Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Scrammer
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:15:00 -
[1]
This is rather a simple issue.
If you look at the different types of Warp Jammers, you see that there are 2 types. One has a Warp Scramble Strength of 1, another has a Strength of 2. Strength 1 also has a range of 20km, while Strength 2 a range of 7,500km.
Now...Warp Core Stabilizers only give a +1 bonus to warp scrambling.
So what's to stop someone from equiping two Strength 2 jammers, or one Strength 1 and one Strength 2? That would give that player either 3 or 4 points of scramble strength inside of 7,500km.
The only way I see to counteract that is to equip more than one WCS, but the mod requires a low slot, and I know for most player ship setups you need those low slots fo a lot of other things than just to stabilize your warp core.
Is this something that will continue this way? Or are we going to get some WCS units with a Strength 2 rating?
87.3% of all statistics are made up on the spot |
Dark Shikari
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:17:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Dark Shikari on 27/10/2005 16:16:52 You're lucky warp stabs even do +1 of anti-scramble strength.
ECM, for example, has no comparable countermeasure. Nor does webbing, NOSing, or tracking disrupting.
Oh, and there is a +2 warp core stab... Viceroy has it - Proud member of the [23].
Don't get the reference in my sig? Click it.
|
Liver Damage
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:18:00 -
[3]
/me hands Scrammer flame-proof suit and hides
|
Rufus Roughneck
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:18:00 -
[4]
Rofl.
WCS are most certainly not underused or underpowered. My bet is you will see str 2 wcs when there's str 3 scramblers or str 2 scrambler with alot more range., and not before. Altho tbh, introducing either would be useless, as it would not change the balance, everyone would train for both of them first thing they do.
|
Pestillence
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:19:00 -
[5]
But wcs use no cap and have unlimited range.
This thread is going to go downhill before the end of page1
|
Scrammer
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:20:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Scrammer on 27/10/2005 16:25:22
Originally by: Liver Damage /me hands Scrammer flame-proof suit and hides
I don't care if people want to flame me/bash me/beat me with a baseball bat or whatever it is they do.
I'm just duscussing game mechanics in a public forum, and if people don't want to contribute to the discussion in an adult manner, well then I won't force them to.
87.3% of all statistics are made up on the spot |
DarkStar251
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:24:00 -
[7]
Yes, WCS need to be nerfed so they prevent the use of any offensive modules. Hell even prevent your ship from locking by interfereing with your targetting scanners :P
WCS are for travelling, in which case fitting 3 or 4 of them isnt a problem as you dont need the slots ofr other things. They should not be for combat at all. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) |
Score
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:26:00 -
[8]
roflmao, range on a wcs? What ya gonna point it at besides your own ship? If they put in a Remote WCS, then I would expect range.
In any case, the issues with the WCS & Jammers are well known and compensated for. I would really have to agree with Rufus!
|
Manwoman
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:38:00 -
[9]
Originally by: DarkStar251 Yes, WCS need to be nerfed so they prevent the use of any offensive modules. Hell even prevent your ship from locking by interfereing with your targetting scanners :P
WCS are for travelling, in which case fitting 3 or 4 of them isnt a problem as you dont need the slots ofr other things. They should not be for combat at all.
Why shouldn't warp cores be used on a ship that can fight? Because you want to have 100% of all fights to the death?
|
Hex Stiletto
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:41:00 -
[10]
Warp core stabs are a piece of nonsense. Can you imagine it.
Captain: Engage warp drive Engineer: Sorry sir, canna dae it, you swapped the warp core stabs for 3 cases of Corellian Wine. [boom]
I feel this is more likely
Captain: Engage warp drive Pointy Ear Guy: We a currently being warp scrambled. Captain: I need warp drive......now
[Engineer flips oversized switches, slides sliders while muttering something about the laws of fizziks]
Pointy Ear Guy: Warp drive back on line.
[woosh]
I myself never fit them, or scramblers, I find it much more effective just to blow up the ship of the guy who has fitted the scrambler.
Hex Stiletto - Pan Galactic Gigolo Your pleasure is my business Available for weddings, funerals and Bar Mitzvah Contact me for rates and availability |
|
Rodge
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:47:00 -
[11]
The devs are already very well aware of the overpowered nature of the existing warp core stabilisers.
That's why there's no WCS II BPO being dropped and it's unlikely that there will be until there's some kind of rework of warp scrambling.
[ 2005.04.17 00:34:30 ] Nagilam > u better leave Rodge, u will not gank any1 else 2nite......
|
Remedial
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:49:00 -
[12]
I think a "chance of success to avoid scrambling" WCS would be preferable to the current system, but no doubt such an implementation would be preceded by an avalanche of whining.
|
Shin Ra
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 16:53:00 -
[13]
Lol. WCS are for whatever you want them to be for. Just because half of eve is too stupid/up themselves to realise they are good modules that have their uses (even in combat). They allow us to get way more kills and also stop some losses (although surprisingly not that many).
|
Scrammer
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 17:00:00 -
[14]
I've been saved a few times, but that's only after I decided to fit a few.
87.3% of all statistics are made up on the spot |
Kara Kaprica
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 17:06:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Kara Kaprica on 27/10/2005 17:10:22 Warp Core Stabilizers are fine as they are. They reduce armour tanking ability, offensive capability (dmg mods) Passive speed mods, cargo space, and anything else you care to put in your low slots. They are a trade off. Ability to POSSIBLY (depending on your agressers Scrambler setup) get away from and engagement once it turns against you, for reduced effectiveness during that engagement. if you are fighting close range they also out-slot scramblers by two to one, as you need two stabs to get away from one strength 2.
EDIT, and to people who moan about stabs, i got one word for you. Stiletto.
|
Sarmaul
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 17:58:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Kara Kaprica
EDIT, and to people who moan about stabs, i got one word for you. Stiletto.
won't scramble a fully stabbed geddon
Originally by: Chowdown We camp a lot
|
pardux
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 18:04:00 -
[17]
wcs's need -15%pg and 50-60cpu ._.
|
Goberth Ludwig
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 18:35:00 -
[18]
Stabs are retarded because they are the number 1 reason solo pvp in eve is so difficult.
Of course tho, most people do not pvp solo so they dont realise that.
- Gob (also known as Admiral Goberius) |
Meridius
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 18:40:00 -
[19]
They need to get rid of the cap use on scramblers and disruptors or just vastly decrease it.
________________________________________________________
|
Skyscorcher
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 18:47:00 -
[20]
I just think that it's funny that Scrammer's name is very similar to Scrambler.
*Scrambles Scrammer* Wheeee! ______________________________
PLAY LIKE YA GOT A PAIR! |
|
Scrammer
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 19:00:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Skyscorcher I just think that it's funny that Scrammer's name is very similar to Scrambler.
*Scrambles Scrammer* Wheeee!
Actually..... =)
People keep calling me "Scrammer the Scammer."
*Holding fingers out like Nixon* I'm not a crook!
87.3% of all statistics are made up on the spot |
hylleX
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 19:18:00 -
[22]
Oh noes!
Well kids you've tried your best and failed miserably, the lesson is: never try |
Mercy Less
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 19:19:00 -
[23]
As we have seen things go from 0/1 type of mechanics to chance based (like EW), I keep wondering why scramblers and webbers are still 100% effective every time they are used.
IMO scramblers should have a chance of failure even if the opponent doesn't have WCS fitted. If a WCS is fitted, the chance of failure would increase dramatically but it would still be possible to scramble the opponent. And I'd imagine that the warp engines of a battleship would be better shielded than a frigate has, requiring several tacklers against a single battleship to prevent it from escaping where as a single tackler would be able to scramble a frig.
For webbers it probably wouldn't work the same way as there is no counter module against them. I think there should be webber for each class of a ship, a small webber would slow 75% of the speed of small ships, but only 10-15% of a battleship. Battleship class webber would slow 75% of the speed of a battleship and 97% of the speed of a frigate (right tool for the right job).
|
Maya Rkell
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 19:34:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Maya Rkell on 27/10/2005 19:36:44
Originally by: Remedial I think a "chance of success to avoid scrambling" WCS would be preferable to the current system, but no doubt such an implementation would be preceded by an avalanche of whining.
Do bear in mind that (and no, this isn't a whine, it's a point) that is a 0 WCS ship has a chance to escape scrambling, pirates are allways going to kill rather than ransom.
Mercy Less, you are NOT going to find many proponents of chance-based webbing, btw. And your "right tool for the right job" is another tired old BS supreme post. NO.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
Rangoon
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 19:37:00 -
[25]
It amazes me how most of the complainers are people who feel they were somehow ripped off or jaded because their prey can actually get away from them.
Lets get rid of insta's because ... well because ... I can't solo camp a gate now and destroy and loot Industrial ships.
Lets get rid of WCS because ... well because when my HAC engaged that cruiser, it warped away despite me warp scrambling it. Big deal. Open the Eve map and select show pods destroyed in last 24 hours.
Other people are destroying player ships and podding them. Why do they have to make it easier for you.
|
Leitari
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 20:59:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Leitari on 27/10/2005 20:59:21 look at the slots, there are ****loads more of lowslots on ships then medslots, you cant deny that. Now, if you are using a 7500meter scrambler then you need to have a mwd on your frig to be able to mwd quickly to your target and hold it down. So I think your point is totally void. And you have to sacrifice the security of getting away for something else like Tanking!!! Or else it would suck. Also I really want to put something else instead of warp scramblers in my med slots but I have to use warpscramblers or else those targets are going to get away :( boohoo
I mean, Im fighting people that put Warp core stabilizers on their damned tech 1 frigates ffs.
|
SoldierOfFortune
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 21:09:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Hex Stiletto Warp core stabs are a piece of nonsense. Can you imagine it.
Captain: Engage warp drive Engineer: Sorry sir, canna dae it, you swapped the warp core stabs for 3 cases of Corellian Wine. [boom]
I feel this is more likely
Captain: Engage warp drive Pointy Ear Guy: We a currently being warp scrambled. Captain: I need warp drive......now
[Engineer flips oversized switches, slides sliders while muttering something about the laws of fizziks]
Pointy Ear Guy: Warp drive back on line.
[woosh]
I myself never fit them, or scramblers, I find it much more effective just to blow up the ship of the guy who has fitted the scrambler.
thats kool and for that...
I have an idea... lol
why not remove the stregth of wcs and scrammers all together, why not change it to a frequcny system?? the way a scrammer jams the core is by probably emiting a beam into the core, which would be runnning at a frequncy, so you would have a max of 1 scrammer and one wcs unit on a ship (like MWD's) and....the scrammer would didrupt the core at a fequceny of say.. 12.6mhz or something, and the Wcs unit would change the ferquceny of the warp core untill it found the ferqucny of the scrammer which would be 12.6mhz in this case, and at that point the ship could warp out, also the scrammer would have to change its ferqucny to rescramm, so there might be a 10-30second lock out time to rescram the same ship, of course the ferqucny would be random, so the time it takes to get free would be differnet each time. so basicly you have...
a scrammer.....disrupts core on a random ferqucny (disabling the warp core)
and the wcs unit would have to change the base ferqucny of the warp core to conspemsate, and allow warp out.
im sorry, i hope you all get what i mean, but im a bad explainer hehe :)
|
Antoinette Civari
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 21:23:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Antoinette Civari on 27/10/2005 21:32:33
Originally by: Mercy Less As we have seen things go from 0/1 type of mechanics to chance based (like EW), I keep wondering why scramblers and webbers are still 100% effective every time they are used.
It was planned and implented on Singularity but fortunately the devs cancelled it. We really dont need another vital part of pvp depending on luck tbh :F Furthermore, a chance based scrambling system shifts the advantage way to much towards the wcs user - if he gets lucky and the scrambler fails, his ship gets away. If the scrambler gets lucky enough to scramble him, even though he doesnt have enough scrambling strenghts, he only has about 5 seconds time to kill his target because it is actually very unlikely that he gets lucky again on the next cycle and i think, and i'm sure everyone can agree here, that 5 seconds are definitely not enough time to kill a target in a standard 1on1 situation.
<edit/> ty maya, havent checked that in a long time ;)
|
dantes inferno
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 21:28:00 -
[29]
the only change i would like to see is the 20Km change to a 35KM scrambler and a 7.5km to a 15km scrambler. scrambling on anything but a frig is dificult due to the small range and makes the 7.5km scrambler redundant which as previously mentioned makes solo pvp very difficult _____
|
Maya Rkell
|
Posted - 2005.10.27 21:29:00 -
[30]
Er.
Scrambler cycles are *5* seconds long.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |