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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Deltor Griffith
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.12.17 07:09:00 -
[211] - Quote
I congratulate your inability to fight your own battles. |
Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
200
|
Posted - 2011.12.17 11:30:00 -
[212] - Quote
Ovalteen wrote: CCP is a business, and they have to respond to the market. Right now there is not a big market for such sadomasochistic games as EVE used to be. EVE Online has always been a "niche" game, and it always will be, but "niche" games are generally speaking not sustainable. The reason being is because interest in them is usually low, and MMOs, being notoriously hemorrhagic, depend on growth for their sustainance - new players are fickle and leave easily. This is evidenced by the following stats: There are 15-20,000 trial accounts per month (at least a Dev told me that), yet EVE's growth is sporadic at best (on a general, slow, upcurve based on QEN data with lots of dips and vallies). The average length of an account on EVE is around 6 months (again, based on QEN data). If you lose more players than you recruit, you're just stuck with "the vets", and "the vets", god bless their loyalty, are not going to play the game forever.
Now, true, there are some very loyal fans who continue to play EVE. But without new players, and this is my main point here so it bears repeating, without new players, an MMO can only get smaller. A 6-month turnover rate is not sustainable - eventually you'll bleed your market base dry. I think CCP realizes that - they've got a large influx of players over the past 2 years due to excellent marketing, and they've reached the "critical mass" for an MMO (250,000 subscriptions). But, again, there are two things that keep an MMO going: Player addition and player retention. You have to get them to play and keep them playing. Marketing gets them to play. Fair, balanced, and fun play keeps them paying for their subscription. Changes like these are meant to make the game more fun for the newer players. Who are these newer players? Well, they're certainly not 3 year vets who get their rocks off on griefing people all day!
A lot of "the vets" want to complain about changes like the above. But these very same "vets" will tell victims of griefing "adapt or die, only the strong survive in EVE." Well guess what: "The vets" need to take their own advice. EVE might not be as harsh as it used to be, but it's still harsher than basically every MMO out there. EVE is changing. It's becoming more marketable to the general public above (or below, depending on your perspective) a certain threshold. And this is a good thing, because growth means more money which means more cool stuff in the game. If that bothers "the vets", then they simply need to either adapt, or unsub.
That's all fine and dandy in theory, but niche games seem to be actually doing much better than mainstream games in the MMO arena, as far as growth curves are conserned and EVE has had one of the best growth curve of any MMO ever made. The only major dip was caused precisely because CCP stopped developing that niche their players came here for in the first place. So there doesn't seem to be any large lack of new players joining the game. The 6 month turnover rate is longer than some of the main stream competition have stayed in business and isn't really informative, since you aren't providing comparison values from other MMOs. That 6 months seems a good number when compared to this news article and combined with the plummeting sub numbers of WoW. If anything it shows it's not about being niche or mainstream, but your ability to provide new interesting content and gameplay, that keeps the game attractive.
I also don't see how a broken wardec system makes the game more fun for new players and why you paint this exclusively a veteran issue. You seem to assume, that new players can't be the ones utilizing wardecs to engage other players and need to be shielded from all aggression as much as possible. Not to mention the NPC corp immunity already protects noobs and people who want to avoid unwanted aggression. To me this seems a clear case of the system simply being broken and people using the loopholes trying to throw in the "won't someone please think of the childred" -excuse in an effort to keep it broken. A new working wardec system seems more fair, balanced and fun to me, than the current broken piece of crap, that can be manipulated to be largely ineffectual.
Your adapt or die comments are also somewhat misused, since the point is that you can't adapt to the changes. You can only keep banging your head against the wall or try to get CCP to look at the system and fix it. The old system wasn't perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but the current one is worse. It's starting to increasingly resemble the bounty system, in that it relies on the recieving side of the wardec to be a good sport about it to work at all. That negates the entire point of a war in many cases and makes serious disrupting of corp operations and POSes impossible. You can debate what the correct cost and risk should be in the system for it to be balanced, but immunity should not be allowed for player corporations.
All this CCP is a business and won't someone please think of the noobs -talk is largely besides the point though. The system didn't work that well before and works even worse now. The point is the system is broken to the point of being useless and needs to be fixed. The debate should focus on how the new system should be implemented and balanced, so it wouldn't suffer from the same problems the old system suffered and offered new options for both the aggressors and the defenders to manage wardecs. That discussion can take in to account CCPs corporate needs and newbies, but trying to justify retaining a broken system using the same reasons isn't acceptable. It's not a matter of to fix or not to fix, but how to fix it. |
Ovalteen
Hedion University Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2011.12.17 16:12:00 -
[213] - Quote
Deltor Griffith wrote:I congratulate your inability to fight your own battles.
You're in Goonswarm. When have you ever had to fight your own battle? Or make your own ISK? Or put any effort into the game what so ever? |
Ovalteen
Hedion University Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2011.12.17 16:36:00 -
[214] - Quote
Quote:The 6 month turnover rate is longer than some of the main stream competition have stayed in business and isn't really informative, since you aren't providing comparison values from other MMOs. That 6 months seems a good number when compared to (news articles) . If anything it shows it's not about being niche or mainstream, but your ability to provide new interesting content and gameplay, that keeps the game attractive.
Okay, it's true I didn't offer comparison values. However, you are comparing the wrong values in a misleading fashion. I'm going to be patient and assume you did that by accident. You are comparing WoW trials to EVE subs. You can't actually do that. Allow me to clarify for you:
EVE has 20,000 trials per month, yet EVE is growing only very slowly. I mentioned that MMOs are notoriously hemorrhagic? The first article you post states that 70% of the people on WoW trials never make it past level 10: Hm, that seems to corroborate my previous statements: Most people who try a game don't play that game (as far as MMO are concerned).
Now, I hate to talk about WoW, but let's face the facts: After a 6 year run being the biggest, most popular MMO on the market (8 million subs? 10 million subs? 11.5 million subs?), it's no surprise that they're starting to lose some of that popularity and momentum. They seem to have bled their market dry, as I mentioned earlier, and as I mentioned earlier, MMOs are notoriously hemorrhagic. All your links have done is corroborate the statements I made earlier. You would have been better off not posting them.
But WoW does serve as a great example. Love the game or hate the game, the game was successful. And it was successful because of growth.
Quote:I also don't see how a broken wardec system makes the game more fun for new players and why you paint this exclusively a veteran issue.
I never said it did. Actually I never even mentioned WarDecs in my post. I said changes like these. These changes make the game more "beginner friendly" - for beginning players or beginning Corps. And I do see it as a "veteran" issue because any small change in the game, especially a change that makes the game more player friendly, and there's tons of tears on the forums from bitter vets. And I do know they are vets because I check employment histories and a lot of those tears are from players dating back before 2008.
The WarDec system was broken before in that it allowed griefers to exploit it and deny other players the ability to play the game.
Now people are saying it's broken for exactly the above reason.
Gimme a break.
Quote:Not to mention the NPC corp immunity already protects noobs and people who want to avoid unwanted aggression.
Because NPC Corps are so fun right?
(Hint: Fun keeps people playing a game.)
Quote:That negates the entire point of a war in many cases and makes serious disrupting of corp operations and POSes impossible.
Only being able to have your tower up and mining operations running a couple days a week is not a serious disruption? Erm...? Seems to me like a major disruption. Seems to me that things are....
Working as intended. |
M Expedience
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.18 00:10:00 -
[215] - Quote
I beg you, when you guys inevitably go rogue and steal from all the corps that use your service, post the tears here. |
Jack Cavanaugh
Mechanical Eagles Inc. The Ancients.
7
|
Posted - 2011.12.19 10:38:00 -
[216] - Quote
Atomik Harmonik wrote:sounds kind of like Socratic....anyone heard anything from him lately?
I haven't been around too long but I assume Socratic has spent the entire 7 years he's been playing in Arnon.
At first I thought he was a very clever troll but then I realized he was actually serious...and then I was like...no way...he's been playing for 7 years and spends all his time trolling a rookie system...and then again...I realized he was totally serious.
I was actually surprised he doesn't post on the forums but I realized brand new players starting the SoE arc must be the only people he can attempt to lord his playtime over and his claims of being in Mensa and being one of the top 0.00000001% smartest people in the world.
So to answer your question, yes...everytime I'm in Arnon he is there in local. The system is actually starting to get cluttered with containers making fun of him.
If you see him...please...won't you fleet him?
http://memegenerator.net/cache/instances/400x/11/12119/12410598.jpg
http://memegenerator.net/cache/instances/400x/11/12119/12410642.jpg
http://memegenerator.net/cache/instances/400x/11/12119/12410084.jpg
http://memegenerator.net/cache/instances/400x/11/12120/12411062.jpg |
Jacob Staffuer
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2011.12.21 13:33:00 -
[217] - Quote
Personally I want to see more griefers crying about how they can't harass Indy's anymore. Come on guys, post some more of those griefer tears! |
Xolve
Intaki Armaments Important Internet Spaceship League
286
|
Posted - 2011.12.21 23:06:00 -
[218] - Quote
Jacob Staffuer wrote:Personally I want to see more griefers crying about how they can't harass Indy's anymore. Come on guys, post some more of those griefer tears!
We can/will still suicide gank you (CCP made it cheaper and stuff). Lady Spank for C&P Moderator.
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Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2011.12.22 20:27:00 -
[219] - Quote
Deltor Griffith wrote:I congratulate your inability to fight your own battles.
Interesting |
Jada Maroo
Mysterium Astrometrics
501
|
Posted - 2011.12.24 23:19:00 -
[220] - Quote
Excellent service and not a scam. Used it when I got wardecced by my former alliance because I hurt their wittle feewings.
But its usefulness depends on how many members you have and how willing they are to stay docked until the war expiration. If you have a small enough/disciplined enough group you can avoid merc groups. Sometimes a corpie undocks into an ambush and you lose a ship - it happens. But if you use it right, it's a great way to cost dumb alliances millions of isk for nothing. |
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Tarrn
The Alpha Company
14
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Posted - 2011.12.27 16:07:00 -
[221] - Quote
War is the number one threat to my credit card being charged another month. It's a distraction to the long term goals of any corporation. I'm always having to coddle not just new players but veteran players who got bored, decided to join a corporation, then we get War Dec'ed, they lose a ship, leave the corp, leave eve.
How does this retain players? How does this retain members? How does this retain subscriptions?
Thank you "Google" for this thread. |
Te Tapunui
Sleeping Dogs Awake
1
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Posted - 2011.12.28 00:49:00 -
[222] - Quote
I guess it's just the way of the world being reflected online. No matter which way those of you who endorse this service try to spin it, in the end you are all cowards.
Our modern societies have created an attitude within most of us that we shouldnt even attempt to stand up for ourselves, and that other people (Police, security guards, soldiers, lawyers etc etc) should do our fighting for us. We have become so non confrontational that this attitude was bound to be brought into this virtual world.
I read about eve before joining and it was made clearly evident that it is a brutal darwinistic game. When I signed up I accepted this, and entered the life of a carebear. I mined and missioned and joined a lacklustre corporation who all mined and missioned together. We eventually attracted a war declaration by a pirate corporation and were morally outraged. It was so unjust and unfair we deemed, that we couldnt just mine and mission in peace. I lost a number of ships, and very nearly rage quit. Then it dawned on me. I had somehow over the years become a coward. Combat on call of duty or warcraft was no preparation for a battle within Eve. There was a real sense of risk and loss going on here, and I was about to shy away from it.
I also realised that I had opted IN for war simply by joining a player corporation. If I wanted to avoid a war all I needed to do was remain in an NPC corporation, problem solved. Upon the realisation that I was indeed a total coward I stopped all thoughts of quitting, and decided to fight, carebear style. I learned the art of war avoidance and combat denial. It turned out to be great fun and resulted in the pirate corporation moving on and finding a new target. They always do, and you realise it was a great learning experience and insight of self realisation.
Before dec shield became legitimate there already existed a great many tools for the carebear to avoid war without fighting. The game just became that much more colorless for pandering to cowards, and the floodgates are opened for more to come...
Just remember guys, not to have Eve turned up too loud while you are mission running. Your neighbours might get annoyed and knock on the door, you'll be faced with some actual confrontation that CCP can't just nerf away ;) |
Parsee789
Immaterial and Missing Power
55
|
Posted - 2011.12.28 08:07:00 -
[223] - Quote
Te Tapunui wrote:BLAH BLAH BLAH ABOUT HIGHSEC WAR DECS AND BRAVERY
Highsec WarDecs is not a sign of bravery, it is the sign of the carebear, for both the griefers and the victims. Griefers are too ***** to come to low/null/WH and victims are too meek to do anything.
I would favor abolishing highsec wardecs just to **** off tough-guy highsec "pvpers".
Real PVPers pvp in non-high security where there is no protection from CONCORD.
Highsec pvpers are not pvpers, they are just carebears who know only station games and session timers.
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Xolve
Intaki Armaments Important Internet Spaceship League
387
|
Posted - 2011.12.28 23:15:00 -
[224] - Quote
Parsee789 wrote:Highsec pvpers are not pvpers, they are just carebears who know only station games and session timers.
Because you know.. there are no stations or session timers in Low Sec or Null.. ...probably bad posting |
Jake McCord
Greater Metropolis Sanitation Service Barbarian Wine and Cheese Society
16
|
Posted - 2011.12.29 13:11:00 -
[225] - Quote
Xolve wrote:Parsee789 wrote:Highsec pvpers are not pvpers, they are just carebears who know only station games and session timers. Because you know.. there are no stations or session timers in Low Sec or Null.. Well, there are, in in lo/null sec, no one really cares. Mostly there's no Concord to worry about in lo/null sec. Which is fine by me.
Never accept a 1v1 challenge. -áIf you do, don't be surprised when the other guy's friends show up and blow you up. |
Xolve
Intaki Armaments Important Internet Spaceship League
395
|
Posted - 2011.12.29 16:50:00 -
[226] - Quote
Jake McCord wrote:Well, there are, in in lo/null sec, no one really cares. Mostly there's no Concord to worry about in lo/null sec. Which is fine by me.
I think you missed the point of my retort space friend.
Everytime You Masterbate, A New-bee (Goon) Gets a Rifter! |
Jake McCord
Greater Metropolis Sanitation Service Barbarian Wine and Cheese Society
16
|
Posted - 2011.12.29 20:46:00 -
[227] - Quote
Xolve wrote:Jake McCord wrote:Well, there are, in in lo/null sec, no one really cares. Mostly there's no Concord to worry about in lo/null sec. Which is fine by me. I think you missed the point of my retort space friend. Yeah, that's the problem with text messages. Hard to read the irony sometimes. Never accept a 1v1 challenge. -áIf you do, don't be surprised when the other guy's friends show up and blow you up. |
Tarrn
The Alpha Company
16
|
Posted - 2012.01.05 16:44:00 -
[228] - Quote
Parsee789 wrote:Te Tapunui wrote:BLAH BLAH BLAH ABOUT HIGHSEC WAR DECS AND BRAVERY Highsec WarDecs is not a sign of bravery, it is the sign of the carebear, for both the griefers and the victims. Griefers are too ***** to come to low/null/WH and victims are too meek to do anything. I would favor abolishing highsec wardecs just to **** off tough-guy highsec "pvpers". Real PVPers pvp in non-high security where there is no protection from CONCORD. Highsec pvpers are not pvpers, they are just carebears who know only station games and session timers.
*Like |
Ahrieman
Heretic Army
9
|
Posted - 2012.01.10 11:20:00 -
[229] - Quote
Tarrn wrote:Parsee789 wrote:Te Tapunui wrote:BLAH BLAH BLAH ABOUT HIGHSEC WAR DECS AND BRAVERY Highsec WarDecs is not a sign of bravery, it is the sign of the carebear, for both the griefers and the victims. Griefers are too ***** to come to low/null/WH and victims are too meek to do anything. I would favor abolishing highsec wardecs just to **** off tough-guy highsec "pvpers". Real PVPers pvp in non-high security where there is no protection from CONCORD. Highsec pvpers are not pvpers, they are just carebears who know only station games and session timers. *Like
Protip: there's a button for that
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nekuen olei
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2012.01.10 19:48:00 -
[230] - Quote
It is a scamm, i have used it and all looks fine but 3 days later they wardec you |
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FeralShadow
CenGen Armament
31
|
Posted - 2012.01.10 20:49:00 -
[231] - Quote
Honestly, i think combat players mainly ask themselves "In this game which isn't supposed to be safe for anybody, why are there people bumbling around high sec ignorantly running missions and mining? They shouldn't be able to do that in perfect safety" and so, the decs begin. Honestly I don't think it's so much the act of being a carebear, as it is how ignorant a lot of carebears are about the game's ideology. Then the bear dies and rage rage rage rage and that just proves the point of how ignorant they were. Yes, there's a lot of carebears who aren't ignorant, and you will find those people effectively combating the pvp pilots. There's a big difference imho, and the ignorant carebear is the one pvpers target above all others. As a matter of fact this whole decshield idea was likely started by one of those non-ignorant carebears, and thus it's effective.
What I'm trying to say is that if you dont like the combat side of eve, don't be an ignorant carebear and wander around highsec in your multi-billion isk ship going about your business. This game doesnt allow for that long, and pvpers exploit it. |
positie10
Friendly Corpses
0
|
Posted - 2012.01.10 23:20:00 -
[232] - Quote
FeralShadow wrote:Honestly, i think combat players mainly ask themselves "In this game which isn't supposed to be safe for anybody, why are there people bumbling around high sec ignorantly running missions and mining? They shouldn't be able to do that in perfect safety" and so, the decs begin. Honestly I don't think it's so much the act of being a carebear, as it is how ignorant a lot of carebears are about the game's ideology. Then the bear dies and rage rage rage rage and that just proves the point of how ignorant they were. Yes, there's a lot of carebears who aren't ignorant, and you will find those people effectively combating the pvp pilots. There's a big difference imho, and the ignorant carebear is the one pvpers target above all others. As a matter of fact this whole decshield idea was likely started by one of those non-ignorant carebears, and thus it's effective.
What I'm trying to say is that if you dont like the combat side of eve, don't be an ignorant carebear and wander around highsec in your multi-billion isk ship going about your business. This game doesnt allow for that long, and pvpers exploit it.
It was started by a crappy pvper because he couldn't survive in 0.0 so now he created a "dec shield" that actually had the functionality of providing information for his executing corp. This way it is very ez for him to get rid of high sec industrialists.
http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=corp&name=Zerg+Hatchery&page=1#losses
http://eve-kill.net/?a=corp_detail&view=kills&crp_id=120513&m=12&y=2011
http://evemaps.dotlan.net/corp/Zerg_Hatchery/pilots
etc etc
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Rasz Lin
41
|
Posted - 2012.01.11 04:06:00 -
[233] - Quote
nekuen olei wrote:It is a scamm, i have used it and all looks fine but 3 days later they wardec you
of course you got decced, people look for weaklings that join DECshield, having that alliance in corp sheet means you are weak and juicy. what did you expect? all benefits no drawbacks? |
dinotopija
Vubi Bubi
0
|
Posted - 2012.01.12 08:30:00 -
[234] - Quote
THKS DEC SHIELD manage to save my pos with your help i I appreciate help like this...... |
HappyJamjam HappyJamjam
0
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Posted - 2012.01.18 22:21:00 -
[235] - Quote
bump. read both of the zerg overminds post regarding this exploit before judging him for or against. |
StonerPhReaK
Nasgul Collective Cascade Imminent
20
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Posted - 2012.01.18 23:30:00 -
[236] - Quote
/me passes out some "relaxing brownies" to both parties. |
Jack Miner
Scorpions Academy
0
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Posted - 2012.01.20 21:54:00 -
[237] - Quote
Bump from a friend. |
Spoony Wan
Tornado Technologies
0
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 15:19:00 -
[238] - Quote
This service saved my bacon when my high sec pos was ransomed. If this service was not free i would have paid to have the help he gave me. I messaged him so many times i thought he would put me on ignore.
Top notch service.
Thank you soo much.
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The Zerg Overmind
Rule Reversal Dec Shield
102
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Posted - 2012.02.02 10:10:00 -
[239] - Quote
At least 150 corps served. I've been asking them to bump the thread here. So far only 2-3 have. Tis tragic. You'd be surprised how little communication goes on with this. People just apply, I accept them, send them an email with info asking them to bump the thread, they leave alliance. I'd say about 80% of them still have CSPA charges up as well. It's generally an equal mix of euro and American.
http://evemaps.dotlan.net/alliance/Dec_Shield/corporations
And this is a bump. Still doing dec shield services. Free Wardec Removal |
Optsix
xLegion of the dammedx.
0
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Posted - 2012.02.02 13:03:00 -
[240] - Quote
Awesome service for any corp looking to avoid a war dec, This is not a scam in anyway just keep your members allert for 24 hours and it should go as planned.
Dec Sheild i salute you o7 |
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