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Mark Androcius
164
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Posted - 2013.08.17 13:48:00 -
[1] - Quote
A general question about taxes here.
When i extract water at an estimated value of 1.5 million from a planet, i pay 500K taxes a 5% tax. When i pull the same amount of precious metals, at an estimated value of 9 million off a planet, i also pay around 500K taxes at 5% tax.
When i pull 97 P4 products at an estimated value of 89.6 million off a planet, i pay 1.305 mil in taxes at 1% tax.
The calculations: 1.5 million isk water at 5% taxes = 7500 isk. 9 million isk in precious metals at 5% tax = 450000 isk. 89.6 million isk in P4 at 1& tax = 896000 isk.
It looks to me like CCP has given each PI level a set value and based the taxes on that. Kinda like this: P0 = 5 isk per unit. P1 = 600 isk per unit. etc etc bla bla bla, you know what i mean.
Why is this still the case? I mean, i get that in the past, back when we only had NPC customs offices, it was used as an isk sink, to balance the economy. But now though, most customs offices are owned by player corporations, so it is not an isk sink anymore AND i pay more then i theoretically need to, while the receiving end gets more than it theoretically "deserves".
It might not seem like to big of a deal, but looking at things like Water, Bio fuels and other really low value PI, i think it is a real pain.
Water and Bio fuels may have a low value, but you still kinda need that stuff. Their low value already deters many people from making them and this tax system, only makes that worse.
I say we ask CCP to change PoCo taxes to reflect actual value per item. This would mean the more expensive stuff will have more tax cost, but also mean the lower value stuff becomes slightly more profitable, which would help balance production levels out a bit. If a man speaks his mind in the forest and no woman hears him, is he still wrong? |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
36106
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Posted - 2013.08.17 14:03:00 -
[2] - Quote
Mark Androcius wrote: But now though, most customs offices are owned by player corporations, so it is not an isk sink anymore
This absolutely does not apply to the majority of active POCO's which are in High Sec. That is an ISK sink most indeed. As are the thousands of POCO's in Low and Null and WHs that have not been replaced yet.
Very few PI products are even worthwhile on the market. And from my experience, if scaled this way, I would pay absolutely no taxes to pickup Smartfab Units which I have never, ever successfully sold in over 3 years. And that would apply to most PI products tbh.
You just don't wanna pay your taxes.
Bad idea is bad. |
Mark Androcius
164
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Posted - 2013.08.17 14:11:00 -
[3] - Quote
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:Mark Androcius wrote: But now though, most customs offices are owned by player corporations, so it is not an isk sink anymore
This absolutely does not apply to the majority of active POCO's which are in High Sec. That is an ISK sink most indeed. As are the thousands of POCO's in Low and Null and WHs that have not been replaced yet. Very few PI products are even worthwhile on the market. And from my experience, if scaled this way, I would pay absolutely no taxes to pickup Smartfab Units which I have never, ever successfully sold in over 3 years. And that would apply to most PI products tbh. You just don't wanna pay your taxes. Bad idea is bad.
You apparently don't live in null-sec space. I have yet to see a non player owned PoCo in null-sec. Also, come on dude, high sec PI? if you actually do that, FAIL on you unless you do higher level PI, for which you buy the low level PI ( and even THEN you are looking at really crappy income, relative to null ). If a man speaks his mind in the forest and no woman hears him, is he still wrong? |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
36106
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Posted - 2013.08.17 14:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Mark Androcius wrote: You apparently don't live in null-sec space. I have yet to see a non player owned PoCo in null-sec. Also, come on dude, high sec PI? if you actually do that, FAIL on you unless you do higher level PI, for which you buy the low level PI ( and even THEN you are looking at really crappy income, relative to null ).
I've been doing all my PI with 5 toons for 3 years since Day One in Low Sec. There are tons of Interbus POCOs around. |
Lee Saisima
Caldari Arms and Industry
14
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Posted - 2013.08.17 14:26:00 -
[5] - Quote
--> Science & Industry |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
36109
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Posted - 2013.08.17 14:47:00 -
[6] - Quote
For real. |
Lee Saisima
Caldari Arms and Industry
14
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Posted - 2013.08.17 14:49:00 -
[7] - Quote
For real, yo. |
baltec1
Bat Country
7595
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Posted - 2013.08.17 16:10:00 -
[8] - Quote
Fo real, man. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Sweet Sensations Radical Industries
12055
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Posted - 2013.08.17 17:14:00 -
[9] - Quote
So real, it bites.
Bullshit is a greater enemy of the truth than lies are ~ Harry G. Frankfurt |
Arduemont
Rotten Legion Ops
1767
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Posted - 2013.08.17 21:04:00 -
[10] - Quote
Fo sure G. "In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." |
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Thur Barbek
Republic University Minmatar Republic
162
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Posted - 2013.08.17 21:32:00 -
[11] - Quote
taxes:
R0 = 5 isk base cost P1 = 500 isk base cost P2 = 9,000 isk base cost P3 = 70,000 isk base cost P4 = 1,350,000 isk base cost Export fee = Base cost * tax rate (*1.5 if launched via CC) Import fee = Base cost * tax rate * 0.5
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Planetary_Interaction#Profit.21 |
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting Home Front Coalition
642
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Posted - 2013.08.17 23:12:00 -
[12] - Quote
...and this is why corporations war over POCO's. If you don't want to pay your tax, or see it applied in your favour, strive for your corp to own POCO's or positive standings with those that do. It's literally that simple. |
Mark Androcius
164
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Posted - 2013.08.18 11:35:00 -
[13] - Quote
Yes, but the point was, WHY? Imagine having to pay taxes on the value of your house. You live in a 200.000 dollar house, but the government decided that..... well..... all houses are now taxed for a value of 1 million dollars, you think people would accept that?
Probably not, so why should we accept it in game?
The only point i tried to make was: Please ccp change this to reflect percentage of actual value. If a man speaks his mind in the forest and no woman hears him, is he still wrong? |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
36352
|
Posted - 2013.08.18 11:42:00 -
[14] - Quote
Mark Androcius wrote:You live in a 200.000 dollar house, but the government decided that..... well..... all houses are now taxed for a value of 1 million dollars, you think people would accept that?
Just get out and stop.
Your example is pathetic.
None of the PI Taxes are higher than the applicable product.
Go read some books or something as this isn't even humorous and smacks of Troll.
Also, needs to be in S & I, not here.
Blech. |
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations Self Sabatoge
1195
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Posted - 2013.08.18 11:51:00 -
[15] - Quote
Mark Androcius wrote:Yes, but the point was, WHY? Imagine having to pay taxes on the value of your house. You live in a 200.000 dollar house, but the government decided that..... well..... all houses are now taxed for a value of 1 million dollars, you think people would accept that? Probably not, so why should we accept it in game? The only point i tried to make was: Please ccp change this to reflect percentage of actual value.
Worst example ever in the history of civilization, no offense. I'm not saying every house is valued the same, but it's certainly nowhere near actual value in many places around th US. It's just based on what the government wants to spend. They need more money? They increase the value or increase the rate. There's only some relation to actual value. Yeah a 12k square foot nicely maintained home will be more than a 500 square foot dump, but it's nowhere near being fair. And you know what? We do accept it. We ***** and moan, but that's all you can do. No one shoots anyone over it.
Now, in regards to the base costs. I suggest CCP do nothing, and I assure you it's not to spite you. Consider that there is some minimum level of labor and other cost involved for the space men to process your order.
Think of it more like license plates. Where I live, the absolute cheapest plate is like 20 dollars. Yes there's a percentage tax, but there is still a floor on the amount of tax for that type of thing. There's a cost involved in the registration and physical plates. Other than being greedy bastards, the minimum is also used to offset these costs. See Bio for isk doubling rules. -áIf you didn't read bio, chances are you helped fund those who did. |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
36358
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Posted - 2013.08.18 12:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
Erotica 1 wrote:
Worst example ever in the history of civilization, no offense.
'Twas most indeed, 'twas it not. |
Eram Fidard
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
221
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Posted - 2013.08.18 13:50:00 -
[17] - Quote
Basing things off static values is the old way of doing things, and is what caused the mass-production and suicide of thousands of battleships before the insurance adjustment.
Hell, the entire mineral basket as it relates to production was designed with static values for minerals, and look at how much ridiculous trouble that has caused CCP (ie. adding 'extra materials').
The obvious consequences of static values for basing PI taxes off of may not be that big, but the concern should be the unforeseen consequences.
Like being able to self-destruct a battleship and receive more from the insurance than you spent on the build. |
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