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Erik Kaassan
Black Sun Brethren
34
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Posted - 2013.09.24 21:21:00 -
[1] - Quote
It seems like i simply can not get away from it today. Everywhere I go I am bombarded with images and conversations that all lead back to one concept.
Could a Capsuleer be a father?
About five months ago I had fallen in love with an Amarrian woman (her name i will not disclose for her own protection) and we have been dating ever since. I work in null sec almost as much as high sec where she lives and that of course means I don't get see her all the time. I read a mail from her recently while I was off from working and she wished to start talking to me... About marriage and having children. On the Net there is surprisingly little about children between capsuleers and baseliners. Is it even possible with the great genetic differences between capsuleer and non-capsuleer? If it is, then how does one solve the problems such a relationship causes already with the addition of caring for children? Plus, would this mean I stay my age in a clone while my children grow up around me? Any thoughts on this? I'm sorta freaking out and I don't know how to respond! |
Katrina Oniseki
Revenent Defence Corperation Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
2089
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Posted - 2013.09.24 23:28:00 -
[2] - Quote
Yes, you can be a father.
Unless you have undergone significant genetic engineering with your clones, or are using a sterile clone, there should not be any difficulty in reproducing with a baseliner. You're not a different species. You just happen to possess a few genetic traits that make you more compatible with hydrostatic capsule technology. It's similar to how you have genetic trats that give you blonde hair, or a big nose, or a certain susceptibility to male pattern baldness, or genetic predisposition to certain diseases.
That being said, being a parent is not something that should be undertaken lightly. You must treat your status as a capsuleer as you would any other profession when judging if you can be an effective parent based on what criteria you believe defines an effective parent. If providing financial and political security is what makes a good parent to you, then being a capsuleer is most fitting. If being an active and present father figure in your child's life is more important, perhaps you should reconsider your deployment out in null-sec.
In my opinion, which is purely my own and should not determine your choices, I believe a father should be a constant influence on a child. I feel that if you already don't see your lover very often, this is not a good precedent for raising children. You need to, at the very least, see her more regularly and frequently before committing to marriage or children. Your children will not have the luxury of being independent adults that do not need you around all the time. They will require your presence, and a sense of regularity with it. Being an absent lover is controversial. Being an absent father is not an option.
In short, you will need to take a close look at your career choices and determine how best to approach the responsibilities of parenthood.
Your visible age is entirely determined by what choices you make on what your clones look like. You can look 20 years older or younger simply by filling out some forms for a new clone appearance. Keep in mind that the supposed immortality of being a capsuleer would suggest you will outlive your own children by nature. Ch+½j+ì Katrina Oniseki ~ (RDC) Chief Operations Officer ~ [I-RED] Sub-Director of Public Relations |
Seriphyn Inhonores
Elusenian Cooperative
545
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Posted - 2013.09.25 01:43:00 -
[3] - Quote
I whimsically titled myself the "Most Prolific Capsuleer Single Father"
Obviously not prolific enough! |
Diana Kim
State Protectorate Caldari State
546
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Posted - 2013.09.25 02:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Of course, you could, but would?... Before thinking what really do you want, have you ever considered others? For example, what would be life for your children... |
Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force Cult of War
1333
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Posted - 2013.09.25 02:28:00 -
[5] - Quote
I think 5 months is a little too soon to be considering marriage and children. I can't give you definitive advice as I don't know you at all and this is your own choice. However keep this in mind, you are young, probably even younger than I judging from your graduation date. At our age, it's not uncommon to imagine spending our entire lives with someone one day, and suddenly dismissing that possibility the next day, especially considering the fast pace of Gallente relationships.
In addition, you should also take the cultural differences of your lover into consideration. Being an Amarrian, arranged and rushed marriages are not uncommon. In some parts of the Empire, a person's partner in marriage is decided even before they are born. Forgive me if I'm stereotyping, but this is a common practice amongst Amarrians, especially for the wealthy and royal, where marriage is a way to elevate you and your family's socioeconomic standing. Several generations of arranged marriages might even get a future family member as a potential heir to the throne.
Marriage and family is a serious issue. While these days some might not consider marriage a life-long commitment, being a parent is. Unless some horrifically tragic scenario occurs, there is NO excuse for being an absent father.
I'm not trying to stop you from going through with this. All I'm asking is that you look deep within yourself and think long and hard about how you feel and I would suggest asking your lover to do the same. Make sure this is something that BOTH of you not only want, but something BOTH of you can do.
When you're immortal, a decision that will last your entire life is going to be pretty damn long. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1779
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Posted - 2013.09.25 03:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
I pray to the Winds that a capsuleer can make an effective father, because I intend to pursue that vocation myself in the mid-term. I have the same problems you mention and the added issue of being tubeborn and never having witnessed parenting in the truest sense. On the other hand, I am aware of the negative impact that parents have made on some of my friends - so perhaps I'm simply getting a clean start.
Good luck with your decision making. I don't agree that a parent needs to be in constant contact with their child in order to make a good father, but I do think you need to make sure you're a part of their lives and keep that connection alive. Don't forget that, as a capsuleer, you may be comitting to much more than a single child, you may be devoting the rest of your VERY long existence to a dynasty.
Also, always remember that your family will be something that others seek to use against you. Keep them secret and keep them safe. |
Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
308
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 03:48:00 -
[7] - Quote
Family and Capsuleer need to be two very, very separate concepts. For the sake of all involved. |
Isis Dea
Combat Cruise Control
106
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Posted - 2013.09.25 05:33:00 -
[8] - Quote
If I wanted you to do anything for me, even the most humiliating of acts... I'd only have to take your child.
You almost make it too easy and on a very boring day something very tempting to do.
Because I love watching an immortal beg.
You know what is more curious to think over? -What would happen if I gave your child to some dark corner of a station's underbelly that we don't talk about. All the lives us capsuleers walk over as I become the better option for entire corporations than a staff of mortals.
All those people out of a job...
All those people who've had to commit atrocity to survive and probably still have failed to...
All that hate...
'Give them a chance to get back at all our kind has done.
It'd be interesting to say the least.
You wannabe mortals are cute when you don't think. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1781
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 06:16:00 -
[9] - Quote
The sad thing is that for all our vaunted immortality, there's still no substitute for leaving behind a legacy. |
Evi Polevhia
True Slave Foundations Shaktipat Revelators
308
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 14:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:The sad thing is that for all our vaunted immortality, there's still no substitute for leaving behind a legacy.
Legacies are written in more than just offspring. |
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Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1782
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 14:17:00 -
[11] - Quote
Is that what Master told you to think? |
Repentence Tyrathlion
Tyrathlion Interstellar
454
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 14:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Is that what Master told you to think?
History, more like. Last I checked, Tovil-Toba is remembered for his actions, not for his offspring. |
Isis Dea
Combat Cruise Control
107
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Posted - 2013.09.25 15:17:00 -
[13] - Quote
History includes atrocity. Atrocities await those stupid enough to make public their family for the hate that awaits our kind to exploit.
Someone is going to be remembered for what they do to your children, just remember that. |
Repentence Tyrathlion
Tyrathlion Interstellar
454
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 15:56:00 -
[14] - Quote
Isis Dea wrote:History includes atrocity. Atrocities await those stupid enough to make public their family for the hate that awaits our kind to exploit.
Someone is going to be remembered for what they do to your children, just remember that.
You're such a ray of sunshine, Isis darling. |
Lasairiona Raske
Mortem Praesidio
31
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Posted - 2013.09.25 16:05:00 -
[15] - Quote
I have three children. A daughter and twin boys. Ignore Isis. She seems to be on a doom and gloom trip lately. I'm sure she is the actual threat to children in New Eden.
Anyways, I would be happy to discuss any questions you have. Feel free to message me. :-) |
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1784
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 16:09:00 -
[16] - Quote
Repentence Tyrathlion wrote:Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Is that what Master told you to think? History, more like. Last I checked, Tovil-Toba is remembered for his actions, not for his offspring.
You win. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1784
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 16:10:00 -
[17] - Quote
Isis Dea wrote:History includes atrocity. Atrocities await those stupid enough to make public their family for the hate that awaits our kind to exploit.
Someone is going to be remembered for what they do to your children, just remember that.
That person would be remembered for what I did to them and THEIR family, believe me. |
Morwen Lagann
Tyrathlion Interstellar
970
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 16:21:00 -
[18] - Quote
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:Isis Dea wrote:History includes atrocity. Atrocities await those stupid enough to make public their family for the hate that awaits our kind to exploit.
Someone is going to be remembered for what they do to your children, just remember that. That person would be remembered for what I did to them and THEIR family, believe me.
The wonders of cloning technology. Why punish once when you can do it over and over until the lesson actually sinks in? Morwen Lagann Director, Tyrathlion Interstellar |
Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1785
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 16:32:00 -
[19] - Quote
As Isis points out, everyone has something they care about and most of that is accessible to somebody with the reach of an Empyrean. |
Diana Kim
State Protectorate Caldari State
547
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 16:53:00 -
[20] - Quote
Isis Dea wrote: Someone is going to be remembered for what they do to your children, just remember that.
This is exaggeration. For example, I hide my family and "my" former name (as a name of person whose memories I inherited), because I know what I (or she) did, and who wants me and why.
As for general population, no one will want to do anything for your children, if you haven't done anything to anyone so wrong that it might happen. The world is full of parents and children, you see. Of course, accidents and maniacs happen, but if you don't provide reason, chance that your children will be hurt are zero to none.
For capsuleers, there is another problem, however. It is not a great secret, that general citizens aren't very fond of capsuleers (hell, even myself would prefer a company of a State citizen to a capsuleer). And this attitude towards capsuleers might, hell, not just might, it will transfer towards his children. We don't care what baseliners think about us, but our children will live among them. I know very well how hard life can be, when there is something not right about your heritage.
I think, that it is cruel for a capsuleer to have children. |
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Makoto Priano
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
4775
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Posted - 2013.09.25 16:55:00 -
[21] - Quote
Security through obscurity is the best one can hope for with baseliner associates and family.
That said, Oniseki-Charantes-haani, I wonder as to whether one would outlive one's children, as a capsuleer. If the children inherit the capsuleer's genetic advantage, it's entirely possible that capsuleer lineages will arise. Given millenia or eons, it's possible that this very significant genetic advantage may result in selection and speciation. I wonder whether the path we've selected will lead to this first, or to the quiet grave of the Sleepers as cloned capsuleers eventually become more infomorph than biological being.
I digress.
More importantly, Kaassan-haan, good fortune if you decide to follow that path. And likewise to you, Tuulinen-haan; I suspect you'll be a good and dutiful father. Priano Trans-Stellar: elegant solutions for the State's needs. |
Anslo
The Scope Gallente Federation
2757
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 17:19:00 -
[22] - Quote
Threatening kids now? Man Isis, why so edgy and dark? It's not a very impressive thing... ....seriously you dumb ****, get over yourself.
As for the OP! That's a thing only you can answer. None of us know your life or mind so itd be hard to say if you'd be a good dad or not. Like other's said, set your criteria, see if you meet it. Personally, i think a good father i always patient, always there for his kid, and is always a steady rock of an example to take a lead from.
In other words, not me. See? Easy! Now you try.
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Isis Dea
Combat Cruise Control
107
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 17:27:00 -
[23] - Quote
Anslo wrote:Threatening kids now? Man Isis, why so edgy and dark? It's not a very impressive thing... ....seriously you dumb ****, get over yourself.
As for the OP! That's a thing only you can answer. None of us know your life or mind so itd be hard to say if you'd be a good dad or not. Like other's said, set your criteria, see if you meet it. Personally, i think a good father i always patient, always there for his kid, and is always a steady rock of an example to take a lead from.
In other words, not me. See? Easy! Now you try.
I won't stop, not while people purposely ignore the dangers of space and the hate that is out there for their kind. You'll thank me one day.
Am I personally going to be the one to do something to your children? Probably not, I've got enough stuff of my plate. But that's not what needs to be heard.
My childhood was destroyed by that hate, that carelessness. Being the daughter of a freedom fighter isn't the exact same as a capsuleer... but it is dangerously close in many ways.
I'd rather not see that happen to anyone else, even if that requires me putting on the face of evil. |
Lasairiona Raske
Mortem Praesidio
31
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 17:44:00 -
[24] - Quote
I laugh because my children are very well cared for. I love them beyond all reason and only a very select few know where I have them living. Automatically assuming we all endanger our children is downright disrespectful, Isis. Not all parents are as careless as yours were. |
Isis Dea
Combat Cruise Control
109
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 19:18:00 -
[25] - Quote
Lasairiona Raske wrote:I laugh because my children are very well cared for. I love them beyond all reason and only a very select few know where I have them living. Automatically assuming we all endanger our children is downright disrespectful, Isis. Not all parents are as careless as yours were.
Being public about your children as a capsuleer is endangering them.
Especially where over half of this board (possibly including me) is your enemy.
This isn't disrespectful, this is a reality check. |
Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force Cult of War
1333
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 20:37:00 -
[26] - Quote
Ms. Dea does have a point. This cluster isn't a nice place overall, and if you have serious enemies you can bet they will try to harm your children if they are given the opportunity.
Though I would have to disagree with her regarding whether or not to have children. You won't be able to have a "normal" family by any means. It would be something much closer to that of the families of world leaders. Armed guards everywhere, roads being shut down just for your kid to visit friends, agents taste testing your child's birthday cake before they can have a bite, assembling and reassembling your families toys and gadgets to check for explosives, all sorts of precautions. If you have a girl, you can bet the boyfriend will be getting interrogated.
It's certainly possible to have a happy and successful family as a capsuleer, many of us do. But keep in mind you'll have to either drop off the face of universe and change your identity completely to keep your family safe, or have extreme and often excessive security measures.
Of course, this is dependent on your line of work. I wouldn't imagine you would have too many serious enemies if you just fly around in a mining barge and build stuff, but if you fight other capsuleers, slaughter pirates for profit, have a major business or political agenda, then you will certainly have many enemies. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |
James Syagrius
Stillwater Corporation
544
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Posted - 2013.09.25 21:58:00 -
[27] - Quote
If you decide to become a father consider carefully the doom your potential family may inherit.
They will always be at peril from those who wish you harm.
GÇ£Here also are the heralds of his praise."
http://syagrius-eve.blogspot.com/
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Pieter Tuulinen
Pyre Falcon Defence Cadre XV-01A Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
1801
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 23:09:00 -
[28] - Quote
I want to disagree with James, but he's right. Attacking a capsuleers family is far easier than attacking them directly - in the long run it won't achieve ANYTHING of lasting importance, except for turning a professional rival into an intractable enemy, but it IS easy and the easy non-solution always attracts the lower class of enemy. |
Xindi Kraid
The Night Wardens Viro Mors Non Est
605
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Posted - 2013.09.26 00:56:00 -
[29] - Quote
I think some of you may be overestimating how important most capsuleers are. A capsuleer's children aren't likely to be at any more risk than your mid level politician (ie. municipal or district level) unless they are the children of top level alliance brass or the parents are stupid enough to take their children into a war zone. |
Fredfredbug4
Eve Defence Force Cult of War
1338
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Posted - 2013.09.26 01:24:00 -
[30] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:I think some of you may be overestimating how important most capsuleers are.
We're only near immortal demi-gods with enough money to allow a baseliner to live in luxery for eternity. That alone gives us a lot of enemies and it's something common to every capsuleer. Watch Fred Fred Frederation and stop cryptozoologist! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it! |
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