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Angrathar 'WrathGate' LichKing
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.07.14 02:46:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hello my name is Angrathar 'WrathGate' LichKing.
I am here to expose some fairly major issues with the game-play mechanic called PVP.
I've been around for 10 days.
In 10 days scouting for fleet operations I have lost: 74 Reapers 47 Pods (coincidence but a cool one )
I am here to expose that untrained ALTs are INCREDIBLY overpowered.
If I were to train up my skills and get in around a 10m ISK pod, and fly in about 10m isk scout ship my costs would be somewhat significant. Not to mention the impossible logistics of the matter.
740m in ships, 470m in clones.
1.21b in 10 days.
about 4.21b per month... just for basic scouting.
But thankfully I am way to smart to train any skills on a scouting alt or use a non-noob ship.
D-Scan works just as well at 53k SP as it does at 53m skill-points. Clever use of tactical safes and bookmarks work just as well.
And these are the major components of a scout.
Now to answer some questions: ANGRATHAR!!! you have no tank! how could you provide ANY level of Intel with so little ehp? Gate Cloaks (60 seconds) 5k ISK clone relocation. I have a microphone. I have a built-in jump-drive with an unlimited range and no requirement for a cyno.
That last one is the most amazing, I can simply change my clone station, and scout several locations hundreds of jump apart for 5k isk. Its brilliant.
Sure but you don't contribute to any kills, you just die If you strike me down now, I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.
Aggression against me not only prevents the use of stations and gates, but also triggers 400+ dps against my aggressor, then my fleet jumps in gets tackle, and often even in death I can top damage via gate guns.
I get it Angrathar your fcking brilliant why brag about it? Because clone costs are why this character type is so much more powerful than a normal player, not to mention an endless supply of ships with a magical logistics chain to replace my losses.
My suggestion? Limit newbie ships to 1 per hour. Swap the 5k clone relocation cost and the clone replacement costs. Add a timer to clone relocation. And maybe even a LY based distance requirement.
This will prevent Angrathar 'WrathGate" LichKing from being the superior scout, and SP will actually make the scouting profession better, not worse. |
Verunae Caseti
Viziam Amarr Empire
109
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Posted - 2013.07.14 02:55:00 -
[2] - Quote
My suggestions?
Stop dying so much you're; an embarassment. |
Xequecal
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
6
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Posted - 2013.07.14 02:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
Not a fan of this. It's already bad enough that surviving in low sec or 0.0 requires multiple accounts, now you're proposing that people have to pay for multiple accounts for months before they become useful. |
Inokuma Yawara
University of Caille Gallente Federation
51
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Posted - 2013.07.14 03:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
It will add realism to the game (an oxymoron for a sci-fi mmo), and add a level, or levels, of difficulty. Hmmm... I LLLLIKE IT!! The more challenging the better!
Perhaps a good way to make scouting viable is to create an actual scouting class, with appropriate skills and a good light scout ship with appropriate skills and modules. No use of clone station relocations, but an actual scout class with skills that allow evasion techniques and equipment. Of course, that means that the electronic warfare guys will have to be on the ball looking for these scouts. It should be very difficult, but not impossible to hunt down a scout. Which means the scout will have to be clever to evade detection.
It'll be kind of like anti-submarine warfare destroyers searching for fast attack submarines.
I give my endorsement to this idea! Watch this space.-á New exciting signature in development. |
Solutio Letum
Terpene Conglomerate
151
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Posted - 2013.07.14 03:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
Wait scouts die? |
GreenSeed
561
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Posted - 2013.07.14 04:05:00 -
[6] - Quote
scouts die, all the time. but podded? even if you are scouting null gates, you have plenty of ways of evading... and bubble camps usually don't even require a scout, even the crappiest intel channels report them. |
Elvis Fett
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
236
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Posted - 2013.07.14 04:35:00 -
[7] - Quote
Last time I checked noob ships can't equip Cover Ops Cloaking Devices. I don't know I didn't read the Odyssey patch notes yet, so maybe they slipped that change in there. If CCP didn't slip that change in, there is your reason to fly a ship besides a noob ship, cloaky eyes are lovely. |
Intar Medris
Arbitrary Spaceship Destruction The Devil's Warrior Alliance
109
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Posted - 2013.07.14 04:57:00 -
[8] - Quote
Wow look another brain dead idiot has come up with a brilliant idea, but posted it in the wrong forum. F&I it that way ----> I try to be nice and mind my business just shooting lasers at rocks. There is just way too many asshats in New Eden for that to happen. |
baltec1
Bat Country
7277
|
Posted - 2013.07.14 05:10:00 -
[9] - Quote
This isn't WOW. In this game we like our hour old newbees being useful. |
Riot Girl
Thundercats The Initiative.
1344
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Posted - 2013.07.14 06:26:00 -
[10] - Quote
How can you lose that many scout ships? Are you repeatedly flying into the same insta-lock gatecamp? Oh god. |
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
3079
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Posted - 2013.07.14 07:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Quote:Angrathar 'WrathGate' LichKing
I'm sure someone will tell you to go back to WoW but with a name like that, it looks like you never left. |
Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2012
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Posted - 2013.07.14 07:16:00 -
[12] - Quote
If you had trained into a covops and had some basic self-preservation knowledge you most likely wouldn't have died at all, and you wouldn't be alerting the people you are scouting of your presence by blundering into their gatecamps over and over. Titans were never meant to be "cost effective", its a huge ****.-á- CCP Oveur, 2006
~If you want a picture of the future of WiS, imagine a spaceship, stamping on an avatar's face. Forever. |
grrlet
doTheNeedful
16
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Posted - 2013.07.14 07:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
You guys are failing horribly at trying to insult this guy by saying he dies to much. If you read the OPs post, he dies on purpose so he can move to a different location and scout the next jump.
OP - Move Clone, Jump, Scout, Die (which engages gate guns) Buddies - Jump, kill what he scouted. OP - Move Clone, Undock, Jump, Scout, Die (which engages gate guns) Buddies - Jump, kill what he scouted. repeat over and over.
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DSpite Culhach
Corp 54 Curatores Veritatis Alliance
129
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Posted - 2013.07.14 07:59:00 -
[14] - Quote
I love how so many people, rather then point out to CCP that so many existing rules in the EVE universe make no sense to start with, actually suggest that the rules that make no sense should in fact be patched with more rules that make no sense.
EVE is a massive tangle of rules to stop idiots doing things so idiotic that they would end up annoying too many people that are actually playing - and more importantly, PAYING, for some entertainment. We all know this, so why add to that tangle?
I suddenly woke up thinking I had a nightmare, then remembered I can't even fly Amarr Battleships. I add bits to this when I'm bored https://www.dropbox.com/s/foijsawsqolarom/EVE_Online.html |
Templar Knightsbane
The Konvergent League Sev3rance
56
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Posted - 2013.07.14 09:51:00 -
[15] - Quote
Scout = Ok Scout who can cloak = Good Scout who can cloak and combat probe = Really Good Scout who can cloak, combat probe, point, tank and boost = Amazing |
Matt Petirov
Red Party
2
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Posted - 2013.07.14 10:44:00 -
[16] - Quote
Verunae Caseti wrote:My suggestions?
Stop dying so much you're; an embarassment.
lol'd +1 |
Yusef Brion
Big Yellow Pidgeon Inc.
18
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Posted - 2013.07.14 11:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
Angrathar 'WrathGate' LichKing wrote: Aggression against me not only prevents the use of stations and gates, but also triggers 400+ dps against my aggressor, then my fleet jumps in gets tackle, and often even in death I can top damage via gate guns.
I get it Angrathar your fcking brilliant why brag about it? Because clone costs are why this character type is so much more powerful than a normal player, not to mention an endless supply of ships with a magical logistics chain to replace my losses.
My suggestion? Limit newbie ships to 1 per hour. Swap the 5k clone relocation cost and the clone replacement costs. Add a timer to clone relocation. And maybe even a LY based distance requirement.
This will prevent Angrathar 'WrathGate" LichKing from being the superior scout, and SP will actually make the scouting profession better, not worse.
I think you make a good point, but I have invited some really bad people to play this game. (I'm sorry to everyone else, they are really bad at eve, no joke) Some people must be burned repeatedly before they learn not to touch the stove. I can't agree with you on the noob ship limit. I think your other suggestions have some merit though. I've always thought that is the reason they don't let you log two characters on the same acct at the same time; everyone would be multiboxing with an untrained scout one jump in front of them.
grrlet wrote:You guys are failing horribly at trying to insult this guy by saying he dies to much. If you read the OPs post, he dies on purpose so he can move to a different location and scout the next jump.
To be clear: I am speaking of myself, not talking about you sarcastically. I have been on the internet forever, but I still have a lot of trouble discerning a sarcastic post that agrees with the OP but can find no solution, from a post that is making fun of OP while completely missing the point. I think this robs me of some of the enjoyment others feel at making or reading posts of this nature.
Back on point though, he is making some investment, grrlet, because it costs to move even an untrained clone, yes? The problem is that the investment is miniscule compared to the payoff for his fleet.
I do question your motives, Angrathar. If this tactic works so well for you, why expose it? |
Khanh'rhh
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1993
|
Posted - 2013.07.14 12:20:00 -
[18] - Quote
Scatim Helicon wrote:If you had trained into a covops and had some basic self-preservation knowledge you most likely wouldn't have died at all, and you wouldn't be alerting the people you are scouting of your presence by blundering into their gatecamps over and over. This right here. I can't even remember the last time I lost a scout ship. Even my hero-tackle Cheetah went down with a ~50:1 K/D
You seem to be just jumping into a system and dying - this is an incredibly poor form of scouting for a massive number of reasons and there's no need to nerf being bad at the game.
If you were even partially competent you would be cloaked, reporting not the gang on the gate, but the composition of their backup one system away, and how long your guys have before they get there.
If you're actually only 10 days into the game, then for mercies sake learn the game before you suggest changes. "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930 |
Angrathar 'WrathGate' LichKing
Doomheim
2
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Posted - 2013.07.14 23:25:00 -
[19] - Quote
The advantages of high SP do not outweigh the advantages of no SP,
Yet another overpowered ability is the name change.
I will be biomassing and starting off with a clean identity.
Try that with your 50m skill point "scout".
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Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
693
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Posted - 2013.07.15 00:01:00 -
[20] - Quote
Angrathar 'WrathGate' LichKing wrote:Hello my name is Angrathar 'WrathGate' LichKing.I am here to expose some fairly major issues with the game-play mechanic called PVP. I've been around for 10 days. In 10 days scouting for fleet operations I have lost: 74 Reapers 47 Pods (coincidence but a cool one ) I am here to expose that untrained ALTs are INCREDIBLY overpowered. If I were to train up my skills and get in around a 10m ISK pod, and fly in about 10m isk scout ship my costs would be somewhat significant. Not to mention the impossible logistics of the matter. 740m in ships, 470m in clones. 1.21b in 10 days. about 4.21b per month... just for basic scouting. But thankfully I am way to smart to train any skills on a scouting alt or use a non-noob ship. D-Scan works just as well at 53k SP as it does at 53m skill-points. Clever use of tactical safes and bookmarks work just as well. And these are the major components of a scout. Now to answer some questions:ANGRATHAR!!! you have no tank! how could you provide ANY level of Intel with so little ehp?Gate Cloaks (60 seconds) 5k ISK clone relocation. I have a microphone. I have a built-in jump-drive with an unlimited range and no requirement for a cyno. That last one is the most amazing, I can simply change my clone station, and scout several locations hundreds of jump apart for 5k isk. Its brilliant. Sure but you don't contribute to any kills, you just dieIf you strike me down now, I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine. Aggression against me not only prevents the use of stations and gates, but also triggers 400+ dps against my aggressor, then my fleet jumps in gets tackle, and often even in death I can top damage via gate guns. I get it Angrathar your fcking brilliant why brag about it?Because clone costs are why this character type is so much more powerful than a normal player, not to mention an endless supply of ships with a magical logistics chain to replace my losses. My suggestion?Limit newbie ships to 1 per hour. Swap the 5k clone relocation cost and the clone replacement costs. Add a timer to clone relocation. And maybe even a LY based distance requirement. This will prevent Angrathar 'WrathGate" LichKing from being the superior scout, and SP will actually make the scouting profession better, not worse.
You understand that spotter alts work better if they can cloak and stay alive...right?
I too am excited about trading playability for more lag and shiny pictures.....:( Petition for a Minimum bounty of 10 mil. Prevent useless bounties!
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Khanh'rhh
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1993
|
Posted - 2013.07.15 00:14:00 -
[21] - Quote
Angrathar 'WrathGate' LichKing wrote:The advantages of high SP do not outweigh the advantages of no SP, Yet another overpowered ability is the name change. I will be biomassing and starting off with a clean identity. Try that with your 50m skill point "scout". You ignored everything in my post, I see.
You can't just keep saying "it's overpowered because it is overpowered" when people are giving you very valid reasons why you're not seeing the whole picture. The chief problem in your scenario is you think losing scout ships is somehow a bad thing, or makes them worse. Far from it, I have well over 50mil SP and I pod myself around all the time because I'm not poor.
The concept of balancing things around their cost is a poor one in any context. "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930 |
Taoist Dragon
The Church of Awesome Caldari State Capturing
515
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Posted - 2013.07.15 00:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
WOW!
I can't believe how many of you took the bait from this troll
8/10 OP That is the Way, the Tao.
Balance is everything. |
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ISD LackOfFaith
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
558
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Posted - 2013.07.15 01:51:00 -
[23] - Quote
Quote:5. Trolling is prohibited.
Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.
Really? Of all things...
Thread locked. ISD LackOfFaith Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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