Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 [7] 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 .. 18 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Menthal
|
Posted - 2006.04.06 19:16:00 -
[181]
dev said the mining foreman crystal optimization link is sort of fixed on test server, won't give extra yield but it'll decrease cycle time, has anyone tested it so we can have some results?
pretty yellow beams
|
Veskrashen
|
Posted - 2006.04.06 20:11:00 -
[182]
Quote: Summarizing the mathematical figures: A retriever with rough skills will mine 565 ore/minute A covetor with good skills will mine 1188 ore/minute A uber miner in a Hulk will 1732 ore/minute alone without any tank.
In ISK, again, using Bistot (9000pu): A retriever will mine about 30mil per hour A covetor with good skills will mine about 64mil per hour A uber miner in a Hulk will mine about 93mil per hour.
The numbers in the second half of the quote don't add up right, given the ore totals in the first half and using a 9,000 isk/unit figure.
Retriever gives 565m3/minute, which is 35 ore per minute or 2100 per hour. That's 18.9 million isk / hour. Covetor at 1188m3/minute gives 74 ore per minute, or 4440 per hour. That's 39.9 million isk / hour. Uber miner in a Hulk at 1732m3/minute gives 108 ore per minute, or 6480 per hour. That's 58.32 million isk / hour.
Dunno how you made up the difference between my figures and what I quoted, but there ya go. Still pretty good isk for minimal training time.
|
Cyber Wolf
|
Posted - 2006.04.07 20:27:00 -
[183]
Anybody know what the lp cost for a Mining Foreman Mindlink is? Do you have to use a certain type of agent or can you get them in any region.
|
helixp0
|
Posted - 2006.04.08 13:26:00 -
[184]
this is one of the best posts i've ever read on these forums. great job with the OP and follow-ups. i appreciate all the hard work and willingness to convey the information. i can't wait to put it all into practice!
take 'er easy,
helixx
|
Cyber Wolf
|
Posted - 2006.04.09 00:55:00 -
[185]
Edited by: Cyber Wolf on 09/04/2006 00:55:16 Edited by: Cyber Wolf on 09/04/2006 00:54:57 I have 3 questions about the suggested setup for the Hulk. Wouldn't the Pithi A-Type Small Shield Booster be better than the Gistii? Wouldn't warp core stabs be better in the low slots for low sec mining? Last question is what skills would you need for optimum shield tanking? I've used Amarr ships mostly for the last 3 years and know jack about shield tanking. Any and all advice is greatly appreciated.
Halada You've done a very fine job with this post. Thanks.
|
Rocco Siffredi
|
Posted - 2006.04.10 10:14:00 -
[186]
After a bit of deliberating and re-reading your post I purchased a hulk and set it up as you recommend
I have some problems though.
For a start its a REAL tight fit, i had to drop one of the mining upgrade modules due to lack of cpu and replaced with a PDU
Then to the tanking part. I was up against 2 angel battlecruisers and 3 angel cruisers, a relatively light spawn for 0.0
I was using active hardeners rather than passive. I first tried one explosive and one kinetic. My tank would not hold. i had to warp out else my 450 million ship would be in pieces.
I then tried fitting 2 x invulnerability field I
That way my tank did just hold. The modulated strips MUST be staggered, and at some points i did think my shield was going down faster than it was repping, but since I am used to armor tanking and have never really done shield tanking before that may be the way it goes usually, and on a longer time period it all averages out.
So what should i do to improve thigs? Here are my relevant skills:
Energy Operation : 5 Energy Management : 4 Shield Operation : 3 (yes i know its low) Shield Management : 3 Shield Compensation : 2 Tactical Shield Manip : 1 (doesnt affect the tank really)
Should I switch to passive npc specific hardeners and train the compensation skills? Should I go all the way to 5 on shield op and 4 on management? Should I get everything hardener based tech 2? What about the other setup with a named shield amplifier?
Any other advice? This tank I doubt will hold against battleships at the moment.
Im thinking this setup can only be used when I find the right spawn and treated as a luxury, not a tank for every mining session.
PS to the last poster, WCS would be a waste of a precious lo slot. If you are risking this much on a ship and mining in 0.0 you would hope you have the benefit of an alliance or corp member who can give intel on any hostiles appearing before they enter the system.
|
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.10 11:45:00 -
[187]
Sorry guys, I've been celebrating the end of my final exams and haven't been paying attention to forums much. I'll try to answer your questions. If I forgot one please re-post.
Originally by: Veskrashen The numbers in the second half of the quote don't add up right, given the ore totals in the first half and using a 9,000 isk/unit figure.
You're right. I have no idea either how I came with those numbers, I must have messed up somewhere. I'll correct them ASAP.
Originally by: Cyber Wolf Anybody know what the lp cost for a Mining Foreman Mindlink is? Do you have to use a certain type of agent or can you get them in any region.
I've seen the Mindlink go on escrow in Jita for anywhere between 250mil to 500mil. Usually a 350mil price is a right one. I don't know how you can get them though. My guess is it's probably a reward from lvl4 agents.
Originally by: helixp0 this is one of the best posts i've ever read on these forums. great job with the OP and follow-ups. i appreciate all the hard work and willingness to convey the information. i can't wait to put it all into practice!
Thanks mate, nice comments like yours are always appreciated and it motivates me to keep it updated. I'm glad it helped
Originally by: Cyber Wolf
I have 3 questions about the suggested setup for the Hulk. Wouldn't the Pithi A-Type Small Shield Booster be better than the Gistii? Wouldn't warp core stabs be better in the low slots for low sec mining? Last question is what skills would you need for optimum shield tanking? I've used Amarr ships mostly for the last 3 years and know jack about shield tanking. Any and all advice is greatly appreciated.
Halada You've done a very fine job with this post. Thanks.
Q1- Wouldn't the Pithi A-Type Small Shield Booster be better than the Gistii? A1- The Pithi does boost more, but has higher CPU requirements (it wouldn't fit on my suggested setup, since with the Gistii it came to 374cpu out of 375 available) and uses more cap. I didn't meet any spawn that I couldn't tank with the Gistii, so I'm not sure the Pithi would be a better choice. I'm also quite sure the Pithi is much more expansive, but cannot check atm.
Q2-Wouldn't warp core stabs be better in the low slots for low sec mining? A2- Yes it would. I lost my hulk and a Gistii SB 4 days after I got it to a hostile HAC because one of the frigs I was tanking scrambled me. You have to weight the importance of security vs efficiency for yourself though.
Q3- What skills would you need for optimum shield tanking? A3- Shield Operation 4-5 as well as Shield Management 4-5. Shield upgrades only needed if you want to passive tank (ferox) as well as the shield compensation skills. For the Hulk the only relevant skills are the first too, and tactical shield manipulation 1 for named hardeners (t2 won't fit).
Thanks for the nice words too :)
My comprehensible mining guide |
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.10 11:47:00 -
[188]
Originally by: Rocco Siffredi
For a start its a REAL tight fit, i had to drop one of the mining upgrade modules due to lack of cpu and replaced with a PDU
With Electronic V you get 375cpu on the Hulk. If you fit 3 strips, 2x NAMED hardeners (very important, ie for angel FS15 (Explosive) and the Non-Ballistic one (Kinetic)), the Gistii SB, the Eutectic (not T2) and 2x mining upgrades you will have 374cpu used. It fits very tightly, yes. With Mining Upgrades 5 you can fit a T2 Cap Recharger instead of an Eutectic, but it's a royal waste of time if you ask me. If you don't fit named hardeners you won't make it.
Originally by: Rocco Siffredi Then to the tanking part. I was up against 2 angel battlecruisers and 3 angel cruisers, a relatively light spawn for 0.0
Cruisers and BC are worst than BS, because of your sig radius they'll hit harder, especially EM. Do not armor tank a Hulk. It's meant for shield tanking. I managed to tank triple BS spawns with its cruiser escorts (3x Generals) with the Gistii and it does it without any problem. Passive isn't an option either. Passive won't cut it on the Hulk, you absolutely need active.
Get your shield management and operation to 4 ASAP, 5 if you can. With the Gistii you won't have any problem. If you still do fit a PDU2 and one mining upgrades in the low instead. Don,t forget the eutectic !
Finallt, T2 strips absolutely must be staggered but T1 do not.
My comprehensible mining guide |
BoinKlasik
|
Posted - 2006.04.10 17:25:00 -
[189]
against angels too you have to be REAL careful what damage types you harden, do exp and kin (i think those are what i normally do) but a great many of them throw in EM and therm. Damage types are a very important factor here.
*doh, I broke my edited sig :/* *cries* this signature was lacking pink, I'll provide it for you. There. Looks better doesn't it? -Eris Fixed it for you. Oh, btw, yarr! ~kieron Didn't I tell you? The damsel moved in with me, we're having a great time. - Wrangler The damsel may not be distressed any more, but how many times does the informant have to be silenced before he gets the message? - Cortes
|
Rocco Siffredi
|
Posted - 2006.04.11 13:42:00 -
[190]
After kitting my hulk exactly as halada has said, I am having no problems with single bship spawns or a few BCs
Havent got the balls to throw my hulk in there with 3 x Angel thrones or anything yet, but the named active exp and kin hardeners did the trick.
I got shield op to lvl 4 but dont see it being of huge importance, i think 5% wont make all the difference in the world.
Forgot to say... a great post, Ive re read it a good few times and its makes a very nice refreshing change to the slagging off miners have to put up with all the time.
One possible point I have RE active vs passive hardeners, with a lot more training and using tech 2 passive hardeners and lvl 5 in shield kin and explosive compensation it could be possible to get a similar level of resists with passive hardeners, saving a lot of cap.
|
|
Tulia
|
Posted - 2006.04.11 14:14:00 -
[191]
I'm currently doing 3x msm2, Gistii, eutectic, FS15, non inertial ballistic, 2x mining upgrade. 372/375 cpu, 42.something out of 43 grid. 5 mining drone IIs 5 Warriors. It is probably one of the tightest fits I have ever seen, but it is also the highest yield ship in the game in this configuration and can still hold its own against most spawns. Angel spawns are naturally easier since you have 70% explosive base.
in 7 days I will have 108 pieces per laser and 3 pieces per drone for a grand total of 369 bistot every 180 seconds. If you compare this to a bone stock covetor with no drones, it is over double the ore intake.
|
Krait
|
Posted - 2006.04.11 16:21:00 -
[192]
Excellent thread and faq. Thank you for the effort.
My question is regarding the Mining Foreman Link(s) - Drone Coordination / Ice Harvesting / Laser Optimization.
I am training up the relevent skills to use the Mining Foreman Mindlink. However, once I am able to use it, I do not see where the above referenced links can be used. They require 5000cpu/200grid. I looked into Command ships, but the specific command ship bonus specifically refers to Warfare Links.
What ship can use the Mining Links?
I'm trying to figure out where I'm going to wind up after getting the Mindlink and several months of skills.
Thank you in advance. _______________________________________________
...been there, done that |
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.11 18:07:00 -
[193]
Edited by: Halada on 11/04/2006 18:07:40 Rocco- I believe you are right. I'm not sure but I remember reading a post about having the compensation skills all at IV and t2 passive hardeners to have the same resists. It would be worth it to check into it further. Thanks for the nice comments as well :)
Tulia- I calculated that if you are maxed out, including the mindlink foreman implant and the slot 7 implant, you will get 372 Bistot/cycle without the drones. So with T2 Drones an impressive 417 every 3 minutes, or 432 with harvester drones. That's a sh**load of bistot.
Krait- Thanks for your nice words as well :) You need a Battlecruiser to hold the links, since they get a bonus for those modules (description includes only warfare but includes mining foreman links as well). It will not fit anywhere else (except capital ships as well). A ferox for example will fit them without any problem.
My comprehensible mining guide
|
Krait
|
Posted - 2006.04.11 19:02:00 -
[194]
Originally by: Halada Edited by: Halada on 11/04/2006 18:07:40 Krait- Thanks for your nice words as well :) You need a Battlecruiser to hold the links, since they get a bonus for those modules (description includes only warfare but includes mining foreman links as well). It will not fit anywhere else (except capital ships as well). A ferox for example will fit them without any problem.
Well, that sure runs counter to my thoughts of having my miner in a hulk with all the skills. Don't really understand the logic behind it.
_______________________________________________
...been there, done that |
Car Wars
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 00:37:00 -
[195]
Anyone have a setup for a skiff in guristas space? 2 shield hardeners would be needed (kinetic and thermal).
Rest......dont know, can it be done?
|
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 08:04:00 -
[196]
Originally by: Car Wars Anyone have a setup for a skiff in guristas space? 2 shield hardeners would be needed (kinetic and thermal).
Rest......dont know, can it be done?
You can use the exact same fitting as the Hulk but only one MDCSM2 instead of 3 MSM2.
My mining guide |
Max Teranous
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 09:50:00 -
[197]
Originally by: Halada
Originally by: Car Wars Anyone have a setup for a skiff in guristas space? 2 shield hardeners would be needed (kinetic and thermal).
Rest......dont know, can it be done?
You can use the exact same fitting as the Hulk but only one MDCSM2 instead of 3 MSM2.
Hmmm, the skiff has less than half the shield hp of the hulk, but the same recharge time. Thus the natural recharge rate of the skiff's shield is much worse than the hulks. Would it make that much of a difference tho? Also with that little shield hp (720 points with lvl 4 skill), burst damage could break the tank.
Max
|
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 11:33:00 -
[198]
I don't have a Skiff on hand to check, fitting a medium shield extender II would help... I came up with this setup, but it fits very tighly:
HIGH-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 12 | 60] Modulated Deep Core Strip Miner II
MED-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 2 | 21] Gistii A-Type Small Shield Booster > [ 0 | 34] F-S15 Braced Deflection Shield Matrix > [ 0 | 36] Non-Inertial Ballistic Screen Augmentation I > [ 21 | 25] Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction
LOW-SLOTS : ~~~~~~~~~~~ > [ 1 | 30] Mining Laser Upgrade I > [ 0 | 15] Power Diagnostic System II
This gives 1732 shield and a 343 shield regen ... better than the Hulk in fact, but you lose a mining upgrade. This is with Energe Upgrade 5, and all shield skills at 5 (as well as eng and electronic 5 of course)
This will hold its own.
My mining guide |
Kaasboer
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 12:33:00 -
[199]
I'd like to thank you for your great post on mining. I'm currently learning Exhumers IV so I have quite some training behind me already. Now all I need is more money! ;)
|
Tulia
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 14:11:00 -
[200]
I'm just getting the two standard +5% implants. the skill associated with the mindlink one and the fact that I already have half a billion isk worth of cybernetics in my skull is a little bit too large of a turn off. I mean at this point I am already a demigod of mining. The only skill I have left to train is mining upgrades to V so I can fit gist hardeners.
|
|
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 14:54:00 -
[201]
Tulia what are current skill requirements on those two 5% implants???
My mining guide |
Kixyrya
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 16:20:00 -
[202]
Michi's (200-300m) and Highwall HX-2 (150-200m) are only Cybernetics V.
The Mining Foreman Mindlink is Cybernetics V, Mining Director V, and Mining Foreman V, and only Leadership 1. Ironically to use the Laser Optimization Module though you need Leadership V and Director I. I would think this is a typo and that they were meant to be the same. It's a lot of training (30-40 days?) but it's only (~200m) and if it gives the +15% Mining Bonus it's worth it without even using the Module. That's a +10% bump over the other implant for a month of skill training.
|
Naxie
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 18:32:00 -
[203]
Could someone help explain how I work out how much ISK I could make mining Arkonor with an Osprey with 3 x MinerII's fitted. (I have Mining IV, Astro II, Refining Eff. III)
My sums keep coming out really high, at like 100+mil isk per hour. I just want rough figures, not bothered about pinpoint accuracy.
Cheers.
|
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 19:21:00 -
[204]
Edited by: Halada on 12/04/2006 19:25:00
Originally by: Kixyrya Michi's (200-300m) and Highwall HX-2 (150-200m) are only Cybernetics V.
The Mining Foreman Mindlink is Cybernetics V, Mining Director V, and Mining Foreman V, and only Leadership 1. Ironically to use the Laser Optimization Module though you need Leadership V and Director I. I would think this is a typo and that they were meant to be the same. It's a lot of training (30-40 days?) but it's only (~200m) and if it gives the +15% Mining Bonus it's worth it without even using the Module. That's a +10% bump over the other implant for a month of skill training.
Thanks for the quick response.
Mining Foreman Link actually gives 20% bonus to yield if you gang yourself with an alt, since the implant give a 50% bonus to the mining foreman skill. So like you said, an extra 20% in yield for 1.5 month of training (exhumer 5 gives 3% for 22 days ...) it's absolutely worth it, not to mention after that you can use links in big ops and get the most out of them.
Still to be confirmed is if the squadron command skill increases the link bonuses... anyone can check that?
Originally by: Naxie
Could someone help explain how I work out how much ISK I could make mining Arkonor with an Osprey with 3 x MinerII's fitted. (I have Mining IV, Astro II, Refining Eff. III)
I'm assuming you have Cruiser IV here, as it's important.
60 (base yield) * 1.2 (mining iv) * 1.1 (astrogeology) * 1.8 (cruiser iv)= 142.56 142.56/16 = 8.91, therefore you'll get 8 Arkonnor per miner per cycle. 8 units of arkonor * 3 miners II * 60 minutes (1cycle=1min) = 1440
With three miners II you'd get 1440 Arknonor per hour, which is roughly 11.5mil per hour (a price of 8000pu)
My mining guide |
Stegnat Gless
|
Posted - 2006.04.12 21:11:00 -
[205]
Originally by: Halada
Still to be confirmed is if the squadron command skill increases the link bonuses... anyone can check that?
This appears to be the case, but check my figures -
I have Mining Director to lvl 4, so that should give me an 8% bonus for the Mining Foreman Link - Laser Optimization (2% x 4). I also have Squadron Command to lvl 3, giving a 30% bonus to the Link effectiveness.
So, if the Squadron Command skill applies, I should get 0.08 x 1.30 = 0.104 (10.4%) bonus for the Link.
When fitted on my BC, this is the figure shown in the attributes for the module. The laser yield reflects this, after accounting for the clash with the Mining Foreman bonus. (i.e. I get a 10.4% bonus with the link active, as opposed to a 10% bonus without).
For the Mindlink, it gives you a +15% bonus and 50% increase to the command bonus of Mining Foreman Link modules. I believe that these should stack, so your yield using the mindlink would be 1.15 x (1+(0.10 x 0.5)) = 1.15 x 1.05 = 1.2075. i.e. an increase of 20.75% without Squadron Command or 1.15 x (1+(0.15 x 0.5)) = 1.2365 (23.65%) with Squadron Command lvl 5.
|
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.13 08:42:00 -
[206]
Originally by: Stegnat Gless
Originally by: Halada
Still to be confirmed is if the squadron command skill increases the link bonuses... anyone can check that?
This appears to be the case, but check my figures -
I have Mining Director to lvl 4, so that should give me an 8% bonus for the Mining Foreman Link - Laser Optimization (2% x 4). I also have Squadron Command to lvl 3, giving a 30% bonus to the Link effectiveness.
So, if the Squadron Command skill applies, I should get 0.08 x 1.30 = 0.104 (10.4%) bonus for the Link.
When fitted on my BC, this is the figure shown in the attributes for the module. The laser yield reflects this, after accounting for the clash with the Mining Foreman bonus. (i.e. I get a 10.4% bonus with the link active, as opposed to a 10% bonus without).
For the Mindlink, it gives you a +15% bonus and 50% increase to the command bonus of Mining Foreman Link modules. I believe that these should stack, so your yield using the mindlink would be 1.15 x (1+(0.10 x 0.5)) = 1.15 x 1.05 = 1.2075. i.e. an increase of 20.75% without Squadron Command or 1.15 x (1+(0.15 x 0.5)) = 1.2365 (23.65%) with Squadron Command lvl 5.
The 15% bonus is applied to your yield, but the implant algo gives 50% to mining foreman links AND the skill. So I *think* it is: 1.15 * (1.5*10% from mining foreman) * (1.5 * 10% from the link) = 1.52 , ie. 52%
Squadron command 5 gives 50% as well, so then 1.52 * 1.5 = 2.28, so 128% bonus. But I'm not sure about all that.
My mining guide |
Lillis85
|
Posted - 2006.04.13 13:48:00 -
[207]
Originally by: Halada Edited by: Halada on 03/04/2006 07:11:25 Since the Mackinaw has a native 25% penalty to ice harvester cycle time, Exhumer V will negate the penalty, leaving you with the 100% bonus.
Is this really correct. Do Exhumer V negate the 25% penalty, cause when I'm trying to calculate it I get different answers when if I add the penalty with the Exhumer V, and when I leave them out.
600 * 0.75 (exhumer v) * 0.75 * 0.9 * 1.25 (penalty) = 379,6875 600 * 0.75 * 0.9 = 405
I don't have the Mackinaw so I can't test to see what's right. Can anyone tell what is correct?
|
Halada
|
Posted - 2006.04.14 14:46:00 -
[208]
Originally by: Lillis85 Is this really correct. Do Exhumer V negate the 25% penalty, cause when I'm trying to calculate it I get different answers when if I add the penalty with the Exhumer V, and when I leave them out.
600 * 0.75 (exhumer v) * 0.75 * 0.9 * 1.25 (penalty) = 379,6875 600 * 0.75 * 0.9 = 405
I don't have the Mackinaw so I can't test to see what's right. Can anyone tell what is correct?
I think you're right, I'll have to check that. I have access to a Mackinaw will verify this.
On another hand, I updated the link section of the guide.
My mining guide |
Mithek
|
Posted - 2006.04.16 17:17:00 -
[209]
really nice topic, thnx for all the math you have done for me
I have played EVE for ...1 month aprox and Ive been into becoming a mission runner/pirate, the other day I found out the thing called Mining and WOW =) thnx again for the nice guide.
|
BoinKlasik
|
Posted - 2006.04.17 19:43:00 -
[210]
ive seen a few references to the laser link that imply that it is workign for people now. Is this true? because id kind of like to be able to do it <3
*doh, I broke my edited sig :/* *cries* this signature was lacking pink, I'll provide it for you. There. Looks better doesn't it? -Eris Fixed it for you. Oh, btw, yarr! ~kieron Didn't I tell you? The damsel moved in with me, we're having a great time. - Wrangler The damsel may not be distressed any more, but how many times does the informant have to be silenced before he gets the message? - Cortes
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 [7] 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 .. 18 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |