
Posted - 2013.04.27 00:52:00 -
[143] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:
4 hours starts as soon as the last asteroid is popped.
And as Darth All Caps has noted, Miner bumping can prevent that last ice-teroid from popping! Join the New Order, buy your permit today, and follow the code.
www.minerbumping.com |
Some Rando
University of Caille Gallente Federation
842
|
Posted - 2013.04.27 01:00:00 -
[144] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Hell for all I know, the ice belts won't be mined out in an extreme fashion. Given what we know at the moment and assuming each system has roughly the same amount of ice miners with the same average cycle time, and that most, if not all, ice mining is done in high-sec, we can assume that each ice anom will be mined out in about 1.6 hours.
I expect some competition in the ice belts. CCP has no sense of humour. |
stoicfaux
2624
|
Posted - 2013.04.27 02:05:00 -
[145] - Quote
Vaju Enki wrote: The thing is, there is nothing wrong with ganking, but the same can't be said for highsec industry. This change was long overdue, highsec risk vs reward has broken.
The "risk vs reward" angle is just wrong. The reason high-sec is so popular is because it is so profitable. If you want to get people out of high-sec, you just need to make high-sec less appealing from a profit standpoint (or make low and null much more profitable.)
Of course, if low/null is more profitable, then people will have something worth defending, which means less ganking and more fighting...
Odyssey's resource reallocation might become a huge nerf to ganking. Enjoy it while you can.
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