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Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2363
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Posted - 2014.01.06 17:56:00 -
[91] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Honestly, how can you expect people to move on if null sec players scam them, low sec players shoot them, and high sec players grief extort them? By doing what the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: find safety in numbers. I think you missed the rest of my post. I wasn't claiming the new order guys grief them (though I wouldn't claim they don't either). I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them. Why would a new player join a corp if all it give them is the opportunity to get killed by greens? Then at the same time, why would a CEO recruit publicly if they want to be able to safely field anything of value?
For miners for example, just in my alt corps alone for example I could field mining boosters, haulers, on grid protection and ore buyback programs. I wouldn't because the logistics of setting it all up so nobody can green kill anything shiny is too much of a pain in the ass.
And safety in numbers? How do you make yourself safe when those numbers could easily be the threat? Simply remaining in an NPC corp gives you more protection. This is why I was surprised when the idea of making corps able to select internal combat status came up and huge amounts of PVP players were screaming "No!". People should be encouraged to join players owned corp with benefits, not put off with additional risks.
EDIT: Oh and most of the gankers, scammers and extortionists also remain in NPC corps. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Angelica Dreamstar
Epic Boo Bees
73
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Posted - 2014.01.06 18:02:00 -
[92] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:I didn't create this thread...
I stated that the bumpers and gankers exist, that you shouldn't pay the new order guys as it encourages them and that if a players feels like what is happening to them is beyond gameplay and they feel genuinely harassed, to raise a support ticket. CCP are more than capable of deciding if it is or not and all that posting in GD will get you is trolled.
I stand behind that, and I'm more than capable of sustaining all of the trolling, attacks and defamation that the new order guys can throw at me. And why am I talking about it? Sheer boredom. I'm not home yet. :D Whoops! Indeed! My bad! I just looked at the pic. -.-
Ah ... yeah, well, they can file a petition ... but it's no use anyway. ^^
I'll see myself out. This thread doesn't really do any good anyway. New player feeling neglected? You're important from day 1!!! Join the Epic Boo Bees! (female chars only, RP!)
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6123
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Posted - 2014.01.06 18:05:00 -
[93] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:[I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them. If the corp is being griefed by an awoxer, can they petition it? ^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18757
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Posted - 2014.01.06 18:11:00 -
[94] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:I think you missed the rest of my post. I wasn't claiming the new order guys grief them (though I wouldn't claim they don't either). I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them. GǪand I'm removing an incorrect usage of the word GǣgriefGǥ. Griefing, as you know, is something you get banned for doing in this game.
Quote:And safety in numbers? How do you make yourself safe when those numbers could easily be the threat? The same way the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: gather around a common goal. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6124
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 18:19:00 -
[95] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Quote:And safety in numbers? How do you make yourself safe when those numbers could easily be the threat? The same way the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: gather around a common goal. Scammers gather around a common goal.... ^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers. |
Nerf Burger
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
181
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 18:25:00 -
[96] - Quote
Rick II Egnald wrote:Judging by the replies... I see this mindset is normal for this game... thanks
sad, isn't it? I honestly can't believe people would spend their time doing this. You just have to be glad you don't have the mind of a 12 y/o brat. "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18757
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Posted - 2014.01.06 18:26:00 -
[97] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Scammers gather around a common goal.... GǪand creating an entire website as a cover, even. Never mind that it's the most obvious and well-known fake in all of EVE, people still fall for it, don't they?
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Nerf Burger
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
181
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Posted - 2014.01.06 18:30:00 -
[98] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Scammers gather around a common goal.... GǪand creating an entire website as a cover, even. Never mind that it's the most obvious and well-known fake in all of EVE, people still fall for it, don't they?
how can you ever imply that OTHER people are pathetic? "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer
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Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
15475
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 18:32:00 -
[99] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Tippia wrote:Quote:And safety in numbers? How do you make yourself safe when those numbers could easily be the threat? The same way the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: gather around a common goal. Scammers gather around a common goal.... The common goal is to be the scammer that scams all of the other scammers that are also trying to be said scammer.
Rick II Egnald wrote:Judging by the replies... I see this mindset is normal for this game... thanks Always has been, always will be, even though I'm a carebear it's one of the major reasons I play. |
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
2283
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Posted - 2014.01.06 18:35:00 -
[100] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them. If the corp is being griefed by an awoxer, can they petition it? How many guys does the awoxer have to kill before it's properly petionable griefing, like a whole mining op? If your corp moves to another region and you follow them and then awox them, then it's griefing. Oh god. |
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6125
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Posted - 2014.01.06 18:41:00 -
[101] - Quote
Riot Girl wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them. If the corp is being griefed by an awoxer, can they petition it? How many guys does the awoxer have to kill before it's properly petionable griefing, like a whole mining op? If your corp moves to another region and you follow them and then awox them, then it's griefing. So my test spy can't awox them since they've moved from null to lowsec to null to Vale...? ^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18757
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 18:42:00 -
[102] - Quote
Nerf Burger wrote:How do you have the audacity to imply that OTHER people are pathetic? What on earth are you on about? Or did you just quote the wrong post?
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
4221
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 18:43:00 -
[103] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Always has been, always will be, even though I'm a carebear it's one of the major reasons I play.
Me too. I'm flying a Stratios around null sec doing sites and dodging people trying to kill me, it makes the loot even sweeter lol.
It's conflict that makes things (like games and stories) better. Who ever read a book that said "once upon a time, people got along swimmingly and no one was ever mad at each other, the end" lol.
The crazy thing (to me) is that they are so many other games (like Star Trek Online for instance, which I play) that actively shield players from the unwanted interference and gameplay of others, where ALL interactions are consensual. And you couldn't PAY an EVE carebear to go play a game like that, yet they choose to play this game while all the while complaining about things that are natural parts of the game like ganking, scamming, piracy and whatever.
It doesn't make a lick of sense to me why they do that.
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Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
2283
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 18:44:00 -
[104] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Riot Girl wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them. If the corp is being griefed by an awoxer, can they petition it? How many guys does the awoxer have to kill before it's properly petionable griefing, like a whole mining op? If your corp moves to another region and you follow them and then awox them, then it's griefing. So my test spy can't awox them since they've moved from null to lowsec to null to Vale...? Only if you're not following them because that's harassment.
Oh god. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2363
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 19:32:00 -
[105] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them. If the corp is being griefed by an awoxer, can they petition it? How many guys does the awoxer have to kill before it's properly petionable griefing, like a whole mining op? What? When did I say anything about petitioning them?
I'll say it as simply as I can. If people want other people to not say in NPC corps forever, they need to make player owned corps more appealing than NPC corps. As it currently stands, unless you are missioning there is no reason to join a layer corp, since all you will get is the opportunity to be shot by greens in high sec. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2363
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 19:37:00 -
[106] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:I think you missed the rest of my post. I wasn't claiming the new order guys grief them (though I wouldn't claim they don't either). I was claiming that players grief corps by joining them and awoxing them. GǪand I'm removing an incorrect usage of the word GǣgriefGǥ. Griefing, as you know, is something you get banned for doing in this game. Quote:And safety in numbers? How do you make yourself safe when those numbers could easily be the threat? The same way the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: gather around a common goal. Well no, you get banned for an excessive level of griefing. When you purposely roll and alt to get into a corp to kill someone for no gain, that's also griefing, it's just not bannable. You are doing it to cause grief.
And no matter what goal you pick it doesn't change the fact that anyone that joins can attack anyone else. honestly, I don't care, since I'm in null on my mains and a few single man corps on my alts. But all of this "waah, NPC corps" whining is put down to the simple fact that there is nothing gained but much lost by being in a player corp. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
368
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 19:40:00 -
[107] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:[Actually, I think the reason so many people remain in NPC corps is that it's impossible to protect yourself joining a player owned one.
Can you be more specific when you say that "it's impossible to protect yourself"?
Paranoia never killed anyone. -áA complete absence of it has. |
Lady Areola Fappington
New Order Logistics CODE.
1085
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 19:54:00 -
[108] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Jonah Gravenstein wrote: Always has been, always will be, even though I'm a carebear it's one of the major reasons I play. Me too. I'm flying a Stratios around null sec doing sites and dodging people trying to kill me, it makes the loot even sweeter lol. It's conflict that makes things (like games and stories) better. Who ever read a book that said "once upon a time, people got along swimmingly and no one was ever mad at each other, the end" lol. The crazy thing (to me) is that they are so many other games (like Star Trek Online for instance, which I play) that actively shield players from the unwanted interference and gameplay of others, where ALL interactions are consensual. And you couldn't PAY an EVE carebear to go play a game like that, yet they choose to play this game while all the while complaining about things that are natural parts of the game like ganking, scamming, piracy and whatever. It doesn't make a lick of sense to me why they do that.
Hey Jenn, how's that Stratios fly? I mean, say I have the resources and skills to fit one out reasonably, and I want to try out serious exploration, is it worth grabbing now or waiting on more of a price drop?
James says if we don't gather up more ISK for him he's going to gank our gankers. The risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built and we want to keep that (infact, this is much more representative of the consensus opinion within CCP). |
Nerf Burger
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
181
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:00:00 -
[109] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Honestly, how can you expect people to move on if null sec players scam them, low sec players shoot them, and high sec players grief extort them? By doing what the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: find safety in numbers.
yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything.
or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk free activities. "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer
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Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2363
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:12:00 -
[110] - Quote
Kimmi Chan wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:[Actually, I think the reason so many people remain in NPC corps is that it's impossible to protect yourself joining a player owned one. Can you be more specific when you say that "it's impossible to protect yourself"? Sure. In a player run corp, you can be merrily playing away, then someone in your corp comes and blows you up either for fun or profit. Anyone that isn't doing missions has no need to leave an NPC corp, since all they are doing is opening themselves up to that.
Sure, you could say they could protect themselves by being cautious of greens, but why would they need to do that? They could simply stay in an NPC corp and avoid both that and wars, or they could create a 1 man corp if they want to get rid of tax.
Corp aggression being always on is just a really dumb mechanic that puts up too much of an issue. A high sec group running mining for example is better running out of NPC corps as their boosters and freighters then can't get awoxed or held to ransom.
The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18757
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:16:00 -
[111] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:Well no, you get banned for an excessive level of griefing. Fair enough. You only get a warning and then a suspension for lesser levels.
Quote:When you purposely roll and alt to get into a corp to kill someone for no gain, that's also griefing, it's just not bannable. If it's griefing, it's bannable. And getting into a corp to kill someone is pretty much always done for gain GÇö its just not always for ISK gain, specifically.
Nerf Burger wrote:yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything. As luck would have it, you're not forced to do anything. You have tons of tools at your disposal; numbers is one of them, and probably the most readily available one.
Quote:or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. It doesn't belong there any more or less than it does in highsec. And again, griefing is not allowed in this game GÇö GÇ£grief monkeysGÇ¥ get banned because they're breaking the rules. As for risk, the only reason for any activity be risk-free is because the players who are supposed to provide that risk fail in their duty to do soGǪ That's not something the devs can fix. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2364
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:19:00 -
[112] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Quote:When you purposely roll and alt to get into a corp to kill someone for no gain, that's also griefing, it's just not bannable. If it's griefing, it's bannable. And getting into a corp to kill someone is pretty much always done for gain GÇö its just not always for ISK gain, specifically. It's not though is it. Some people do it specifically for the tears, which is fine, that's part of the game. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18757
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:20:00 -
[113] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:It's not though is it. Sure it is. It's just that griefing is far more narrowly and specifically defined in this game than in most.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
15476
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:21:00 -
[114] - Quote
Nerf Burger wrote:yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything. or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk and punishment free activities. So.... You're saying that ganking is an essentially risk and punishment free activity, which is as risky or costly as other players make it for them. While promoting the removal of activities you deem undesirable, such as "risk and punishment free" ganking, to low and nullsec to make doing pretty much anything in highsec a risk free activity.
How can you not see the hypocrisy in this? |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
4222
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:23:00 -
[115] - Quote
Nerf Burger wrote:Tippia wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Honestly, how can you expect people to move on if null sec players scam them, low sec players shoot them, and high sec players grief extort them? By doing what the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: find safety in numbers. yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything. or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk free activities. The low costs and risks associated with being a high sec "pirate" are the lamest and most imbalanced thing about this game by far. It just sucks that so many total losers who gravitate to this kind of activity get off so easy. That is the kind of bullshit that makes people want to quit this game. Not that its harsh (that is the idiots arguing), but that sociopaths are so easily rewarded and never pay any meaningful costs.
And you're still going on about that dude who took your COSMOS item?
Look, you got outplayed. it's ok, it happens to all of us (like that time when i was a young mission runner and got tricked into CONCORDING myself). But damn guy, get over it. No wonder ccp told you to stop petitioning.
You know every time., you know that "princess" character is someone's alt and they read the forums. You know they get a good laugh everytime you allude to how they beat you out of your COSMOS item right? |
Ptraci
3 R Corporation Boarderline Cartel
1650
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:24:00 -
[116] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote: So my test spy can't awox them since they've moved from null to lowsec to null to Vale...?
Heh I doubt very much the "omgz griefing!" people in this thread are right. I'm sure you can get away with following someone and ganking them - for a LITTLE while. But of course if a GM looks at the logs and it becomes pretty evident that you're making a point to go out of your way to make the other guy miserable time and time again, then it's a EULA violation. But doing it once or twice is probably no biggie. After all, this IS New Eden, full of nice people. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
4223
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:25:00 -
[117] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Nerf Burger wrote:yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything. or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk and punishment free activities. So.... You're saying that ganking is an essentially risk and punishment free activity, which is as risky or costly as other players make it for them. While promoting the removal of activities you deem undesirable, such as "risk and punishment free" ganking, to low and nullsec to make doing pretty much anything in highsec a risk free activity. How can you not see the hypocrisy in this?
No he can't, and he couldn't when he made TWO general discussion threads about the same one COSMOS mission incident (this is after ccp told him to stop petitioning about the same incident, we only know this because he told us lol). The dude is seriously cracked lol. Nerf Burgers? He shoulda Nerfed crying |
Nerf Burger
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
183
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:26:00 -
[118] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Nerf Burger wrote:Tippia wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Honestly, how can you expect people to move on if null sec players scam them, low sec players shoot them, and high sec players grief extort them? By doing what the scammers, gankers, and extortionists do: find safety in numbers. yes, because what is supposed to be a sandbox game should force you to seek safety in numbers to do anything. or devs could do something that actually benefits the game and keep douche bag activity in low and null where it belongs. carebears are the lifeblood of EVE and the cancer is the tards who somehow think grief monkeys should have what are essentially risk free activities. The low costs and risks associated with being a high sec "pirate" are the lamest and most imbalanced thing about this game by far. It just sucks that so many total losers who gravitate to this kind of activity get off so easy. That is the kind of bullshit that makes people want to quit this game. Not that its harsh (that is the idiots arguing), but that sociopaths are so easily rewarded and never pay any meaningful costs. And you're still going on about that dude who took your COSMOS item? Look, you got outplayed. it's ok, it happens to all of us (like that time when i was a young mission runner and got tricked into CONCORDING myself). But damn guy, get over it. No wonder ccp told you to stop petitioning. You know every time., you know that "princess" character is someone's alt and they read the forums. You know they get a good laugh everytime you allude to how they beat you out of your COSMOS item right?
still mad about looking like an idiot in another thread I see
try to contain your rage and discuss the topic kiddo, or we will have to ask you to go back to your basement. "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18758
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:29:00 -
[119] - Quote
Nerf Burger wrote:It just sucks that so many total losers who gravitate to this kind of activity get off so easy. That is the kind of bullshit that makes people want to quit this game. Not that its harsh (that is the idiots arguing), but that sociopaths are so easily rewarded and never pay any meaningful costs. It is a disgusting imbalance. How does sociopathy in any way factor into all of this? And how is it being rewarded? How is it not harsh that you have to be aware of your surroundings or you'll get hit with some kind of loss?
What's this imbalance you're talking about? How is it an imbalance that proactive stance yields more than an inactive one? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
15476
|
Posted - 2014.01.06 20:31:00 -
[120] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:No he can't, and he couldn't when he made TWO general discussion threads about the same one COSMOS mission incident (this is after ccp told him to stop petitioning about the same incident, we only know this because he told us lol). The dude is seriously cracked lol. Nerf Burgers? He shoulda Nerfed crying He should join up with Dinsdale, any proposals they come up with between them will make the hopefully tongue in cheek "nerf highsec" proposals look sane. |
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