Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
888
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 16:34:00 -
[91] - Quote
Teamosil wrote:Malcanis wrote:If instead of buffing CONCORD, CCP actually put the effort into finally fixing the humilating joke of a bounty system that hi-sec has labored under, then players could fix their own problems. I agreee that would be ideal, but what specifically would you change about the way it works? If you let everybody with a bounty on their heads get attacked in hi sec then the gankers could just put a 1 ISK bounty on every mining barge they saw.
Tie the bounty system into contractable killrights, with the payout being limited to a fraction (say 50%) the NPC value of any modules, clone value and implants lost (since we're getting proper pod killmails now).
So say I really **** Mike the Miner off. Mike puts a 250M Bounty on my head, and now bounty hunters chase me! Under the old system, I would just jump to an empty clone and have an alt pod me me to collect 250M. As my clones cost 20M, I stroll off with 230M of Mike's money. Hahaha, stupid miners!
Under the new system, Mike can create an open contract on me if he has killrights, and anyone who accepts the contacts can collect. Mike might chose to limit the contract to people in his corp, in his alliance, to people with good standings or to people who don't have bad standings. The contract lasts as long as his killrights, with uncollected ISK being refunded on expiry ff I manage to avoid being killed enough in the meanwhile.
If I accept with my alt and she pods me, she'll only collect 10M, half the value of my Sigma clone. I lose 10M.
On the other hand if I'm flying around in my Halo clone (NPC implant value = something like 600M ISK, I'd have to look it up), then someone podding me could collect the full 250M bounty. (Or even up to 310M, if my bounty was that high).
Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players.
Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
256
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 16:37:00 -
[92] - Quote
Teamosil wrote:Malcanis wrote:If instead of buffing CONCORD, CCP actually put the effort into finally fixing the humilating joke of a bounty system that hi-sec has labored under, then players could fix their own problems. I agreee that would be ideal, but what specifically would you change about the way it works? If you let everybody with a bounty on their heads get attacked in hi sec then the gankers could just put a 1 ISK bounty on every mining barge they saw.
Not a lot of mining barges in high-sec with negative sec status... GÇ£Status quo, you know, is Latin for 'the mess we're in.GÇ¥
~ Ronald Reagan |
Razzor Death
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 16:57:00 -
[93] - Quote
I know there are a lot of excited people in this thread and I really don't want to be 'that guy' here but I think its for the best.
You can't buff the stupid.
Sorry |
David Grogan
The Motley Crew Reborn
132
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 17:01:00 -
[94] - Quote
XIRUSPHERE wrote:Miners have had years to learn that saving their barges is stupidly easy and nearly 100% fool proof but would rather be lazy victims. They don't need more tank, they don't need concord fixes. The pilots need to step up and actually fly the ship.
a tank would add surviveability vs a smartbombing bs and u cannot avoid being ganked by a smartbombing bs... the barge will never warp out in time
your argument is flawed Everytime you buy something that says "made in china" you are helping the rising unemployment in your own country unless your from china, Buy locally produced goods and help create more jobs. |
I Accidentally YourShip
Suzuka Heavy Industries
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 17:58:00 -
[95] - Quote
Vachir Khan wrote:I figured it out!
Goons are doing this to force CCP's hand, but when CCP asks their Goon overlords on how to do it the answer will be "don't buff concord, buff the icemining ships instead". CCP will then buff the Mackinaws and a while later (after having had yet another "chat" with their overlords) CCP decides to move ice belts to 0.0 and specifically to Goon space. Now goons can bot mackinaws with ease on their Rifter accounts (increased tank needs less SP and isk to tank 0.0 rats).
It's all a plot you see.
I don't think there is enough tin in the universe to make a hat for this. |
I Accidentally YourShip
Suzuka Heavy Industries
8
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 18:09:00 -
[96] - Quote
Shadowsword wrote:
Let's be honest, it is currently far to cheap to gank someone. You should need hours of farming or sec statut grinding to recover from a gank.
There needs to be a threat to miners. If players can't be the threat then belt rats need to be. Belt rats below 0.8 sec need to be dangerous enough that you cannot fight them off in an untanked mining barge. This does not mean super dangerous, but they certainly shouldn't be able to be fought off by a team of T1 drones. A tanked hulk should be able to survive, for a while, but the belt rats should escalate to the point where a Hulk cannot tank it either. Also no T2 combat drones in a mining ship, what do you think you are, a combat ship? They should also scramble at some point during escalation. This escalated group should persist for a while to disrupt anyone else's mining activity in that belt for a period of time. All ore above 0.8 and above are substantially reduced to prevent miners from cowering in 1.0-0.8 sec.
Does this seem better? No more of those mean player gankers that only come along every once and a while! Just faceless, emotionless NPCs that won't think twice. But at least they won't get any pleasure out of it!
|
baltec1
159
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 18:23:00 -
[97] - Quote
David Grogan wrote:XIRUSPHERE wrote:Miners have had years to learn that saving their barges is stupidly easy and nearly 100% fool proof but would rather be lazy victims. They don't need more tank, they don't need concord fixes. The pilots need to step up and actually fly the ship. a tank would add surviveability vs a smartbombing bs and u cannot avoid being ganked by a smartbombing bs... the barge will never warp out in time your argument is flawed
Bs warps into belt on top of you and one of two things happen.
1. Miner warps out before the BS even lands because he was smart and kept aligned.
2. Miner was stupid and just sat there.
|
Teamosil
Good Time Family Band Solution
19
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 18:35:00 -
[98] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:1. Miner warps out before the BS even lands because he was smart and kept aligned.
By aligned you mean actually moving towards it so you can insta warp? Or just facing towards it? Because if you mean the former, it would appear you've never actually mined. If you mean the later, it is true that it's a good idea to be facing your warp point, but it only shaves off a second or two from your still very long time to warp. In fact I've heard, but not tested, the theory that what direction your ship is facing is just graphical and the time to warp is the same. But making sure your path is clear so you don't bump into an asteroid on your way out would be wise. |
baltec1
159
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 18:40:00 -
[99] - Quote
Teamosil wrote:baltec1 wrote:1. Miner warps out before the BS even lands because he was smart and kept aligned. By aligned you mean actually moving towards it so you can insta warp? Or just facing towards it? Because if you mean the former, it would appear you've never actually mined. If you mean the later, it is true that it's a good idea to be facing your warp point, but it only shaves off a secord two from your still very long time to warp.
Use multiple align points?
|
Teamosil
Good Time Family Band Solution
19
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 19:14:00 -
[100] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Use multiple align points?
Yeah that's true. Sometimes there are already objects positioned in such a way that you can bounce back and forth between being aligned to them. But IMO that's a bit much for hi sec mining. The rewards for hi sec mining are absurdly low. Why would anybody bother doing it if it required a bunch of knowledge and attention to do it? It's mostly there for new players to build up enough ISK to buy their first battleship. There needs to be something people can do in eve while they're learning. Everybody was a newbie at some point. |
|
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
68
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 19:41:00 -
[101] - Quote
Renan Ruivo wrote:The Apostle wrote:
2) Fully support your actions and allow it to repeatedly occur.
Why do you suppose those are the only two options? Not doing anything is always an option... these two are similar
They hired actual clothing designers for WiS clothes "no wonder the monocle cost $80, they had to pay royalties" Screw "FiS" its called EVE CCP |
XIRUSPHERE
In Bacon We Trust
56
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 21:32:00 -
[102] - Quote
Teamosil wrote:baltec1 wrote:Use multiple align points? Yeah that's true. Sometimes there are already objects positioned in such a way that you can bounce back and forth between being aligned to them. But IMO that's a bit much for hi sec mining. The rewards for hi sec mining are absurdly low. Why would anybody bother doing it if it required a bunch of knowledge and attention to do it? It's mostly there for new players to build up enough ISK to buy their first battleship. There needs to be something people can do in eve while they're learning. Everybody was a newbie at some point.
Make bookmarks 200km in front and behind of where you want to mine with a fast frigate, align towards either bookmark as needed at 2/3 speed to stay in range, profit. That really requires a bunch of knowledge and attention doesn't it? How easy would it be to for miners to share this knowledge with each other if they were interested in anything but thoughtless isk farming.
You could strip most belts bare with just 4 bookmarks that would take about 5 minutes to set up. Why should anyone make isk with near zero input or thought into it. Training mining skills is not a free pass for isk generation, or a pass to sit on top of a GSC perfectly still while you only check on your cycles. I figured out the alignment trick years ago when I had a hulk alt out in 0.0 and it survived legitimate raids from all sorts.
The largest problem with mining and highsec in general is it has been allowed to be perceived as an activity that should grant you immunity and grant you isk for little to no interaction. To be safe requires 5 minutes investment per belt and a single click every couple minutes why is that so hard? |
Teamosil
Good Time Family Band Solution
20
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 22:03:00 -
[103] - Quote
XIRUSPHERE wrote:Make bookmarks 200km in front and behind of where you want to mine with a fast frigate, align towards either bookmark as needed at 2/3 speed to stay in range, profit. That really requires a bunch of knowledge and attention doesn't it? How easy would it be to for miners to share this knowledge with each other if they were interested in anything but thoughtless isk farming.
You could strip most belts bare with just 4 bookmarks that would take about 5 minutes to set up. Why should anyone make isk with near zero input or thought into it. Training mining skills is not a free pass for isk generation, or a pass to sit on top of a GSC perfectly still while you only check on your cycles. I figured out the alignment trick years ago when I had a hulk alt out in 0.0 and it survived legitimate raids from all sorts.
The largest problem with mining and highsec in general is it has been allowed to be perceived as an activity that should grant you immunity and grant you isk for little to no interaction. To be safe requires 5 minutes investment per belt and a single click every couple minutes why is that so hard?
I think you're misunderstanding the role hi sec mining plays in eve. It isn't a way to make money really. It makes virtually no ISK at all. Just enough to like save up for your first battleship over the course of a few weeks... To call that a "free pass to isk generation" is not a very accurate description.... The only things in the plus column for hi sec mining are how accessible it is for new players and how you can do it without paying attention. If you knock both of those out of the plus column, there is nothing left to recommend it.
Think about it from a balance perspective. Already I think it's a pretty rough profession in terms of what you have to put into it and what you get out of it. If they started having to be as capable and attentive as 0.0 miners, there is no way that could still be considered balanced IMO. |
Richard Hammond II
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
69
|
Posted - 2011.10.30 22:45:00 -
[104] - Quote
Teamosil wrote: Just enough to like save up for your first battleship over the course of a few weeks...
then you get into missions and eventually lvl 4 missions (and we all know how evil they are) so your next comment:
Quote: To call that a "free pass to isk generation" is not a very accurate description....
is flat wrong
They hired actual clothing designers for WiS clothes "no wonder the monocle cost $80, they had to pay royalties" Screw "FiS" its called EVE CCP |
Covert Kitty
SRS Industries SRS.
20
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 00:52:00 -
[105] - Quote
Quote:Miners have had years to learn that saving their barges is stupidly easy and nearly 100% fool proof but would rather be lazy victims. They don't need more tank, they don't need concord fixes. The pilots need to step up and actually fly the ship.
^This^, not getting ganked is easy as hell. Making them invincible to a solo ganker is silly. Your not safe if your afk, should you be? Of course not. Learn2play
I'm not against "smarter" concorde. I mean all they do now is just show up and instwtfpwn the offender, I wouldn't call that "smart". Maybe they should be slower and smarter, more gameplay surrounding them, etc. I don't see something like that as being important though. |
Cypermethren
Hardcore p0wnography Cascade Probable
27
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 01:11:00 -
[106] - Quote
some highsec systems should be a safehavent for newbies. Perhaps make 1.0 to ?? instant concord reaction. IE you fire lazars and you blow up before the cycle finishes.
People need to accept that there is a large enough percentage of people that just want to do THEIR OWN THING in peace and quiet. Wether it be running the same level 4 over 1000 times or being able to mine ice/ore without fear of loss.
At current players are being forced into non-conensual pvp by people whom purely do it because they get a kick out of knowing that the person they just ganked IRL is probably crying/raging in their chairs over the incident. not for any other reason, its just sad, and, if happens IRL you're generaly sent to jail, so again, its just people wanting to be assholes and doing ******* things that benefits from the current situation.
There is a crapload of systems in eve. at current Highsec is the most filled, because a large percentage of players - again - want to be left alone to do things in peace, quetly, "PvE only" kind of thing.
This should be permitted - just restrict it to 1.0 - ?? systems.
No insurance on concorded ships should be a given. You decide you're going to take an action that is going to result in you're ship getting blown up - guarenteed . You should at least have to do you're homework to ensure the target you're about to blow up on will give you profits, enough to cover the ship you just lost + for time spent. At current, the best IRL comparison so you can realise how stupid you're argument to CCP is:
going to work and punching a brick wall because you're angry at it. Then taking a claim to work cover to have you're medical bills coverd by your place of employment, every single time even tho you're inflicting the damage/pain to yourself, of you're own will/decisions.
Now that you realise you're pleas/cry's for the system to be changed will be ignored becuase you're logic is that of a ******** geneticly engineered maggot, please find something worthwile to cry about.
Again on the subject of concord reacting quicker - good on you CCP for finaly acknowleding theres a large % of people that simply want to be left alone, and catering to them.
There's an absolute shitload of pvp to be had in lowsec/0.0. I hope CCP make it complately unfun, and un rewarding for you griefing tossers to go around turkey slapping newbies purely so you can giggle like a downie and feel good about yourself for a few seconds because you fail at life.
|
Sara XIII
The Helljumpers
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 01:38:00 -
[107] - Quote
High sec is too big, its' resources are too plentiful, and CONCORD is illogical.
That's the whole problem with EVE IMO.
|
Elyssa MacLeod
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 01:58:00 -
[108] - Quote
Sara XIII wrote:High sec is too big, its' resources are too plentiful, and CONCORD is illogical.
That's the whole problem with EVE IMO.
Like ppl said earlier... make it all 0.0 **** FiS Its Called EVE |
Sara XIII
The Helljumpers
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:01:00 -
[109] - Quote
I disagree with 0.0 everywhere. A starter space is vital in a game like EVE.
It should be small, resource-depleted, heavily patrolled, and encourge players to leave |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
795
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:21:00 -
[110] - Quote
Sara XIII wrote:I disagree with 0.0 everywhere. A starter space is vital in a game like EVE.
It should be small, resource-depleted, heavily patrolled, and encourge players to leave Suicide ganking? Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
|
|
Elyssa MacLeod
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:25:00 -
[111] - Quote
Sara XIII wrote:I disagree with 0.0 everywhere. A starter space is vital in a game like EVE.
It should be small, resource-depleted, heavily patrolled, and encourge players to leave
well other than the small bit, thats most of high sec. I can never find big rocks in high sec
**** FiS Its Called EVE |
Cypermethren
Hardcore p0wnography Cascade Probable
27
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:34:00 -
[112] - Quote
Sara XIII wrote:I disagree with 0.0 everywhere. A starter space is vital in a game like EVE.
It should be small, resource-depleted, heavily patrolled, and encourge players to leave
but this game is a sandbox that tries to cater to everyones playstyle.
Wether it be solo play (npc corps doing missions - undeccable) Exploration/Wormholes Market Wizards (buy low one place resell high where there's demand elsewhere) Small/Medium fleet pvp (lowsec/0.0) Blow warfare (0.0) Griefing (everywhere)
Why neglect, no, neglect is the wrong term. Why continualy allow the people whom just want to be left alone, to play a game they enjoy the way they want to be. I mean its not as if they're needing the game to be massively changed to cater to their needs - all they want is to be left alone to have fun by themselves.
Why should this be dis-allowed simply to allow a bunch of pricks to get happy in the pants purely from knowing they've caused someone grief?
Hell, even the suicide gankers get it good. At current they can go destroy someone's ship, worth over tenfold more than the ship they get concorded in - and get all the money back on insurance? This benefits the griefers.
The only people upset about the possible changes are - the griefers.
Their play style isnt being disallowed - they can still do it - just their actions now have consiquences to THEMSELVES - which previuosly it did not due to their ship/fittings being refunded as insurance.
Hell, even if you give the carebare/newbies a permnant safehaven, say insta concord in 1.0 - 0.8 systems - disallow can flipping as well - you'd give them the much needed safehaven - while the griefers can go to 0.7 and below systems to do what they are currently doing anyway.
Yes - the mining yields are poop in these systems - but it gives the player who;s probably just lost a ship to suciide gankers a place where they can rebuild - without threat of loosing it all again due to a tosser who purely plays the game to disrupt other's fun.
It wouldent be gamebreaking, it wouldent ruin eve at all, it would, however, cause massive outcry from the gankers.
Hell, think of it this way. If the botters decide to move all their operations to 1.0 - 0.8 systems - they're income would drop to rock bottom, as they would all move there to avoid suicide ganking.
People would still have to move out to lower security systems to make profits, but they can do so in their own time, when they are ready, without being forced into non-concencual pvp.
And FYI - I hate highsec personaly. If there was no 0.0 i wouldent be playing this game. But, i started in highsec, i have friends in highsec, and i can proudly say im able to sit back and see both the griefers side of the story and the carebear/newbies side of the argument.
Unfortunaltey for the griefers, the carebares/newbies are able to produce alot more reasons that have valid points, as to why they should be catered for in the aspect of having a "safe place" to play eve, and all the griefers seem to be able to come up with are selfish reasons that revolve around how many lols per hour they can get out of blowing up people in mining barges with suicide canes. |
Sara XIII
The Helljumpers
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:38:00 -
[113] - Quote
Elyssa MacLeod wrote:Sara XIII wrote:I disagree with 0.0 everywhere. A starter space is vital in a game like EVE.
It should be small, resource-depleted, heavily patrolled, and encourge players to leave well other than the small bit, thats most of high sec. I can never find big rocks in high sec
But you can find an almost infinite amount of small rocks. Enough that you could mine a fortune and never have to go into 0.4 space.
|
Ranka Mei
TANoshii Incorporated New Eden Research.
33
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:42:00 -
[114] - Quote
David Grogan wrote:boohoo suicide gankers might soon find that ganking untankable mining barges will have harsher consequences miners have had to put up with gankers for years deal with it
I love the pirate tears! Kudos to Hilmar and his team for finally addressing the issue!
-- "All your monies AUR belong to us!" -- CCP |
Elyssa MacLeod
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:43:00 -
[115] - Quote
well apparently can flipping in noob systems gets you banned according to the devs if you do it maliciously. I think thats stupid Imo, they need to learn the game after all. **** FiS Its Called EVE |
Morganta
Peripheral Madness The Midget Mafia
213
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:43:00 -
[116] - Quote
Cypermethren wrote:
Why continualy allow the people whom just want to be left alone, to play a game they enjoy the way they want to be. all they want is to be left alone to have fun by themselves.
because catering to lone wolves in a MMOG is counter productive and catering to anti-pvp lone wolves in a pvp-centric MMOG is laughable
if you want peace go play minecraft in easy mode The American public's reaction to the change was poor and the new cola was a major marketing failure. The subsequent reintroduction of Coke's original formula, re-branded as "Coca-Cola Classic", resulted in a significant gain in sales, leading to speculation that the introduction of the New Coke formula was just a marketing ploy |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
795
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:46:00 -
[117] - Quote
Morganta wrote:Cypermethren wrote:
Why continualy allow the people whom just want to be left alone, to play a game they enjoy the way they want to be. all they want is to be left alone to have fun by themselves.
because catering to lone wolves in a MMOG is counter productive and catering to anti-pvp lone wolves in a pvp-centric MMOG is laughable if you want peace go play minecraft in easy mode Should make this post a sticky. Save you having to type it over and over and over and over.... [add Wow, kitty online ad nusaeum] Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
|
Elyssa MacLeod
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
15
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:46:00 -
[118] - Quote
Ranka Mei wrote: I love the pirate tears! Kudos to Hilmar and his team for finally addressing the issue!
what is it the gankers usually say? OH YES adapt or die **** FiS Its Called EVE |
Sara XIII
The Helljumpers
14
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 02:55:00 -
[119] - Quote
To Cyper: I would suggest that maybe the "just left alone" types are playing the wrong game. I don't say that out of arrogance. I've never been to nullsec. Well, I did get crushed by some drones in a -1.0 WH. It's just that I have absolutely no reason besides ego to go there. I have all the resources and activities I need in High sec.
EVE is two different games with two different communities.
One game is played in the safety of personal sandboxes the other is played in just one.
p.s. I hope to enter nullsec full time by December........if anyone is recruiting an active. |
Ranka Mei
TANoshii Incorporated New Eden Research.
33
|
Posted - 2011.10.31 03:01:00 -
[120] - Quote
EVE has supposedly always been a game of consequence... except for highsec gankers, who get their attack vessels reimbursed by Concord. This has been a thorn in the eyes of many, simply because it-¦s so absurdly out of whack.
And to those who say suicide ganking won-¦t stop when their insurance is taken away: good, you won't miss it then.
-- "All your monies AUR belong to us!" -- CCP |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |