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Evil Incarn8
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.10.19 11:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
Ok this is by no means a finished idea and will require tweaking (prob with a large hammer) to iron out whatever glaring problems I have missed.
This idea revolves around the trade hub (namely Jita) issue and why people tend to congregate rather than go down their local mini hub, also to a lessor extent this can be seen as addressing the Industry in 0.0 thing.
The TLDR of this is simple, add a tax based on ship mass for jumping through regional gates, capped at a minimum size so as not to hurt frigs/cruisers etc.
I know this isnt exactly in the style of things to introduce an NPC rule to curb player activities but I think the concept if not this exact implementation has legs.
The main effects of this as I see them are;
1) Inter hub freighting will be hit hardest, long route including multiple region gates with the highest ship mass tarriff being charged. This will encourage traders/Industrialists to consider selling their wears at a closer hub rather than paying the premium to take their goods to Jita.
2) The Jita supply run. Why doesnt anyone build stuff in 0.0? its easier faster and cheaper to buy it in Jita and haul it out. Regional gate taxes will add to the cost of Jita products either through gate travel or the jump bridge fuel to bypass the gates.
3) Losec boost. Ya rly, what is the shortest route from Jita to Rens? via Rancer, What is the shortest route from Amarr to Rens? via Amamake. The incentive to take a shortcut through lowsec is now no longer just a time issue, it will cost you less as well (assuming you dont blow up horribly).
4) This wont hit the small volume specialist item market, running to Jita for that meta 14 shield rep in your covert ops wont incur you any tax, but buying 10 battleships and hauling them home in a freighter will.
If you want to put a little RP on it, well its customs fees, the Empires dont particularly like each other so like in RL they charge import/export duties on all cargos.
There are prob additional benefits, spinoffs and/or mistakes I have not seen in my Eureka moment so feel free to discuss them below.
Evil Incarn8. |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
11
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Posted - 2011.10.19 12:22:00 -
[2] - Quote
You are not required to go to Jita, if someone else does then more power to them cause its their choice. Everybody has this terrible idea that the empires must be cordoned off from each other to boost local markets, when in fact if you do that you will increase local competition as everyone moves out of Jita (which either drives up the cost of goods or drives it down reducing profit depending on the .01 isk habits of people). Do you want more people .01isk in your local non-jita markets? If you do, it sounds like an awesome idea to give yourself more frustration to .01 those orders every 30 seconds (with multiple orders). If you don't, then it sounds like an awesome idea to just leave the system as it is and how you can exploit it to your benifit by manipulating with less hassle in your local market while picking up cheaper items at the Regional Jita swapmeet. |
COMM4NDER
Umbrella Holding Inc Umbrella Chemical Inc
17
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Posted - 2011.10.19 12:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
Well its not that easy about this issue, Jita is like supermarkets having all stuff in one place instead of going shop by shop to get all your all stuff.
This is one way of doing it but it wont fix it since lowsec routes sure they are not taking tax but the risk of getting blown up is not worth it.
But this is something I will follow to se how this develops. |
XXSketchxx
Remote Soviet Industries
32
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Posted - 2011.10.19 13:11:00 -
[4] - Quote
Supported, along with fees on all gates. Noob systems free, systems within constellations cost a fee, cross constellations a fee 5x that of in constellation, and then cross regional 5x cross constellation.
Isk sinks are fun. |
Mirima Thurander
Deventer Exploration An Acquisition
22
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Posted - 2011.10.19 15:21:00 -
[5] - Quote
i like I love the the smell of victory in the morning. It smells like... Blood, vomit and burning flesh. |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
38
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Posted - 2011.10.19 16:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
Hi. I do small scale import in a blockade runner sometimes. Your idea would make that seriously unprofitable, yet the guys who use jump freighters wouldn't even notice it. This makes it a bad idea. |
XXSketchxx
Remote Soviet Industries
32
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Posted - 2011.10.19 16:47:00 -
[7] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:Hi. I do small scale import in a blockade runner sometimes. Your idea would make that seriously unprofitable, yet the guys who use jump freighters wouldn't even notice it. This makes it a bad idea.
"Hurts me, thus its a bad idea." |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
39
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Posted - 2011.10.19 17:51:00 -
[8] - Quote
XXSketchxx wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Hi. I do small scale import in a blockade runner sometimes. Your idea would make that seriously unprofitable, yet the guys who use jump freighters wouldn't even notice it. This makes it a bad idea. "Hurts me, thus its a bad idea."
Hurts the small scale, leaves the huge scale alone, actually. A jump freighter hauls hundreds of times what a blockade runner does, yet it won't need to use gates, so it won't be paying any taxes, yet a guy with a smaller ship, and thus much smaller profits anyway, will have to pay the tax. |
XXSketchxx
Remote Soviet Industries
33
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Posted - 2011.10.19 17:55:00 -
[9] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:XXSketchxx wrote:Danika Princip wrote:Hi. I do small scale import in a blockade runner sometimes. Your idea would make that seriously unprofitable, yet the guys who use jump freighters wouldn't even notice it. This makes it a bad idea. "Hurts me, thus its a bad idea." Hurts the small scale, leaves the huge scale alone, actually. A jump freighter hauls hundreds of times what a blockade runner does, yet it won't need to use gates, so it won't be paying any taxes, yet a guy with a smaller ship, and thus much smaller profits anyway, will have to pay the tax.
...right because size is an indicator of potential profits. |
Evil Incarn8
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2011.10.19 18:10:00 -
[10] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:
Hurts the small scale, leaves the huge scale alone, actually. A jump freighter hauls hundreds of times what a blockade runner does, yet it won't need to use gates, so it won't be paying any taxes, yet a guy with a smaller ship, and thus much smaller profits anyway, will have to pay the tax.
Did you miss the part where I said the tarriff scaled by ship mass?
Did you miss the part where this is mostly a hub trade thing where jump freighters cannot jump?
As for the other replies, thanks for the comments. I dont see how spreading traders and products out would increase the number of 0.01isk types? you would have fewer traders per hub and thus less need to update so often.
I think fees on every gate is a bit much, i'm trying to curb the tendancy for someone to transport mil of m3 of t1 stuff 50 jumps to sell rather than 3 or 4 to their regional hub. Taxing at every jump would make people into hermits :) Per region or even just the empire borders even if not a great value would add that little extra cost to poke people into selling locally.
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XXSketchxx
Remote Soviet Industries
33
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Posted - 2011.10.19 18:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
Evil Incarn8 wrote:Danika Princip wrote:
Hurts the small scale, leaves the huge scale alone, actually. A jump freighter hauls hundreds of times what a blockade runner does, yet it won't need to use gates, so it won't be paying any taxes, yet a guy with a smaller ship, and thus much smaller profits anyway, will have to pay the tax.
Did you miss the part where I said the tarriff scaled by ship mass? Did you miss the part where this is mostly a hub trade thing where jump freighters cannot jump? As for the other replies, thanks for the comments. I dont see how spreading traders and products out would increase the number of 0.01isk types? you would have fewer traders per hub and thus less need to update so often. I think fees on every gate is a bit much, i'm trying to curb the tendancy for someone to transport mil of m3 of t1 stuff 50 jumps to sell rather than 3 or 4 to their regional hub. Taxing at every jump would make people into hermits :) Per region or even just the empire borders even if not a great value would add that little extra cost to poke people into selling locally.
I WANT MORE ISK SINKS |
Mfume Apocal
Origin. Black Legion.
40
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Posted - 2011.10.19 18:41:00 -
[12] - Quote
Evil Incarn8 wrote:2) The Jita supply run. Why doesnt anyone build stuff in 0.0? its easier faster and cheaper to buy it in Jita and haul it out. Regional gate taxes will add to the cost of Jita products either through gate travel or the jump bridge fuel to bypass the gates.
Look at a highsec system, notice how many stations there are? There are single systems in highsec with more production capability than entire 0.0 regions. And most minerals mined in 0.0 go to the production of supercapitals, even if that's a silly way, inefficient way of doing things.
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Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
39
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Posted - 2011.10.19 19:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
XXSketchxx wrote:
...right because size is an indicator of potential profits.
Carrying 300,000m3 of stuff is generally going to make you more money than carrying 10,000m3 of the same stuff :V
Evil Incarn8 wrote: Did you miss the part where I said the tarriff scaled by ship mass?
Did you miss the part where this is mostly a hub trade thing where jump freighters cannot jump?
As for the other replies, thanks for the comments. I dont see how spreading traders and products out would increase the number of 0.01isk types? you would have fewer traders per hub and thus less need to update so often.
I think fees on every gate is a bit much, i'm trying to curb the tendancy for someone to transport mil of m3 of t1 stuff 50 jumps to sell rather than 3 or 4 to their regional hub. Taxing at every jump would make people into hermits :) Per region or even just the empire borders even if not a great value would add that little extra cost to poke people into selling locally.
cynoing out means no gates are used, means no tax is paid. Jump in to the forge lowsec, jump straight out of jita, pay no tax. Can't do that in a prowler.
Why do trade hubs need to be nerfed anyway? It's a hell of a lot easier to buy and fit a ship in jita than to buy a ship in a regional hub and have to fly fifty jumps to actually get the fittings for it after all. |
Messoroz
AQUILA INC
40
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Posted - 2011.10.19 20:01:00 -
[14] - Quote
highsec to highsec wormholes would finally become useful for bypassing fees I suppose. They can already allow freighters to pass through. |
Evil Incarn8
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2011.10.20 16:38:00 -
[15] - Quote
Danika Princip wrote:
Why do trade hubs need to be nerfed anyway? It's a hell of a lot easier to buy and fit a ship in jita than to buy a ship in a regional hub and have to fly fifty jumps to actually get the fittings for it after all.
I'm not trying to nerf hubs, I'm trying to create more smaller ones, Jita will remain a hub and probably the biggest / best known one for faction and high value items as they wont be traded with large ships.
I am trying to even out the population a bit, why do people fly 20-30 jumps to Jita to fit out a T1 ship wit standard T2 modules? why cant a local hub deal with these buyers, only go to Jita for the specialist / rare things.
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