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Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
15424
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 14:49:00 -
[31] - Quote
I'll agree, under the following conditions.
- 1 Plex buys you 1 months worth of SP at your lowest attribute configuration.
- To apply the SP, requires you to pause your current training.
- You must chose which skills you are applying the SP to, before you start the process.
- It takes a full month to apply the new SP and at no point can you resume the normal training queue.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
15424
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 14:54:00 -
[32] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Caleb Seremshur wrote:PLEX is game time. Game time is SP. Nope. PLEX can (among other things) purchase game time. Game time allows you access to the game. Quote:PLEX for SP could work at a rate of no training implants across the 30 days of game time.
It would be functionally the same thing. Nope. It would be entirely bypassing the training time game mechanic. So I just buy a character off the bazaar and functionally do the same thing?? You're going in circles here! The only thing standing in the way of using PLEX to buy SP is the personal hang-ups people have about newbies equalling them in SP. Excuse me but I thought SP was meaningless? <--- isn't this what we're normally told? It's all strawman logic. I say give people the opportunity to buy SP with PLEX then goons and PL/FA etc can upskill their whole player base and ruin the game completely. Maybe then CCP will finally address the cancers at the heart of this game. Buying a char off the bazaar does not bypass the time it took to train that char, you are simply paying someone else to pre do that for you. Whereas buying SP with a plex, completely bypasses the time it would normally take to acquire that SP.
The only strawman I saw, was your rant regarding goons etc.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Baygun
EVE University Ivy League
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 15:06:00 -
[33] - Quote
Malcanis wrote: Synonyms for no
:: wall of text ::
I do not want to argue with anyone by no means, but that words i can read in any dictionary. May i ask for some reason(s) why buying SP for PLEX (with some reasonable restrictions) is bad?
I am missing the connection between SP and "winning the game by paying". Why buying SP is considered "pay to win" while character bazaar is not? Why buying unlimited amounts of PLEX is not "pay to win"?
I play this game since recently and may be i can not see clearly some obvious facts.
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Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
15425
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 15:12:00 -
[34] - Quote
Baygun wrote:Malcanis wrote: Synonyms for no
:: wall of text ::
I do not want to argue with anyone by no means, but that words i can read in any dictionary. May i ask for some reason(s) why buying SP for PLEX (with some reasonable restrictions) is bad? I am missing the connection between SP and "winning the game by paying". Why buying SP is considered "pay to win" while character bazaar is not? Why buying unlimited amounts of PLEX is not "pay to win"? I play this game since recently and may be i can not see clearly some obvious facts. The character bazaar does not bypass normal game play when the character acquires that SP. It's gained over time like everyone else and each and every consequence of that time and the choices made therein, are part and parcel of that character. Therefore NOT P2W.
Buying SP on the other hand, completely bypasses normal game mechanics. SP is created immediately out of thin air, simply by buying a plex. In other words, P2W.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Baygun
EVE University Ivy League
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 15:21:00 -
[35] - Quote
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris wrote:Caleb Seremshur wrote:RubyPorto wrote:If you feel like SP is the defining characteristic of a character, nab one off the Character Bazaar.
Allowing you to use PLEX to circumvent normal game mechanics is bad, mmkay? PLEX is game time. Game time is SP. PLEX for SP could work at a rate of no training implants across the 30 days of game time. It would be functionally the same thing. You just completely scrapped one of most crucial parts of EvE gameplay: time. Instant gratification is bad for games as you'll get bored of them quickly and will search for other ways to amuse yourself. Spending time on your character, slowly savoring different aspects of game, is one of EvE's main charms and selling points.
I'll scrap it even more :)
1) difference between getting SP now instead of later (anyway giving PLEX) is like the difference between armor repairer and shield booster...
2) SP gratification is more like giving extra SP when separating Destroyer and BC skills to be racial. Although well reasoned by CCP it is nontheless gratification. PLEX costs ISK/real money.
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Caleb Seremshur
Angel of War
50
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 15:23:00 -
[36] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Caleb Seremshur wrote:
The only thing standing in the way of using PLEX to buy SP is the personal hang-ups people have about newbies equalling them in SP.
Excuse me but I thought SP was meaningless? <--- isn't this what we're normally told?
It's all strawman logic. I say give people the opportunity to buy SP with PLEX then goons and PL/FA etc can upskill their whole player base and ruin the game completely.
Maybe then CCP will finally address the cancers at the heart of this game.
Buying a char off the bazaar does not bypass the time it took to train that char, you are simply paying someone else to pre do that for you. Whereas buying SP with a plex, completely bypasses the time it would normally take to acquire that SP. The only strawman I saw, was your rant regarding goons etc.
Irony isn't your forte is it.
Buying SP with PLEX is the next inevitable step in CCP's business strategy. Every second of every day alts devalue new players more and more. The only way to compete is to get a better character. Yes you could use your time to train it, or buy someone else's time, or just circumvent that scenario entirely and buy the SP outright and have something you want.
Saying that the investment of time is what matters isn't a very salient point. You're just devaluing new players further and further. Read my thread here for my thoughts on eve economy https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=263968&find=unread Mining in game, from the perspective of an IRL miner. |
Baygun
EVE University Ivy League
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 15:34:00 -
[37] - Quote
Mag's wrote:The character bazaar does not bypass normal game play when the character acquires that SP. It's gained over time like everyone else and each and every consequence of that time and the choices made therein, are part and parcel of that character. Therefore NOT P2W.
Buying SP on the other hand, completely bypasses normal game mechanics. SP is created immediately out of thin air, simply by buying a plex. In other words, P2W.
So apparently i am not aware of what is "normal game play".
Thanks to all who answered my questions. |
Demica Diaz
The Scope Gallente Federation
41
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 15:36:00 -
[38] - Quote
Buying actual skill points for PLEX is big no no, it would be horrible for EVE. |
Caleb Seremshur
Angel of War
50
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 15:54:00 -
[39] - Quote
Baygun wrote:Mag's wrote:The character bazaar does not bypass normal game play when the character acquires that SP. It's gained over time like everyone else and each and every consequence of that time and the choices made therein, are part and parcel of that character. Therefore NOT P2W.
Buying SP on the other hand, completely bypasses normal game mechanics. SP is created immediately out of thin air, simply by buying a plex. In other words, P2W. So apparently i am not aware of what is "normal game play". Thanks to all who answered my questions.
It doesn't matter anyway. Look at CCP business strategy over last 3 years.
Cosmetic shop. ISBoxing and botting implicitly allowed due to lack of incentive for intervention. PLEX price being manipulated by CCP to keep it at an 'acceptable' price. Massive inflation over the whole game, much of it unjustified. Encouraging the purchase of plex through encouraging the procurement of alts via discounts every month or so on PLEX package purchases. Now we have dual character training ie poor man's alt account.
Buying SP with PLEX is an inevitability because you functionally triple the PLEX purchased per toon. Will this drive prices down on PLEX on the market? It might. I doubt it as you'd see more PLEX purchased than ever from CCP with $ and then being burnt instantly on dual-character training and then boosting their SP by a given amount thanks to a further PLEX.
Bored nullsec veterans wanting to upskill their FW alts/mission alts/industry alts would be a big consumer. New players not wanting to be behind the bellcurve might buy 12 PLEX in one hit to give themselves a years headstart on the peasant whose morale compass forbids them from taking advantage of it, ergo dooming them to 2 years worth of waiting to do what they want for exactly the same cost.
Now you have players not just consuming PLEX for game time, they consume PLEX for their alts and consume even more PLEX for to gain SP.
CCP will end up in this place. Eventually. The embarassing DUST514 and WoD being practically forgotten since Incarna would have cost them dearly. Read my thread here for my thoughts on eve economy https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=263968&find=unread Mining in game, from the perspective of an IRL miner. |
Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
1570
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 16:06:00 -
[40] - Quote
Get Out.
EVE has one limited resource. Just one. Time. Why, exactly, do you think it is a good idea to remove this? |
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Caleb Seremshur
Angel of War
51
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 16:30:00 -
[41] - Quote
Why not? Can you actually provide a reason? Read my thread here for my thoughts on eve economy https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=263968&find=unread Mining in game, from the perspective of an IRL miner. |
Tobias Hareka
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
82
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 16:45:00 -
[42] - Quote
It would bypass intentional game mechanic. It would destroy idea behind character bazaar. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
15426
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 16:48:00 -
[43] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Mag's wrote:
Buying a char off the bazaar does not bypass the time it took to train that char, you are simply paying someone else to pre do that for you. Whereas buying SP with a plex, completely bypasses the time it would normally take to acquire that SP.
The only strawman I saw, was your rant regarding goons etc.
Irony isn't your forte is it. Buying SP with PLEX is the next inevitable step in CCP's business strategy. Every second of every day alts devalue new players more and more. The only way to compete is to get a better character. Yes you could use your time to train it, or buy someone else's time, or just circumvent that scenario entirely and buy the SP outright and have something you want. Saying that the investment of time is what matters isn't a very salient point. You're just devaluing new players further and further. Not mine, but most definitely yours. You state many things, but I've yet to see much in the way of proof to back them up.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
15426
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 16:50:00 -
[44] - Quote
Baygun wrote:Mag's wrote:The character bazaar does not bypass normal game play when the character acquires that SP. It's gained over time like everyone else and each and every consequence of that time and the choices made therein, are part and parcel of that character. Therefore NOT P2W.
Buying SP on the other hand, completely bypasses normal game mechanics. SP is created immediately out of thin air, simply by buying a plex. In other words, P2W. So apparently i am not aware of what is "normal game play".] If you had to ask, then yes you were not aware.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
Caleb Seremshur
Angel of War
51
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 17:33:00 -
[45] - Quote
Tobias Hareka wrote:It would bypass intentional game mechanic. It would destroy idea behind character bazaar.
Yes and no. Character bazaar you are treating like everyone uses it with a statement like that. Character bazaar doesn't even make sense really. You spend all this time making a character and running their training and then sell them for ISK? What? Buying SP through plex or buying a character from the bazaar are the same thing. It's not *you* spending the time so it's irrelevent how old the toon your buying is.
People need to stop thinking of this game in terms of characters and start thinking of it as real people. There is an over abudance of characters to real players. That is why newbies get devalued by alts. Even their own alts are devaluing them. Buying SP creates value for a new player even if he lacks the skills to use them(not that there aren't guides for that stuff by now).
Quote:You state many things, but I've yet to see much in the way of proof to back them up.
If you're insinuating that isboxers and OGB aren't a major concern then there's nothing else to say to you. Your vested interest in keeping this self-deprecating practice in motion is exactly the kind of thing I expected to see.
They are infact so serious that game mechanics are being changed to lower their influence. This isn't a policy change or a metagame influence, this is literally game code being rewritten to reduce the impact of people with multiple accounts. Read my thread here for my thoughts on eve economy https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=263968&find=unread Mining in game, from the perspective of an IRL miner. |
Tobias Hareka
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
82
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 17:54:00 -
[46] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Yes and no. Character bazaar you are treating like everyone uses it with a statement like that. Character bazaar doesn't even make sense really. You spend all this time making a character and running their training and then sell them for ISK? What? Buying SP through plex or buying a character from the bazaar are the same thing. It's not *you* spending the time so it's irrelevent how old the toon your buying is.
They aren't the same thing.
Quote:If you're insinuating that isboxers and OGB aren't a major concern then there's nothing else to say to you. Your vested interest in keeping this self-deprecating practice in motion is exactly the kind of thing I expected to see.
They are infact so serious that game mechanics are being changed to lower their influence. This isn't a policy change or a metagame influence, this is literally game code being rewritten to reduce the impact of people with multiple accounts.
OGBs are going to get fixed. That means "removed" btw.
ISBoxer still requires you to press the buttons. If you want to ban ISBoxer how are you going to ban these? |
Swiftstrike1
Interfector INC. Fade 2 Black
171
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 17:59:00 -
[47] - Quote
No. The title of the thread is a question, so I think 'no' is a perfectly suitable response.
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RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
3894
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 18:15:00 -
[48] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:So I just buy a character off the bazaar and functionally do the same thing??
Buying a character bypasses nothing. Just like buying a Rifter off the market doesn't bypass anything, but some PLEX for Rifters program would.
Quote:You're going in circles here!
How's that now?
Quote:The only thing standing in the way of using PLEX to buy SP is the personal hang-ups people have about newbies equalling them in SP.
Or, game balance, y'know...
Quote:Excuse me but I thought SP was meaningless? <--- isn't this what we're normally told?
SP is meaningless. Skills are meaningful. You're asking for the ability to bypass the normal method of acquiring skills.
Quote:It's all strawman logic. I say give people the opportunity to buy SP with PLEX then goons and PL/FA etc can upskill their whole player base and ruin the game completely.
Maybe then CCP will finally address the cancers at the heart of this game.
I do not thing this term means what you think it means. This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
Egravant Alduin
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
17
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 18:55:00 -
[49] - Quote
I like the idea.And for you people who say this will lead to P2win why now, can't someone buy plexes and then buy a character from bazaar with great skill points? |
Caleb Seremshur
Angel of War
53
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 19:03:00 -
[50] - Quote
Quote:The straw man fallacy occurs in the following pattern of argument:
- Person 1 has position X.
- Person 2 disregards certain key points of X and instead presents the superficially similar position Y. The position Y is a distorted version of X and can be set up in several ways, including:
- Presenting a misrepresentation of the opponent's position.
- Quoting an opponent's words out of contextGÇöi.e., choosing quotations that misrepresent the opponent's actual intentions (see fallacy of quoting out of context).[4]
- Presenting someone who defends a position poorly as the defender, then refuting that person's argumentsGÇöthus giving the appearance that every upholder of that position (and thus the position itself) has been defeated.[3]
- Inventing a fictitious persona with actions or beliefs which are then criticized, implying that the person represents a group of whom the speaker is critical.
- Oversimplifying an opponent's argument, then attacking this oversimplified version.
It's all happening right here in this thread. Out of context quotation, implying that Character Bazaar is not just the first iteration of SP-PLEX funding, attempting to insert game balance as an argument in a game that is hilariously broken at every level and has been broken for so long that CCP are now rebalancing it entirely in order to fix it, implying that SP are meaningless meanwhile without any SP whatsoever you can't even fly an ibis.
Are macros banned under the EULA? I'm pretty sure they are. That's where the contention comes with ISBoxing because it replaces the human need to manually change client and click. Also OGB aren't being "fixed" they're being spindoctored in to the too-hard-basket.
Oh and not to mention some people posting with obvious alts. Post with main or gtfo much? Read my thread here for my thoughts on eve economy https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=263968&find=unread Mining in game, from the perspective of an IRL miner. |
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RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
3894
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 19:39:00 -
[51] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:It's all happening right here in this thread. Out of context quotation, implying that Character Bazaar is not just the first iteration of SP-PLEX funding, attempting to insert game balance as an argument in a game that is hilariously broken at every level and has been broken for so long that CCP are now rebalancing it entirely in order to fix it, implying that SP are meaningless meanwhile without any SP whatsoever you can't even fly an ibis.
Point to me the part where I misrepresented your position.
It's not an implication, it's a clear statement. The Character Bazaar is in no way a method to bypass the normal acquisition of in game assets (i.e. skills). Just like the market at Jita 4-4 does not allow you to bypass the normal acquisition of in game assets (i.e. manufacturing).
Are you now saying that your argument for including your proposed process is "EVE is broken, let's break it more"?
No amount of SP allows you to fly an Ibis. The Skill "Spaceship Command I" allows you to fly an Ibis.
Quote:Are macros banned under the EULA? I'm pretty sure they are. That's where the contention comes with ISBoxing because it replaces the human need to manually change client and click. Also OGB aren't being "fixed" they're being spindoctored in to the too-hard-basket.
Macros are, in fact, not banned by the EULA. Automating gameplay is. Before the LP stores gained the "buy 50 of these" button, people regularly used macros when they wanted to buy 50 of the items, replacing 50 clicks with a long click-and-hold, and it was fine because there was a human holding the mouse button.
Quote:Oh and not to mention some people posting with obvious alts. Post with main or gtfo much?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem This is EVE - Everybody Versus Everybody.
"the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP)." -CCP Solomon |
El Geo
Pathfinders. The Marmite Collective
138
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 19:40:00 -
[52] - Quote
OGB getting totally removed is handing the game to the biggest gangs, its hard enough pulling people off their gangs to kill them when they have links and you do not but having to have your links on grid while trying to pull and seperate members off a bigger gang? Think about that for a while path-+find-+er (pthfndr, p+ñth-)n. 1. One that discovers a new course or way, especially through or into unexplored regions.
http://www.youtube.com/user/EvEPathfinders/videos?view=0 |
Mr Tinker Train
Capsuleer Outfitters Easily Excited
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.17 23:01:00 -
[53] - Quote
I for one would love to purchase SP
So many butt hurts talking about buying SP = person wins eve how stupid is that so many 2003 toons are killed by 5 month old toons every day. History has shown many times people buy 2003 toon from bizarre = ganked in juicy expensive cap you should be encouraging this for easy kills.
Whats really the point here nothing, buying SP has no game breaking advantage other then CCP might run out of skills to train big deal game would and is more enjoyable for that person.
its the same in RL ugly people say beauty is skin deep Poor people say money can't buy happiness well Bull crap this is not the issue and ccp should treat this as a business idea let people buy SP let the accountants state money = x quantity of SP
this has merit on many levels
So butt hurts state a game breaking reason other then it will ruin the game show it prove it. |
Tobias Hareka
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
82
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 09:49:00 -
[54] - Quote
Mr Tinker Train wrote:So many butt hurts talking about buying SP = person wins eve how stupid is that so many 2003 toons are killed by 5 month old toons every day. History has shown many times people buy 2003 toon from bizarre = ganked in juicy expensive cap you should be encouraging this for easy kills.
Only problem with your plan is the fact that players who want this PLEX for SP thing won't make any mistakes. |
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Republic Military Tax Avoiders
280
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 10:11:00 -
[55] - Quote
Mr Tinker Train wrote:ccp should treat this as a business idea let people buy SP let the accountants state money = x quantity of SP The day CCP start to monetize everything in game is the day EvE ceases to exist as a good game. Opinions are like assholes. Everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks. |
Lephia DeGrande
Luxembourg Space Union
37
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 10:12:00 -
[56] - Quote
And what happens with a Person who dont want or cant afford a Plex to keep Up with the Corp, its like a two class Society.. |
Whitehound
1847
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 10:27:00 -
[57] - Quote
Mr Tinker Train wrote:I for one would love to purchase SP
So many butt hurts talking about buying SP = person wins eve how stupid is that so many 2003 toons are killed by 5 month old toons every day. History has shown many times people buy 2003 toon from bizarre = ganked in juicy expensive cap you should be encouraging this for easy kills.
Whats really the point here nothing, buying SP has no game breaking advantage other then CCP might run out of skills to train big deal game would and is more enjoyable for that person.
its the same in RL ugly people say beauty is skin deep Poor people say money can't buy happiness well Bull crap this is not the issue and ccp should treat this as a business idea let people buy SP let the accountants state money = x quantity of SP
this has merit on many levels
So butt hurts state a game breaking reason other then it will ruin the game show it prove it. The irony of your comment is that you want to buy SPs, because you have low skills.
I have got 82m SPs on Whitehound and more than 100b ISKs in its wallets. You think I am butthurt if I could buy me more skillpoints?!
All that would happen is that the price of PLEX would shoot up to several billions in one day. A lot of players could not play for free any longer, because players like me would suck up as many PLEXes as we could get out of the market.
I wonder who here is butthurt and will be more so after such a game change. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
15426
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 10:28:00 -
[58] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Quote:You state many things, but I've yet to see much in the way of proof to back them up. If you're insinuating that isboxers and OGB aren't a major concern then there's nothing else to say to you. Your vested interest in keeping this self-deprecating practice in motion is exactly the kind of thing I expected to see. They are infact so serious that game mechanics are being changed to lower their influence. This isn't a policy change or a metagame influence, this is literally game code being rewritten to reduce the impact of people with multiple accounts. OGB are being removed. But the issue with that in the eyes of CCP, is about handing out boosts without much of a commitment to the fight. They wish for you to be there and in the thick of it, committing your ship to the fray.
So as I currently use OGB (when I last played) and I will adapt to any changes in that mechanic, there is not much to say in that regard. Although one would question the connection with this and what you said previously. You may wish to link this in some way to your claim of devaluing new players. But as this is an MMO, new players have the option of joining others and gain the same benefits. If you claim is in regards to the ISK value of new players, then show me proof.
I don't and have never used ISBoxer, but do not see any issues with it. They pay for each and every account and cannot gain items at an accelerated rate. It basically doesn't break any rules.
I think the main problem here, is your lack of understanding the concept and workings of the mechanics being discussed. This in turn means you post claims, without any proof to back them up.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
seany1212
Tides of Silence Care Factor
217
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 10:34:00 -
[59] - Quote
Every so often threads get created on Features & Ideas by a person who will throw up any counter argument, even if it doesn't make logical sense and that they haven't actually thought in-depth of the ramifications of the change.
No; reasoning being that every character created so far has been limited, as already stated here, by time, time created by the skillpoint training system. Every character in the character bazaar has taken months/years to train upto that skillpoint level and in turn created revenue for CCP in some way or form.
Now introducing Plex for SP will indeed bring in more revenue, but only temporarily, because before long you've got everybody maxed out on all available skills and everyones hot-dropping in titans and carebears have brought every available officer mod for that ridiculously overfit nightmare of theirs. Then people start to leave, just because CCP wont be able to churn out content fast enough and everyone can already fly everything anyway.
With the current system CCP doesn't need to worry about revenue for the forseeable future, because they know that every active account will provide them revenue in one way or form while that account stays active. The only thing they'll need to be concerned about is amount of active accounts, and there's ways to keep people interested and accounts active.
My question to you is why do you feel that you need SP for Plex, and why is it that you can't survive in eve without it? |
ArcticPrism
Bondage Goat Zombie Strictly Unprofessional
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 16:03:00 -
[60] - Quote
No thanks. There are already too many capital ship pilots in the game. |
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