Pages: 1 [2] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Embrace My Hate
Black Horizon. Test Friends Please Ignore
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:41:00 -
[31] - Quote
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
Hmm interesting.
just few differencies
blue null / local consisted of few people in system / intel chanell you know about possible aggresor even before he reach same constelation you are in. When he comes all skill you really need is to warp under FF
empire you are there with dozens somewhere even houndreds of people in local/ every one of them is possible danger and can mobilize and shot you/destroy your ship / you dont know jack about when it will come / you cant defend against it once they decide to destroy you.
Seems like blue null is actually far more secure than an empire
I never claimed any one was more secure than the other. I was only preaching that null-sec even at its most individual level requires SOME amount of social interaction as opposed to running missions.
If the most social interaction you get out of missioning is the lottery chance of a loss mail then you only prove my point in that missions in general are just very un-eve like. |
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
26
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:42:00 -
[32] - Quote
Embrace My Hate wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
Hmm interesting.
just few differencies
blue null / local consisted of few people in system / intel chanell you know about possible aggresor even before he reach same constelation you are in. When he comes all skill you really need is to warp under FF
empire you are there with dozens somewhere even houndreds of people in local/ every one of them is possible danger and can mobilize and shot you/destroy your ship / you dont know jack about when it will come / you cant defend against it once they decide to destroy you.
Seems like blue null is actually far more secure than an empire
I never claimed any one was more secure than the other. I was only preaching that null-sec even at its most individual level requires SOME amount of social interaction as opposed to running missions. If the most social interaction you get out of missioning is the lottery chance of a loss mail then you only prove my point in that missions in general are just very un-eve like.
true however with recent changes to anomalies i dont really see huge chunk of us carebears moving there any time soon.
|
Igualmentedos
Shadow Veil Industrial Shadow Directive
47
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:42:00 -
[33] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:The Apostle wrote:Baphommet wrote:I made a reply on another thread, and I though the subject required more attention. So instead of coming up with ideas on highsec careers like in the other thread, I'd like to have your opinion on weather my points are valid and reasonable.
Here was my post: (The idea is that lvl 4s are way OP) ------------ Has it ever occurred to anybody that some people only play BECAUSE of level 4's? And anyway, why is it neccessary to move carebears to get PvP? Is it because they will make low/0.0 target rich? PvP'ers are the ones complaining about lowsec etc. so why don't YOU move out there? I've already said - and this is why I post on it, if highsec targets are taken away (either by assured safety OR by complete reversal of highsec safety), then people will move out by default. PvP'ers DON'T want to leave highsec because they are SAFE there. It's not a "carebear" created problem. why do YOU play? Other than to QQ out of curiosity... Know what I say? make deadspace areas akin to 0.0 No CONCORD, no sec etc
I'm going with 2/10 on this one.
The good: -Proposal of a bad idea is always a good laugh.
The bad: -Very little effort. -Unoriginal. -Boring. -Grammar, spelling, etc.
I suggest baiting the person into a ridiculous conversation. That is usually much more effective.
|
Rocky Deadshot
In The Goo EVE Trade Alliance
49
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:43:00 -
[34] - Quote
low/null is having issues because of ITS problems.
And anyone still running lvl 4s for anything over than sec status is behind the times on money making. |
Igualmentedos
Shadow Veil Industrial Shadow Directive
47
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:45:00 -
[35] - Quote
Baphommet wrote:Overpowered enough to make dangerous ventures not worth it. Fives may reward more, I don't really have much to say on that.
-No -I also ignore the fact that level 5's are more rewarding.
|
Kengutsi Akira
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
133
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:45:00 -
[36] - Quote
Make lvl IVs PVP friendly. No CONCORD, no Sec, free for all.
I think I said that once but I could be wrong Im kinda tired lol https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=255722#post255722
My well known stance on WiS |
Barbelo Valentinian
The Scope Gallente Federation
96
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:50:00 -
[37] - Quote
Embrace My Hate wrote:The Apostle wrote: You're absolutely right and it comes back the same ol'. Did the significant shift to highsec occur after the Sanctums nerfs?
The high population in the "good" systems (as you said) took away the isk potential so much so that moving to highsec gave you similar income without the risk - particularly Incursions.
Although, granted, Incursions require solid fleet discipline and multiplayer ethos but the coinage is superb for relatively low risk.
I'm pretty sure CCP have the numbers and the Sanctum nerf may well be reversed if what we're saying has any truth in it.
For mine, L4 missions ain't the problem, they're the result.
I think the point I'm trying to make is that in order to do anything in 0.0 lot's of things have to happen. There needs to be sov/upgrades. Some stuff needs to be scanned, most are to difficult to do without multiple players. You need to be aware of hostile players etc, etc. As for level 4 missions there is very little to no interaction. Even disregarding how much ISK you actually make doing it it is just a very poor mechanic that fosters a very un-eve like mentality. Missions are sort of the theme park in a sandbox world they just don't really fit. Am I making any sense lol?
Yeah you're making sense, but it seems that CCP have decided they have to have a bit of themepark in their sandbox to capture some of the casual and/or solo players who make up the bulk of the population of most MMOs. Evidently there aren't enough hardcore sandboxers around, or many of them have played EVE and left already.
And to forestall the "but MMO means multiplayer" argument, some people (like me) like to play solo in MMOs just because the background to one's virtual adventures feels more real when there are other people around. Plus there's a chatbox too. |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 02:53:00 -
[38] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote:Make lvl IVs PVP friendly. No CONCORD, no Sec, free for all.
I think I said that once but I could be wrong Im kinda tired lol The last thing needed is a 1 sided gank-based solution. While this is an MMO, it is nice to have solo things to do when you can't reliably be a part of a group dynamic. I mission when I have to take frequent breaks from the keyboard. Otherwise I do incursions for PvE. If I may ask, why suck hate for the solo players? |
Embrace My Hate
Black Horizon. Test Friends Please Ignore
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:01:00 -
[39] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote: The last thing needed is a 1 sided gank-based solution. While this is an MMO, it is nice to have solo things to do when you can't reliably be a part of a group dynamic. I mission when I have to take frequent breaks from the keyboard. Otherwise I do incursions for PvE.
Having a soloable option when you cannot at the time play as a part of a group, especially for those smaller groups out there is absolutely necessary. What we have with missions though is not just something soloable to do when no one is on but an entire way of life in EVE. Some players never do anything except missions in game.
Some people create alts just to do misisons to make ISK. When you have to make an alt to mission run because your main in his or her corp can't generate an income there is something seriously wrong with situation. |
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local Break-A-Wish Foundation
54
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:04:00 -
[40] - Quote
I get the feeling that significantly nerfing L4s might actually have a very negative effect on the game in general, alot of general highsec folks seem to pay for their subs entierly off the backs of L4 missions and without them may not actually be able to play the game at all, and nobody wants that.
If people are legitimately concerned about how much money people can make running L4s in an NPC corp then it might be better to focus on the NPC corps rather than missions. Raising the tax rate on the non-school NPC corps significantly and putting a maximum time limit on being in a starting corp might address that a little. |
|
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
26
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:06:00 -
[41] - Quote
Embrace My Hate wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote: The last thing needed is a 1 sided gank-based solution. While this is an MMO, it is nice to have solo things to do when you can't reliably be a part of a group dynamic. I mission when I have to take frequent breaks from the keyboard. Otherwise I do incursions for PvE.
Having a soloable option when you cannot at the time play as a part of a group, especially for those smaller groups out there is absolutely necessary. What we have with missions though is not just something soloable to do when no one is on but an entire way of life in EVE. Some players never do anything except missions in game. Some people create alts just to do misisons to make ISK. When you have to make an alt to mission run because your main in his or her corp can't generate an income there is something seriously wrong with situation.
well but that doesnt have to be an problem with level IV mission, does it ?
It could be problem on the other part of the train, aka why he is not able to make isk at the place he is now. I probably know the answer, however he made that choice, its his way how he wants to play.
Changing the entire gameplay for many in order to deny something from them is not gonna make the guy who made an alt to do lvl IVs mission any happier, will it ? |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:11:00 -
[42] - Quote
Embrace My Hate wrote:Tyberius Franklin wrote: The last thing needed is a 1 sided gank-based solution. While this is an MMO, it is nice to have solo things to do when you can't reliably be a part of a group dynamic. I mission when I have to take frequent breaks from the keyboard. Otherwise I do incursions for PvE.
Having a soloable option when you cannot at the time play as a part of a group, especially for those smaller groups out there is absolutely necessary. What we have with missions though is not just something soloable to do when no one is on but an entire way of life in EVE. Some players never do anything except missions in game. Some people create alts just to do misisons to make ISK. When you have to make an alt to mission run because your main in his or her corp can't generate an income there is something seriously wrong with situation. The only issue is that this creates a catch-22. if it's doable by someone semi-AFK and worth doing in any way, someone will attentively min/max it for maximum profit. Changing the game to try to force them out isn't very "sandboxy" and makes it less viable solution to those who do not "abuse" the system. That being said, with faction items, implants, meta mods, standings and so much else tied to missions, I can't help but wonder if they were intended to be viable playstyle by themselves. |
Embrace My Hate
Black Horizon. Test Friends Please Ignore
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:14:00 -
[43] - Quote
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:[ well but that doesnt have to be an problem with level IV mission, does it ?
It could be problem on the other part of the train, aka why he is not able to make isk at the place he is now. I probably know the answer, however he made that choice, its his way how he wants to play.
Changing the entire gameplay for many in order to deny something from them is not gonna make the guy who made an alt to do lvl IVs mission any happier, will it ?
The problem is that running missions regardless of the ISK made is the easy way out.
Would EVE be a better game if more people traded/built/researched/explored etc.? It couldn't hurt it Would you in the long run make more ISK in other ventures in highsec? According to posters in this thread yes.
Essentially all missions have become is a place to make relatively easy ISK with small investment and absolutely zero social interaction in a sandbox game. |
Embrace My Hate
Black Horizon. Test Friends Please Ignore
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:20:00 -
[44] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote: The only issue is that this creates a catch-22. if it's doable by someone semi-AFK and worth doing in any way, someone will attentively min/max it for maximum profit. Changing the game to try to force them out isn't very "sandboxy" and makes it less viable solution to those who do not "abuse" the system. That being said, with faction items, implants, meta mods, standings and so much else tied to missions, I can't help but wonder if they were intended to be viable playstyle by themselves.
Good post lol. I'm still thinking of a counter-argument but in the mean time enjoy the "like". |
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
26
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:24:00 -
[45] - Quote
Embrace My Hate wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:[ well but that doesnt have to be an problem with level IV mission, does it ?
It could be problem on the other part of the train, aka why he is not able to make isk at the place he is now. I probably know the answer, however he made that choice, its his way how he wants to play.
Changing the entire gameplay for many in order to deny something from them is not gonna make the guy who made an alt to do lvl IVs mission any happier, will it ? The problem is that running missions regardless of the ISK made is the easy way out. Would EVE be a better game if more people traded/built/researched/explored etc.? It couldn't hurt it Would you in the long run make more ISK in other ventures in highsec? According to posters in this thread yes. Essentially all missions have become is a place to make relatively easy ISK with small investment and absolutely zero social interaction in a sandbox game.
True, however its necessary evil. Accordingly to some statistics i read somewhere there is really an huge chunk of people living in high sec comparing to the null/low.
Some of them dont have time convenience to actually be bothered with other aspects of the game. And as i pointed out before the "recent" changes to anomalies will not get those with time and somewhat passive attitude into nullsec any time soon.
And missions can be done in groups you know, you can do fleet of ten people and do lvl IVs problem is the human attitude which incline to the part when you want better isk/hr ratio. There are some far more viable options for isk/hr ratio most of it doesnt even require you to undock
Yes lvl IVs can be viable ISK maker and yes it doesnt require group but so does any other activity actually if you know how and got at least two accounts you can actually do anything solo. Only restriction for some professions is having an blue nullsec possibly with your corporation/alliance owning an sovereignty .
I dont log to game as frequently as i used to and sometime i just log in and just reading chats, offering help time to time with lvl II missions, bought an Omen for it.
The human interaction cannot be forced, if someone try it the people who actually play the game for its possibility to do stuff alone will not get into ganks and start doing other things they will most likely un-sub. Would less subscriptions be better to EVE ? I guess not.
If someone wants to do the stuff you mentioned and wants to be part of something "greater" than his own need for best isk/hr ratio he will get into it. |
Marcus Janus
82nd Assault Fleet
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:26:00 -
[46] - Quote
So what've I've gotten from this translates to the following.
OMG PEOPLE PLAY DIFFERENT THAN ME NERF IT NAO!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's not just your sandbox to play in, if you want to make it more dangerous for them suicide ganking is very possible. |
Embrace My Hate
Black Horizon. Test Friends Please Ignore
16
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:32:00 -
[47] - Quote
Marcus Janus wrote:So what've I've gotten from this translates to the following.
OMG PEOPLE PLAY DIFFERENT THAN ME NERF IT NAO!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's not just your sandbox to play in, if you want to make it more dangerous for them suicide ganking is very possible.
It has actually been nothing like that. It has been a good discussion with valid points raised. Quit shitting it up. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
544
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 03:35:00 -
[48] - Quote
Marcus Janus wrote:So what've I've gotten from this translates to the following.
OMG PEOPLE PLAY DIFFERENT THAN ME NERF IT NAO!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's not just your sandbox to play in, if you want to make it more dangerous for them suicide ganking is very possible. Thanks for not reading the thread and then mucking it up with your bad posting.
The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
19
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 04:08:00 -
[49] - Quote
Eve in a nutshell
- terrible FPS in space. How do you counter its an MMO sandbox when 99% of the community wants to shoot you first thing on site once you load grid. Yeah, very much like when you see a Soldier9313 lugging around a shotgun, LMS, or assault rifle you blast his ass as it comes around the corner. So much for a MMORPG, swear to god EVE is a "ground breaking FPS since 2003"
- terrible cost of risk vs reward. Sorry bro, my sub pays for my time. Not to entertain you. For that monthly sub, I choose to not be screwed over by you, your dog, your aunt, and cousin....just because you can. I have better things to do then let my trust get used by you, to benifit you, and waste the time paid for by my money so you can steal my assets and pod the crap out of me.
- terrible ROI vs time. I gave up on lowsec a long time ago, from the top two reasons. No matter how much time I spent looking, scouting, checking maps and Dotlan I was always caught within 3 jumps for the hours I spent looking. For the days and weeks spent training for a ship, it goes boom in minutes - why, FPS syndrome. So much for MMO interaction, amirite? Would I pay ransom, **** no cause "I can" get podded by you after paying cause "You do what ever you want" in this sandbox FFS.
Lack of respect, FPS mentality, and general "do what ever the hell I want, so long as it causes trouble to someone else" attitude is why I prefer level 4 and 11% tax to virtual coffers. Its a sandbox, your choice to play how you want and my choice of how I want to play. You want to take my reason for playing and chatting with others, sure I agree with it so long as highsec PVP is taken away from you to become 100% carebear land - No attacking, No wardecs, CONCORD on your ass and Podding you should you drop below 0 sec status while traveling .5 space in just a pod (NPC would shoot and pod you on site + loose SP regardless if your clone was updated if I had my way, but I don't work for CCP). I loose something, you loose something, no one wins. |
Kengutsi Akira
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
133
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 04:15:00 -
[50] - Quote
Igualmentedos wrote:Kengutsi Akira wrote:The Apostle wrote:Baphommet wrote:I made a reply on another thread, and I though the subject required more attention. So instead of coming up with ideas on highsec careers like in the other thread, I'd like to have your opinion on weather my points are valid and reasonable.
Here was my post: (The idea is that lvl 4s are way OP) ------------ Has it ever occurred to anybody that some people only play BECAUSE of level 4's? And anyway, why is it neccessary to move carebears to get PvP? Is it because they will make low/0.0 target rich? PvP'ers are the ones complaining about lowsec etc. so why don't YOU move out there? I've already said - and this is why I post on it, if highsec targets are taken away (either by assured safety OR by complete reversal of highsec safety), then people will move out by default. PvP'ers DON'T want to leave highsec because they are SAFE there. It's not a "carebear" created problem. why do YOU play? Other than to QQ out of curiosity... Know what I say? make deadspace areas akin to 0.0 No CONCORD, no sec etc I'm going with 2/10 on this one. The good:-Proposal of a bad idea is always a good laugh. The bad:-Very little effort. -Unoriginal. -Boring. -Grammar, spelling, etc. I suggest baiting the person into a ridiculous conversation. That is usually much more effective.
But its so easy to get him to reply....
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=255722#post255722
My well known stance on WiS |
|
Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
125
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 04:49:00 -
[51] - Quote
CCP know that if they mess around with Highsec and missions there, it will cost them a lot of real cash, they're not ignorant as to the needs of a large portion of "casual" players.
One can speculate about changing Missions/payouts/drops etc, but the fact remains it all works for CCP. They're not about to kill a cash-cow.
In any case, level 4 missions are not as lucrative as they are being made out to be. There are very few where there are decent bounties and good payouts.
Older, better players may also lose sight of the fact of their superior skills at pew-pew, whereas newer players still sweat and battle to do missions.
The question regarding players who prefer solo in an MMO/Sandbox, again, we lose sight of this fact - it is a sandbox. Many people play how they can, when they can. We do not all have all the time in the world to play Eve, as much as we would like to.
It's long past time where we as players get on with the game and stop pointing fingers at Missioners for the alleged problems they cause in the markets. That is utter nonsense.
Change the Highsec Mission dynamics and you will break Eve beyond repair. CCP knows this.
Peace out.
The universe is an ancient desert, a vast wasteland with only occasional habitable planets as oases. We Fremen, comfortable with deserts, shall now venture into another. - STILGAR, From the Sietch to the Stars. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
750
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 05:01:00 -
[52] - Quote
Kengutsi Akira wrote: quote=Aqriue]Eve in a nutshell
- terrible FPS in space.
um its not a First Person Shooter[/quote] That's why it's a terrible FPS
Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
|
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
27
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 05:05:00 -
[53] - Quote
The Apostle wrote:Kengutsi Akira wrote: quote=Aqriue]Eve in a nutshell
- terrible FPS in space.
um its not a First Person Shooter That's why it's a terrible FPS [/quote]
well he was referring to mind set of the "PvP" players
true its not FPS in FPS you are at somewhat leveled field. In EVE you get roflstomped by someone far more experienced / SP wise / and better equipped for fight.
Altho he takes the losses to seriously
http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=3680304
just something to have an good laugh, most epic fit of stabber / excuse 6 day old i was.
|
|
CCP Spitfire
C C P C C P Alliance
376
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 06:56:00 -
[54] - Quote
Moved from "EVE General Discussion".
CCP Spitfire | Russian Community Coordinator @ccp_spitfire |
|
Pent'nor
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 07:34:00 -
[55] - Quote
The Apostle wrote:
The type of person that does missions all day (rightly or wrongly) is also not the type of person to head to lowsec/0.0 to make their coin.
You must keep in mind that 0.0 and L5's in lowsec are much more profitable than L4's, so using your logic, why haven't they moved? It's not the isk, it's the safety.
Same reason why PvP'ers stay in highsec. Mitigation of risk.
I am one of those casual players that will never leave highsec except on rare occasions when I'm loaded with isk and don't care if I die. I understand that I can make loads more isk in low/null but thats not going to get me out there. I like the low risk of highsec and when I have the isk and time, i'll pop out to lowsec for some dumb get rich quick hulling scam to see if I can make it past the gate camps, but only when I have the isk because at any point I enter lowsec for what ever reason, I expect to die. I would think that many others act this way. So there is the catch, I think the mission payouts are fine because if it takes me so long to make that isk, then I would never venture out to lowsec.
Although I would say that I find the missions are very boring. I'd love to pep them up a bit with a different missioning system. |
TrollFace TrololMcFluf
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 10:21:00 -
[56] - Quote
Oh lookie here another L4 mission tearbaby
Dose the wittel low/nullsec carebear not like missions so you come here and cry your eyes out about it
AWWWWW
let me guess you think that if ccp nerfs everything darling dosnt like it will make eve better
YES NERF NERF NERF thats the answer to everything
I swear parasites like the OP really get my goat |
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
28
|
Posted - 2011.10.28 15:57:00 -
[57] - Quote
TrollFace TrololMcFluf wrote:Oh lookie here another L4 mission tearbaby
Dose the wittel low/nullsec carebear not like missions so you come here and cry your eyes out about it
AWWWWW
let me guess you think that if ccp nerfs everything darling dosnt like it will make eve better
YES NERF NERF NERF thats the answer to everything
I swear parasites like the OP really get my goat
Read before post. Thanks in advance.
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 [2] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |