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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2292
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:25:00 -
[181] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:
You know that this is a LIE. You know very well thatyou can make far far more isk per hour in 0.0. THe only place in high sec where you do near that level of isk per our is incursions. but those you cannot just get home and spend 30 mintues doing it. You need to get on wait list and wait for 2 hours before you start doing money.
If 0.0 is so much less productive than high sec? Why you guys fich so many wars for the income resources of 0.0?
SImplyu, this is a #!@#!@ excuse. 0.0 income is still 2-3 orders of magnitude larger than high sec (except commerce of course)
So is every L4 mission runner posting their isk/h after LP sales a liar or what? You'd have been arguably correct before the anom nerfs that took vindicator ratting away as a staple. Oh and exploration for complexes is up there too, but it's so heavily contested that it drops below "Worth doing" once you get more than a dozen or so people actively hunting in an entire region.
Honestly the best reason to live in null is the ego and the narrative. |
Logical 101
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
376
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:26:00 -
[182] - Quote
SmilingVagrant wrote:Don't get me wrong I have no problem utilizing inherently broken mechanics to my advantage, but that doesn't stop me from objectively arguing that they are broken as well. That's not intellectually bankrupt at all. And here's where you fell down. It was well thought out, but eventually you stumbled.
The entire premise of what you have just delivered rests on the truth that something is inherently broken. First of all, nothing is "inherently" broken. Things break. When fabricated (implemented), they were "working as intended", because that was what was made available. It was designed that way.
You may feel it's unfair, overly advantageous, easily exploitable, and so on, but none of that means it's broken. It just means it's overpowered given its environment. And so whether it is "broken", as you put it, or not depends on whether or not an individual believes it to be "working as intended". It's all a matter of perspective.
The perspective you put forth is, therefore, "inherently broken" and assailable.
Also, the whiny bitchy thing never goes over well in terms of being a defensible starting position. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18896
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:27:00 -
[183] - Quote
tiberiusric wrote:OMG you whining tw@ts. Big alliances trying to control eve again.
its ONLY 5% jesus christ! what is up with you. Dont use the ESS you ARE NOT FORCED to. They're forced to do one or the other: lose 5% or gamble 20% against a potential (unlikely) gain of 5%. I say GÇ£unlikelyGÇ¥ since the purpose of the thing is apparently to reduce the ISK influx. Not that it will achieve that goal, but still.
And if 5% is so meaningless, let's do it across the board. All bounties, incursion payouts, agent rewards, NPC buy orders, reimbursements are reduced by 5%. Reduce the daily ISK influx from 2 trillion to 1.9 rather than the measly reduction to 1.97 they're suggestingGǪ that would more than double the effect and still have plenty of not-particularly-inflationary headroom above the ~1tn ISK daily outflow.
Kagura Nikon wrote:If 0.0 is so much less productive than high sec? Why you guys fich so many wars for the income resources of 0.0? Those resources tend to be on an alliance level rather than on the individual level, which is what's being hit here, and the main virtue of those resources are that they're fairly self-going. In terms of actual income, they're easily outdone by highsec ice mining. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
9826
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:29:00 -
[184] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:
You know that this is a LIE. You know very well thatyou can make far far more isk per hour in 0.0. THe only place in high sec where you do near that level of isk per our is incursions. but those you cannot just get home and spend 30 mintues doing it. You need to get on wait list and wait for 2 hours before you start doing money.
If 0.0 is so much less productive than high sec? Why you guys fich so many wars for the income resources of 0.0?
SImplyu, this is a #!@#!@ excuse. 0.0 income is still 2-3 orders of magnitude larger than high sec (except commerce of course)
Average earning on anoms is 90 mil an hour. You earn 120 to 180 doing SOE missions in high sec or 150 to 200 mil with incursions and unlike anoms, you dont have to stop whenever a neutral enters local. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2292
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:30:00 -
[185] - Quote
Logical 101 wrote:The entire premise of what you have just delivered rests on the truth that something is inherently broken. First of all, nothing is "inherently" broken. Things break. When fabricated (implemented), they were "working as intended", because that was what was made available. It was designed that way..
And the weakest non argument yet out of our friendly neighborhood pedant who thinks he's a word smith. |
Logical 101
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
376
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:32:00 -
[186] - Quote
SmilingVagrant wrote:And the weakest non argument yet out of our friendly neighborhood pedant who thinks he's a word smith. Cornered?
I'm disappointed. I thought you'd keep it going.
It was fun while it lasted. |
Trii Seo
Sabotage Incorporated Executive Outcomes
449
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:34:00 -
[187] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:baltec1 wrote:tiberiusric wrote:OMG you whining tw@ts. Big alliances trying to control eve again.
its ONLY 5% jesus christ! what is up with you. Dont use the ESS you ARE NOT FORCED to.
if you ratted for an hour and made 80mill you would be ONLY losing 4 million isk from what you would get now. big deal! and if you live in nullsec if losing 4 million isk is a problem for you, your doing it wrong.
Sorry if your botters will now lose a little more income!
get a god damn grip
posting with my main-main because i dont give a feck, this is getting out of hand
personally if ccp wanted to nerf nullsec they should of gone further and dropped it to 50% then the ESS would go up in scale the longer its there to 110%. this would of made it a far far better and interesting concept. At the moment the 5% is so small i wouldnt even bother deploying a ESS, so ignore it. Its the fact that over the last decade null has seen nerf after nerf to its income and we are now at the point where high sec offers much better income. This latest nerf is simply making the problem even worse. There is no reason at all to run anoms over high sec level 4s. You know that this is a LIE. You know very well thatyou can make far far more isk per hour in 0.0. THe only place in high sec where you do near that level of isk per our is incursions. but those you cannot just get home and spend 30 mintues doing it. You need to get on wait list and wait for 2 hours before you start doing money. If 0.0 is so much less productive than high sec? Why you guys fich so many wars for the income resources of 0.0? SImplyu, this is a #!@#!@ excuse. 0.0 income is still 2-3 orders of magnitude larger than high sec (except commerce of course)
The fights are over moons/rental space and it's not member-level income, it's alliance-level - you don't get the money from it, it goes into the warchest and is used for alliance investments. And yes, risk vs. reward wise hisec is a better investment - it's not a lie. Is it Hotdrop O'Clock yet?
Covert pilots unite! Safer working conditions, less accidental limb loss due to unfortunate Cyno accidents! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=258986 |
Treborr MintingtonJr
Quantum Reality R n D Spaceship Samurai
136
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:39:00 -
[188] - Quote
Wow anybody can warp to it, ok everyone, every other ship has now become useless, lets just fly all over nullsec in interceptors stealling everybodies bounties. |
Plug in Baby
Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber
91
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:40:00 -
[189] - Quote
Dev time would have been better spent on Dust
..and I never thought I'd see that sentence. This is not a forum alt, this is a forum main. |
Mag's
the united SCUM.
16470
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 09:53:00 -
[190] - Quote
Logical 101 wrote:SmilingVagrant wrote:And the weakest non argument yet out of our friendly neighborhood pedant who thinks he's a word smith. Cornered? I'm disappointed. I thought you'd keep it going. It was fun while it lasted. I generally like your posting and agree with some things you say. But this time you really missed the mark and looked like a bit of a tool.
Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the lions will ignore you in the savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless. |
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Logical 101
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
377
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 10:06:00 -
[191] - Quote
Mag's wrote:I generally like your posting and agree with some things you say. But this time you really missed the mark and looked like a bit of a fool. I just didn't get the escalation I wanted.
If you're looking for someone to toss the straw man in front of and douse it with water, you have to accept the fact that clarification of an understanding that this is what is happening is entirely possible. On top of that, you have to deal with the fish who not only willingly bite, but who also prove their point (which is utterly pointless).
What would be truly foolish would to be inconsistent. |
tiberiusric
Comply Or Die Retribution.
114
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 10:14:00 -
[192] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:tiberiusric wrote:OMG you whining tw@ts. Big alliances trying to control eve again.
its ONLY 5% jesus christ! what is up with you. Dont use the ESS you ARE NOT FORCED to.
if you ratted for an hour and made 80mill you would be ONLY losing 4 million isk from what you would get now. big deal! and if you live in nullsec if losing 4 million isk is a problem for you, your doing it wrong.
Sorry if your botters will now lose a little more income!
get a god damn grip
posting with my main-main because i dont give a feck, this is getting out of hand
personally if ccp wanted to nerf nullsec they should of gone further and dropped it to 50% then the ESS would go up in scale the longer its there to 110%. this would of made it a far far better and interesting concept. At the moment the 5% is so small i wouldnt even bother deploying a ESS, so ignore it. Its the fact that over the last decade null has seen nerf after nerf to its income and we are now at the point where high sec offers much better income. This latest nerf is simply making the problem even worse. There is no reason at all to run anoms over high sec level 4s.
mate, look the bounties in nullsec are far far higher in nullsec than lowsec or highsec. Why are you running anoms and not just belt ratting? True the anoms are pathetic isk wise, i have no idea why anom bounties in null are so bad. I never run anoms personally because i dont understand why i should spend more time on harder rats for less bounty, i just dont get why they are like that. So yes i agree with you on that part. But there is plenty of systems in nullsec with lots of belts to kill more, easier rats with much bigger bounties.
But actual belt ratting is much much better isk wise than high sec.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18900
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 10:17:00 -
[193] - Quote
tiberiusric wrote:mate, look the bounties in nullsec are far far higher in nullsec than lowsec or highsec. I think you may be confusing the difference in bounties between different ships with some assumed difference between sec levels.
The latter does not exist; the former does. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Wulfy Johnson
NorCorp Security
12
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 10:23:00 -
[194] - Quote
They can rather spend their time fixing **** already ingame that needs rework and balancing than spending months therorycrafting usless **** we can come up with.
Im rather annoyed that they wasted o'so long developing this in stead. |
tiberiusric
Comply Or Die Retribution.
115
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 10:26:00 -
[195] - Quote
Tippia wrote:tiberiusric wrote:mate, look the bounties in nullsec are far far higher in nullsec than lowsec or highsec. I think you may be confusing the difference in bounties between different ships with some assumed difference between sec levels. The latter does not exist; the former does.
Not sure what your actual point is. The fact is a BS rat bounty in nullsec for example is far higher than in high or nullsec. The sec status is not relevant per say as its relative to how eve works whether in high/low/null. Bounty gets higher the lower the sec level becomes. so in a 1.0 system it will be lower than a 0.5 system relatively speaking but thats still in the high sec band. You would be hard pressed to find a 1.85Mill BS rat in highsec
But i do agree actual anom rats bounties in nullsec is wrong, they should be the same as the belt rat bounties, otherwise why bother. Unless your thinking about getting the juicy BPC or goodies at the end of the DED anomoly which then may balance it out a bit. However normal anoms dont give juicy goodies at the end of it and the bounties are still crap so they should raise them to be the same as the belt rats imo if they want to introduce the ESS |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
18903
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 10:31:00 -
[196] - Quote
tiberiusric wrote:Not sure what your actual point is. My point is that, as a matter of fact, any given rat pays out the same bounty no matter where you find it. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
March rabbit
Federal Defense Union
1176
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 10:44:00 -
[197] - Quote
Fix Lag wrote:You know there's a pretty huge issue when
Goonswarm Federation Mordus Angels Fatal Ascension Razor Alliance Li3 Federation Tactical Narcotics Team Space Monkey's Alliance Pandemic Legion Black Legion Nulli Secunda Against All Authorities Darkness of Despair D00M. Northern Coalition. The Initiative. Brothers of Tangra Fidelas Constans Gentleman's Agreement Solar Fleet Circle of Two The Kadeshi Legion of xXDEATHXx Curatores Veritatis Alliance Spaceship Samurai Executive Outcomes
all have managed to agree that the new ESS deployable is really fucking stupid.
Somebody at CCP who isn't SoniClover needs to address this issue. The ESS sucks. If you put it into the game, people are going to riot and then leave. you mean that finally new people will be able to get into 0.0 space? And they will not need to kiss asses of scrub lords of all these alliances?
CCP: implement and deploy this module ALREADY! Let open new page of 0.0 history!
The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
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Jessica Danikov
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
235
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 10:46:00 -
[198] - Quote
I love how, with one forum post, someone believes they speak for thousands of players who are all in agreement.
I mean, seriously, what are the chances? Hell, I'd like the ESS just to **** people off and if it really does make that many people butthurt, I'm all the more tickled by that. |
Trii Seo
Sabotage Incorporated Executive Outcomes
450
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 11:00:00 -
[199] - Quote
Anom rats are exactly the same as belt rats, in fact belt ratting (unless you're cycling spawn to try and spawn an officer or faction rat) is less profitable than blitzing anomalies.
I do believe rat bounties remained mostly unchanged with time and the inflation rendered them worthless. An belt spawn now is not worth as much as a belt spawn several years ago because those few million ISK won't buy you as much anymore.
There's little point to including structures like the ESS unless CCP is planning to make a big reveal of sweeping changes to PvE in 1.1 or very, very soon. I suspect this may be the case because with certain people on the CSM this idea would not really pass without heavy arguing, and it's not being talked about in public due to NDA.
The other deployables are cool, very cool in fact - the promised siphon variants look neat and the dscan disruptor can be used in so many ways. With those features being good, releasing ESS in this state seems like breaking the "if the only thing you have to say is something stupid, don't say anything at all" rule.
If I had to propose a change, it would be having the ESS units be pirate. They would cause "navy" anoms to spawn in the area and shooting the navies would generate pirate LP. I mean, we already have the thematic thing of pirates vs. concord where the latter tried to attack pirate assets in Syndicate and Curse. Is it Hotdrop O'Clock yet?
Covert pilots unite! Safer working conditions, less accidental limb loss due to unfortunate Cyno accidents! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=258986 |
Fix Lag
683
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 11:03:00 -
[200] - Quote
Jessica Danikov wrote:I love how, with one forum post, someone believes they speak for thousands of players who are all in agreement.
Actually, if you so much as read the feedback thread, you'd see where I'm coming from with that statement. CCP mostly sucks at their job, but Veritas is a pretty cool dude. |
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March rabbit
Federal Defense Union
1176
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 11:05:00 -
[201] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote:Batelle wrote:Of course they dont like it. It represents a direct nerf to their income and a whole new mechanic for blues to get butthurt at other blues.
Its fantastic. It's an unnecessary risk though in which it's considerably easier to lose more than you stand to gain when you try to take advantage of it. At the very least the amount put at risk should be the same as what you stand to gain and furthermore probably shouldn't be a defacto loss for not participating. Lore wise it still doesn't make sense to me. actually this is what Eve is about. Example: you run lvl4 in battleship. - you win: you get 25-30 million ISK from mission rewards - you lose: you lose like 200 million ISK just from ship itself
Tyberius Franklin wrote:I mean logically you would think concord would be happy capsuleers were roughing up pirates where they live rather than letting them build strength and further disrupt the empires. logically i don't see any reasons to CONCORD to pay for killing pirates in deep ass of space where there is no CONCORD and empires..... logically i don't see any reasons in paying CONCORD for having your name of system in SOV space. ..... The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
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illirdor
Upper Class Goat
90
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 11:09:00 -
[202] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:illirdor wrote:im soooooo gonna fly around and dropping this baby just to **** ppl off XD but you can't deploy them in high sec... awwwww really ?? well im gonna have to settle with null then to bad they dont whine...
Soooo this is my sig....-á |
Tauranon
Weeesearch Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
629
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 11:13:00 -
[203] - Quote
tiberiusric wrote:Tippia wrote:tiberiusric wrote:mate, look the bounties in nullsec are far far higher in nullsec than lowsec or highsec. I think you may be confusing the difference in bounties between different ships with some assumed difference between sec levels. The latter does not exist; the former does. Not sure what your actual point is. The fact is a BS rat bounty in nullsec for example is far higher than in high or nullsec. The sec status is not relevant per say as its relative to how eve works whether in high/low/null. Bounty gets higher the lower the sec level becomes. so in a 1.0 system it will be lower than a 0.5 system relatively speaking but thats still in the high sec band. You would be hard pressed to find a 1.85Mill BS rat in highsec But i do agree actual anom rats bounties in nullsec is wrong, they should be the same as the belt rat bounties, otherwise why bother. Unless your thinking about getting the juicy BPC or goodies at the end of the DED anomoly which then may balance it out a bit. However normal anoms dont give juicy goodies at the end of it and the bounties are still crap so they should raise them to be the same as the belt rats imo if they want to introduce the ESS
You make 0 isk in warp. A sanctum spawns 40m of isk in the one spot. A good belt spawn is a triple 1.8.
In any case, as has been pointed out ad infinitum in many threads, most of null is flyover country, and has belts that spawn veldspar to hedbergdite and cruisers with the odd double 500k battleship. I have such a system.
Also note that in 634 anomalies completed, its spawned a grand total of 5 faction commanders, and it 100% reliably escalates into hostile space.
Everyone that suggests that we all huddle in the 3 systems in PBLRD Vale that have decent truesec is entirely missing the point (ie that this debate is literally comparing the best 5% of null systems to highsec, not the worst 80%).
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Decian Cor
Disconnected. The Cursed Few
126
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 11:17:00 -
[204] - Quote
I can't believe this *E-peen* measuring contest thread is already 11 pages long. Unfiltered for the masses.
Forum Posting - Basic Common Sense Level - III Grammar Level - III Reading Comprehension - III Facetiousness - III Skin Level- V Trolling Level - V |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
9828
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 12:08:00 -
[205] - Quote
Decian Cor wrote:I can't believe this *E-peen* measuring contest thread is already 11 pages long.
This is a wakeup call to CCP that Null has been nerfed into the ground and cannot take any more nerfs to income.
There is zero reason to make isk out here now, highsec is simply better. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Erin Crawford
22
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 12:10:00 -
[206] - Quote
Decian Cor wrote:I can't believe this *E-peen* measuring contest thread is already 11 pages long.
Indeed!
And the launcher images doesn't say EvE Rubicon "Now live" anymore, instead it says "THERE'S NO TURNING BACK." i guess that's a hint.
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Dave Stark
4194
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 12:14:00 -
[207] - Quote
maybe they should have let players build stargates to new places before beating them out of null with the nerf bat... |
TigerXtrm
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
405
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 12:33:00 -
[208] - Quote
There are no better tears than null sec tears. The fact that almost every major alliance is crying and whining over this means it was a great idea. My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things! |
Dave Stark
4194
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 12:35:00 -
[209] - Quote
TigerXtrm wrote:There are no better tears than null sec tears. The fact that almost every major alliance is crying and whining over this means it was a great idea.
something that will never be used is a great idea? sorry, what? |
Arkady Romanov
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
40
|
Posted - 2014.01.16 12:38:00 -
[210] - Quote
TigerXtrm wrote:There are no better tears than null sec tears. The fact that almost every major alliance is crying and whining over this means it was a great idea.
Here's a thought;
if the vast majority of the residents of an area provide rational, reasoned arguments as to why this deployable is an overall detriment to the game, maybe CCP should listen. We live there, we want to earn there, and we want that space to be all it can be. The situation in null is bad, and has been getting worse for quite some time.
We don't want to have hisec alts if we don't have to (or more accurately, if it was practical not to). I'm sure you'd rather not have us there gobbling up incursion spots and otherwise devaluing LP rewards by adding weight to the market.
EVE can and should have properly reasoned mechanics in hi, low and nullsec.
Stop being a myopic ******* about it. |
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