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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Jason Xado
Xado Industries
136
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Posted - 2013.06.09 14:46:00 -
[31] - Quote
Artemis Ellery Sazas wrote:If they were trying to remove botting and 50 ship mining fleets, epic fail. All they really managed to accomplish is to hurt the small, casual ice mining corp. Botting is back from what I am seeing. They will now mine a bigger percentage of available ice and sell it for higher profits as the ice price rises. Win win for botters!
For me personally I could really care less about ice mining. However I did do a little afk ice mining while watching a ballgame or something, but now I just log off.
Instead of teasing high sec miners with 30 minutes ice belts, I think they should have moved all the ice to low & null like was planned. They could also ban the use of multibox programs and stop the 50 ship mining fleets. Why not offer a reward to increase reporting suspected botters? For every confirmed botter, maybe CCP could pay out 100, 200, 500 million isk? Offering rewards, along with CCP fighting botting programs may be a better alternative. The best anti-botting tool CCP has is other players, so empower them to help you fight illegal activities. If a program like that already exists, I'm sorry I've never heard about it. I believe there were better ways to change ice mining and have a better system than is currently running.
I think the idea was to screw afk playing, mostly mining. However, can someone tell me the difference between afk mining and afk freighter flying. After all afk is afk. I would suggest on the next expansion CCP remove the autopilot button, since I bet there are many more player flying afk around Eve than mining afk.
1.) Multiboxing is valid gameplay. It allows a level playing field for smaller groups (or solo players) to compete with larger groups. 2.) Please do not confuse botting with multiboxing, they are not the same thing.
Thank you for your cooperation, it is much appreciated. |
Moonlit Raid
State War Academy Caldari State
94
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Posted - 2013.06.09 17:23:00 -
[32] - Quote
I think they've done well actually with what they've done. cranking out 50 ships for 5 minutes of mining isn't really worth it any more. I never really liked that ice belts didn't run out. |
Dave Stark
3143
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Posted - 2013.06.09 17:27:00 -
[33] - Quote
Moonlit Raid wrote:I think they've done well actually with what they've done. cranking out 50 ships for 5 minutes of mining isn't really worth it any more. I never really liked that ice belts didn't run out.
your average high sec ice site is still worth over half a billion isk per spawn. if you can mine all of it in 5 mins then that's worth the time, for sure. |
Morgan Knight
Halcyon Knights Incorporated
0
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Posted - 2013.06.10 17:42:00 -
[34] - Quote
Lyra Jedran wrote:I donGÇÖt see what all the fuss is about. My mining fleet mines in a system that takes 2 and a half hours to chew the ice anomaly. There is another system with an ice belt three jumps away that takes even longer to finish off their ice anomaly. If I felt like it I could mine ice all day long going back and forth. As always in Eve the rich get richer as they can afford to plan ahead and bankroll larger mining fleets.Hooray for progress.
Your experience is clearly not the norm though. I mine in a very out of the way system with no station, the ice belt there lasts about 1-2 hours depending on the time of day, as I recall the nearest alternative belt is 8 jumps away in a very busy system. IGÇÖm all for stopping the botting but a 4 hour respawn is painful. Even if you do see the previous spawn get totally mined out, it then requires you to either plan your day around getting on EVE at a set time, not mine ice or rely on luck. As other have said, two hours would be much nicer. |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E. Aegis Solaris
1953
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Posted - 2013.06.10 23:51:00 -
[35] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:what? nothing in that situation favours botters at all. Actually it does. A bot can sit patently doing nothing for four hours, then the second a spawn shows log in the fleet and blob the field. A person will have a real hard time doing that without going insane in short order.
By the way, does a ice belt always spawn at downtime if the system was cleared before downtime? In other words, is someone who logs in right after downtime guaranteed to see ice? If so its a bit of an issue.
A player who's window for eve play starts 2 hours after downtime and ends 5 hours after downtime will almost never see ice. The first spawn of the day will have already been cleared and the next will come right at the end of his window. I thought the idea of the 4 hour timer was so anyone in any time zone would have an equal chance at ice. But for that to be so, the 4 hour timer has to bridge downtime.
Is the first spawn linked to downtime? http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Styth spiting
Ion Corp. NightSong Directorate
318
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Posted - 2013.06.11 01:17:00 -
[36] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:Dave Stark wrote:what? nothing in that situation favours botters at all. Actually it does. A bot can sit patently doing nothing for four hours, then the second a spawn shows log in the fleet and blob the field. A person will have a real hard time doing that without going insane in short order. By the way, does a ice belt always spawn at downtime if the system was cleared before downtime? In other words, is someone who logs in right after downtime guaranteed to see ice? If so its a bit of an issue. A player who's window for eve play starts 2 hours after downtime and ends 5 hours after downtime will almost never see ice. The first spawn of the day will have already been cleared and the next will come right at the end of his window. I thought the idea of the 4 hour timer was so anyone in any time zone would have an equal chance at ice. But for that to be so, the 4 hour timer has to bridge downtime. Is the first spawn linked to downtime?
If you stay in system your scanner will not update with any new sites. Not sure if this was intentional or not but as of yet new sites that spawn will not show up in your display until you logout or leave system, so botters cannot just wait around (until CCP makes the sites refresh correctly, and even then, they repop in a different location).
They do not spawn at down time. The count down continues from whenever they were depleated counting downtime.
You may never see ice in the systems YOU are watching, but I've been in several systems where there have only been 5 - 10 people mining ice. If you're mining ice in heavily populated areas with popular ice belts thats your own fault. Do your research and find out of the way areas people don't mine, and then defend them against other miners. |
Revolution Rising
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
382
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Posted - 2013.06.11 03:36:00 -
[37] - Quote
CCP cares nothing for mining except where it impacts PVP and 0.0 players.
Surely the past few years have made this clear ?
The mining profession has been broken for a long long time - there is little interest in fixing it from CSM, and none from CCP.
When they make a change like this and it impacts mining/industry, the care factor is close to zero from all parties concerned.
Perhaps if you worded it in such a way as it shows the impact that 4 hour respawns effect the PVP community or stop retention of new players, someone might care. Or if perhaps the entire economy were to fall apart because of it, they might change it. CSM7 Skype Leak
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Dave Stark
3159
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Posted - 2013.06.11 09:53:00 -
[38] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:Dave Stark wrote:what? nothing in that situation favours botters at all. Actually it does. A bot can sit patently doing nothing for four hours, then the second a spawn shows log in the fleet and blob the field. A person will have a real hard time doing that without going insane in short order. By the way, does a ice belt always spawn at downtime if the system was cleared before downtime? In other words, is someone who logs in right after downtime guaranteed to see ice? If so its a bit of an issue. A player who's window for eve play starts 2 hours after downtime and ends 5 hours after downtime will almost never see ice. The first spawn of the day will have already been cleared and the next will come right at the end of his window. I thought the idea of the 4 hour timer was so anyone in any time zone would have an equal chance at ice. But for that to be so, the 4 hour timer has to bridge downtime. Is the first spawn linked to downtime?
players can sit patiently doing nothing for hours too.
no, it doesn't respawn at downtime as far as i know because that'd make the new system completely pointless.
boohoo some one is too lazy to move to find ice when there isn't any in their system. well, **** them for being lazy. people do have an equal chance to mine ice, you people keep using this ****** argument like the respawn timer is at a fixed time in the day. tip: it's not. |
Trilanttia
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2013.06.15 17:58:00 -
[39] - Quote
energypills wrote:Mark Munoz wrote:You do know that your ship can use star gates to travel to other systems that also spawn ice belts right? Yeah I want to jump 24 slow alignments to another system to see if a belt just 'happens' to be there.
That is exactly what I have been doing. I thought I was never going to find an ice belt, but it only took me about 10-15 jumps to find one today. Tomorrow........ it may be a different story. I can mine ice now, I am much happier. |
Kirkwood Ross
Golden Profession
34
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Posted - 2013.06.16 03:13:00 -
[40] - Quote
The blog says ice belts respawn 4 hours after depleted. I've seen ice belts respawn in 4-7 hours after being depleted so i'm not sure what's up with that. |
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Joanna RB
JoJo Industries n Shipbreakers
8
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Posted - 2013.07.19 17:06:00 -
[41] - Quote
With 5 alts - Buy 40 macks. Base yourself in a system with a nice run of 8 ice systems that rings back to your 'base'. Ship five macks to each ice system. Run between them in a shuttle or nano frig until you find a spawn. Autopilot your alts to that system in shuttles, have your team mack up, and mine. When the belt pops, put everyone back in shuttles, leave your alts alone and go back to running the 'ring' with one alt as before. |
Zero Sum Gain
The Scope Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2013.07.20 02:46:00 -
[42] - Quote
I'm not seeing your conclusion. From the title I assume you're condemning the ice system and the post is how to 'exploit' it? This new learning amazes me sir Bedimere. Tell me again how sheep's bladders may be employed to prevent earthquake. |
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
34
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:09:00 -
[43] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:Dave Stark wrote:what? nothing in that situation favours botters at all. Actually it does. A bot can sit patently doing nothing for four hours, then the second a spawn shows log in the fleet and blob the field. A person will have a real hard time doing that without going insane in short order. By the way, does a ice belt always spawn at downtime if the system was cleared before downtime? In other words, is someone who logs in right after downtime guaranteed to see ice? If so its a bit of an issue. A player who's window for eve play starts 2 hours after downtime and ends 5 hours after downtime will almost never see ice. The first spawn of the day will have already been cleared and the next will come right at the end of his window. I thought the idea of the 4 hour timer was so anyone in any time zone would have an equal chance at ice. But for that to be so, the 4 hour timer has to bridge downtime. Is the first spawn linked to downtime?
There is a lot of incorrect information being put out as to when & how ice anomalies respawn.
If there is an ice anomaly in a system before DT with ice still left in it then the same anomaly will still exist after DT. If a system usually has an ice anomaly but it has been totally cleared before DT then the four hour rule is ignored and a ice anomaly will spawn immediately after DT with the full 2500 units. Ice anomalies can last as long as three hours depending on the system. They are not all cleared within 30 minutes. |
Echo Mande
59
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Posted - 2013.07.22 23:58:00 -
[44] - Quote
CCP is probably trying to do several things at once and breaking bots, had that happened, would have been nothing more than an unintended side-effect.
First there is an attempt to modify the economy by reducing the highsec ice source. The intent on this part is to make nullsec more attractive to indy. Nice, but a lot more needs doing before nullsec indy becomes more attractive than highsec indy for anything but T1 cruiser and BS hulls and (super)capitals. As it is almost everything needed for T2 industry has to be imported to nullsec.
Secondly and probably more important for CCP is to see how the delayed respawning works out in terms of belts emptied. CCP has said it wants to redo mining at some point and the ice changes could well be a prototype for that.
The last and probably most important reason is probably downtime. Currently the respawning of ore belts is done as a part of downtime and probably requires the servers to be down to work. An on-the-fly ore/ice site respawn is independent of downtime. CCP has stated they really would like to get rid of daily downtime at some point and not having to do ore respawn during downtime would be a big step toward that. |
Blacksuns
Industrial Experts of New Eden
19
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Posted - 2013.07.23 03:14:00 -
[45] - Quote
[quote=Revolution Rising]CCP cares nothing for mining except where it impacts PVP and 0.0 players.
this could be soooo true
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El 1974
Green Visstick High Green Rhino
90
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Posted - 2013.07.23 13:32:00 -
[46] - Quote
Echo Mande wrote:The last and probably most important reason is probably downtime. Currently the respawning of ore belts is done as a part of downtime and probably requires the servers to be down to work. An on-the-fly ore/ice site respawn is independent of downtime. CCP has stated they really would like to get rid of daily downtime at some point and not having to do ore respawn during downtime would be a big step toward that. Then why do icebelts that were mined out before DT respawn at DT rather than exactly 4 hours after the last ice was mined? |
Echo Mande
59
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Posted - 2013.07.23 14:38:00 -
[47] - Quote
El 1974 wrote:Echo Mande wrote:The last and probably most important reason is probably downtime. Currently the respawning of ore belts is done as a part of downtime and probably requires the servers to be down to work. An on-the-fly ore/ice site respawn is independent of downtime. CCP has stated they really would like to get rid of daily downtime at some point and not having to do ore respawn during downtime would be a big step toward that. Then why do icebelts that were mined out less than 4 hours before DT respawn at DT rather than exactly 4 hours after the last ice was mined? Dunno. Maybe it's something they're still working on ironing out. It's probably not pushing things too far to consider the entire ice mining system as it stands right now as a work in progress. |
DB Jones
Justin's Beavers
0
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Posted - 2013.07.23 15:27:00 -
[48] - Quote
Make the ice belts spawn in different places, rather than having systems they "frequent". Give them a severely reduced chance of respawning in the system where they were cleared and have people having to move around for them. It will (probably) not stop botting, but it will at least make it require effort for everyone (miners, botters and gankers alike) to go and find them. I am not 100% sure if they respawn in the same system, but if they do, that is just ridiculous. Randomly spawned based on sec rating (not sticking to constellations etc.) please. |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
23782
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Posted - 2013.07.23 16:19:00 -
[49] - Quote
DB Jones wrote:Make the ice belts spawn in different places, rather than having systems they "frequent". Give them a severely reduced chance of respawning in the system where they were cleared and have people having to move around for them. It will (probably) not stop botting, but it will at least make it require effort for everyone (miners, botters and gankers alike) to go and find them. I am not 100% sure if they respawn in the same system, but if they do, that is just ridiculous. Randomly spawned based on sec rating (not sticking to constellations etc.) please.
There is only so much moving around that players will tolerate on a repetitive basis, like this especially, to no real purpose. |
Qutain Malakovic
Zuiderzee corporation The Obsidian Front
1
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Posted - 2013.07.25 15:20:00 -
[50] - Quote
I was wondering about the feasibility of returning the "system fixed" ice belts to the previous re-spawn cycle; there are a number of valid points to consider when you have to mine an entire belt of ice you can't use. Also create a random spawning ice belt that follows the current pattern and appears anywhere. The reason for this is that many of the null sec mining operations are to fuel their own POS, by making the re-spawn cycle of the fixed sites dependent upon clearing a belt, that puts the continuation of that POS in jeopardy. Much of the high sec ice mining is to increase isk, by having two separate types of ice belt spawning, you can alleviate a number of issues. |
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El 1974
Green Visstick High Green Rhino
91
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Posted - 2013.07.26 13:33:00 -
[51] - Quote
I would more favor some kind of compromise between what various people have proposed. The main problem I see with people not being able to cherrypick the most valuable ice ore is that it could lead to huge price spikes for ice products when stocks run out. Miners are unable to adjust what they mine. I wouldn't mind if the isotope containing ice ores remain the way they are now, but if the other ice ores show up in seperate belts, possibly in different systems, then miners can choose which belts to clear and leave the others. The distribution could look like this: 0.5- -0.25: chance of Glare Crust belt -0.25- -0.5: chance of Glare Crust or Dark Glitter -0.5- -0.75: Glare Crust, Dark Glitter or Gelidus -0.75- -1: chance of Glare Crust, Dark Glitter, Gelidus or Krystallos If not mined out, it should despawn after just a day or so (so they don't all end up in bad locations). |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
326
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Posted - 2013.07.28 05:40:00 -
[52] - Quote
I know at least one system that seems to have an Ice Belt over 90% of the time I pass through. It's not Caldari Ice of course. If you want to farm the FOTM Ice, expect competition. |
Arashi Tengu
Bhaalgorn Industries
0
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Posted - 2013.08.06 07:08:00 -
[53] - Quote
The harder it is, the better. More profit for the dedicated. Nomnomnom -- confuse the hell out of the bots and let me eat the ice. For those complaining that it's over three hours... Well, yeah. It's precisely 4 hours.
And 25 jumps to get at ice? Ouch. There are plenty of places where ice belts are within 6 systems of each other, and even some with no more than 2 jumps. Uncle DOTLAN is your friend.
Also, "set up barges in eight systems and search for ice with shuttles" is a stupid and asinine idea. I can only assume it's a joke response meant to "solve" the complication mentioned in the OP with way more complication.
Lastly, giant multi-box fleets are barely better than botting. Keep defensively insisting that it's valid. You need to compete with the large groups? Make actual friends. Don't want to make friends? Get by as an actual solo player with lower profits -- you want to eat your cake and have it too, play all alone but still have a fleet. You know CCP would ban it if they could; and if you weren't taking the place of the subscriptions lost by new players leaving when they see that they can't compete by just playing normally. I guess hating yourself is a small price to pay for all the ISK. |
Velicitia
Aliastra
1581
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Posted - 2013.08.06 09:46:00 -
[54] - Quote
energypills wrote:Tess Emmagan wrote:energypills wrote: The regular ice miners that have 10 or more exhumers at their command will eat the ice belt spawn in less than 30 minutes. That leaves a VERY tiny window for people to mine ice.
This is a good reason to support your friendly neighboorhood gankers and blow those miners the **** up. Believe me I would much rather be doing that. If only smart bombs were allowed in high sec. Or maybe it is just that 'cosmic anomaly' that is some how magically creating a space kangaroo that is attacking my smart bomb launcher and causing it not to fire! OF COURSE! Just like they do with my bomb launcher on my hound! Riight.. But space kangaroos don't like hanging out in null sec -cause everything works there just fine!
Uh, smartbombs work just fine in hisec (bomb launchers that stealth bombers use will not). You just have to fit up a BS with 8 of them (larges) and go to town; though a few catalysts are cheaper...
Not to mention, you have to set that green dot to RED.
One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia |
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