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Verity Sovereign
Sovereign Fleet Tax Shelter
566
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Posted - 2013.10.01 17:08:00 -
[1] - Quote
Now that they've decided to tiericide turrets, I think its time to take a look at drone skills.
Why do we have amarr/caldari/gallente/Minmatar drone specs? its pointless IMO. (especially amarr spec, thats a different issue)
I proposed we refund all SP for these skills, and replace them with:
Light Scout drone specialization Medium Scout drone specialization Heavy drone specialization
and.... maybe....
Sentry drone specialization ( a new pre req for T2 sentries) Although this last one may over buff sentries (assuming a 2% damage/skill level, with no changes
And while we're at it... can they please finally get around to fixing the apparent amarr/minmatar drone damage modifier mixup (Myabe not a direct swap, but the amarr drone do need a buff) |
Tikitina
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
22
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Posted - 2013.10.01 17:19:00 -
[2] - Quote
I think you are confusing at least three different things here.
Tiers, Racial Skills, and Specialization Skills.
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Danika Princip
Freelance Economics Astrological resources Tactical Narcotics Team
1745
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Posted - 2013.10.01 17:44:00 -
[3] - Quote
...Why? |
Swiftstrike1
Interfector INC. Fade 2 Black
247
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Posted - 2013.10.01 17:57:00 -
[4] - Quote
Swap racial drone specialisation skills for role spec skills? Have a +1
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Aglais
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
396
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Posted - 2013.10.01 18:22:00 -
[5] - Quote
While we're at it, why don't we replace all racial ship skills with "(ship class) specialization"? |
Verity Sovereign
Sovereign Fleet Tax Shelter
569
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Posted - 2013.10.01 20:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
Quote:I think you are confusing at least three different things here.
Tiers, Racial Skills, and Specialization Skills.
Perhaps, I was just using the same term they used when they changed the turret skills. Perhaps I should have said drone skill rebalance
Quote:While we're at it, why don't we replace all racial ship skills with "(ship class) specialization"?
because there is nothing "racial" about the drones, they have no racial pre-requisites, they all pretty much behave the same. Its not like gallente hulls have gallente drone bonuses. No ship of race X has any particular affinity for using drones assigned to race X.
The way it is now, might be analagous to having a "gallente ships" skill as opposed to a "frigates" skill using your logic, but its not
Drones are a weapon system, not a ship type.
The behavior of one light drone to another is not sufficiently different to warrant a separate skill like lasers vs projectiles. It would be like getting rid of light/Heavy/cruise missile specialization, and adding Explosive missile spec, EM missile spec... etc Or gett rid of the small/medium/large artillery specs, and add EMP artillery specalization, Fusion Artillery spec .... and so on. However, there are much greater differences between the drone sizes, rather than the racial drone "flavor"
Drones are a weapon system, and the different drones are analogous to different ammo types.
They now want to emphasize speacalization, rather than grinding through tiers (although I'll admit that these racial things don't really form a tier structure)
If I fly an Ishkur, I want to specalize in light drones, I don't want to train to better my medium and heavy drones... but training any racial drone spec does just that, while leaving 3/4ths of my light drones unimproved (ok, maybe only 2/3 as amarr dones are crap and why would anyone use them - and even more lenient 1/2, as most go for minmatar or gallent drones, and skip over the caldari drones in the middle of the speed vs damage range) |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1593
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Posted - 2013.10.01 20:25:00 -
[7] - Quote
That is an interesting point, drones are weapon systems and not racial systems, I was going to do another drone overhaul thread and I will keep that in mind when doing it. Novis Initiis is Recruting-á --á Ideas for Drone Improvement |
HardRockLife
War Decs Inc
4
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Posted - 2013.10.01 20:39:00 -
[8] - Quote
Aglais wrote:While we're at it, why don't we replace all racial ship skills with "(ship class) specialization"? I wondered about that as well. I mean we can swap readily but apparently CCP wants you to ship specialize with the req changes to bc/destroyers |
Soldarius
Deadman W0nderland Forsak3n.
344
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Posted - 2013.10.01 21:10:00 -
[9] - Quote
This suggestion has sufficient merit to warrant further discussion. I hope CCP takes notice. +1 Free Ripley Weaver! |
Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
87
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Posted - 2013.10.01 23:10:00 -
[10] - Quote
Drone skills are fine.
Amarr drones need a damage buff.
Heavy drones need some work now that sentries are so good. |
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1594
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Posted - 2013.10.01 23:37:00 -
[11] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Drone skills are fine.
Amarr drones need a damage buff.
Heavy drones need some work now that sentries are so good. When did sentries change? No drone has be changed in the 2.5 years I have been playing. The only thing drones have gotten are DDAs and T2 drone mods. And the salvage drone. Novis Initiis is Recruting-á --á Ideas for Drone Improvement |
Lucine Delacourt
The Covenant of Blood
53
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Posted - 2013.10.02 00:12:00 -
[12] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Drone skills are fine.
Amarr drones need a damage buff.
Heavy drones need some work now that sentries are so good. When did sentries change? No drone has be changed in the 2.5 years I have been playing. The only thing drones have gotten are DDAs and T2 drone mods. And the salvage drone.
And better hull bonuses. |
Kitty Bear
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance
875
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Posted - 2013.10.02 01:07:00 -
[13] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Drone skills are fine.
Amarr drones need a damage buff.
Heavy drones need some work now that sentries are so good. When did sentries change? No drone has be changed in the 2.5 years I have been playing. The only thing drones have gotten are DDAs and T2 drone mods. And the salvage drone.
Sentries haven't changed, but the pervading thought process within the playerbase is
if you have 100/125mb bandwidth use Sentries
if you suggest using heavies, or making heavies a viable choice your ridiculed and scorned the Domi got a tracking buff .. which is a huge bonus to sentries, especially when combined with a MJD
regular combat drones need something to reduce their 'time to target' which is their most often quoted weakness compared to sentries, not one single droneboat got a built in MWD speed bonus during the rebalance process (unless I blinked and missed it) |
Verity Sovereign
Sovereign Fleet Tax Shelter
572
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Posted - 2013.10.02 11:03:00 -
[14] - Quote
I think the Eos has a bonus to heavy drone MWD speed, and one of the new destroyers (do those count as part of the rebalance process?) has such a bonus.
The MJD has been an indirect buff to sentries, as has the domi hull bonus (since the domi is the most common user of them, I think)
Quote:Drone skills are fine.
Amarr drones need a damage buff.
Heavy drones need some work now that sentries are so good.
Amarr drones do need a damage buff.
Heavies do need some work - I'd say heavies should be like blasters, and sentries like rails, so I have no problem with garde's having the range they do, but maybe their tracking needs a nerf - I'd double the heavy's optimal and falloff, and give them a speed boost + wider orbit, but thats a different thread.
The skills are less "fine" than T2 gun skills were, and those got changed. 4 skills for 1 weapon system makes no sense. The different drone flavors are like the different missile or projectile flavors - they shouldn't have their own skill based upon damage type, ammo properties (like DU vs fusion having better damage application depending on target range and speed) They should be divided based on size, like any other weapon system.
Light drones = small weapon system Medium drones = medium weapon system Heavy drones = Large close range weapon system Sentry drones = Large long range weapon system
* gives me an idea for a drone overhaul... split lights into close range and long range variants... have spec skills for each... the would not quite be sentries... but perhaps for lights and mediums, the amarr and caldari are one type, gallente and minmatar are another..... one type has short range, high tracking, high speed, the other variant has long range (like 125mm railgun range for lights, 200mm rail for mediums), but a relatively low MWD speed. the close range ones need high MWD speeds to keep within range of a MWDing target to apply DPS, the long range ones wouldn't need to get very close, thus wouldn't need to travel far, and would have large orbits. |
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
527
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Posted - 2013.10.02 13:01:00 -
[15] - Quote
I'd honestly push for racial drone stats iterationGäó over this (although you've mentioned it anyways). Although I agree that racial drones skills are outright boring. I wouldn't compare drones with racial ships. The latter are pretty different. In comparision with that drone differences are bleh. |
Kitty Bear
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance
878
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Posted - 2013.10.02 13:19:00 -
[16] - Quote
had a random thought about this
if your going to compare Scout/heavy drones to other weapon systems they are much closer to missiles than turrets
Sentry Drones, Lasers, Hybrids & Projectiles all have a fixed range and instant damage application within that range
Scout & Heavy Drones are launched, travel to the target, where thier dps is applied in a small localised area Drone Control Range is directly analogous to velocity * flight time |
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