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Molly Molou
Hedion University Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2013.06.26 08:46:00 -
[1] - Quote
I made the mistake of spending my first month training minmatar frigates.
At first the slasher looked OK. But I was looking at joining the faction war thing and if you are fighting lasers users I figure you want some EM and therm resist. So you really want to be armor tanking. That means you are stuck with the Rifter. But if you put a 400 plate on a Rifter it is slow. Plus it does not have much fitting, so you need smaller guns with lower dps and range.
In other words it seems like Minmatar frigates suck. Minnie cruisers don't look so great either. Should I quit while I'm behind and start training Caldari? They seem to have much better ships.
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Tsukino Stareine
EVE University Ivy League
409
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Posted - 2013.06.26 10:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
you can increase your EM/therm resists using modules and rigs
or you can just negate their damage completely by using tracking disruptors and orbiting close.
Very few ships in this game outright "suck" (there are a few but nothing you can fly yet) you just aren't flying them right. |
Zoe Allende
Gardes Feydakin
0
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Posted - 2013.06.26 10:40:00 -
[3] - Quote
Lasers also got the worst tracking of all turrets. And Minmatar ships are small and fast. So you see where I'm heading: use your agility and speed to "tank" the incoming damage from laser turrets.
But anyway you'll encounter all types of weapons in Factional Warfare. Races and factions do not define your fitting and piloting styles, YOU do. There are lots of Amarr Militia pilots who fly Minmatar ships, and lots of Minmatar Militia pilots who fly Amarr ships, and so on...
Don't be fooled by paper figures, buy a ship, fit it, fight, lose it, understand why you've been defeated, repeat countless times and find your own way.
Aaaand... You can also hull tank and/or armor tank a Slasher (and it works great).
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Ovv Topik
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
437
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Posted - 2013.06.26 10:52:00 -
[4] - Quote
The Slasher is the ultimate anti Amarr frig.
Em and Thermal resist rigs. And never undock without a Neut in the utility high.
I've taken at least 5 Slicers in my Slash.
"Jita 4 4 spaceport. You will not find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious!" |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
1965
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Posted - 2013.06.26 17:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
Zoe Allende wrote:Lasers also got the worst tracking of all turrets. And Minmatar ships are small and fast. So you see where I'm heading: use your agility and speed to "tank" the incoming damage from laser turrets. I used to have a silly amount of fun flying a fast Condor with a just smartbomb and a NOS. Tracking wasn't an issue, and it even worked defensively vs. drones.
There is an almost limitless number of better / different / crazy mousetraps in EVE
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Cyberin
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2013.06.26 19:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
Miinny ships...are awesome....(along with Caldari, Amarr, and Gallente...)
It's up to you to decide, but all you need is skill training, the right fit, and player skills and any frig can be a beast (well...almost any frig...). |
Haedonism Bot
Viziam Amarr Empire
398
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Posted - 2013.06.27 14:02:00 -
[7] - Quote
The slasher is a sweet frigate. The Rifter, once the king of all PvP frigates, is sadly at the bottom of the pack today. You can actually armor tank a slasher if you choose to do so. Personally, I prefer to shield tank it and use rigs to increase my EM and thermal resists (small anti-em screen reinforcer...)
You should also take note, just because you will be fighting Amarr faction warfare people does not mean that they will be flying Amarr ships or using lasers. Likewise, just because you chose Minmatar as a starting race, does not mean that you need to fly Minmatar ships. Cross training is a simple matter and most of your core skills transfer.
Join the Revolutionary Front and liberate New Eden from it's stuff.
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Motorbit
Cobalt Collective
0
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Posted - 2013.07.18 05:55:00 -
[8] - Quote
i agree with the op: minmatar friggates currently do suck. imo, the problem is that whatever a given minmatar frigate can do, other races can do it so much better. i actually dont know if its the hulls or the weapons though. untill we speak of t2 frigates or destroyers, small projectiles just seem to be in a bad position with to little range to make up for the better damage of blasters (especially as these track better) , and to little damage to make up the lower range when compared with lasers.
now, this is just my oppinion that is based on my inferiour skills and many dozend of blown up minmatar t1 friggates. (mostly slashers and firetails)
however, it seems the fact that one sees so few t1 minmatar frigates flying around is kind of an indicator that there is something more to this then just two noobs that suck at eve. |
erg cz
Sliperer
10
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Posted - 2013.07.18 08:06:00 -
[9] - Quote
Please take this post as a question, not a suggestion. I do not have any personal experience with minmatar frigates yet, but I seriosly concider to use them in FW. The reason is that lots of ppl seems to use power drainer and projectile weapons do not use the capacitor. Plus Slasher has the smalest signature among all combat vessels. I plan to learn necessary skills to fly this:
[Slasher, Slasher] Beta Hull Mod Nanofiber Structure Local Hull Conversion Overdrive Injector I
F-392 Baker Nunn Tracking Disruptor I J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Experimental 1MN Afterburner I Small Ancillary Shield Booster
5W Infectious Power System Malfunction 200mm Light Gallium Machine Gun 200mm Light Gallium Machine Gun 200mm Light Gallium Machine Gun
Small Projectile Burst Aerator I Small Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I Small Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I
The idea is to dodge damage instead of resist it. Do you think it may work?
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arktyus
Turalyon Plus
2
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Posted - 2013.07.18 08:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
I also don't like min ships. They have speed but feel paper thin and dps is lower than the gallente frigs that I've used. Maybe it's my low sp, but a Tristan with 5 drones seems to do better at low sp. |
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Ovv Topik
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
459
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Posted - 2013.07.18 08:26:00 -
[11] - Quote
erg cz wrote:Please take this post as a question, not a suggestion. I do not have any personal experience with minmatar frigates yet, but I seriosly concider to use them in FW. The reason is that lots of ppl seems to use power drainer and projectile weapons do not use the capacitor. Plus Slasher has the smalest signature among all combat vessels. I plan to learn necessary skills to fly this:
[Slasher, Slasher] Beta Hull Mod Nanofiber Structure Local Hull Conversion Overdrive Injector I
F-392 Baker Nunn Tracking Disruptor I J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I Experimental 1MN Afterburner I Small Ancillary Shield Booster
5W Infectious Power System Malfunction 200mm Light Gallium Machine Gun 200mm Light Gallium Machine Gun 200mm Light Gallium Machine Gun
Small Projectile Burst Aerator I Small Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I Small Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I
The idea is to dodge damage instead of resist it. Do you think it may work?
Thats a very good start!
A few variations you might like to play with:
A Medium Shield Extender instead of the ASB will need less micromanaging at first when things seem overwhelming. Frig 1v1 is fast and furious. This is called a 'Buffer' fit as opposed to your ASB 'Active' fit. The MSE relly wont make a noticable difference to your sig rad in terms of how much damage you take.
Thats one fast Slash! Therefore 150mm guns will have better tracking than the 200's and will actually put more of the dps onto the target in most cases. The 'Scout' 150's are the meta4 version to use until you can fit T2's.
Incidentally, counting how many rounds, and how long it takes to kill the rat in an enemy plex is a good way to real world comparison of fits.
And in the lows: Nano fits are awesome, but what you've done there is a kiting fit with brawling guns and the Slash is already a v fast ship. Either try that with arties or I would suggest a DCU and a gank mod. Frig fights are over so quickly, the extra tank will let you live long enough to get a feel for whats going on even when you lose.
Fly it like you stole it buddy! "Jita 4 4 spaceport. You will not find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious!" |
Ovv Topik
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
459
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Posted - 2013.07.18 08:33:00 -
[12] - Quote
arktyus wrote:I also don't like min ships. They have speed but feel paper thin and dps is lower than the gallente frigs that I've used. Maybe it's my low sp, but a Tristan with 5 drones seems to do better at low sp. The best way to look at it is that CCP has had 10 years to balance and tweak all the ships in the game, and has done a pretty good job of making sure there is no longer a single best ship or race.
There are no bad ships at the mo. And thinking there are will get you pwned.
It is your job to figure out the strengths and weaknesses of each and every ship, so you know what you can beat, and what you cant. It's simply 'Rock, Parer, Scissors, Lizard, Spock' at the end of the day. "Jita 4 4 spaceport. You will not find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious!" |
Motorbit
Cobalt Collective
0
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Posted - 2013.07.18 08:51:00 -
[13] - Quote
have a day of friggate 1on1. please share your succesfull fit after. |
Zoe Allende
Gardes Feydakin
5
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Posted - 2013.07.18 09:01:00 -
[14] - Quote
Motorbit wrote:i agree with the op: minmatar friggates currently do suck.[...]
Well, I don't know which part of space you use to roam but I see plenty of them through FW area and they excel in combat when in good hands.
And that's got to be the first time I read somebody saying that projectile weapons, especially ACs, might suck. This is probably the most versatile weapon system in the game. There's no real range gap between the short and long range weapon types (whereas there is with hybrids, for example). You can also choose the damage type you inflict, and the list of good things goes on... Of course ACs do not sport the same damage output than blasters, they have insane damage projection instead! To try to match what ACs are capable of in falloff range, the blaster pilot must load Null ammo which will significantly impair his base damage output and tracking speed. Try both weapons systems in solo PvP and you'll see what I mean, it is extremely difficult to apply the maximum potential dps of blasters. This implies either landing right ON your opponent's ship or dictating range, which blaster ships are usually not very good at, often belonging to either Caldari or Gallente hence being reasonably slow.
To the guy who posted a Slasher fit: my respectable, slave-hugging, war enemy Ovv Topik has pretty much covered it. It is quite good for a first fit. However don't use small ASBs, they are useless (at least in brawling fits) as the damage input you'll be exposed to in scram range is way off what they can tank. So put either a buffer mod (not a small shield extender though, they're useless as well) or a medium ASB there. Swap the overdrive with something else, you're already fast enough. Downgrade the guns, bigger is not always better. Also be aware that putting a TD over a web there diminishes your range dictation ability. It may not be an issue as the Slasher is already very fast, but alters which targets you can engage. |
Motorbit
Cobalt Collective
0
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Posted - 2013.07.18 09:07:00 -
[15] - Quote
i like projectiles in general. just not small projectiles. the difference in range between them and blasters is to small to maintain during fast friggate fights, while the diffference in damage is big enough to realy matter. |
Ovv Topik
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
459
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Posted - 2013.07.18 13:25:00 -
[16] - Quote
Motorbit wrote: just... have a day of friggate 1on1 with minmatar. its not realy fun.
lol. You're a very wrong person. "Jita 4 4 spaceport. You will not find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious!" |
erg cz
Sliperer
10
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Posted - 2013.07.18 14:43:00 -
[17] - Quote
Zoe Allende wrote: However don't use small ASBs, they are useless (at least in brawling fits) as the damage input you'll be exposed to in scram range is way off what they can tank. So put either a buffer mod (not a small shield extender though, they're useless as well) or a medium ASB there. Swap the overdrive with something else, you're already fast enough. Downgrade the guns, bigger is not always better. Also be aware that putting a TD over a web there diminishes your range dictation ability.
I try to keep it cheap. Now it is about 1 mio ISK and looks like this: [Slasher, Slasher] Beta Hull Mod Nanofiber Structure Emergency Damage Control I
'Langour' Drive Disruptor I Fleeting Progressive Warp Scrambler I Experimental 1MN Afterburner I Small Ancillary Shield Booster
5W Infectious Power System Malfunction 150mm Light Prototype Automatic Cannon 150mm Light Prototype Automatic Cannon 150mm Light Prototype Automatic Cannon
Small Projectile Burst Aerator I Small Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I Small Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I
Medium AncillaryBooster would double that price. I changed overdrive to DCU, but I am afraid I will not be fast enough without it when I will be webbed. The idea of the initial fit was to be fast enough even being under webifier. Fast enough to speed tank the damage of disrupted small turrets. But I guess I will have to try both fits to find out, which one will work. If any of them ;)
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Radius Prime
Tax Evading Ass.
117
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Posted - 2013.07.18 18:52:00 -
[18] - Quote
erg cz wrote:Zoe Allende wrote: However don't use small ASBs, they are useless (at least in brawling fits) as the damage input you'll be exposed to in scram range is way off what they can tank. So put either a buffer mod (not a small shield extender though, they're useless as well) or a medium ASB there. Swap the overdrive with something else, you're already fast enough. Downgrade the guns, bigger is not always better. Also be aware that putting a TD over a web there diminishes your range dictation ability. I try to keep it cheap. Now it is about 1 mio ISK and looks like this: [Slasher, Slasher] Beta Hull Mod Nanofiber Structure Emergency Damage Control I 'Langour' Drive Disruptor I Fleeting Progressive Warp Scrambler I Experimental 1MN Afterburner I Small Ancillary Shield Booster 5W Infectious Power System Malfunction 150mm Light Prototype Automatic Cannon 150mm Light Prototype Automatic Cannon 150mm Light Prototype Automatic Cannon Small Projectile Burst Aerator I Small Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I Small Projectile Metastasis Adjuster I Medium AncillaryBooster would double that price. I changed overdrive to DCU, but I am afraid I will not be fast enough without it when I will be webbed. The idea of the initial fit was to be fast enough even being under webifier. Fast enough to speed tank the damage of disrupted small turrets. But I guess I will have to try both fits to find out, which one will work. If any of them ;)
If it means you actually win some fights the price doesn't matter. Look at things in a practical manner.
Reopen the EVE gate so we can invade Serenity. Goons can go first. |
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