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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Burning Furry
Crouching Tiger Hidden Ibis
16
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Posted - 2013.11.13 14:26:00 -
[511] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Burning Furry wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote: They could undokc in cheap ships and have FUN, there is nothing madochist about it.
Guaranteed loos is not fun, by any definition. Trying to call guaranteed destruction enjoyable is indeed sociopathic or sado. It's like passion of the christ. "Oh yes, good sir, whip me more, i loves its!" Did you even tried? Some of the most fun PVP you can have is LOOSING a cheap t1 frigate! Far mroe enjoyable than ALL that even can offer to you outside of PVP, increased tenfold, multiplied by the number of people in JITA.
That sure is some complex maths right there!
"Far mroe enjoyable than ALL that even can offer to you outside of PVP," ??
Speaky engly? |
Burning Furry
Crouching Tiger Hidden Ibis
16
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Posted - 2013.11.13 14:27:00 -
[512] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Burning Furry wrote:
How do you specifically believe war does NOT drive players away?
Simple.. peopel that are so abhorent of any PVP iteraction are already NOT EVE PLAYERS! So there is no eve player lost in this.
Er... by playing EVE i kinda, well...am an eve player?
You've not answered the question. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17376
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Posted - 2013.11.13 14:31:00 -
[513] - Quote
Burning Furry wrote:Er... by playing EVE i kinda, well...am an eve player? Only in the sense that trying a salad and hating it makes you vegetarian.
Quote:You've not answered the question. Yes he is: you're confusing a non-sale with a lost customer. Someone who wasn't interested in the product is not lost because they were never established as a customer to begin with.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
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CCP Eterne
C C P C C P Alliance
2934
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Posted - 2013.11.13 14:35:00 -
[514] - Quote
I have been asked to clarify that there are no restrictions against declaring war against any player entity. All player corporations and alliances are considered valid targets of war declarations from other player entities. EVE Online/DUST 514 Community Representative GÇ+ EVE Illuminati GÇ+ Fiction Adept
@CCP_Eterne GÇ+ @EVE_LiveEvents |
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Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
609
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Posted - 2013.11.13 14:41:00 -
[515] - Quote
CCP Eterne wrote:I have been asked to clarify that there are no restrictions against declaring war against any player entity. All player corporations and alliances are considered valid targets of war declarations from other player entities.
As it was written, so it shall be.
<3 Eterne http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/ |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3313
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Posted - 2013.11.13 14:57:00 -
[516] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Burning Furry wrote:Er... by playing EVE i kinda, well...am an eve player? Only in the sense that trying a salad and hating it makes you vegetarian.
LOL
And there goes that coffee all over my keyboard again, damn it. It's like CCP added loot spew mechanics to my cup or something.
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Znagl
Missions Mining and Mayhem Northern Coalition.
3
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Posted - 2013.11.13 15:01:00 -
[517] - Quote
some CCP staff have released a Video on how to deal with wardecs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgvM7av1o1Q |
March rabbit
True Horde
878
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Posted - 2013.11.13 15:45:00 -
[518] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:They could undokc in cheap ships and have FUN, there is nothing madochist about it. usually people does not consider stupid death without chances as "fun"
Null people are like a kid who broke his own toy and is jealous about another kid that still has a new, shiny toy. In the kid's mind, the only way to happiness is to grab that shiny toy and break it so both kids are in equal misery.
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Burning Furry
Crouching Tiger Hidden Ibis
18
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Posted - 2013.11.13 15:58:00 -
[519] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Burning Furry wrote:Er... by playing EVE i kinda, well...am an eve player? Only in the sense that trying a salad and hating it makes you vegetarian. Quote:You've not answered the question. Yes he is: you're confusing a non-sale with a lost customer. Someone who wasn't interested in the product is not lost because they were never established as a customer to begin with.
There is more to eve than pvp if you haven't noticed.
Just because you don't pve/mine/explore/etc doesn't mean they don't exist.
I like those things. Those things are in eve. I login and use eve in order to play at these things. I therefore play eve. Maybe not the same eve as you, but eve nonetheless
To quote the thread title: Does WAR make players leave Eve?
By definition, if you were in the game and had paid for it, then you were a customer. Anyone who has paid money is a customer, interested or not.
If people leave due to war (going back to thread title, try to keep up) then they are a lost customer, not a non-sale. |
Anomaly One
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
24
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Posted - 2013.11.13 16:03:00 -
[520] - Quote
Burning Furry wrote:Tippia wrote:Burning Furry wrote:Er... by playing EVE i kinda, well...am an eve player? Only in the sense that trying a salad and hating it makes you vegetarian. Quote:You've not answered the question. Yes he is: you're confusing a non-sale with a lost customer. Someone who wasn't interested in the product is not lost because they were never established as a customer to begin with. There is more to eve than pvp if you haven't noticed. Just because you don't pve/mine/explore/etc doesn't mean they don't exist. I like those things. Those things are in eve. I login and use eve in order to play at these things. I therefore play eve. Maybe not the same eve as you, but eve nonetheless To quote the thread title: Does WAR make players leave Eve? By definition, if you were in the game and had paid for it, then you were a customer. Anyone who has paid money is a customer, interested or not. If people leave due to war (going back to thread title, try to keep up) then they are a lost customer, not a non-sale.
You mistake those things for not being pvp as well. This is the problem with everyone that thinks this game is single player, here's a tip: even if you are a solo Player in EVE chances are your actions affected someone somewhere, I know that when I go mining and see 3-6 empty belts cleared out by 2 players, they affected my "income".. and that's just one simple thing of the multitude facets of pvp in EVE.
Again the people that leave because of this mechanic should not be catered for, there are other games that suit their needs, refer to Tippia's signature, the first part.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17382
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Posted - 2013.11.13 16:14:00 -
[521] - Quote
Burning Furry wrote:There is more to eve than pvp if you haven't noticed. Actually, there really isn't.
Everything in the game either is PvP, is there to support PvP, or is so filled to the brim with PvP elements that making the distinction becomes downright silly. There are really only two things you can do in EVE that is not subject to player-to-player interaction and competition: pressing the GÇ£request missionGÇ¥ button and pressing the GÇ£complete missionGÇ¥ button.
Quote:Just because you don't pve/mine/explore/etc doesn't mean they don't exist. Funnily enough, I do almost all of those because they are all examples of the varying faces of PvP that EVE has to offer. Just because you don't fully realise the interaction effects of the activities you do doesn't mean they don't exist.
Quote:To quote the thread title: Does WAR make players leave Eve? And the answer is: not really. It may make the curious sampler or tourist leave EVE, since they figure out this is not where they want to spend their money, but EVE players don't particularly get driven away by such an intrinsic component of the game they've chosen to play.
Quote:If people leave due to war (going back to thread title, try to keep up) then they are a lost customer, not a non-sale. It's nowhere near as clear-cut as that, no. They can be either of the two depending on whether or not they were actual customers to begin with. As it is, there's little to suggest that players are actually lost because of this game mechanic, but a fair amount to suggest that people figure out that this was not their kind of game to begin with.
So going back to the title: does WAR make players leave Eve? Most likely no. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
3625
|
Posted - 2013.11.13 16:19:00 -
[522] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote:They could undokc in cheap ships and have FUN, there is nothing madochist about it. usually people does not consider stupid death without chances as "fun"
Someone with a kill board full of cheap ships and noob pods wants exactly that.
So staying in the dock and denying them is a perfectly valid thing to do.
My recommendation to noobs getting decced is to use wormholes to get to deep null and see if the griefers have the balls to look for them there.
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Varius Xeral
Galactic Trade Syndicate
1692
|
Posted - 2013.11.13 16:36:00 -
[523] - Quote
Green colored cars drive away buyers who want red colored cars. Therefore no cars should ever be colored green. Official Representative of The Nullsec Zealot Cabal |
March rabbit
True Horde
881
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Posted - 2013.11.13 16:42:00 -
[524] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:March rabbit wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote:They could undokc in cheap ships and have FUN, there is nothing madochist about it. usually people does not consider stupid death without chances as "fun" Someone with a kill board full of cheap ships and noob pods wants exactly that. So staying in the dock and denying them is a perfectly valid thing to do. staying in the dock can be harmful to many play styles
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote: My recommendation to noobs getting decced is to use wormholes to get to deep null and see if the griefers have the balls to look for them there.
let's say you are noob and you did exactly this
question: what now? Your wartargets didn't follow you but.... What will YOU do there? (we speak about noobs) Null people are like a kid who broke his own toy and is jealous about another kid that still has a new, shiny toy. In the kid's mind, the only way to happiness is to grab that shiny toy and break it so both kids are in equal misery.
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J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
2468
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Posted - 2013.11.13 16:58:00 -
[525] - Quote
Burning Furry wrote:J'Poll wrote:[quote=Burning Furry]
Those 4 noobs could have read a thing or 2 about corps before forming one. As all the info regarding corps clearly states you can be wardecced.
Lets go to Vegas as you can win big money in casinos and then rage when you lose money in the process. Well done, you can read a manual.... You're straying away from the topic of the thread. I have given my reasons as to why i believe that WAR drives players away (albeit a certain kind of player). Other than simply parrot on current mechanics and how we should like it or leave it, try your hand at answering the topic. How do you specifically believe war does NOT drive players away?
i answered it well before you started to whine in this thread.
people leave EVE because the game is NOT what they expected it to be.
Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
2468
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Posted - 2013.11.13 17:00:00 -
[526] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Burning Furry wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote: They could undokc in cheap ships and have FUN, there is nothing madochist about it.
Guaranteed loos is not fun, by any definition. Trying to call guaranteed destruction enjoyable is indeed sociopathic or sado. It's like passion of the christ. "Oh yes, good sir, whip me more, i loves its!" Did you even tried? Some of the most fun PVP you can have is LOOSING a cheap t1 frigate! Far mroe enjoyable than ALL that even can offer to you outside of PVP, increased tenfold, multiplied by the number of people in JITA.
This. Only lousy carebears consider a cheap T1 frigate loss as a loss. What is so bad about losing a ship that costs you about 2 mil. Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
2468
|
Posted - 2013.11.13 17:01:00 -
[527] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Burning Furry wrote:
How do you specifically believe war does NOT drive players away?
Simple.. peopel that are so abhorent of any PVP iteraction are already NOT EVE PLAYERS! So there is no eve player lost in this.
This.
EVE is a PvP game. If you dont like PvP you will likely quit anyway.
It's like joining a FPS game while you hate FPS. Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
2468
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Posted - 2013.11.13 17:31:00 -
[528] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:March rabbit wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote:They could undokc in cheap ships and have FUN, there is nothing madochist about it. usually people does not consider stupid death without chances as "fun" Someone with a kill board full of cheap ships and noob pods wants exactly that. So staying in the dock and denying them is a perfectly valid thing to do. staying in the dock can be harmful to many play styles Herzog Wolfhammer wrote: My recommendation to noobs getting decced is to use wormholes to get to deep null and see if the griefers have the balls to look for them there.
let's say you are noob and you did exactly this question: what now? Your wartargets didn't follow you but.... What will YOU do there? (we speak about noobs)
Yes. Because mining an asteroid belt in empire is SO MUCH different then in nullsec. Yes. Because missions in NPC nullsec are so different then the empire ones. Yes. Because probing works in a totally different way in nullsec. Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
2468
|
Posted - 2013.11.13 17:34:00 -
[529] - Quote
Varius Xeral wrote:Green colored cars drive away buyers who want red colored cars. Therefore no cars should ever be colored green.
This.
But clearly mr whine-bear will find away to twist it so he can keep preaching his "CCP GIVE ME COMPLETE SAFETY" propeganda.
We have the official CCP statement twice now.
If you are in a corp, you can be wardecced and become a valid target. Period.
If you dont want it, stay in NPC corp or even better, go to low/null/W space.
The mechanic is working as intended, only the carebears dont see it like that and keep whining because EVE isnt like WoW. Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
2468
|
Posted - 2013.11.13 17:46:00 -
[530] - Quote
CCP Eterne wrote:I have been asked to clarify that there are no restrictions against declaring war against any player entity. All player corporations and alliances are considered valid targets of war declarations from other player entities.
Thwnks Eterne for clarifying the rules regarding wars and new players. Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy |
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Zheng'Yi Sao
DIRTY MONEY INC. The Mountain Empire
29
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Posted - 2013.11.13 18:42:00 -
[531] - Quote
I didn't just see that, that was (expletive) hilarious. I think they should add the Dihatsu as a new frigate.
Do months of darkness affect the mind? I'll just let that ride...
(honestly, it was the sunlight that made me batty) "It's funny the things you people think are mandatory for us, as if we don't do what we do because it's a hilarious good time in a space video game." - Johnny Marzetti
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Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
276
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Posted - 2013.11.13 19:42:00 -
[532] - Quote
- Put war dec fees in an escrow bucket and pay it out to the defending players for aggressor ship value killed. (i.e. come at me bro!)
- Increase NPC corp taxes to 50-60% to incentivize (not force) people hiding out forever in NPC corps to get into player corps
- Players leaving or disbanding a corp remain in corp stasis for 1 week. (i.e. you can run but you cant hide)
- Put a 15-second delay on local chat, combined with the upcoming interceptor warp changes this would mean we could actually bag targets without resorting to logoffski's
- Get rid of the mechanic setting a suspect flagged persons jet cans as takeable by all. The poor little bears already have a green safety setting to prevent going suspect by taking from it right? Lets get can flipping back for christs sake.
For additional win...
- Auto-undock players from stations after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay docked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. afk blue ballsing is not cool, your actively playing the game or your not -- logoff!)
- Auto-uncloak players after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay cloaked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. see above)
On the flipside double wardec fees, which will further make the proposed escrow fees compelling to folks fighting back.
Would you like to know more? |
Rekon X
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
48
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Posted - 2013.11.13 20:24:00 -
[533] - Quote
CCP Eterne wrote:I have cleaned up the beginning of this thread. I've called for further moderation from CCL.
Sandbox |
Zheng'Yi Sao
DIRTY MONEY INC. The Mountain Empire
29
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Posted - 2013.11.13 20:30:00 -
[534] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote: - Put a 15-second delay on local chat, combined with the upcoming interceptor warp changes this would mean we could actually bag targets without resorting to logoffski's
We are trying to train people to watch local, not remove the benefit of doing so. What next? A delay on D-Scan? Work for it...
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote: - Auto-undock players from stations after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay docked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. afk blue ballsing is not cool, your actively playing the game or your not -- logoff!)
- Auto-uncloak players after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay cloaked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. see above)
If I want to go AFK, I dock up. I can't speak for cloakers. I need some point where I can get beer, walk the dog, have a smoke, do whatever. We are trying to train people to dock up when they go AFK. Don't penalize people for it. Who says I have to log off? CCP didn't put a logoff timer in the game.
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote: On the flipside double wardec fees, which will further make the proposed escrow fees compelling to folks fighting back.
No. Fighting is what people want me to do. If they cannot catch me, they cannot fight me. If I am too slippery to fight, there is no point in wardecing me as it is simply a waste of time. Continuing buisness as usual, while thumbing my nose at the hunters is more fun. "It's funny the things you people think are mandatory for us, as if we don't do what we do because it's a hilarious good time in a space video game." - Johnny Marzetti
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MadMuppet
AirHogs Zulu People
918
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Posted - 2013.11.13 20:36:00 -
[535] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote: - Put war dec fees in an escrow bucket and pay it out to the defending players for aggressor ship value killed. (i.e. come at me bro!)
- Increase NPC corp taxes to 50-60% to incentivize (not force) people hiding out forever in NPC corps to get into player corps
- Players leaving or disbanding a corp remain in corp stasis for 1 week. (i.e. you can run but you cant hide)
- Put a 15-second delay on local chat, combined with the upcoming interceptor warp changes this would mean we could actually bag targets without resorting to logoffski's
- Get rid of the mechanic setting a suspect flagged persons jet cans as takeable by all. The poor little bears already have a green safety setting to prevent going suspect by taking from it right? Lets get can flipping back for christs sake.
For additional win...
- Auto-undock players from stations after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay docked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. afk blue ballsing is not cool, your actively playing the game or your not -- logoff!)
- Auto-uncloak players after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay cloaked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. see above)
On the flipside double wardec fees, which will further make the proposed escrow fees compelling to folks fighting back.
So basically you want to make corps prisons via wardecs.
Oh you forgot a rule, if you are in a war you cannot jump clone. We can't have players running to the other side of the galaxy on you can we?
This message brought to you by Experience(tm). When common sense fails you, experience will come to the rescue. Experience(tm) from the makers of CONCORD. |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
2468
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Posted - 2013.11.13 21:37:00 -
[536] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote: - Put war dec fees in an escrow bucket and pay it out to the defending players for aggressor ship value killed. (i.e. come at me bro!)
- Increase NPC corp taxes to 50-60% to incentivize (not force) people hiding out forever in NPC corps to get into player corps
- Players leaving or disbanding a corp remain in corp stasis for 1 week. (i.e. you can run but you cant hide)
- Put a 15-second delay on local chat, combined with the upcoming interceptor warp changes this would mean we could actually bag targets without resorting to logoffski's
- Get rid of the mechanic setting a suspect flagged persons jet cans as takeable by all. The poor little bears already have a green safety setting to prevent going suspect by taking from it right? Lets get can flipping back for christs sake.
For additional win...
- Auto-undock players from stations after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay docked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. afk blue ballsing is not cool, your actively playing the game or your not -- logoff!)
- Auto-uncloak players after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay cloaked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. see above)
On the flipside double wardec fees, which will further make the proposed escrow fees compelling to folks fighting back.
1st: Yes. I like that idea.
2nd: Yes. It will gently push more players into player corps, making them grow. Or there will be hundreds more 1 man corps, which means that PvP guys will be too busy wardeccing others.
3rd: 1 week is a bit much, but don't make it instant.
4th: YES. Not only does it work for high-sec, but roaming null-sec will be more fun too because intel channels that cross multiple regions will become less accurate unless someone actually gets a visual on you
5th: I vote for the removal of that stupid safety system. What was wrong with the old system, where you just had to LEARN what you could and couldn't do. This is the perfect example of CCP catering the idiots.
6th / 7th: NO. For same reason already mentioned. I dock up and go AFK for a smoke or something. Or most of the time I'm docked and busy chatting in a 1001 chat channels, I don't want annoying pop ups. I already find the DT warnings annoying as hell.
8th: Mixed: Yes if point 1 is also added, otherwise no. Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy |
Burning Furry
Crouching Tiger Hidden Ibis
19
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Posted - 2013.11.14 00:53:00 -
[537] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote: - Auto-undock players from stations after 15 minutes who don't respond to a 'Stay docked?' prompt within 10 seconds. (i.e. afk blue ballsing is not cool, your actively playing the game or your not -- logoff!)
Would this also apply to jita/amarr trading alts? Or is it only for those under war dec?
If only for those under dec, how would you prevent abuse? I.e: Deccing to give an advantage over your trading rivals? |
Burning Furry
Crouching Tiger Hidden Ibis
19
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Posted - 2013.11.14 00:56:00 -
[538] - Quote
J'Poll wrote: 5th: I vote for the removal of that stupid safety system. What was wrong with the old system, where you just had to LEARN what you could and couldn't do. This is the perfect example of CCP catering the idiots. .
I would agree if eve had a well designed UI, which sadly it doesn't.
There are too many examples of "destroy/delete button" being placed directly beside the "use" button.
The menu bars are tiny, and if you're in a hurry and you missclick by 1/2 millimeters and this causes you to break some security rule, is this your fault or the result of bad UI design?
Improve the UI, then remove the safety system. |
J'Poll
CDG Playgrounds
2470
|
Posted - 2013.11.14 06:25:00 -
[539] - Quote
Burning Furry wrote:J'Poll wrote: 5th: I vote for the removal of that stupid safety system. What was wrong with the old system, where you just had to LEARN what you could and couldn't do. This is the perfect example of CCP catering the idiots. .
I would agree if eve had a well designed UI, which sadly it doesn't. There are too many examples of "destroy/delete button" being placed directly beside the "use" button. The menu bars are tiny, and if you're in a hurry and you missclick by 1/2 millimeters and this causes you to break some security rule, is this your fault or the result of bad UI design? Improve the UI, then remove the safety system.
Weird. Ive played for over 2 years with NO security system and NEVER I misclicked or did someone stupid.
The ones that make such a mistake....well too bad, should have be more careful.
And the UI is fine. If stuff is too small, you can increase the scale in the ESC menu.
So again, you complain that CCP should change a feature back to the good way too cater SOME players.l, namely those to stupid to read what they are clicking on.
And name me 1 single menu...only 1...where the delete and use is right under each other and where the delete one doesnt have a pop up to warn you about it. Want to have some chat in game? Need help to get into the game as a new player? Just join my channel: Crazy Dutch Guy |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
742
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Posted - 2013.11.14 10:02:00 -
[540] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Burning Furry wrote:Er... by playing EVE i kinda, well...am an eve player? Only in the sense that trying a salad and hating it makes you vegetarian. Quote:You've not answered the question. Yes he is: you're confusing a non-sale with a lost customer. Someone who wasn't interested in the product is not lost because they were never established as a customer to begin with.
Exaclty what I was trying to say, but with a different type of humor :P "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
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