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Aran Cole
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:19:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Aran Cole on 17/12/2005 00:20:07
Originally by: Teblin Oh dear. I didn't mean to start an argument .
Lies and slander!
EDIT: It's probably better that I don't discuss moderation ;) _______________________
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Wild Rho
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:22:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Teblin Oh dear. I didn't mean to start an argument .
I think you should give yourself a warning for starting a flame war.
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Montague Zooma
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:25:00 -
[33]
I don't care what the EULA says in this regard and neither should CCP. People subscribe to Eve in order to play a game. If people can't play the game for 24 hours, it's appropriate for them to extend subscriptions by one day to make up for it. It's good customer relations. They don't have to do it, but they should.
If Eve went offline for 31 days, would you still say they shouldn't extend subscriptions by a month to make up for it? How about a whole year? After all, the EULA allows them to take your money and give nothing in return...but that's not a good way to build up a profitable business.
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Nash
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:29:00 -
[34]
Originally by: mopheus Well it could very well be, but they don't owe you.
They made a patch to make ure game better, they gave it out for free. Now they have a little trouble and u want ure money refunded.
Go to the casino, play, lose and ask ure money back. There answer is a good one.
It's normal people think of their money tho and I can understand it, but be friendly to the ones we love and owe so much to, CCP :p
No the patch isn't for free. The developers do not work for nothing! The revenue is from our subscription fee's.
As for the Casino analogy. No, we are paying for a service not gambling.
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Aran Cole
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:30:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Montague Zooma I don't care what the EULA says in this regard and neither should CCP. People subscribe to Eve in order to play a game. If people can't play the game for 24 hours, it's appropriate for them to extend subscriptions by one day to make up for it. It's good customer relations. They don't have to do it, but they should.
If Eve went offline for 31 days, would you still say they shouldn't extend subscriptions by a month to make up for it? How about a whole year? After all, the EULA allows them to take your money and give nothing in return...but that's not a good way to build up a profitable business.
I know what will solve the problem! Let's blow things way out of proportion! If I come across as sarcastic in this thread, it's only because I'm sick and tired of not being able to read the forums due to the spammage that is these whine threads. _______________________
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Mned Graydroggen
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:30:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Mned Graydroggen on 17/12/2005 00:30:34 If there should be any payback , it should be us paying back CCP for the love and dedication they have given to serving us a Masterpiece of Online gaming.
Give the Devs the time they need to fix the issues that have been raised. They are working hard, look at the swift fix that the Capital construction vs. sec space has gotten.
CCP listens and fixes stuff, they allways have and I believe, if we can grant them the time they need, they will keep doing so in the future.
Mned
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Skelum
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:37:00 -
[37]
Oh come on, atleast your skills are still training. If youve started to train the new skills ull need a while to get them trained up anyways=D
I think everyone should not comment for 2-3 days after patch, then if there are any problems then start whining.
Besides it gives us time to run out and do some christmas shopping
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Montague Zooma
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Posted - 2005.12.17 00:55:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Aran Cole I know what will solve the problem! Let's blow things way out of proportion! If I come across as sarcastic in this thread, it's only because I'm sick and tired of not being able to read the forums due to the spammage that is these whine threads.
Thank you for your whine. I read the thread and was simply stating my preference. If you don't like "whine" threads, don't read them...they're not hard to avoid.
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Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.17 08:21:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Mned Graydroggen Edited by: Mned Graydroggen on 17/12/2005 00:30:34 If there should be any payback , it should be us paying back CCP for the love and dedication they have given to serving us a Masterpiece of Online gaming. <snip>
Mned
I do hope your tongue is firmly in your cheek.
CCP are a business, they're in it to make money, not for love and dedication. Jeez
Someone prove me wrong.
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Aarn Khaar
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Posted - 2005.12.17 08:52:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Chiile VorseT I know the CCP boys and girls work very hard, to some very demanding customers, but hey that's business in the real world, and in the real world one would be expecting a refund on a service that is paid for.
Do you think that something like time extension, or a refund maybe in order?
So, we should get paid for them releasing a free expansion? You are loosing what 2 days of game time out of a total of 31 days for the month. That is about 6% of the entire month. So, that comes to grand total of 96 cents.
So, you would rather have less than a dollar than the expansion which adds free content that will last months. Seems rather silly. Just be patient, you are not loosing much by not being able to play for a couple of days out of the month.
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Vladimir Ilych
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Posted - 2005.12.17 08:57:00 -
[41]
this was a FREE content expansion. Any other game would make you PAY for it.
Also you lost what?
2 days of play time = 1 euro
er okay......
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asher n
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Posted - 2005.12.17 08:59:00 -
[42]
Everyone that wants a refund should get one for the 2 days or so that eve was down...
then CCP should collectively bill those whingers for the development costs of RMR.
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Nyphur
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Posted - 2005.12.17 09:37:00 -
[43]
Ack well it wuld be a really nice gesture to get a free day on our accounts but honest, it doesn't mean too much to us but multiply it by 80,000/30 and that's how many months they're missing out on of subs for giving us a free day. This stunt would set them back $40,000. Pricey :S.
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Wyke Mossari
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Posted - 2005.12.17 09:41:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Skelum
I think everyone should not comment for 2-3 days after patch, then if there are any problems then start whining.
The proxy connection failure prevented playing on tuesday and wednesday evenings, the patch on thursday, patch checksum failures on Friday. I got back on shortly after midnight last night, Sat morning. This means that Eve has essentially been unavailable for me for 4 days already.
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Qalten
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Posted - 2005.12.17 09:44:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Chiile VorseT
Do you think that something like time extension, or a refund maybe in order?
Absolutely not, and honestly I'm quite sick of people demanding refunds and extra days the minute something doesn't go quite right. Most of the other MMOs have you pay extra money PER expansion and PER upgrade. Most of the other MMOs are on all a fleet of sharded servers made to only hold a couple thousand of players.
This was a major patch. Don't start crying for refunds when it takes a bit to iron out all the wrinkles. Here's an idea, stop playing EVE, and go play a game that asks for money from you everytime they put out an expansion.
EVE Diplomacy Table |
Wyke Mossari
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Posted - 2005.12.17 09:44:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Teblin Oh dear. I didn't mean to start an argument .
I would call it a discuss not an argument, since *most* posters have kept it civil.
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Inspiration
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Posted - 2005.12.17 09:45:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Locke DieDrake OK, first of all, most other time based services that offer refunds or free days based on outages are selling a "always up" service. OR if they aren't an always up service, they are afraid you will go to the competitors.
EVE is different in that they are not selling an always up service, nor are there any real competitors in this niche. EvE is unique, not only in concept, but in implementation.
The bottom line is this. Major content updates cause some minor problems. They are minor.
The content update was free. It didn't have to be. They could easily have made it manditory to continue to play, and charged for it.
If, because of the FREE update, you can't play for a while, or your play experiance is not as good as it could be, then you are not entitled to anything but a small rant on the forum. And actually, not even that technically speaking. (see forum rules)
The fact is that CCP has done us ANOTHER wonderfull update, and AGAIN they did it for free.
EVE is the incredible game that it is, because CCP pour their hearts and souls into making it such. And I feel offended on their behalf by amount of petty crap posted on these forums in the last 24 hours.
Is the update perfect? Nope. Was the game perfect to start? Nope. Would any other online game company give you multiple free content updates each year with the SOLE intent of making the game more fun to play? It's never happened except here, with CCP.
So I say NO, you don't get free time, or reimbursements because CCP EARNED the right to a little down time, and a little rough edges. They have EARNED the right to tell you that if you can't handle the free update and the rough edges, then you probably can't handle the awesomeness that is EvE and CCP.
In short, It's not standard for MMO's to refund for down time. It's not standard for MMO's to release free updates. CCP gives you free updates. They don't (and shouldn't) refund game time.
In short...nothing is FREE and you know it! And if you got any braincell left working, you know they cant charge us for an enforced update. At the best they would loose a lot of customers, and at the worst it might even be a breach of contract.
You realy think they make content updates for free? As if free, where they don't get anything for it back in return from their existing customer base? It's part of subscription price you pay, they use your subscription money to finance the maintenance and further development of the game. It is not that they go to the bank and arrange loans to make each new content patch, then wait and see if they can ever make their mney back!
Game enhancements are part of the game maintenance you pay for, that is what the service you pay for is afterall..gameplay. Problems in delivering this service is definatly something that customers can hold CCP accountable for to some level.
Now, stop this nonsence about FREE, will you...you start to sound like a corporate lawyer with no real footing in the true world other then his own wallet!
Check out my resistance calculator.
WARNING: It is not RMR ready, mail me the stacking penalty math so I can fix this! |
Bas Rendar
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Posted - 2005.12.17 09:49:00 -
[48]
A refund! Lemme see, 14.95 a month, 31 days in this month...... Server was down for 1 day, sooo that roughly works out too..
I want my .50 cents Dammit !
(VTIC) |
Qalten
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Posted - 2005.12.17 09:49:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Inspiration
It's part of subscription price you pay, they use your subscription money to finance the maintenance and further development of the game.
"Free" is used when comparing to mostly every other MMO that DOES charge you for a content upgrade/expansion. Each time. This is in addition to the subscription you pay them, as well.
EVE Diplomacy Table |
Inspiration
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Posted - 2005.12.17 09:53:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Qalten
Originally by: Inspiration
It's part of subscription price you pay, they use your subscription money to finance the maintenance and further development of the game.
"Free" is used when comparing to mostly every other MMO that DOES charge you for a content upgrade/expansion. Each time. This is in addition to the subscription you pay them, as well.
I bet the subscription fee is less then that in EVE? Same thing in a different package realy as at the end of the day everyone needs food on the table, plain and simple. Your words are just that a play with words, the underlining effect of the different pricing model they describe is the same!
Check out my resistance calculator.
WARNING: It is not RMR ready, mail me the stacking penalty math so I can fix this! |
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Qalten
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Posted - 2005.12.17 10:08:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Inspiration
I bet the subscription fee is less then that in EVE? Same thing in a different package realy as at the end of the day everyone needs food on the table, plain and simple. Your words are just that a play with words, the underlining effect of the different pricing model they describe is the same!
You bet incorrectly. Per monthly fees for other major MMO's averages $14.00 USD. Same as EVE. And they're the ones that you need to pick up a copy in-store for and pay for the expansions.
EVE Diplomacy Table |
Idio T
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Posted - 2005.12.17 10:18:00 -
[52]
To the original poster: I donÆt think they owe us.
IÆve never seen an online game with zero downtime, itÆs expected and tolerable. As for the folks who seam to be irate about the downtime, well, life would be great if my biggest worry was EVE being down for short time.
Btw, I personally donÆt see how RDR being free or charging for it would make any difference to the server population. EQ had 8 (I think) charged expansions before it was bumped from the #1 mmorpg spot. Free or not, itÆs a great ôperkö.
Frigate about it! |
Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.17 10:21:00 -
[53]
But RMR is still not free. It's there to generate money, to make you continue to subscribe. CCP has choosen to look at a long term income generation rather than charging up front. It's called business, which is what Eve is.
My orginal question was whether people thought a refund, of some manner, was in order not that I was demanding a refund. So whine about people whining, but don't libel me with demanding a refund. It's simple English comprehension. Just like spelling...
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Qalten
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Posted - 2005.12.17 10:23:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Chiile VorseT My orginal question was whether people thought a refund, of some manner, was in order not that I was demanding a refund. So whine about people whining, but don't libel me with demanding a refund. It's simple English comprehension. Just like spelling...
Very well, to answer your original question directly: No, I don't think that a refund of any shape, size or form is in order. This is what happens when you patch a complex unsharded game like EVE. Things happen, Murphy visits, everyone will get over it soon. ~
EVE Diplomacy Table |
Sirial Soulfly
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Posted - 2005.12.17 10:34:00 -
[55]
Although CCP is a company Iam sure almost everybody there loves their job =)
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Chiile VorseT
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Posted - 2005.12.17 10:36:00 -
[56]
I agree. I don't think a refund is in order at the moment. But if serious problems do continue to occur over a week say, denying service then CCP should look as some sort of refund.
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Ra'virr
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Posted - 2005.12.17 10:37:00 -
[57]
No for gods sake. We got a free expansion, and CCP are _the_ best making this wonderful game, and i think we¦ll survive a couple of days with some lag. Im kinda of used to this anyway (Castor anyone?).
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