Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Dragnkat
Winfield Star-Tech Un.Bound
33
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 16:00:00 -
[1] - Quote
Regarding the upcoming planned caldari ice interdiction planned by CFC
http://themittani.com/news/cfc-announces-caldari-ice-interdiction
I'd like to highlight the final paragraph as why you need to seriously look into your concord mechanics.
A lot of the new guys will have no idea that highsec is even a viably fun place. The truth is that it's one of the most entertaining parts of EVE if you're a ganker. Case in point, this kill had NC. corps at each others' throats for a good while. The tears you gather are simply wonderful. Most interestingly, judicious use of instawarps and warpins means you can continue ganking well past -5 security status and on down through -10.
Can someone explain to be how this isn't abusing loopholes in EVE mechanics to get around security status and not an outright exploit?
I watched this activity first hand in Ogoten a few weeks back, not once but SEVEN times a fleet of suicide gankers all below -5 were able to insta warp cata fleets from the station, suicide gank a target of choice, and pull it off before concord could get there.
Which makes me ask what is the bloody point of even having security status mechanics in the first place if players can exploit (and it is one!) ways around it to continue to act with impunity, and zero consequence for their actions!
This is a broken system, what will it take for CCP to address it.
Let's be clear about one thing, if i'm ganked by someone above -5, who could act without insta concord spawns i'm all for that, it's part of the actual game. I faced the consequences for not paying attention or just bad luck.
CFC ganking the caldari ice fields? I'll be the first to say "Welcome to EVE." right until they hit the -5 line, then you've crossed the line from actual gameplay into rulebreaking.
Consequences should be a two way street, why am I facing the loss of a ship but the criminal continues to be able to act in high sec, dock, access gates, get a new ship, and continue to gank with no consequences on his end?
The fix is a bloody simple one too, you want people to be pirates then make them actual pirates. Why the heck would a high sec station let someone at -10 even dock? Limit them to low sec stations for ships and supplies if they want to go that route, make them face some real consequences for those actions instead the laughable system we have now.
CCP / CSM it's time to do something about this, you do not have PVP in EVE. Not the kind you hope for anyway aside from the occasional large battle recently, what you have is a game that may as well be called "ganker online" as it seems like everything you do (ore site changes, why don't you just put an even bigger bullseye on those of us that wanted to venture into low sec with some protection and now don't even have that!) seems to favor a playstyle that just rewards the lowest common denominator of childish pvp ganker. Or just reduces low sec to nothing but gate camps, and the rule of "He with the most smartbombs and logi ships to tank the gate guns wins." All the while this unfairly punishes those of us who try to play a game by the rules. You don't have a sandbox, you have a schoolyard playground where the biggest bully is able to do whatever he wants (see again the upcoming ice intervention and CFC admitting they can break the rules to keep it going) And those in charge seem all to happy to turn a blind eye to it, after all negative press is still press right?
And frankly trying to work around it is getting pretty old, |
Baaldor
Capsuleer Outfitters Easily Excited
70
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 16:28:00 -
[2] - Quote
You are new around here it seems.
Or this is a troll...not sure which. |
Vex Riftrider
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.19 16:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
Hey not to ruin CFCs day or nothing...
Hire bounty hunters to camp the gates and kill these inbound -6 through -10s Just by tackling them as they enter the gate and let concord do the work? Or even better and counter intuitively ...
Grow a pair and get a tackle frig with decent scan res and do it yourself.
You'd have all of concord helping you right?
That could be a long list of very easy kills man.
Just a thought.. I'm new here ...probably wrong. |
Devil Dodger
Holy Amarrian Battlemonk I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth
28
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 04:01:00 -
[4] - Quote
What do you mean zero consequences? The navy shoots me whenever they catch me and players can shoot me at will. What more do you want? Support my implant marketing campaign: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1903853#post1903853 Our customer list: http://poachers.mindflood.org/ |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11288
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 06:24:00 -
[5] - Quote
Anyone can shoot at -10s with no penalty.
If these gankers are facing "zero consequences" it's because you choose not to inflict them on those who have been declared literally outlaws.
1 Kings 12:11
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11288
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 06:25:00 -
[6] - Quote
Devil Dodger wrote:What do you mean zero consequences? The navy shoots me whenever they catch me and players can shoot me at will. What more do you want?
Maybe CCP should write a letter to your parents and get you grounded
1 Kings 12:11
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11288
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 06:27:00 -
[7] - Quote
Dragnkat wrote:
CFC ganking the caldari ice fields? I'll be the first to say "Welcome to EVE." right until they hit the -5 line, then you've crossed the line from actual gameplay into rulebreaking.
See, there are two sets of rules here
i. The actual rules that apply in the game in reality [NOT BROKEN]
ii. The imaginary rules that you are trying to apply here but that don't in fact exist [BROKEN]
Sadly, CCP will only enforce.... well look, you see where this is going, right?
1 Kings 12:11
|
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
1639
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 13:16:00 -
[8] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Dragnkat wrote:
CFC ganking the caldari ice fields? I'll be the first to say "Welcome to EVE." right until they hit the -5 line, then you've crossed the line from actual gameplay into rulebreaking.
See, there are two sets of rules here i. The actual rules that apply in the game in reality [NOT BROKEN] ii. The imaginary rules that you are trying to apply here but that don't in fact exist [BROKEN] Sadly, CCP will only enforce.... well look, you see where this is going, right?
Pressing on CCP to change the rules is also a way to PvP. The Greater Fool Bar is now open for business, 24/7. Come and have drinks and fun somewhere between RL and New Eden! |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
8607
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 13:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Pressing on CCP to change the rules is also a way to PvP.
"please remove suicide ganking CCP, nobody told me this game was challenging in any way" Twitter: @EVEAndski
TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest.-á |
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
1748
|
Posted - 2013.08.23 12:27:00 -
[10] - Quote
Not sure if OP is trolling or just drowning in his own tears. |
|
Andrew Articuli
Astra Corva Explorations The Empire of Byzantium
34
|
Posted - 2013.08.24 15:31:00 -
[11] - Quote
Suicide ganking is called suicide for a reason, they don't get away with it and 90% of the time lose ships, while definitely the concord system is stupid on some levels (I had a fleet mate get Concorded cause he shot a can in his harbinger) the sec status system works fine as is, suicide ganking is a natural risk of eve, as soon as you undock from station you consent to pvp. |
Andrew Articuli
Astra Corva Explorations The Empire of Byzantium
34
|
Posted - 2013.08.24 15:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Double post ignore |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Late Night Alliance
3113
|
Posted - 2013.08.25 19:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
Andrew Articuli wrote:Suicide ganking is called suicide for a reason, they don't get away with it and 90% of the time lose ships, Not to nitpick... but they lose their ships 100% of the time (I should know)... and they don't get any insurance for their loss. Saving a ship (in any way) from CONCORD's wrath is actually classed as an exploit. Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11385
|
Posted - 2013.08.25 21:57:00 -
[14] - Quote
Dragnkat wrote:
Can someone explain to be how this isn't abusing loopholes in EVE mechanics to get around security status and not an outright exploit?
CCP have repeatedly affirmed that suicide ganking is not just legitimate but intended.
It would be hugely easier to simply disable players from making any "CONCORDable" action than to have the whole flagging/CONCORD system, but CCP don't do this because it's both appropriate and necessary for players in hi-sec to be at risk of non-consensual PvP.
Anyone can shoot a -10 character. CONCORD won't do it because they've already punished him for whatever he did. But they won't interfere if you want to.
1 Kings 12:11
|
Rengerel en Distel
1788
|
Posted - 2013.08.26 14:09:00 -
[15] - Quote
If CCP wanted to make a change, they could actually enforce the bits about -10s not able to enter 1.0 space, etc. Or allow them to enter in pods like currently, but don't allow them to board a ship. That would fuel the tags for sec a bit more than currently, because as has been pointed out, there's little reason for actual gankers to care about their status.
With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
|
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
8631
|
Posted - 2013.08.26 19:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
Rengerel en Distel wrote:there's little reason for actual gankers to care about their status.
Why not just ask for suicide ganking to be made impossible rather than have more and more arbitrary penalties attached to it? Twitter: @EVEAndski
TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest.-á |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
42
|
Posted - 2013.08.26 19:54:00 -
[17] - Quote
Malcanis wrote: Anyone can shoot a -10 character. CONCORD won't do it because they've already punished him for whatever he did. But they won't interfere if you want to.
Top guy on the E-Uni kill-board the month that the new aggression mechanics went in was a guy who sat in Amarr shooting Suspects and -10s. In-fact some of his biggest kills were -10 pods (pretty sure I remember him getting a guy with full Slave set).
If you have a fleet of catalysts warping to you then hire a guy with a fast-locking Battlecruiser to watch your backs. Hell some would probably do it just for the fun of it.
Hell, these are Gank Catalysts. Moving around with an AB fit will probably throw off their warp-in point enough that you can react at least a little. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11412
|
Posted - 2013.08.27 05:56:00 -
[18] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Malcanis wrote: Anyone can shoot a -10 character. CONCORD won't do it because they've already punished him for whatever he did. But they won't interfere if you want to.
Top guy on the E-Uni kill-board the month that the new aggression mechanics went in was a guy who sat in Amarr shooting Suspects and -10s. In-fact some of his biggest kills were -10 pods (pretty sure I remember him getting a guy with full Slave set). If you have a fleet of catalysts warping to you then hire a guy with a fast-locking Battlecruiser to watch your backs. Hell some would probably do it just for the fun of it. Hell, these are Gank Catalysts. Moving around with an AB fit will probably throw off their warp-in point enough that you can react at least a little.
Good for him: he's actually doing -and proving it can be done- what the OP is complaining doesn't happen. There are the "consequences".
1 Kings 12:11
|
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
42
|
Posted - 2013.08.27 06:36:00 -
[19] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Cade Windstalker wrote:Malcanis wrote: Anyone can shoot a -10 character. CONCORD won't do it because they've already punished him for whatever he did. But they won't interfere if you want to.
Top guy on the E-Uni kill-board the month that the new aggression mechanics went in was a guy who sat in Amarr shooting Suspects and -10s. In-fact some of his biggest kills were -10 pods (pretty sure I remember him getting a guy with full Slave set). If you have a fleet of catalysts warping to you then hire a guy with a fast-locking Battlecruiser to watch your backs. Hell some would probably do it just for the fun of it. Hell, these are Gank Catalysts. Moving around with an AB fit will probably throw off their warp-in point enough that you can react at least a little. Good for him: he's actually doing -and proving it can be done- what the OP is complaining doesn't happen. There are the "consequences".
Yup, hells if the OP had posted in Crime and Punishment saying there were -10s to gank and posted a system he'd have probably solved his own problem by now!
BTW, hope the summit is going well! |
Lugia3
Pirates Incorporated
550
|
Posted - 2013.08.29 21:22:00 -
[20] - Quote
It has consequences. You lose your ship, they lose their ships. Also, this is not an exploit. CCP defines what exploits are and are not, and this is legitimate gameplay that has been featured in advertisements for the game before. Yarr |
|
Estella Osoka
Deep Void Merc Syndicate Sicarius Draconis
130
|
Posted - 2013.09.01 21:11:00 -
[21] - Quote
Do people really not understand this? Geez, read and learn: Security Status |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4278
|
Posted - 2013.09.03 03:52:00 -
[22] - Quote
Andski wrote:Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Pressing on CCP to change the rules is also a way to PvP. "please remove suicide ganking CCP, nobody told me this game was challenging in any way" Sounds good. There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over.
"Progodlegend said the goal of N3 is to destroy Goonswarm Federation, but in reality NCdot is in Fountain due to the fact it is virtually the last place there is action." ~NC., Fountain 2013 |
Omega Flames
Last Resort Inn
54
|
Posted - 2013.09.08 18:07:00 -
[23] - Quote
IMO anytime a -5 or below can fly around highsec in a ship and not get killed is a broken mechanic. (and yes they are in fact not getting killed when they can warp from stations/gates in anything other than a near instawarp ship) -10 has always been a can't survive in highsec status, and if you can survive long enough to suicide gank then you are surviving way too long already if you're already -10 <Munnkeh> i'm gonna use that excuse if i ever kill someone. "look, if you keep meeting ppl, it's bound to happen eventually" http://i.imgur.com/76pQ9.jpg |
Elizabeth Aideron
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
217
|
Posted - 2013.09.08 20:00:00 -
[24] - Quote
Omega Flames wrote:IMO anytime a -5 or below can fly around highsec in a ship and not get killed is a broken mechanic. (and yes they are in fact not getting killed when they can warp from stations/gates in anything other than a near instawarp ship) -10 has always been a can't survive in highsec status, and if you can survive long enough to suicide gank then you are surviving way too long already if you're already -10
So shoot them instead of whining. |
Omega Flames
Last Resort Inn
54
|
Posted - 2013.09.08 21:41:00 -
[25] - Quote
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:Omega Flames wrote:IMO anytime a -5 or below can fly around highsec in a ship and not get killed is a broken mechanic. (and yes they are in fact not getting killed when they can warp from stations/gates in anything other than a near instawarp ship) -10 has always been a can't survive in highsec status, and if you can survive long enough to suicide gank then you are surviving way too long already if you're already -10 So shoot them instead of whining. funny i seem to be missing where I whined at, dumbass. And it aint my job to go around doing concord's job. <Munnkeh> i'm gonna use that excuse if i ever kill someone. "look, if you keep meeting ppl, it's bound to happen eventually" http://i.imgur.com/76pQ9.jpg |
Doris Dents
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
201
|
Posted - 2013.09.09 07:14:00 -
[26] - Quote
Omega Flames wrote:Elizabeth Aideron wrote:Omega Flames wrote:IMO anytime a -5 or below can fly around highsec in a ship and not get killed is a broken mechanic. (and yes they are in fact not getting killed when they can warp from stations/gates in anything other than a near instawarp ship) -10 has always been a can't survive in highsec status, and if you can survive long enough to suicide gank then you are surviving way too long already if you're already -10 So shoot them instead of whining. funny i seem to be missing where I whined at. And it aint my job to go around doing concord's job. edit: There also seems to be this issue with people constantly complaining about people "whining" about stuff when in reality they are just voicing their opinion, not actually whining. Here is a link for you folks so you have at least been told the actual definition of the word whine http://www.thefreedictionary.com/whine It has never been Concords job to preemptively defend those that choose not to defend themselves. Suicide ganking has been nerfed into the ground and is at historically low levels according to CCP but still bears demand more nerfs. When exactly will you be satisfied? |
Cade Windstalker
Donohue Enterprises Ad-Astra
168
|
Posted - 2013.09.09 07:21:00 -
[27] - Quote
Doris Dents wrote:It has never been Concords job to preemptively defend those that choose not to defend themselves. Suicide ganking has been nerfed into the ground and is at historically low levels according to CCP but still bears demand more nerfs. When exactly will you be satisfied?
Got a source for "at historically low levels"? Because I don't quite think I believe that... |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
11514
|
Posted - 2013.09.09 09:44:00 -
[28] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Doris Dents wrote:It has never been Concords job to preemptively defend those that choose not to defend themselves. Suicide ganking has been nerfed into the ground and is at historically low levels according to CCP but still bears demand more nerfs. When exactly will you be satisfied? Got a source for "at historically low levels"? Because I don't quite think I believe that...
Got a source for your disbelief?
Nevertheless my recollection matches Cade's. IIRC the numbers were mentioned a few months ago. My impression from CCP is that they think they might have over-nerfed suicide ganking.
1 Kings 12:11
|
Doris Dents
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
201
|
Posted - 2013.09.09 13:00:00 -
[29] - Quote
Cade Windstalker wrote:Doris Dents wrote:It has never been Concords job to preemptively defend those that choose not to defend themselves. Suicide ganking has been nerfed into the ground and is at historically low levels according to CCP but still bears demand more nerfs. When exactly will you be satisfied? Got a source for "at historically low levels"? Because I don't quite think I believe that... http://www.yumpu.com/en/document/view/8089066/csm-ccp-meetings-december-2012
Page 104:
"For reasons that are left as an exercise to the reader, Exhumers are now blowing up at historically low rates." |
Omega Flames
Last Resort Inn
54
|
Posted - 2013.09.09 13:05:00 -
[30] - Quote
Cause exhumers are the only measure of suicide ganks right? <Munnkeh> i'm gonna use that excuse if i ever kill someone. "look, if you keep meeting ppl, it's bound to happen eventually" http://i.imgur.com/76pQ9.jpg |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |