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Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
281
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Posted - 2014.01.20 17:58:00 -
[31] - Quote
Answer: Battleclinic |
The Djego
Hellequin Inc. Mean Coalition
225
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Posted - 2014.01.20 20:51:00 -
[32] - Quote
It is mostly because people are to lazy to check/not familiar enough with some module groups to know what module got the same stats and often use simply the stuff they see on fittings(what mostly use CN Invus, since it is what most people click on in eft or other fitting programs).
You can save up to 20% of the module value if you take a expensive fitting and and just look for the cheapest alternative or something with similar stats(like gist c or gist b) in Jita. Also the market value of the CN Invu is mostly bound at the tag and lp price what also depends on the demand of this 2 resources for other stuff while the price of the DG Invu depends mostly on drop rates and and how many people do gurista stuff(also to a lesser extend on the price of gist and pith c type invus that offer similar or better values). Improve discharge rigging: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=246166&find=unread
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Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
69
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Posted - 2014.01.20 20:52:00 -
[33] - Quote
Gimme more Cynos wrote:Verity Sovereign wrote:Probably the same reason people use CN antimatter charges rather than the identical and cheaper FN antimatter charges.
And yes, faction launchers are more efficient. They are the only faction weapon system that will outdamage the T2 equivalent when using the same ammo. Sure, using fury missiles will get the T2 paper DPS higher, but the application is worse. The application on precision missiles is higher, but the base dps is lower. Switching between faction, precision, and fury is inefficient due to the 10 second reloads, so its most efficient to stick with faction launchers and faction ammo.
The reason, as far as I can figure, is CCP fails at math. going from meta 0--4, faction for turrets is: +0%, +5%, +10%, +15%, +20%, +25% base damage T2 base damage is basically meta 4 * 1.1 if you have spec to V, ie, +32% compared to the +25% of faction guns
But for missiles, going from meta 0--4, faction for RF/Domination, faction forCN/DG launchers is: -0%, -5%, -10%, -15%, -20%, -25%, -30% base cycle time T2 base cycle time is basically meta 4 * 0.9 if you have spec to V, ie, -28% compared to the -30% of DG/CN launchers 0.72/0.7 = 1.02857..... Ie 2.86% more DPS with faction launchers, assuming the same ammo.
#1 the "30%" bonus is too much, no faction gun gets more than that CN/DG launchers should be nerfed in raw DPS, but become easier to fit
#2 cycle time reductions are too much. A Meta 4 gun does 20% more dps, while a meta 4 launcher does 25% more. A faction gun does 25% more, while a low grade faction launcher does 33.3% more. Missile meta progression should go at 4% cycle time/level instead of 5% (much like they did with resist bonuses), so that a meta 4 missile launcher gives the same DPS improvement over meta 0, as with turrets. To get this straight: You say: Faction launchers are more efficient, because they outperfom T2 launchers while using T1 or Faction ammo, while loosing to T2 when using T2 Ammo. Hum, I guess I'm about to lol. T2 Fury can hit proper targets just fine (especially in PvE), and precisions will apply damage significantly better. Imho, it is nicely balanced between T2 and Faction launchers, just that no sane brain with the choice between both of them would pay the crapton of money for a really marginal increase in DPS while using T1 or Faction. Of course, not everyone in EvE is a sane brain :D
faction missile launcher (cn) are more efficient than t2. faster cycle bigger ammo capacity and t1 work better on smaller targets which happen to be more common in missions. U are correct that t2 are more efficient against same sized targets because of higher damage with fury.
now to the op battleclinic or the availability on the market |
Morrigan LeSante
The Lost and Forgotten Troopers
606
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Posted - 2014.01.20 22:39:00 -
[34] - Quote
Precision have an identical "paper" DPS to T1 (unless I'm mistaken, or you're blowing faction missiles) but far better application.
Besides, a well fit CNR pretty much get most of the damage down on cruisers and up with fury these days. |
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
69
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Posted - 2014.01.21 01:50:00 -
[35] - Quote
Morrigan LeSante wrote:Precision have an identical "paper" DPS to T1 (unless I'm mistaken, or you're blowing faction missiles) but far better application.
Besides, a well fit CNR pretty much get most of the damage down on cruisers and up with fury these days.
in my experience bc upwards for frigates and cruisers i fared better with t1 missiles but i didnt use precise because they where double the price of fury at the time i tested it |
Gimme more Cynos
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
124
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Posted - 2014.01.21 05:13:00 -
[36] - Quote
Jeanne-Luise Argenau wrote:Morrigan LeSante wrote:Precision have an identical "paper" DPS to T1 (unless I'm mistaken, or you're blowing faction missiles) but far better application.
Besides, a well fit CNR pretty much get most of the damage down on cruisers and up with fury these days. in my experience bc upwards for frigates and cruisers i fared better with t1 missiles but i didnt use precise because they where double the price of fury at the time i tested it
T2 Fury can oneshot cruisers, T1 can't. That's why faster ROF means ****.
Yes, T1 shoots frigates better, but you can either switch to precision or use drones. No need to shot frigs with fury.
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James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
17
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Posted - 2014.01.22 10:56:00 -
[37] - Quote
Another reason for this is that until fairly recently, the two were not actually equivalent IIRC. DG used less cap and had lower resists the last time I looked into it deeply. And by lower, I mean just barely over t2 resists if at all. Saw them alot on ships for people who didn't actually have the skills to fly the ships they were trying to as an incursion FC. That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did. |
Soldarius
Deadman W0nderland Test Alliance Please Ignore
494
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Posted - 2014.01.24 15:53:00 -
[38] - Quote
Aluka 7th wrote:Maybe trying to do level 4 in tier 2 Tech 1 ship like Raven is problem and not CPU/POWER of ship itself. I don't expect arbitrator to supply enough CPU/POWER for T2 fit but I do expect it from Curse or Pilgrim. It is actually by design that Tech 1 ships have hard time fitting T2 modules.
With good skills nd some intelligence Raven is perfectly capable of running just about every level 4 in the game solo with a T2 fit. I only use faction hardeners (not the invuln, just the type-specific ones) for the CPU reduction. Free Ripley Weaver! |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
979
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Posted - 2014.01.24 17:48:00 -
[39] - Quote
James Baboli wrote:Another reason for this is that until fairly recently, the two were not actually equivalent IIRC. DG used less cap and had lower resists the last time I looked into it deeply. And by lower, I mean just barely over t2 resists if at all. Saw them alot on ships for people who didn't actually have the skills to fly the ships they were trying to as an incursion FC.
It's always fun to see someone go pop because they had a bling fit with no supporting skill at all. |
Arec Bardwin
1234
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Posted - 2014.01.25 12:48:00 -
[40] - Quote
Aluka 7th wrote:Caldari Navy Invul. instead of Dread Guristas Invul. Because if you go all out Caldari Navy on your fit you get the secret set bonus.
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James Baboli
Ferrous Infernum
17
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Posted - 2014.01.25 18:56:00 -
[41] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:James Baboli wrote:Another reason for this is that until fairly recently, the two were not actually equivalent IIRC. DG used less cap and had lower resists the last time I looked into it deeply. And by lower, I mean just barely over t2 resists if at all. Saw them alot on ships for people who didn't actually have the skills to fly the ships they were trying to as an incursion FC. It's always fun to see someone go pop because they had a bling fit with no supporting skill at all.
I wouldn't say fun. Amusing, and vindicating to see a vindicator die after insisting that "no, really I have enough tank bro" That crazy bag FC with the silly things on the hull that shouldn't but just did. |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
703
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Posted - 2014.01.25 20:36:00 -
[42] - Quote
It is just a game. I think people like the idea of *all navy* fittings, and they don't mind the cost.
It's the same with Fed Navy fittings on other races. Pith or Gist etc. |
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