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Ciyrine
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
38
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Posted - 2013.07.22 13:51:00 -
[1] - Quote
1 small neut = 6 sec cycle 6 small neuts can be spread out so there is one going off every second the server works on 1 sec tics
If an opponent is capped out and you use 6 small neuts in 1 sec intervals can you keep a person from being able to use their low cap usage weapons? or do the weapons fall through the cracks and still get the cap they need? |
Jon Joringer
Zero-K
34
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Posted - 2013.07.22 14:15:00 -
[2] - Quote
Six small neuts may take a while to cap a ship out, but nothing is going to be running when they do. |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon Drunk 'n' Disorderly
768
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Posted - 2013.07.22 14:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
Ciyrine wrote:1 small neut = 6 sec cycle 6 small neuts can be spread out so there is one going off every second the server works on 1 sec tics
If an opponent is capped out and you use 6 small neuts in 1 sec intervals can you keep a person from being able to use their low cap usage weapons? or do the weapons fall through the cracks and still get the cap they need?
cycling is always a good idea. you probably can cap out weapons but there could be still drones on field.
"Also, your boobs " -á CCP Eterne, 2012
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RaTTuS
BIG Insidious Empire
313
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Posted - 2013.07.22 14:33:00 -
[4] - Quote
may I introduce you to Projectile weaponry http://eveboard.com/ub/419190933-134.png http://imgur.com/nuBlxbC |
seth Hendar
I love you miners
146
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Posted - 2013.07.22 15:08:00 -
[5] - Quote
Ciyrine wrote:1 small neut = 6 sec cycle 6 small neuts can be spread out so there is one going off every second the server works on 1 sec tics
If an opponent is capped out and you use 6 small neuts in 1 sec intervals can you keep a person from being able to use their low cap usage weapons? or do the weapons fall through the cracks and still get the cap they need? yes, you will even be able to turn off his damage control, wich is to my knowledge the active module requiring the less cap.
note that a proper timing on bigger neut may achieve the same.
also,6 small neut are only effective on frig and destro, maybe some cruiser if using a ship with bonuses on neuts (cruor, but you can't squeeze 6 of them so...) |
The VC's
Spack Force 5
154
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Posted - 2013.07.22 15:14:00 -
[6] - Quote
Jon Joringer wrote:Six small neuts may take a while to cap a ship out, but nothing is going to be running when they do.
6 small neuts have the same nesting power as 3.6 medium neuts, with the advantage of a cycle every second. I fly the dragon with 5 (fitting 6 is tricky) and it caps cruisers out in less than 30 secs, and keeps them down.
It'll turn of their DCU. One in five people are Chinese. There are five people in my family, so one must be Chinese. It's either my mum, my dad, my older brother Colin or my younger brother Ho-Cha-Chu. But I think it's Colin |
Whitehound
1630
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Posted - 2013.07.22 15:24:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ciyrine wrote:1 small neut = 6 sec cycle 6 small neuts can be spread out so there is one going off every second the server works on 1 sec tics
If an opponent is capped out and you use 6 small neuts in 1 sec intervals can you keep a person from being able to use their low cap usage weapons? or do the weapons fall through the cracks and still get the cap they need? First you need to understand how the capacitor recharges. There are somewhat opposing formulas and graphs for it, but they give a picture of the non-linear behaviour of a capacitor's recharge rate:
Graph 1 and Graph 2
It does not matter which of the two is right, but they both show common features. One is that the recharge rate has got a peak where the capacitor fills up very fast, and that it fills only slowly when it is almost empty and when it is almost full.
This means that when you drain a ship's capacitor very fast and with all 6 neuts down to 0 GJ will the ship's capacitor recharge just very slowly. It takes a long time to get from 0% to just 10% and it recharges much faster when going from 10% to 20% or 20% to 30%.
So you really only need to neut very fast until you are sure your target is out of cap and then can just use a single neut or only 2 to keep the capacitor empty, because it just does not recover fast at that point.
If the targeted ship then uses any cap will it put itself back to 0 GJ and punish itself with a very low recharge rate. You do not need fiddle around with timing 6 neuts once you understand how a capacitor recharges. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
1862
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Posted - 2013.07.22 15:48:00 -
[8] - Quote
one small neut is sufficient to prevent most module activation once you caped the target dry. Use two if you really want to make sure that nothing runs but its usually a waste of YOUR cap at this point.
things get interesting if the target has a cap booster and knows how to use it eve style bounties (done) dust boarding parties imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW |
Brother Mercury
Fire on the Mountain
5
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Posted - 2013.07.22 16:05:00 -
[9] - Quote
6 small neuts on me my cap booster does nothing I hope they buff NOS |
Ciyrine
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
38
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Posted - 2013.07.22 18:32:00 -
[10] - Quote
@brother - what does nos stand for? Then ill probably understand ur comment in full.
@bienator - i was told by other posters in a different topic that it was extremely difficult to keep weapons and other small cap usage modules turned off because any cap regen will fuel them and since cap recharges every sec u need to hit them non stop to keep the small cap regen from fueling the low cap usage modules. But u say 1 small is enough which sounds more manageable but does what they say have any truth to it?
Also what would someone who know how to use their cap booster do with it thats different from what a newb like me would do with it? |
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ElQuirko
Jester Syndicate S0UTHERN C0MF0RT
1629
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Posted - 2013.07.22 18:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
Brother Mercury wrote:6 small neuts on me my cap booster does nothing I hope they buff NOS
EVE player writes haiku A shame it's on this forum this thread is now spiderman Save the Domi model! Spacewhales should be preserved. |
Ciyrine
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
38
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 18:37:00 -
[12] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Ciyrine wrote:1 small neut = 6 sec cycle 6 small neuts can be spread out so there is one going off every second the server works on 1 sec tics
If an opponent is capped out and you use 6 small neuts in 1 sec intervals can you keep a person from being able to use their low cap usage weapons? or do the weapons fall through the cracks and still get the cap they need? First you need to understand how the capacitor recharges. There are somewhat opposing formulas and graphs for it, but they give a picture of the non-linear behaviour of a capacitor's recharge rate: Graph 1 and Graph 2It does not matter which of the two is right, but they both show common features. One is that the recharge rate has got a peak where the capacitor fills up very fast (25%-30%), and that it fills only slowly when it is almost empty and when it is almost full. This means that when you drain a ship's capacitor very fast and with all 6 neuts down to 0 GJ will the ship's capacitor recharge very slowly. It takes a long time to get from 0% to just 10% and it recharges much faster when going from 10% to 20% or 20% to 30%. So you really only need to neut very fast until you are sure your target is out of cap and then can use a single neut or only 2 to keep the capacitor empty, because it does not recover fast at that point. If the targeted ship then uses any cap will it put itself back to 0 GJ and punish itself with a very low recharge rate. You do not need to fiddle around with timing 6 neuts once you understand how a capacitor recharges.
So a bs with 6 slots if neuting is all i car about would 5x heavy and 1x small be recomended for keeping them down?
Does the cap recharge a small amount every sec?
Should i use a ship scanner to see when they need to be neuted again? |
Whitehound
1631
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Posted - 2013.07.22 18:42:00 -
[13] - Quote
Ciyrine wrote:@brother - what does nos stand for? Then ill probably understand ur comment in full.
@bienator - i was told by other posters in a different topic that it was extremely difficult to keep weapons and other small cap usage modules turned off because any cap regen will fuel them and since cap recharges every sec u need to hit them non stop to keep the small cap regen from fueling the low cap usage modules. But u say 1 small is enough which sounds more manageable but does what they say have any truth to it?
Also what would someone who know how to use their cap booster do with it thats different from what a newb like me would do with it? NOS is short for Nosferatu.
Some weapons need no cap at all, cannot be turned off and will do full damage. Others need very little, are hard to turn off but begin to stutter. And some need more, especially when grouped, can easily be turned off and do not do any damage.
The trick with a cap booster when neuted is to inject a cap charge and at the same time fire the MWD and get away before the newly injected cap is gone, too. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
1862
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Posted - 2013.07.22 22:10:00 -
[14] - Quote
Ciyrine wrote: @bienator - i was told by other posters in a different topic that it was extremely difficult to keep weapons and other small cap usage modules turned off because any cap regen will fuel them and since cap recharges every sec u need to hit them non stop to keep the small cap regen from fueling the low cap usage modules. But u say 1 small is enough which sounds more manageable but does what they say have any truth to it?
i solo with a sentinel sometimes and can only say in my experience that one small neut is enough to keep most stuff off once the cap is empty. If you really want to make sure that its off use two. Thats what i do when i make an mistake and land in scram range which happens from time to time if you fight multiple targets.
people will try to activate things like weapons, tank or prop mods, all those things use a lot of cap, so even if they manage to enable SOMETHING its only one cycle. So don't panic you are not dead yet.
but again: as soon you see that the target has cap boosters you have to act differently eve style bounties (done) dust boarding parties imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW |
dethleffs
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
230
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Posted - 2013.07.22 23:08:00 -
[15] - Quote
ElQuirko wrote:Brother Mercury wrote:6 small neuts on me my cap booster does nothing I hope they buff NOS EVE toon writes haiku A shame it's on this forum thread is now spiderman
I'm so happy now, I didn't know GD could do this stuff to me.
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Ciyrine
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
38
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Posted - 2013.07.22 23:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
Bienator II wrote:Ciyrine wrote: @bienator - i was told by other posters in a different topic that it was extremely difficult to keep weapons and other small cap usage modules turned off because any cap regen will fuel them and since cap recharges every sec u need to hit them non stop to keep the small cap regen from fueling the low cap usage modules. But u say 1 small is enough which sounds more manageable but does what they say have any truth to it?
i solo with a sentinel sometimes and can only say in my experience that one small neut is enough to keep most stuff off once the cap is empty. If you really want to make sure that its off use two. Thats what i do when i make an mistake and land in scram range which happens from time to time if you fight multiple targets. people will try to activate things like weapons, tank or prop mods, all those things use a lot of cap, so even if they manage to enable SOMETHING its only one cycle. So don't panic you are not dead yet. but again: as soon you see that the target has cap boosters you have to act differently e.g: take a look at this fight where i start at scram range: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uifGwdqUhj0 (its actually a bad example because i overneuted at the end a bit too much) or this one against an cap injecting tristan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKZBIioDMK8
awesome thanks ill watch the vids. I tend to have a tough time seeing whats happening. Could you summarize some of the main points of the fights where decisions were made and why? |
Whitehound
1633
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Posted - 2013.07.22 23:15:00 -
[17] - Quote
dethleffs wrote:ElQuirko wrote:Brother Mercury wrote:6 small neuts on me my cap booster does nothing I hope they buff NOS EVE toon writes haiku A shame it's on this forum thread is now spiderman I'm so happy now, I didn't know GD could do this stuff to me. trolling not we are this forum Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Ciyrine
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
38
|
Posted - 2013.07.22 23:47:00 -
[18] - Quote
@bienator - what program are you using to make your videos its some of the best definition ive seen. I could read everything on the screen which was nice for me to understand better what was going on
he was using rail guns which us very little cap and he was capped out unable to fire? thats surprising. Would it work with 1 small neut or was the 3 you used needed to make it effective? |
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
1862
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Posted - 2013.07.23 02:45:00 -
[19] - Quote
Ciyrine wrote:@bienator - what program are you using to make your videos its some of the best definition ive seen. I could read everything on the screen which was nice for me to understand better what was going on
he was using rail guns which us very little cap and he was capped out unable to fire? thats surprising. Would it work with 1 small neut or was the 3 you used needed to make it effective?
I am using OBS which is free and can be used to live stream or safe to disc. I don't edit anything and use almost default settings nothing fancy.
If you talk about the tristan he had a capacitor booster. So i cycled two neuts all the time. You can still see him repping from time to time but you can't really avoid that if he is a competent pilot and knows how to use cap boosters. I have 12s cap with everything turned on so i have to watch out. (sentinel has a neut amount bonus btw, so one neut is as good as two) eve style bounties (done) dust boarding parties imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW |
Ciyrine
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
38
|
Posted - 2013.07.23 03:23:00 -
[20] - Quote
Bienator II wrote:Ciyrine wrote:@bienator - what program are you using to make your videos its some of the best definition ive seen. I could read everything on the screen which was nice for me to understand better what was going on
he was using rail guns which us very little cap and he was capped out unable to fire? thats surprising. Would it work with 1 small neut or was the 3 you used needed to make it effective? I am using OBS which is free and can be used to live stream or safe to disc. I don't edit anything and use almost default settings nothing fancy. If you talk about the tristan he had a capacitor booster. So i cycled two neuts all the time. You can still see him repping from time to time but you can't really avoid that if he is a competent pilot and knows how to use cap boosters. I have 12s cap with everything turned on so i have to watch out. (sentinel has a neut amount bonus btw, so one neut is as good as two)
if that was a tristan where were his drones? or maybe that wasnt second vid havent watched that yet(just got back with kids from movie) |
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ElQuirko
Jester Syndicate S0UTHERN C0MF0RT
1647
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Posted - 2013.07.23 15:16:00 -
[21] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:dethleffs wrote:ElQuirko wrote:Brother Mercury wrote:6 small neuts on me my cap booster does nothing I hope they buff NOS EVE toon writes haiku A shame it's on this forum thread is now spiderman I'm so happy now, I didn't know GD could do this stuff to me. Trolling not we are this forum.
Your haiku was bad And you therefore should feel bad get on my level Save the Domi model! Spacewhales should be preserved. |
Arduemont
The Asteroid Solution
1628
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Posted - 2013.07.24 19:42:00 -
[22] - Quote
Ciyrine wrote: If an opponent is capped out and you use 6 small neuts in 1 sec intervals can you keep a person from being able to use their low cap usage weapons? or do the weapons fall through the cracks and still get the cap they need?
Missiles, ASB, and damage mods... Who needs cap? "In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." |
Ciyrine
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
57
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Posted - 2013.07.24 20:07:00 -
[23] - Quote
Arduemont wrote:Ciyrine wrote: If an opponent is capped out and you use 6 small neuts in 1 sec intervals can you keep a person from being able to use their low cap usage weapons? or do the weapons fall through the cracks and still get the cap they need?
Missiles, ASB, and damage mods... Who needs cap?
Propulsion and shield hardeners needa cap. Asb need cap after running out of charges. Damage control, traget painters etc. If all ur using is asb, damage mods then u must have the best ship in eve, the best pvp record and uve already won eve |
Zimmy Zeta
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
25643
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Posted - 2013.07.24 20:11:00 -
[24] - Quote
The VC's wrote:Jon Joringer wrote:Six small neuts may take a while to cap a ship out, but nothing is going to be running when they do. 6 small neuts have the same neuting power as 3.6 medium neuts iirc, with the advantage of a cycle every second. I fly the dragoon with 5 (fitting 6 is tricky) and it caps cruisers out in less than 30 secs, and keeps them down. It'll turn of their DCU.
The question is how do you keep this slow ass clumsy spacebrick alive for 30 seconds against any decent cruiser?
Just think of how bad an average post by me is, and then realize half of them are even worse |
Andrea Griffin
623
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Posted - 2013.07.24 21:02:00 -
[25] - Quote
Ciyrine wrote:watching your vids has made me more familiar with the attack frigates and the sentinel which is an awesome ship. Love its bonuses and drone bay. Even the gallente attack frigate has less drone bandwidth...nice :) The Sentinel is a wonderful ship to fly. It's exceptional against the right targets. It also has the defenses of a wet paper bag, so a single mistake and you could be in big trouble.
That's why I love to fly it. Really forces me to pay attention.
It's also a great ship for getting ransoms. You can neut them out, make them very helpless, so you have some time to extract a good ransom out of them. Just make sure to let them go after! Be an honoUrable pirate. : > CCP Sreegs is my favorite developer. |
The VC's
Spack Force 5
155
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Posted - 2013.07.24 22:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Zimmy Zeta wrote:The VC's wrote:Jon Joringer wrote:Six small neuts may take a while to cap a ship out, but nothing is going to be running when they do. 6 small neuts have the same neuting power as 3.6 medium neuts iirc, with the advantage of a cycle every second. I fly the dragoon with 5 (fitting 6 is tricky) and it caps cruisers out in less than 30 secs, and keeps them down. It'll turn of their DCU. The question is how do you keep this slow ass clumsy spacebrick alive for 30 seconds against any decent cruiser?
Hehe, good question.
It's more of a gang support/anti station camper fit.
One in five people are Chinese. There are five people in my family, so one must be Chinese. It's either my mum, my dad, my older brother Colin or my younger brother Ho-Cha-Chu. But I think it's Colin |
Ciyrine
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
57
|
Posted - 2013.07.24 22:15:00 -
[27] - Quote
Andrea Griffin wrote:Ciyrine wrote:watching your vids has made me more familiar with the attack frigates and the sentinel which is an awesome ship. Love its bonuses and drone bay. Even the gallente attack frigate has less drone bandwidth...nice :) The Sentinel is a wonderful ship to fly. It's exceptional against the right targets. It also has the defenses of a wet paper bag, so a single mistake and you could be in big trouble. That's why I love to fly it. Really forces me to pay attention. It's also a great ship for getting ransoms. You can neut them out, make them very helpless, so you have some time to extract a good ransom out of them. Just make sure to let them go after! Be an honoUrable pirate. : >
How do u decide how much to ask for? |
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