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Paul Tsukaya
Dirt 'n' Glitter Imperial Outlaws.
0
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Posted - 2013.08.30 22:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
My experienced corpmate told me this.
However in ATXI PL used harpies with MWDs and blasters: http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=19061967
Is it that they don't mix in a 1v1 setting, but it's fine in gangs? Or what? |
Zarnak Wulf
In Exile. Imperial Outlaws.
1294
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Posted - 2013.08.30 23:39:00 -
[2] - Quote
AB and blasters REALLY don't work. Did your corpmate say why he thinks they don't match up? |
Paul Tsukaya
Dirt 'n' Glitter Imperial Outlaws.
0
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Posted - 2013.08.30 23:47:00 -
[3] - Quote
Zarnak Wulf wrote:AB and blasters REALLY don't work. Did your corpmate say why he thinks they don't match up? He said in a 1v1 situation at least, you could get kited to death within scram range. |
Zarnak Wulf
In Exile. Imperial Outlaws.
1294
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Posted - 2013.08.31 00:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
Neutrons, Null ammo, and one tracking enhancer will adequately cover most of scram range. Optimal or falloff bonuses on particular ships (Atron, Harpy, Catalyst) are great. Be aware of ships that can push their full DPS out towards the edge of scram range. Rockets and lasers come to mind. Many blaster pilots get into trouble by chasing paper DPS numbers and loading antimatter. |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
492
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Posted - 2013.08.31 00:34:00 -
[5] - Quote
The concept with Blasters is that you HAVE to get close to apply damage. I can't imagine an AB Mega hull or an AB Brutix for that matter. Frigs are out of my area of experience. |
Jack Miton
Semper Ubi Sub Ubi
2302
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Posted - 2013.08.31 00:57:00 -
[6] - Quote
dude... MWD is absolutely mandatory on ANY ship with blasters. anyone telling you otherwise doesnt fly blaster boats.
(solo, 1v1 frigs being an acceptable exception.) |
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
526
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Posted - 2013.08.31 01:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
In general it's MWD for fleet work, AB for solo. Both if you can. With a web if you can.
Edit: And what Zarnak said, or you'll die. http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
Substantia Nigra
Dopaminergic Systems
1170
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Posted - 2013.08.31 04:24:00 -
[8] - Quote
IIRC many of the fleets that just took down ex-TEST Fountain were MWD fit blaster armed ships.
I guess that makes it all a bad idea. I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. Our pirate epic arc completion packages really are very good: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=12973&find=unread |
Disastro
Wrecking Shots Black Legion.
87
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Posted - 2013.08.31 11:41:00 -
[9] - Quote
Dont make the mistake of thinking that just because a character is older than you in game means he is actually experienced or good at pvp. Find advice from a different corp mate. Not everyone who plays the game of eve, even those who play the game for years, are into the PVP aspect of this game. Yes, it really is a game about PVP, but there are many who do not view it that way. |
Fret Thiesant
The Scope Gallente Federation
37
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Posted - 2013.08.31 11:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
AB tends to be better in FW plexes.
Anywhere else you gotta go with mwd. |
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Drax Concrilla
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
22
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Posted - 2013.08.31 15:12:00 -
[11] - Quote
Jumping onto the MWD is (nearly) mandatory boat here. Even in frigates, if you load Null like a pro you project out to all of scram range, unless you get TDed. However, you will often see the TD before you enter scram range and can then attempt to disengage.
AB Blaster boat is only viable sitting inside a plex on the button imho, as Fret was alluding to above. |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
892
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Posted - 2013.08.31 16:33:00 -
[12] - Quote
Quote:Jumping onto the MWD is (nearly) mandatory boat here. Even in frigates, if you load Null like a pro you project out to all of scram range, unless you get TDed. However, you will often see the TD before you enter scram range and can then attempt to disengage.
Sort of. Small blaster damage at ~8km is awful, but it exists.
For frigates you expect to be 1v1ing other frigates in, AB is often a good idea. Otherwise, MWD is a better option. |
Machiavelli's Nemesis
Angry Mustellid
329
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Posted - 2013.08.31 17:21:00 -
[13] - Quote
Substantia Nigra wrote:IIRC many of the fleets that just took down ex-TEST Fountain were MWD fit blaster armed ships.
I guess that makes it all a bad idea.
I'm pretty sure that doctrine was mainly rail Megas.
On the OP, ABs with blasters is something you should really restrict to solo frigate fights and even then you'll just end up being kited by a condor. As others have said, if you're using blasters without an MWD you're probably doing it wrong.
For preference, dual prop :)
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Lugia3
Pirates Incorporated
553
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Posted - 2013.09.01 00:25:00 -
[14] - Quote
If you're going to use AB with blasters, try to get a dual-prop fit. On some ships such as a Megathron MWD + Blasters works fine. "QQ threads are only allowed in the Out of Pod Experience forum." - ISD Cura Ursus |
Moonlit Raid
State War Academy Caldari State
99
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Posted - 2013.09.01 14:23:00 -
[15] - Quote
As someone has already said, it's pretty much obligatory to have an mwd on a blaster boat. Brutix, mega, vindi, thorax all come to mind. |
Volundark Gallente
Intergalactic Space Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.09.02 05:27:00 -
[16] - Quote
Moonlit Raid wrote:As someone has already said, it's pretty much obligatory to have an mwd on a blaster boat. Brutix, mega, vindi, thorax all come to mind.
What about a strategic cruiser? is MWD mandatory?
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Substantia Nigra
Dopaminergic Systems
1171
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Posted - 2013.09.02 05:31:00 -
[17] - Quote
Machiavelli's Nemesis wrote:Substantia Nigra wrote: I guess that makes it all a bad idea.
I'm pretty sure that doctrine was mainly rail Megas.
ya, the baseline baltec is rail-mwd-megas ... but was often swapped over to blasters for awesome up-close surprises, and easier fitting. you right tho, most often rails. I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. Our pirate epic arc completion packages really are very good: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=12973&find=unread |
Joan Greywind
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
107
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Posted - 2013.09.02 09:02:00 -
[18] - Quote
I don't want to make assumptions, but your friend (if he decent at all) was talking about 1v1 frigates in faction warfare. Now I don't even like frig fights or fw (too low end, no hate mail please, I am not saying they don't require skill all I am saying that losing 2m merlins doesn't exactly increase my adrenaline rush), but I got this good mail from a corpie I used to run with, Astonhodge, which I think explains the situation perfectly. I also think your so called friend could have explained the situation better than just " MWD on blaster frigates are for nubz lol". I warn you it is a bit long, so here goes:
"OK so know I will describe EXACTLY how I will find a solo fight in a Faction warfare system. Firstly I will check Local count as well as what the status of local is at. I'm looking for big groups of similar alliance or faction. If they are all the same then i will move on! they will be together and it will not be a solo fight you find. The status of local as in are they pirates or suspect or not is another thing you are looking at. If you find 3,4,5 all flashy red then I would say there is a gate camp and you should turn around or check your out gate very carefully for a smart bombing BS or something.
Once I'm happy with local ill start looking at D-scan. Ill have the sites (listed above) on my overview and systematically go through each one checking if anything is in the sites. changing the D-scan to roughly 15 degreese and using active direction cam on. usually I will warp to the sun when in system at 100km and find my solo target.
Good targets for kiting are weapon based ships like other Atrons, Merlins, Blaster comets, Slashers etc. Most brawling ships in low sec will use the Web, Scram with an After Burner. If you fly a BRAWLER ship with MWD you will NEVER get the option to escape as you prop mod will be turned off and you will be webbed but they will still have there AB active and will be able to run away easily. Just keep this in mind.
So I have just found a Merlin solo in a Novice site that i wish to kill in my kiting rail Atron what do I do next? Some times people will sit on the acceleration gate with there friends next door in higher class ships. to stop them getting an easy gank ALWAYS, ill say this again ALWAYS warp to a site at at least 10 KM. even at 10 you will still be in activation range of the gate but more importantly you will be out of scram/web range when you land.
OK i have landed and he is in the site. Right now I need to pre-heat my MWD before going in so i get the best chance o get out of his range. also i need to have my 'keep at range' range set right. I have discovered a very magic number when using keep at range to stay in warp disrupt range and out of web/scram range. this number is 19500 meters. when using this the closest they will get to you is 15km range, and the furthest they will get is 22km away (if the Merlin was AB fit, which it usually would be)
Now i have activated the gate and i am about to land what now? You MUST SPAM THE SH*T OUT OF THE MWD BUTTON and keep clicking infront of you to move away from him as fast as possible. Once you have slingshot yourself away from him with you heated mwd he will have has a few seconds of web and scram on you while you fly out of the range. then again you must SPAM THE SH*T OUT OF THE WMD BUTTON to fly away from him. once you have no scram or web on you and you are over 15km away from the Merlin you know need to click the Keep at range you have set at 19500 meters. now all you need to do is put the WD and Point on him and kill him :)
Congratulations you have just beaten they system and killed hm while he was sat waiting for you! Trust me aslong as you ship can go around 4km before heat with an mwd, you will always slingshot out of a web and scram combo as long as you keep spamming it.
Hope this helps you out, I really do hope you go and have fun :)
All the best"
Full credit goes to AstonHodge, modified it a little bit to have paragraphs :P |
Trinkets friend
Rules of Acquisition Acquisition Of Empire
1132
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Posted - 2013.09.03 03:22:00 -
[19] - Quote
Don't worry if your corp mate is a dill. I have heard "I'll fit a web to my drake, it's for tackle" and other pieces of comedy gold. YOLO is the Carpe Diem of Gen Y http://www.localectomy.blogspot.com.au
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Leto Thule
Sons of Retribution
24
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Posted - 2013.09.04 13:56:00 -
[20] - Quote
Joan Greywind wrote:
/STUFF/
Congratulations you have just beaten they system and killed hm while he was sat waiting for you! Trust me aslong as you ship can go around 4km before heat with an mwd, you will always slingshot out of a web and scram combo as long as you keep spamming it.
Hope this helps you out, I really do hope you go and have fun :)
All the best"
Full credit goes to AstonHodge, modified it a little bit to have paragraphs :P
Just sayin, as a FW blaster harpy pilot, ill NEVER engage a kiter outside of the plex unless he lands right on top of me. There is no point, because youll never catch them. If im there 1v1 and something like a slicer lands, ill hit gate. If he is stupid enough to follow thru, ill have him on the button and its all over. |
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Bad Messenger
Nasranite Watch OLD MAN GANG
556
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Posted - 2013.09.04 15:56:00 -
[21] - Quote
AB is only good if you are sure you can tackle enemy and keep him tackled, i recommend that you have some backup with fast ship with mwd scram web to save you when some damp kite condor manages to tackle you :D |
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1384
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Posted - 2013.09.05 12:16:00 -
[22] - Quote
Your corpmate is afraid of scram kiters.
Thing is, AB won't really save you either because the best scram kiters are most quite fast. Also the harpy is one blaster ship that isn't nearly as weak to scram kiting because it has that great range bonus.
However small rails are superior to small blasters in most cases imo. BYDI recruitment closed-ish |
Phaade
Debitum Naturae
95
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Posted - 2013.09.05 21:34:00 -
[23] - Quote
Even with your MWD overheated, you will NOT always get out of scram / web range. Not from an overheated AB / Scram / Web approach.
In my experience, you rarely will. |
Josclyn Verreuil
Justified Chaos
0
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Posted - 2013.09.11 16:53:00 -
[24] - Quote
Phaade wrote:Even with your MWD overheated, you will NOT always get out of scram / web range. Not from an overheated AB / Scram / Web approach.
In my experience, you rarely will.
As a scram range kiter (I prefer ab/scram/web rail comets) I've caught me many slicers/condors/etc just like this.
If you're the guy on the inside waiting for him to come in, you *have* to make sure and overheat your ab/scram/web and then follow them as they try to fly away. Most of the time they peak their distance at around 10km, at which point I have them. |
Drax Concrilla
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
66
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Posted - 2013.09.16 00:12:00 -
[25] - Quote
Don't tell them the secrets! This is, indeed, correct information. It is very difficult for a MWD kiter to escpe a properly Overheated brawler - though in the case of Slicers (which this thread is definitely not about) don't necessarily assume the fight is over because you've caught them.
However, don't let that put you off from MWD ships - there is no ship that is "the best" at everything, every ship has situations that it is weaker in, just be aware that scramkiters on a gate are a bad matchup for an MWD blaster boat. That being said, if you have Null loaded AND they don't have a TD (or they fit a TD instead of a web) you can still put up a good fight before you go down. |
Scoto Timta
Heaven's End League of Infamy
26
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Posted - 2013.09.18 21:30:00 -
[26] - Quote
Volundark Gallente wrote:Moonlit Raid wrote:As someone has already said, it's pretty much obligatory to have an mwd on a blaster boat. Brutix, mega, vindi, thorax all come to mind. What about a strategic cruiser? is MWD mandatory? I think the cov ops cloak fit changes the game just a bit. In a non-cloaky ship, your target will see you on d-scan and/or grid for a while, and you are often landing at least several km away from them and may need to burn into range. That all gives them some time to get away. But with a cov ops cloak you can generally get up close and personal, then pick your moment to decloak.
When you decloak a blaster proteus next to someone in anything cruiser-sized or larger they will usually not be getting out of your scram range before you have them pointed. Assuming you fit an AB+web to your own ship, you can easily keep them within scram range and they will not be able to shut off your prop mod. Seems to me that the AB is a better choice in this case.
My pvp is mostly in w-space, though, so my tactics may not apply in k-space.
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