Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 [8] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1074
|
Posted - 2014.01.14 22:38:00 -
[211] - Quote
Oh and I forgot... Pions also have 0 spin.
|
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
1930
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 08:36:00 -
[212] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:[...] Quote:Because of this latter effect, observations of the sunGÇÖs magnetic field (they presume photons are carriers of the electromagnetic force there) have already proved that the photon, if it weighs anything at all, must be extremely light. The current experimental limit on the possible mass of the photon is 10 (-54) kilogram Do you see the word IF? That is a totally different word than "does" or "sure" or "certain". It is in fact "IF" as in it is still in question and is not an absolute known. NOTHING in science is ever "an absolute known". But until it is PROVEN wrong, we go ahead AS IF it's the absolute truth even if we fully know it's possibly not. Everything is always up for debate, and as soon as what we previously thought we knew is conclusively proved wrong, everything else adjusts accordingly.
Photons MIGHT have rest mass, but they more likely have no rest mass, and so far, there's no proof they do have a rest mass. If they do have any rest mass at all it will necessarily be very small, and so far we only know for sure it's less than an incredibly tiny value. Even if they do turn out to have some infinitesimally small rest mass, most of physics would not radically change, just be slightly adjusted. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T Build your own EVE PC http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=1559734 |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
1930
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 08:46:00 -
[213] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:I guess to put as simply as possible, a hypothesis should remain a hypothesis, and we do not award Nobel prizes for those. After comes a Theory, and once a theory is supported through repeatable observations... then you are really on to something. After that awards can start to be handed out.
So, wait... how much longer do WE have to wait until we pass your so-called criteria anyway?
It USED to be a hypothesis back before 1962. It became a somewhat working model by 1964, basically the same model independently reached by three separate teams. Additional supporting work was done by 1967. Then for over 40 years, physicists have been trying to EITHER prove or disprove it by, what a shocker, repeated tests and observations. And finally, after half a century of theorizing and testing and data analysis, they are certain enough that something that can be accurately described as a Higgs boson exists.
When exactly should the awards start being handed out again? Wait half a century longer? http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T Build your own EVE PC http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=1559734 |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
867
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 13:03:00 -
[214] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Photons MIGHT have rest mass, but they more likely have no rest mass, and so far, there's no proof they do have a rest mass. If they do have any rest mass at all it will necessarily be very small, and so far we only know for sure it's less than an incredibly tiny value. I might be wrong about this, but I think our belief that photons have no rest mass goes beyond an inability to measure amounts that small. Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance) And bring back the missile Inquisitor!! |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
1930
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 16:59:00 -
[215] - Quote
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:Akita T wrote:Photons MIGHT have rest mass, but they more likely have no rest mass, and so far, there's no proof they do have a rest mass. If they do have any rest mass at all it will necessarily be very small, and so far we only know for sure it's less than an incredibly tiny value. I might be wrong about this, but I think our belief that photons have no rest mass goes beyond an inability to measure amounts that small. The measurement needs to be indirect, and a few methods of measurement were proposed. At the currently available instrumental precision, no effect which would arise from a photon that does indeed have mass has been observed. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T Build your own EVE PC http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=1559734 |
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
90258
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 19:37:00 -
[216] - Quote
I just find the idea of being skeptical of science (wtf else is there ????????, the answers ain't gonna be in the Bible), anti-science, or calling it's methodology flawed from top to bottom, to be a scary and dangerous mindset.
These self-absorbed know-nothings should get to work on their own methodologies, then report back to us with results, and quit pestering people for "definite" answers of which there are none, especially for what's being discussed here.
I really feel sorry for a lot of people, and what they find to be their life "priorities", and how much more could be accomplished in other directions with their energy expended on argumentative nonsense. "He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."-á - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882 |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
870
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 19:59:00 -
[217] - Quote
While I agree with that, I don't feel that Eternum Praetorian has been doing that here. His points may need a bit of work but he admits that. He's pointing out flaws he sees in the work, and whether or not I agree that these are real flaws, I can see what led him to believe they are. EP is not one of your common close-minded fools. He just has a different point of view. In the interest of science, that is a thing that should be encouraged, not discouraged. Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance) And bring back the missile Inquisitor!! |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
1930
|
Posted - 2014.01.17 23:34:00 -
[218] - Quote
Well, I suppose I can sometimes see why he thinks some things are flaws when they in fact are not. That being said, the problem is (speaking from longer-term past experience, not just this particular thread), he seldom (if ever) acknowledges when he's clearly been proven to be wrong and just goes off on a different tangent. Also, his (superficially"novel" and "insightful") ideas rarely even try to go past a "fast-food for thought" mental contortionist act, with no real attempt at a design of a falsifiable experiment, let alone any practical application. And THAT is a thing that doesn't really need any encouragement. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T Build your own EVE PC http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=1559734 |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
872
|
Posted - 2014.01.18 00:27:00 -
[219] - Quote
Well maybe instead of shooting him down, it would be more effective to show him examples of ways to increase the effectiveness of his argument. Don't tell him he's wrong, but show him where he can get a better insight and let him figure that out for himself, and then show him how to present his greater findings in a more refined way that explains his points and research better.
I'm not telling you what to do but I have noticed you are putting considerable time and energy into commenting on this thread. I can only assume you are trying to help. Well I think this is the way. If you want him to take you seriously, you've got to encourage him, not break him down. The point isn't to show him the error of his ways (though that might be one of your goals), but the real point, and the one that'll have the most effective results is to give him a tool that he can use to become more and greater. Don't fear that he will use it to play Devil's Advocate; if he (or anyone else in a similar situation) is actually close-minded and is presenting destructive viewpoints, that person won't really listen to your help--but if they did, they might open their eyes and see the error of their ways. On the other hand, when you have someone who is listening, you've got to realize that person does want to learn but that person also has an ego and wants to be right. Don't tell him he is wrong, tell him what he is right about and guide him in the right direction.
And lastly, you have an ego too. We all do. Your first instinct is to prove him wrong so that you are seen as right. You may even fool yourself into believing that it is a noble act, but it's misguided. If you can steer him in the right direction and change his viewpoints to something better, then you have helped him. And if you take yourself off your pedestal and admit to yourself (not saying you personally have not done this) that your ideas aren't 100% superior to his, you can wind up learning from him while you help him. It's a win-win scenario and once you realize what you have done, you feel great (as long as you aren't a sociopath). Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance) And bring back the missile Inquisitor!! |
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome Caldari State Capturing
819
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 02:08:00 -
[220] - Quote
To answer the thread title directly.
To upset 3rd world morons who think an imaginary fairy created all of the things.
If you want to get your soul to heaven, trust in me. Now don't judge or question. You are broken now, but faith can heal you. Just do everything I tell you to do. (Opiate - Tool) |
|
Slade Trillgon
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1532
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 02:18:00 -
[221] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote:To answer the thread title directly.
To upset 3rd world morons who think an imaginary fairy created all of the things.
WoW!
I really hope the above is a troll. The morons are the ones in the Industrialized nations that have been educated and still believe in 'imaghinary faries' and those that just may be serious when they call 3rd world people morons because they have not access to........well just about anything other than what their parents told them before and their parents before them..... |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
889
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 02:58:00 -
[222] - Quote
No he's saying the scientists are desperate to finish the Standard Model in order to upset superstitious people in 3rd world countries. The funny thing is, it'll more likely be upsetting superstitious people in first world countries. Now THAT's irony. Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance) And bring back the missile Inquisitor!! |
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome Caldari State Capturing
821
|
Posted - 2014.01.20 03:02:00 -
[223] - Quote
Slade Trillgon wrote:IbanezLaney wrote:To answer the thread title directly.
To upset 3rd world morons who think an imaginary fairy created all of the things.
WoW! I really hope the above is a troll. The morons are the ones in the Industrialized nations that have been educated and still believe in 'imaghinary faries' and those that just may be serious when they call 3rd world people morons because they have not access to........well just about anything other than what their parents told them before and their parents before them.....
I rest my case. If you want to get your soul to heaven, trust in me. Now don't judge or question. You are broken now, but faith can heal you. Just do everything I tell you to do. (Opiate - Tool) |
Kitty Bear
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance
1186
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 02:14:00 -
[224] - Quote
Akita T wrote:[quote=Eternum Praetorian]When will YOU be satisfied it's enough?
When they can explain exactly what is happening in a black hole. When they can explain accurately the cause of the initial creation of energy and it's subsequent decay into matter and lesser types of energy. When they can accurately prove or disprove the possibility of there being a multidimensional universe, and how those other dimensions work, and explain them in a rational, meaningful way. When they can accurately determine if the universe is finite or infinite, and how that ties into the above questions.
All the current science either falls apart at these levels, or there are conflicting theories for them.
It's not that much to ask is it ?? |
Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
889
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 03:10:00 -
[225] - Quote
Kitty Bear wrote:All the current science either falls apart at these levels, or there are conflicting theories for them. Once those questions are answered, more questions will be asked. We haven't reached a wall in science yet. There's no reason to think we will in the forseeable future. Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance) And bring back the missile Inquisitor!! |
Slade Trillgon
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1533
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 13:39:00 -
[226] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote:Slade Trillgon wrote:IbanezLaney wrote:To answer the thread title directly.
To upset 3rd world morons who think an imaginary fairy created all of the things.
WoW! I really hope the above is a troll. The morons are the ones in the Industrialized nations that have been educated and still believe in 'imaghinary faries' and those that just may be serious when they call 3rd world people morons because they have not access to........well just about anything other than what their parents told them before and their parents before them..... I rest my case.
Your case would be rested if I had proven that I was upset about the research being discussed in this thread, which I am not. My case is rested |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
1933
|
Posted - 2014.01.21 21:26:00 -
[227] - Quote
Kitty Bear wrote:Akita T wrote:When will YOU be satisfied it's enough? When they can explain exactly what is happening in a black hole. When they can explain accurately the cause of the initial creation of energy and it's subsequent decay into matter and lesser types of energy. When they can accurately prove or disprove the possibility of there being a multidimensional universe, and how those other dimensions work, and explain them in a rational, meaningful way. When they can accurately determine if the universe is finite or infinite, and how that ties into the above questions. All the current science either falls apart at these levels, or there are conflicting theories for them. It's not that much to ask is it ?? Actually, it *IS* way, waaaaay too much for ask at the stage where you simply have to decide whether the Higgs Boson actually exists and whether some people deserve an award for its discovery.
Also, you can at best try to model what might happen inside a black hole, but actually getting observations from inside it lies way beyond the limits of even near-future technology. As far as "the beginning of the universe" goes, you can also not (or, as far as we know practically not, assuming time travel and FTL are indeed impossible for the near future technology level we have) get any actual observation to DIRECTLY test any hypothesis, theory or whatnot. As far as "multidimensional universes" go, I'm not completely sure whether you mean just extra actual dimensions beyond our current perception, parallel universes, or a combination of those concepts? Either way, accurately DISPROVING any of that might be practically impossible, while proving any is contingent on them existing, and even if they do, interaction might be impossible so proving that might also be impossible. And finally, again, given the premise of no FTL and no time travel, determining whether the universe is finite or infinite might also be impossible, but anyway, it doesn't really actually matter all that much (whether the universe ends just slightly beyond the range of the observable or goes on for thousands of time longer doesn't really make much of a practical difference). http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T Build your own EVE PC http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=1559734 |
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1075
|
Posted - 2014.01.28 23:15:00 -
[228] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Actually, it *IS* way, waaaaay too much to ask for. I mean, considering we're talking about the stage where you simply have to decide whether the Higgs Boson actually exists or not.
Necro thread!
Man I though you guy were done here when I posted last At any rate, I thought that this needed a quote because Akita has just demonstrated the "science faith" in full. Thank you Akita. In the holy doctrine of science we are supposed to believe that all things are explainable and quantifiable and nothing is beyond our (eventual) abilities to do so if given enough time and space. We are meant to believe in theories that cannot be proven because they "make sense" and have been "predicted". We are meant to bend knee to shotty circumstantial evidence and interactions that have never been seen or tested.
Amen.
Akita T wrote:As far as "multidimensional universes" go, I'm not completely sure whether you mean just extra actual dimensions beyond our current perception, parallel universes, or a combination of those concepts? Either way, accurately DISPROVING any of that might be practically impossible, while proving any is contingent on them existing, and even if they do, interaction might be impossible so proving that might also be impossible.
Heh... kind of like a god hey? That's just to damn funny.
|
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1075
|
Posted - 2014.01.28 23:22:00 -
[229] - Quote
Akita T wrote:[
When exactly should the awards start being handed out again? Arbitrarily wait half a century longer? Or just wait until we're extra extra extra extra sure in 5 to 10 years? When is enough enough? The scientists said it's enough already. When will YOU be satisfied it's enough?
When you see the damn particle doing what the theory says it does... Duh?
|
Eternum Praetorian
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1075
|
Posted - 2014.01.28 23:32:00 -
[230] - Quote
Akita T wrote:Well, I suppose I can sometimes see why he thinks some things are flaws when they in fact are not.
That being said, the problem is (speaking from longer-term past experience, not just this particular thread), he seldom (if ever) acknowledges when he's clearly been proven to be wrong and just goes off on a different tangent. Also, his (superficially"novel" and "insightful") ideas rarely even try to go past a "fast-food for thought" mental contortionist act, with no real attempt at a design of an experiment that could prove or disprove his ideas, let alone any practical application. And THAT is a thing that doesn't really need any encouragement.
His threads are sadly generally limited to mere entertainment value and not much more.
This one is for Akita specifically Regarding an ancient necro'd thread.
I still do not think that if you fliped a coin infinite times you can eventually end up with 1,000,000,000 heads in a row And my reason for this is not a "tangent" either. It is a simple observation with regards to the tenancy of objects in flux. A flipping coin is an oscillation and oscillations tend to oscillate. Thus no "force" needs to be there in order to prevent a coin from turning heads again come the 10,000 th time (as you once suggested) because it is the very nature of the thing in question to exist in a state of flux. That flux provides a reasonable upwards limit to how many heads you can roll in a real and physical universe.
I just have to prove it mathematically
So you see... what you may see as going off on a tangent is in fact two ideas that i see as having an intuitive relationship, where as you clearly do not. That does not mean that there is not one, because you do not see it. I will however always happily explain when asked to. You may not think that standing waveforms and particles have a relationship, but i do and I think that it can explain a great deal of the subatomic world.
@Reaver Glitterstim
Thank you for your open mind. I wish there were forums of people like you, I'd happily post there in place of my various alias on various forums. I also totally agree with you, I love it when people actually go through the effort and truly prove me wrong. I want to see the kinks in my theories. That will only make them better. o7 Salute.
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 [8] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |