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Jen Ann Tonique
University of Caille Gallente Federation
7
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Posted - 2013.05.29 21:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
Okay, I have looked around and through the commonly proposed ideas thread and and have kept an eye a bit for various ideas and so far nothing has really stuck. One thing that seems to be common is the idea to include some kind of "mini game" that needs human interaction. Only problem is, most of them would require more work to implement than it's worth.
So I had an idea, why not use what's already in the game to do it? Alright, most players and miners (I hope) know about modules that scan the nearby astroids and then gives you information regarding size and/or units left.
That's the key here.
Next up, we have these advanced mining lasers with their own tractor beams that can pinpoint the ore and extract only what's necessary right? This should leave behind an empty rock. Not make the rock you were mining magically disappear. With current mechanics you can warp to 0 on a belt and almost just by looking figure about how much ore is there, seems a bit odd to me.
What I propose is;
leaving the rocks in the belts after they are mined out. The name and look of the rocks would not change. This means that you would have to actively scan the rocks to find out which ones still had minerals in them.
Additionally let the lasers keep running on a rock instead of shutting off by themselves. If a person is AFK, the mining lasers will attempt to keep extracting ore from the rocks they are working on because the rock wouldn't just vanish. This means that a player would have to keep track of their ore and scan new asteroids in order to keep up their maximum yield. This means that you can't (or at least it would be much more difficult to) AFK mine, although you might get some "free" ore it wouldn't last very long.
I believe it is possible to put a survey scanner I (or better) on every mining vessel so this should be a non issue.
The way I see it the coding required to do this should all be in the game now and this "should be" easy to implement and would actively discourage AFK mining. This would increase mineral prices, which would increase ship prices. To adjust maybe CCP could take the "extra materials" off all the blueprints...(I can dream right?)
yays/nays? Jen Ann Tonique does not approve of this product and/or service. Any comments contained herin are to be taken not seriously and no person/s shall hold Jen Ann Tonique responsible for any damage real and/or imagined due to use or misuse of above comment. By reading this statement you agree to the above terms. |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc Ex Cinere Scriptor
1756
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Posted - 2013.05.29 21:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
I would suggest something slightly different, in that many suggestions along this line of thinking hits a conflict.
Many players see mining as a low effort means of relaxing in game, and don't want that changed or devalued.
Now, if you can find a means to make higher levels of activity convert to higher returns, but still keep the casual feel of slow and steady progress for the easy going crowd, I think you'll have it. Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata) Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14795
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Posted - 2013.05.29 21:43:00 -
[3] - Quote
You can only AFK mine for so long, as it still requires human input to continue. Exactly what problem are you trying to solve here? Just looks like a pain in the arse for no good reason tbh.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Sean Parisi
Fugutive Task Force
281
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Posted - 2013.05.29 21:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Just looks like a pain in the arse for no good reason tbh.
People need to stop trying to fix unbroken mechanics. I agree that mining could be more interesting and there should be a way for more active miners to get out there and risk their ship but pull in more minerals (Not talking about Lowsec or Null sec belts). Something along the lines of working as a team to avoid gas explosions or whatever else. But fact is, AFK mining is a non issue. Similar to how cloaking is a non issue.
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Jen Ann Tonique
University of Caille Gallente Federation
7
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Posted - 2013.05.29 22:12:00 -
[5] - Quote
It is an issue, unless you are a AFK miner...
I see mining ships killed everyday b/c the players are afk and somebody comes in and blows them up.
And this provides greater reward to those that are paying more attention to their mining.
This would also deter boting.
The bots might be able to click through and find 'roids...but can they sort through a list and pick the right rock? Probably not. Jen Ann Tonique does not approve of this product and/or service. Any comments contained herin are to be taken not seriously and no person/s shall hold Jen Ann Tonique responsible for any damage real and/or imagined due to use or misuse of above comment. By reading this statement you agree to the above terms. |
Sean Parisi
Fugutive Task Force
282
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Posted - 2013.05.29 22:20:00 -
[6] - Quote
Jen Ann Tonique wrote:It is an issue, unless you are a AFK miner...
I see mining ships killed everyday b/c the players are afk and somebody comes in and blows them up.
And this provides greater reward to those that are paying more attention to their mining.
This would also deter boting.
The bots might be able to click through and find 'roids...but can they sort through a list and pick the right rock? Probably not.
Ta-Da, Solution. If you don't pay attention, your gonna get ganked. Problem? That seems like it is only an issue to those people who choose to AFK mine, which as far as I'm concerned I do not care about ( though I care about their playstyle, an easy going one).
See this is different. You are saying "AFK mining" vs "Botting". There is a major difference between the two, I can set up a retriever to mine ice and go to work for the day. A Botter doesn't require my input.
So yes, if it is botting - solutions are needed and it should be stopped and deterred. Afk mining though? No, its fine. |
Sean Parisi
Fugutive Task Force
282
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Posted - 2013.05.29 22:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
Also this just looks like it would be a royal pain in the @$$ for actual miners. Having to scan through each rock to get the same pay off that they would otherwise get. Cluttery and annoying, not fun - nor interesting. As such I do not see it as an improvement from my personal point of view. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14796
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Posted - 2013.05.29 22:47:00 -
[8] - Quote
Jen Ann Tonique wrote:It is an issue, unless you are a AFK miner...
I see mining ships killed everyday b/c the players are afk and somebody comes in and blows them up.
And this provides greater reward to those that are paying more attention to their mining.
This would also deter boting.
The bots might be able to click through and find 'roids...but can they sort through a list and pick the right rock? Probably not. If people die then that's a good thing. It doesn't mean that AFK mining is a problem. So what is the problem?
Oh and botting and AFK mining are a seperate thing. CCP already target botters, they don't target AFK mining.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14796
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 22:49:00 -
[9] - Quote
Sean Parisi wrote:Also this just looks like it would be a royal pain in the @$$ for actual miners. Having to scan through each rock to get the same pay off that they would otherwise get. Cluttery and annoying, not fun - nor interesting. As such I do not see it as an improvement from my personal point of view. Plus botters wouldn't have a problem with this change. Where as like we both say, for players it would be a pain in the ass and for what?
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Jen Ann Tonique
University of Caille Gallente Federation
7
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Posted - 2013.05.29 23:01:00 -
[10] - Quote
A pain in the ass? I guess you don't check to make sure you don't full cycle your lasers on a rock with 100 units left in it eh? I know I do so I can short cycle my lasers and increase my yield and/or decrease my time spent wasted in the belts. Jen Ann Tonique does not approve of this product and/or service. Any comments contained herin are to be taken not seriously and no person/s shall hold Jen Ann Tonique responsible for any damage real and/or imagined due to use or misuse of above comment. By reading this statement you agree to the above terms. |
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Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14796
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Posted - 2013.05.29 23:05:00 -
[11] - Quote
Still waiting for you to tell us the problem that needs fixing.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Rayzilla Zaraki
Tandokuno
44
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Posted - 2013.05.29 23:17:00 -
[12] - Quote
Oh wait! I know!
Let's add in "dead" rocks to the mix so that 75% of every belt is comprised of these.
Then, let's make it so players have to scan each and every rock one at a time to ascertain their composition.
Yeah...that'd be fun.
Wheee.
As much as I like change and challenges, I think mining can be pretty much left alone in Eve. So what if you can go AFK while doing it? It's a damn boring means to an end if you ask me. I do everything I can to get as much ISK per hour out of it so I can engage in other aspects of the game. If nothing blew up, no one would buy your stuff. |
SGT FUNYOUN
Arachnea Phoenix Battalion Hoodlums Associates
67
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Posted - 2013.05.29 23:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
Mag's wrote:You can only AFK mine for so long, as it still requires human input to continue. Exactly what problem are you trying to solve here? Just looks like a pain in the arse for no good reason tbh.
BOT Miners... the fix here is against bot miners. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14796
|
Posted - 2013.05.29 23:53:00 -
[14] - Quote
SGT FUNYOUN wrote:Mag's wrote:You can only AFK mine for so long, as it still requires human input to continue. Exactly what problem are you trying to solve here? Just looks like a pain in the arse for no good reason tbh. BOT Miners... the fix here is against bot miners. Except it isn't.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Hesod Adee
Turalyon Plus
10
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Posted - 2013.05.30 00:00:00 -
[15] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Oh and botting and AFK mining are a seperate thing. CCP already target botters, they don't target AFK mining. Well, they don't target AFK miners with bans. But the Odyssey Ice changes tell me that CCP still want AFK miners gone.
SGT FUNYOUN wrote:BOT Miners... the fix here is against bot miners. I see nothing in this thread that will actually hurt the bot miners. They will just rewrite their bots to deal with the gameplay change and continue botting.
Leave mined out rocks. Bots can scan rocks just as well as everybody else. Keep the laser running on empty rocks. Bots will just track the amount they scanned against the amount they have mined and stop themselves. Or keep scanning.
Make it profitable to gank miners. Bot miners already flee when unknown ships get too close. |
Sean Parisi
Fugutive Task Force
284
|
Posted - 2013.05.30 01:34:00 -
[16] - Quote
Hesod Adee wrote:Mag's wrote:Oh and botting and AFK mining are a seperate thing. CCP already target botters, they don't target AFK mining. Well, they don't target AFK miners with bans. But the Odyssey Ice changes tell me that CCP still want AFK miners gone. SGT FUNYOUN wrote:BOT Miners... the fix here is against bot miners. I see nothing in this thread that will actually hurt the bot miners. They will just rewrite their bots to deal with the gameplay change and continue botting. Leave mined out rocks. Bots can scan rocks just as well as everybody else. Keep the laser running on empty rocks. Bots will just track the amount they scanned against the amount they have mined and stop themselves. Or keep scanning. Make it profitable to gank miners. Bot miners already flee when unknown ships get too close.
Wrong, it isn't an issue with AFKer's mining. It is an issue of High Sec ice supply being able to supply both High, Low, Null and Wormhole space. Supply / Demand issue. |
Cekle Skyscales
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.05.30 03:12:00 -
[17] - Quote
Personally I would really like it if every asteroid belt were made into an anomaly.
Either that, or make them into a single gigantic ring around the system similar to our asteroid belt where the majority is unmineable rock with pockets of mineable rock. Think the current ice belts but even more massive. |
sabre906
Old Spice Syndicate Sailors of the Sacred Spice
1129
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Posted - 2013.05.30 04:09:00 -
[18] - Quote
Let us raise mineral prices even high so that everything cost even more. Because it fixes things. Standings Improvement Service https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19454 |
Hesod Adee
Turalyon Plus
10
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Posted - 2013.05.30 04:23:00 -
[19] - Quote
Sean Parisi wrote:Wrong, it isn't an issue with AFKer's mining. It is an issue of High Sec ice supply being able to supply both High, Low, Null and Wormhole space. Supply / Demand issue.
That's also part of it. If it was adjusting supply, CCP could have just reduced the amount of Ice in each belt. Instead they also set the anomalies to deplete quickly. Encouraging conflict between ice miners. Even if that conflict is limited to bumping, the AFKer will be hurt more than the ATK player because the AFK will take longer to reactivate their mining equipment. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14806
|
Posted - 2013.05.30 09:08:00 -
[20] - Quote
Hesod Adee wrote:Mag's wrote:Oh and botting and AFK mining are a seperate thing. CCP already target botters, they don't target AFK mining. Well, they don't target AFK miners with bans. But the Odyssey Ice changes tell me that CCP still want AFK miners gone. I respect that that's your take on the situation. But it is not the same as CCP targeting AFK miners, or in fact proof that they want them gone.
Hesod Adee wrote:SGT FUNYOUN wrote:BOT Miners... the fix here is against bot miners. I see nothing in this thread that will actually hurt the bot miners. They will just rewrite their bots to deal with the gameplay change and continue botting. Leave mined out rocks. Bots can scan rocks just as well as everybody else. Keep the laser running on empty rocks. Bots will just track the amount they scanned against the amount they have mined and stop themselves. Or keep scanning. Make it profitable to gank miners. Bot miners already flee when unknown ships get too close. Exactly. This change does nothing to botters, it just adds tedium for players.
Anyway the OP was regarding AFK miners and I'm still waiting to here the problem about it that needs fixing.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
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Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
1904
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Posted - 2013.05.30 10:00:00 -
[21] - Quote
I like my ideas better.
You can afk mine, but not efficiently (strip mining). If you want to choose your ore, you have to be somewhat active (deposit mining). If you are very active you can even get a higher output (vein mining). Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics |
Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
208
|
Posted - 2013.05.30 18:23:00 -
[22] - Quote
Jen Ann Tonique wrote:Okay, I have looked around and through the commonly proposed ideas thread and and have kept an eye a bit for various ideas and so far nothing has really stuck. One thing that seems to be common is the idea to include some kind of "mini game" that needs human interaction. Only problem is, most of them would require more work to implement than it's worth.
So I had an idea, why not use what's already in the game to do it? Alright, most players and miners (I hope) know about modules that scan the nearby astroids and then gives you information regarding size and/or units left.
Why is the problem with AFK mining? You are assuming there is a problem here. I don't see it. If a guy wants to park himself in a belt with a mackinaw and start his miners on a block of ice, then go afk for 45 minutes to do something else, what is the big deal?
What really gets me...afk in station. Mother of God that is ruining the game!
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Teckos Pech
The Executives Executive Outcomes
208
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Posted - 2013.05.30 18:35:00 -
[23] - Quote
Hesod Adee wrote:Mag's wrote:Oh and botting and AFK mining are a seperate thing. CCP already target botters, they don't target AFK mining. Well, they don't target AFK miners with bans. But the Odyssey Ice changes tell me that CCP still want AFK miners gone.
No, there will be nothing stopping you from scanning down the ice anomaly, warping there, finding a block of ice that has enough ice for several cycles, maybe two if you are in a mackinaw, and starting your lasers then going afk. It might not be as efficient as it is now, since the ice roids never deplete, but afk mining would still be an option. |
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